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 Ouze wrote:
Question for the team.

I've wanted a CZ Scorpion Evo 3 s2 w/ brace pretty much since I saw it. Now they seem to be readily available.

On the other hand, i hear tell on the internets that PSA is about to be putting out some MP5 clones.

You guys think the CZ is worth getting, or should I wait to see what the PSA stuff is like?

Difficulty: the CZ Scorpion Evo 3 s2 w/brace appears to have been discontinued for some reason. So I need to decide sight unseen, most likely. I don't know how long until they dry up.

Hrm, before SHOT this year, I'd have unreservedly said the Scorpion. I think that's still my ultimate answer, but hot damn did PSA come out like a boss this year.

As far as I can tell though, the braced S2 (SKU 91345) is still available.

From my experience with my Scorpion, it feels unbreakable (it's basically a thick polymer shell encasing a giant metal block for a bolt) and I've never had a malfunction in mine. The aftermarket has exploded with cool stuff for them, they're available in everything from micro 4" formats to 16" rifles, everything in between, multiple aftermarket triggers are available and every sort of stock/grip/handguard one could ask for, and Magpul is now making mags for them, PSA is even making AK's that take Scorpion mags

PSA however is looking awesome, and if they can put out an inexpensive MP5, that's gonna be hard to ignore, if for nothing else but cool pop culture factor. That said, we don't know how much they'll be or when they'll be available and it's always possible they never come out.

No, the 91348 - https://cz-usa.com/product/cz-scorpion-evo-3-s2-pistol-micro-w-brace/ has this giant disclaimer now:

"Discontinued/Limited Production Product
CZ Scorpion EVO 3 S2 Pistol Micro w/ Brace – Discontinued 2019"

I'm probably going to buy it but wanted to make sure no one said it was a clunker. I've wanted it for a long time but it also had availability issues for a long time.

 cuda1179 wrote:
I take it that either way this will just be a "fun gun"? If so, go with whatever you think looks coolest.

Yeah, a range toy - it's too cold for shooting outside and all the indoor ranges here are pistol only. I'm tired of shooting the pistols I have and want one of these little miami vice drug runner guns.

Ah ok, I see now, it looks like they're discontinuing the collapsing brace in favor of the side folder, however SB tactical does sell the collapsing brace separately (though it's $280 it looks like ).

The S2 definitely fits the vibe you're going for.

Yeah, I'm gonna get it. There is a new hole in the wall gun shop about 20 seconds from my house now, pinged that guy to see what his FFL fees are before buying.

But now we're concentrating on the peas, not the steak - as a Cheerios commercial once asked, "why not both?" I'm doing pretty well money wise, there is really not a good reason not to just buy this and then if the PSA roller locks are great, to buy one of those too.

Then I can have one in each hand, just like Carl Weathers in Predator.

I salute your wise conclusion, and expect pics...

 Vaktathi wrote:
Yup, .40 is just a cut down 10mm, FBI wanted to move up from 9mm after the Miami-Dade shootout (blaming the equipment instead of...everything else) but then found 10mm was a wee bit toasty and people had trouble qualifying with it, and in the process of toning that down came up with 40S&W and ironically basically coming back with something equivalent to a very hot 9mm

IIRC you can shoot 40S&W out of some 10mm guns.

Yeah, a common misnomer is that the S&W in 40S&W stands for Smith and Wesson when actually it stands for "short and weak ".

Just joking. Carry what you like and shoot best. Personally I don't find 10mm punishing at all. I carry a Glock 29 and keep it loaded with Underwood xtreme defenders or penetrators and love shooting it. Adding Pearce Grips to the mags makes a big difference.

 Spacemanvic wrote:
Ive noticed a slight uptick in our costs and a lowering of availability for ARs from our distributors since the Virginia 2A rally. Funny how when something is threatened to be pulled, people rush out to "get theirs".

Guilty as charged. I've always been more a fan of exotic/historical stuff (these are my go-to .308, .223, and 9mm long arms), but with legislation looming I went out and bought an Aero Precision lower yesterday. If there's going to be a ban on purchase, I can't argue with the flexibility of the AR platform.

 catbarf wrote:

 Spacemanvic wrote:
Ive noticed a slight uptick in our costs and a lowering of availability for ARs from our distributors since the Virginia 2A rally. Funny how when something is threatened to be pulled, people rush out to "get theirs".

Guilty as charged. I've always been more a fan of exotic/historical stuff (these are my go-to .308, .223, and 9mm long arms), but with legislation looming I went out and bought an Aero Precision lower yesterday. If there's going to be a ban on purchase, I can't argue with the flexibility of the AR platform.

Nice stock on the Uzi! I must admit I much prefer it over the folders. SBR or is that the prop barrel?



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ouze wrote:
Yeah, I'm gonna get it. There is a new hole in the wall gun shop about 20 seconds from my house now, pinged that guy to see what his FFL fees are before buying.

But now we're concentrating on the peas, not the steak - as a Cheerios commercial once asked, "why not both?" I'm doing pretty well money wise, there is really not a good reason not to just buy this and then if the PSA roller locks are great, to buy one of those too.

