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d10? Ugh.

D10?

Excellent!

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
d10? Ugh.

Its much better than D6s, and their are many good D10 games out their, I preferably still vote for D20s, but as long as it is not the limiting D6s I am fine .

( Unless its for a game like DBA that game a D6 is fantastic for , but for anything that involves different races or high different stat valued units going higher than a D6 is usually the better idea).

Dice are just a tool, and d10s are a marginally fancier version of the d6 that is easily available. D10s create the veneer of difference, but the game plays the same, so there's no real point aside from aesthetics of being different for the sake of being different. D10s (and D20s) create a lot of hair-splitting that actually avoids the hard choices of understanding what is truly significant in being "better". D6s force clear decisions among good/better/best.

If I were doing a game, it'd be using custom six-siders giving values from 0 to 4. Keep the numbers down and remove math where possible.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Or WGF survivors as a scruffy militia/freedom fighters.

WGF Russians would make a natural low-tech, high-numbers enemy.


Isn't Iron Core going to have some space soviets? I can't wait.

Funny you mention them, I got a Red Army box and should have a review soon.

Short answer is if you want a hoard of cheap riflemen who don't look 'too' historical they're a good pick.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Dice are just a tool, and d10s are a marginally fancier version of the d6 that is easily available. D10s create the veneer of difference, but the game plays the same, so there's no real point aside from aesthetics of being different for the sake of being different. D10s (and D20s) create a lot of hair-splitting that actually avoids the hard choices of understanding what is truly significant in being "better". D6s force clear decisions among good/better/best.

If I were doing a game, it'd be using custom six-siders giving values from 0 to 4. Keep the numbers down and remove math where possible.

I disagree you can get a lot more stat values that reflect a higher amount of racial characteristics. The only other solution I would see if you did not want to bring the dice value up is either using multiple lower value dice or having a built in page describing special abilities and perks of said unit to give your game the ability to have high diversity. Going to a higher dice value is a lot easier than doing the other two options and is why you see almost every single RPG using a D20 and many games that have high diversity in unit types like Infinity use Higher Dice values. Even Mantics Deadzone with its simple game has moved up its dice value to D8s.

At this point I feel it is personal preference but I would rather have high diversity in a game and a lot more options for different units than 5 values. It however counts on the game. For something were everyone is the same race and all units at the scale would share very similar values, for example DBA than it makes sense to go with a smaller dice value. Games were every single individual can be quite different from the other I would say up the Dice value to give you more options then and down the road.

No skirmish battle / mass battle game should track individual models at RPG-level detail. That's automatic fail in my book.

And 5 values would cover quite a lot, given a range of humans up to Leviathans.

D10 is good. D6 is...suboptimal.

Agreed!

I'm glad John's not making the ICU game!

If you need chrome, no, I'm not your guy for rules.

D6's need love too

I think you can have simple rules with a few conditions that affect success threshold that are represented on a 1-10 spread. I'm thinking the quick list of stuff from the old Battletech, say.

If you're looking for RPG style, then I am out too. But I don't think anyone is arguing for that level of details. And even RPGs could have nice, simple systems using d10. In my memory, I remember the old World of Darkness games as having a simple system to determine the threshold.

On a d6, it's really only 4 values that can make a difference. 1 is always a failure, and 6 is always a success. Except for some extreme cases, of course. In 40K, at least. Who knows, he might have something up his sleeve that we do not suspect.

I just hope I get to use most of my minis I plop on the tabletop. I can't stand a system that, even though I have a horde, I barely can pass an activation test and must bear witness to being shot/beaten piecemeal.

shade1313 wrote:
D10 is good. D6 is...suboptimal.

D12s forever! Dodecahedron is in da house!

And D10s roll like crap...

Or you could roll, say, 2d6 and still have your 10 value spread.
From the blog, looks like the developer is set on d10s, though.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Dice are just a tool, and d10s are a marginally fancier version of the d6 that is easily available. D10s create the veneer of difference, but the game plays the same, so there's no real point aside from aesthetics of being different for the sake of being different. D10s (and D20s) create a lot of hair-splitting that actually avoids the hard choices of understanding what is truly significant in being "better". D6s force clear decisions among good/better/best.

If I were doing a game, it'd be using custom six-siders giving values from 0 to 4. Keep the numbers down and remove math where possible.