Then I can have one in each hand, just like Carl Weathers in Predator.

I don't think you will be disappointed with the CZ. I suggest staying away from the PSA magazine if you want a magazine that drops free. They are tight, though could probably be sanded down. Magpuls are my favorite for the Skorp, they are releasing a drum.....

I imagine PSA can pull off the MP5. I'm happy with their Akv 9mm. Fething advice from Cheerios commercials why not both indeed. I like the sliding brace but it's a bit small for the best hookup. The dimensions seem to encourage chicken wings. I think I'm now waiting for an AR lower that takes scorpion magazines. Glock mags just aren't sexy.

 Insurgency Walker wrote:
Nice stock on the Uzi! I must admit I much prefer it over the folders. SBR or is that the prop barrel?

SBR. And yeah, it's a much nicer stock for actually shooting- the shorter LOP is more comfortable and the cheek weld is far better, and it can still be detached for compactness/transport. I find people tend to assume it's a civilian model thing, but it's actually the original configuration. From what I've read, Uzi Gal himself was strongly opposed to the metal folder.

I've still got the folder just because it's so iconic, but I don't ever need to concealed carry a submachine gun anymore so it stays in the parts bin.

Anyone have a Walther PPQ .45? I have one at a store here for a good price and it looks like a nice pistol. Any recomendations? I already have a 1911 but this Walther holds 12 rounds compares to the 1911's 8. That is impressive. I have heard nice things.

Haven't shot a PPQ in .45, but have owned a couple of PPQs and it's my main non-carry gun. Mine are first edition because I prefer the paddle magazine release. It's an excellent pistol all around. Comfortable, ergonomic, easy to manipulate, fully ambi-dextrous (Gen 1 at least, 2nd Gen lose that with the mag release).

Magazines for the 9mm are great quality and "okay" priced (around $35). Trigger is top three that you'll find in a plastic striker fired gun, mine easily rivals a 1911 trigger - but it's been heavily worn in. I don't know if the .45 trigger would be any different.

The ergos and trigger make the 9mm like a cheat button. I look like a far better shooter than I am, it's that easy. Thing's a laser.

PS: I have no idea on the reputation of the PPQ in .45. The 9mm is highly regarded as reliable with no major issues.

 Xenomancers wrote:
Anyone have a Walther PPQ .45? I have one at a store here for a good price and it looks like a nice pistol. Any recomendations? I already have a 1911 but this Walther holds 12 rounds compares to the 1911's 8. That is impressive. I have heard nice things.

Just FYI, if the magazine capacity is the main selling point, most double-stack .45 handguns have around that capacity. The Glock 21 has 13, the FNX-45 is 15, the P227 has 14 with an extended baseplate, and double-stack 1911 variants are typically 14.

The PPQ is pretty nice, but I think it handles better in 9mm. Same goes for most polymer handguns, really.

 catbarf wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
Anyone have a Walther PPQ .45? I have one at a store here for a good price and it looks like a nice pistol. Any recomendations? I already have a 1911 but this Walther holds 12 rounds compares to the 1911's 8. That is impressive. I have heard nice things.

Just FYI, if the magazine capacity is the main selling point, most double-stack .45 handguns have around that capacity. The Glock 21 has 13, the FNX-45 is 15, the P227 has 14 with an extended baseplate, and double-stack 1911 variants are typically 14.

The PPQ is pretty nice, but I think it handles better in 9mm. Same goes for most polymer handguns, really.

I am also looking at a 227. If I am gonna spend that much I am going to get a 220 in 10mm though (just cause it's cool). The Walther just seemed like a lot of bang for the buck and it is my favorite round to shoot. (not a fan of extended baseplates ether)(don't like glocks - they kill my hands)

 Ouze wrote:
Question for the team.

I've wanted a CZ Scorpion Evo 3 s2 w/ brace pretty much since I saw it. Now they seem to be readily available.

On the other hand, i hear tell on the internets that PSA is about to be putting out some MP5 clones.

You guys think the CZ is worth getting, or should I wait to see what the PSA stuff is like?

Difficulty: the CZ Scorpion Evo 3 s2 w/brace appears to have been discontinued for some reason. So I need to decide sight unseen, most likely. I don't know how long until they dry up.

I have a braced folding evo 3 with a Franklin binary for the "dakka". Just need to get an Omega 9k suppressor for it. Lots of fun.

 catbarf wrote:

 Insurgency Walker wrote:
Nice stock on the Uzi! I must admit I much prefer it over the folders. SBR or is that the prop barrel?

SBR. And yeah, it's a much nicer stock for actually shooting- the shorter LOP is more comfortable and the cheek weld is far better, and it can still be detached for compactness/transport. I find people tend to assume it's a civilian model thing, but it's actually the original configuration. From what I've read, Uzi Gal himself was strongly opposed to the metal folder.

I've still got the folder just because it's so iconic, but I don't ever need to concealed carry a submachine gun anymore so it stays in the parts bin.