Math would be a lot simpler. Instead of going off of a 1/6 which is like a 16.77777 something, you just get a 10% interval on percentages. Makes probabilities and math easier to do and allows you to have more variation in stats that you can just roll a single die against.

Would be a pain to have to buy a whole new set of dice, but if the game is really good I wouldn't care.

privateer4hire wrote:
Or you could roll, say, 2d6 and still have your 10 value spread.

That's...not how it works. With a d10, you have an equal chance for each result. Rolling 2d6 does not give you an equal chance for each result.

Tann... play nice

Talking about dices i rather have a D20 or 2D10 To go from 1 to 100, you can work with percentages and make very diverse troop/hero charcteristics

About Shadokesh maybe you can steal i mean be inspired by warframe some interesting designs there.


And a light walker! giddy! shows us ze precsiousz me wants it!

privateer4hire wrote:
Or you could roll, say, 2d6 and still have your 10 value spread.

Except, 2d6 turns the 10 value spread up to 11. Literally.

I prefer D12 or 2D6, too. I am open to D10s but they're definitely not the best rolling dice shape (I think only the D4 is worse).

Eeesh.. after seeing the pricing on the new units I'm really regretting that I missed the KS. Also wishing there was a way to load up the heavies with 5x of 1 particular weapon but I understand why that would not have been economically sound.

Damn this looks good damn son!

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Or WGF survivors as a scruffy militia/freedom fighters.

WGF Russians would make a natural low-tech, high-numbers enemy.


Isn't Iron Core going to have some space soviets? I can't wait.

Funny you mention them, I got a Red Army box and should have a review soon.

Short answer is if you want a hoard of cheap riflemen who don't look 'too' historical they're a good pick.

Good to know. I already have a bunch of Dust soviet vehicles, so semi-historical minis will be perfect. I may just chop up the spare weapons and glue them to the weapons the minis are holding to give them space weapons. I might even find a use for some PSC plastic tanks.

Also, is anyone else more excited about the hover tank than the transport or even the 15mm walkers? I will be all over that.

Also, poor Shadowkesh are going through Pon Farr. That's okay. I will convert their weapons so they don't look so ...desperate.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

privateer4hire wrote:
Or you could roll, say, 2d6 and still have your 10 value spread.

That's...not how it works. With a d10, you have an equal chance for each result. Rolling 2d6 does not give you an equal chance for each result.

I realize that one is a 1/10 chance for each value (rolling 1d10) versus a bell curve distro rolling the 2d6 : http://mathinsight.org/image/two_dice_distribution
I was saying it was an alternate way to get a spread of 10 values (actually 11 so even more room for state play), not that it was equivalent.

At any rate, sounds like they're going for d10s any way.
I'll probably use Bolt Action with/without mods, depending.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JohnHwangDD wrote:

privateer4hire wrote:
Or you could roll, say, 2d6 and still have your 10 value spread.

Except, 2d6 turns the 10 value spread up to 11. Literally.

Yeah. I was focusing on the discussion point about 1-6 being too limiting.

Maybe I'll get some custom D12s with the top and bottom faces as a logo (reroll the die) to use as D10s . Absolutely love the D12 shape, wish it had caught on more!

There are other types of d10 dice out there:

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-Shipping-10-Dice-Bosons-18-Sided-Polyhedral-Dice-Multicolour-Small-Gift-Game-Dice-18mm/1508211552.html

That APC is awesome and huge.

The female torso will fit the legs of the seated male troopers...(not sure how the arms will work out yet)


Apologies if these come out huge - Photobucket is having a 'senior moment'!

 Dravis wrote:
There are other types of d10 dice out there:

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-Shipping-10-Dice-Bosons-18-Sided-Polyhedral-Dice-Multicolour-Small-Gift-Game-Dice-18mm/1508211552.html

That is awesome! I'll totally be getting a set of those to try out

Are there more alternative shapes out there (even for other dice numbers) as I had never even heard of these!

Those Shadowkesh look great. I like their weapons a lot.

I think the scythe element needs to be a bit bigger, not much, maybe 20%?

While I would have preferred finishing out the current line with the Chitty Chitty Stug Stug (love the look!), I can understand why he'd want to work on an opfor instead. Will the shadowkesh stuff be straight to retail or another kickstarter instead? I'm also curious if we'll see a preview pic of the light armor as well since we can't really make out much under the leviathan's foot.