Call me strange, but if I had my pick of subgun for a hostile environment I'd probably still pick an Uzi. Just wish aftermarket parts were I little less expensive for rails and optics.

 Insurgency Walker wrote:
Magpuls are my favorite for the Skorp, they are releasing a drum.....

My body is ready.


I can't really think of where I'd actually use one over a 30 in practical terms, but oh man do I need one anyway.

The Skorpion might be one of the few drum mags that makes practical sense if you are using it with the folding or a regular stock. They're not terribly huge unlike most other drum mags so carrying a couple around on a belt if you plan on using the weapon with the folding stock isn't bad. Only downside is you couldn't put it in a holster.

 Vaktathi wrote:

 Insurgency Walker wrote:
Magpuls are my favorite for the Skorp, they are releasing a drum.....

My body is ready.


I can't really think of where I'd actually use one over a 30 in practical terms, but oh man do I need one anyway.

Hmmm...Practical. I like some drums because they let you get closer to the ground.
Part of why I like some of the lower round count magazines for some firearms. Back in my day the monopod magazine position was considered to exacerbate feeding problems, but I served before anti tilt followers.

I did wind up ordering that Scorpion along with the Magpul grip / mags/extended mag release and a Burris Fastfire 3*. If they had the drums now I would have gotten those too, obviously. I'm a huge fan of drums - I don't think they're generally practical, but I love how they look. The only one I have so far is one of those Korean 75 rounders for my AK.

After this latest attack on my wallet subsides, I'll start looking into an appropriate can - I still need a 22LR can as well for my 22/45 Lite so maybe I can find a deal.

*Not wedded to the Fastfire, going to try it out and see what I think. I want something RMR style, but not RMR priced since I don't really need a rugged sight, this is a range toy.

Seen pretty solid things about the Holosun line of optics for a mid-range option.

They were a pretty top contender - a coworker brought one in for me to check out, and while I didn't run it through a torture test or anything, it seemed to have a surprisingly good build quality. I didn't really know the name as had assumed it was UTG airsoft grade junk... but after handling it, I was impressed. At least one thread I saw when looking around was full of people claiming they would trust Holosun over Eotech, which was mindblowing - I guess Eotech has had some quality control problems.

Eotech is hugely divisive. They've been extremely hit or miss (I had several issues with them on duty, personally). Their parent company(?), L3 was also caught installing counterfeit cheapo hardware in their products - and I think they were the military ones, a full CAGE contract/etc.

It was a big deal maybe 4-5 years ago, though I haven't followed it lately. Never had a reason or enthusiasm to purchase one. Mainly keep to Trijicon and Aimpoint. I'd definitely do a bit more research if you're heading that direction.

The only midrange companies I'm familiar with who seem to have generally solid reviews are Holosun and Vortex. I'm sure there are heaps more out there, but I haven't been in the game for a while. Once I slap an Aimpoint on a rifle I tend to stop shopping or paying much attention

I have Aimpoint, Eotech, and Vortex products. Oh, and a Sig red dot. And a Trijicon RMR. All are good. I love the Eotech reticule and it has been abused more than it should have been and still runs great.

My Aimpoint is also fantastic. No issues with it.

Having said all that, if I was doing it over I would probably own a lot more Vortex. Very solid products. I have one of their 3x magnifiers, and 3 different red dot sights. I don't think you can get a better sight for 1.5 times or even 2x their prices.

Vortex seems to be a perfect balance of price and performance to me.

I have a vortex red dot that I am very pleased with, and also a Viper PST 1-4 on my AR-15:

Very cool, interesting bolt action setup on that AR. The Viper is definitely a solid option.

I've got some Holosun optics. Their tube red dots I haven't been super impressed with, lots of battery related issues there (either parts falling out or batteries dying within hours). Their Eotech-esque Reflex sights like the 510C however have been awesome for me, I have 3 of these and have basically left them on 24/7 for a couple years now and they just work no matter what I do to them.

The Holosuns can be pretty hit-or-miss as far as quality, as can the Primary Arms (which are comparable OEM, but backed by better US support).

I have two SIG Romeo 5 red dots- one for airsoft, one for a 9mm PCC- and find them to be very good quality for the price. The motion activation is a handy feature, too.

Here's a question: I was looking at DDs yesterday and found something called the Anzio Takedown. It's chambered for 20mm Vulcan along with .50bmg and what sounds an awful lot like a 20mm necked down to 50cal. .

Anyone try one of these behemoths? If so, what's it like compared to the L-39?

I saw one once, but didn't get to handle it really much less shoot it unfortunately. Looks like fun if there's an appropriate range and targets

You can probably kill someone just by throwing the muzzle brake at them.

Sorry to swing this back to the 5.7 ammo again, but I just saw something kind-of interesting. Diamondback Firearms has a new subgun/carbine called the DBX 57. AR fire control group and takes FN57 mags (Ruger 57 mag version coming).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsNZ7i5S29A&t=337s

Around the 2:12 mark.

Looks kinda neat if one's into 5.7, a bit spicy on price but that's kinda to be expected with that caliber and still cheaper than a PS90.