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Normally, I'd start another thread, but seeing as this is a gun thread, and I have a gun question
I thought I'd ask it here, plus people have been very helpful in the past
and they probably own the guns in question.
To cut a long story short, I've mentioned before I'm interested in historic guns (anything pre 1945) and I was watching Zulu the other day. There's this scene where Stanley Baker is fighting off Zulus with his revolver, and it got me thinking::
is the age of the Revolver over?
Obviously, we have automatic pistols in this day and age, but is the revolver still a viable weapon for military, police, or even self-defense?
Or is it now a history piece, its memory held together by a small band of dedicated enthusiasts, some of whom are probably my fellow dakka members who own and enjoy shooting revolvers.
Thanks for any replies.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
I think it is still a reliable self defense weapon, especially in the home were it will sit in a drawer or some place for years at a time. A semi-auto might have had its springs set over that time but a revolver will still fire reliably.
As for Police or military, nope.
I love Webleys, I have several of them. The Indiana Jones gun
If you dont short hand your list, Im not reading it.
Example: Assault Intercessors- x5 -Thunder hammer and plasma pistol on sgt.
or Assault Terminators 3xTH/SS, 2xLCs
For the love of God, GW, get rid of reroll mechanics. ALL OF THEM!
Col. Dash wrote: I think it is still a reliable self defense weapon, especially in the home were it will sit in a drawer or some place for years at a time. A semi-auto might have had its springs set over that time but a revolver will still fire reliably.
As for Police or military, nope.
I love Webleys, I have several of them. The Indiana Jones gun
When I was young, I was raised on a diet of British War films and Empire tales: Zulu, Charlton Heston fighting them off with a revolver in Gordon of Khartoum, and even Errol Flynn in that charge of the light brigade film.
A trusty revolver was always at their side. And of course, numerous Western and American civil war films.
For want of a better word, there's something more 'romantic' about a revolver than an automatic. Probably to do with its history.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Revolvers do have their place, and their advantages.
For one thing, they are significantly less selective when it comes to what ammo will work in them. Semi-autos sometimes tend to have a problem cycling some rounds. They might run too hot, or might not have enough bang to chamber the next round. Other times they might have issues with steel cases, or some semi-autos might not like hollow points. You also have to factor in that semi-autos only properly function if the bullet weight is within a certain range. With revolvers it's really not an issue. They will pretty much shoot whatever crap you can fit into the cylinder. This is particularly nice for reloads.
Revolvers also have their sights directly mounted to the barrel. Many Semi-autos do not and have their barrels as a moving mechanism. This means that Revolvers have a slight edge in accuracy. (Note, direct blowback semiautos don't usually have this issue).
In the case of self defense, you can have a revolver loaded for literally decades with no worry that it will function when needed. Semi autos can, after time, suffer from spring fatigue in the magazine. This means that the spring in the magazine gets weak and will fail to feed the next round into the chamber.
If you have a semi auto and have a dud round your gun stops working until you re-rack a new round. With a revolver, you just keep pulling the trigger.
Revolvers are also significantly less likely to malfunction. When a semi-auto ejects it's round it can get stuck in the chamber, fail to extract, or double feed.
If you are into reloading revolvers are great. You don't have to go hunting all over the ground looking for spent brass.
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Normally, I'd start another thread, but seeing as this is a gun thread, and I have a gun question
I thought I'd ask it here, plus people have been very helpful in the past
and they probably own the guns in question.
To cut a long story short, I've mentioned before I'm interested in historic guns (anything pre 1945) and I was watching Zulu the other day. There's this scene where Stanley Baker is fighting off Zulus with his revolver, and it got me thinking::
is the age of the Revolver over?
Obviously, we have automatic pistols in this day and age, but is the revolver still a viable weapon for military, police, or even self-defense?
Or is it now a history piece, its memory held together by a small band of dedicated enthusiasts, some of whom are probably my fellow dakka members who own and enjoy shooting revolvers.
Thanks for any replies.
Do you own a Webley .45 yet? (the Revolver he had).
Its fight shooting with a brick of lead, but man its awesome. Plus you can use it as a hammer to build a house.
To your question, outside of concealed carry -where it is very viable- I don't see it as a viable in a military of police context. I could see it as a house gun where it generally is more accurate and has less recoil.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: Normally, I'd start another thread, but seeing as this is a gun thread, and I have a gun question
I thought I'd ask it here, plus people have been very helpful in the past
and they probably own the guns in question.
To cut a long story short, I've mentioned before I'm interested in historic guns (anything pre 1945) and I was watching Zulu the other day. There's this scene where Stanley Baker is fighting off Zulus with his revolver, and it got me thinking::
is the age of the Revolver over?
Obviously, we have automatic pistols in this day and age, but is the revolver still a viable weapon for military, police, or even self-defense?
Or is it now a history piece, its memory held together by a small band of dedicated enthusiasts, some of whom are probably my fellow dakka members who own and enjoy shooting revolvers.
Thanks for any replies.
Do you own a Webley .45 yet? (the Revolver he had).
Its fight shooting with a brick of lead, but man its awesome. Plus you can use it as a hammer to build a house.
To your question, outside of concealed carry -where it is very viable- I don't see it as a viable in a military of police context. I could see it as a house gun where it generally is more accurate and has less recoil.
I've never fired a Webley before, but I'm in the same boat as you Frazz, raise on a diet of classic war and western films.
A brave British Captain, alone on the edge of Empire, surrounded by fierce tribemen, armed with nothing more than his trusty revolver, sharp wit, and a dash of courage, or something like that
Automatically Appended Next Post:
cuda1179 wrote: Revolvers do have their place, and their advantages.
For one thing, they are significantly less selective when it comes to what ammo will work in them. Semi-autos sometimes tend to have a problem cycling some rounds. They might run too hot, or might not have enough bang to chamber the next round. Other times they might have issues with steel cases, or some semi-autos might not like hollow points. You also have to factor in that semi-autos only properly function if the bullet weight is within a certain range. With revolvers it's really not an issue. They will pretty much shoot whatever crap you can fit into the cylinder. This is particularly nice for reloads.
Revolvers also have their sights directly mounted to the barrel. Many Semi-autos do not and have their barrels as a moving mechanism. This means that Revolvers have a slight edge in accuracy. (Note, direct blowback semiautos don't usually have this issue).
In the case of self defense, you can have a revolver loaded for literally decades with no worry that it will function when needed. Semi autos can, after time, suffer from spring fatigue in the magazine. This means that the spring in the magazine gets weak and will fail to feed the next round into the chamber.
If you have a semi auto and have a dud round your gun stops working until you re-rack a new round. With a revolver, you just keep pulling the trigger.
Revolvers are also significantly less likely to malfunction. When a semi-auto ejects it's round it can get stuck in the chamber, fail to extract, or double feed.
If you are into reloading revolvers are great. You don't have to go hunting all over the ground looking for spent brass.
Good info, thanks. I've been watching gun channels on youtube, and they were saying similar things to your post. With regards to the webley, they were also saying that there is a probelm with some webleys that were converted to fire ammunition more widely available in the USA.
Sometimes, if the shaving? is not done properly, the webley struggles to fire, which is a shame.
My interest is primarily historical/miniature wargaming, so its good to learn these facts about revolvers, especially if you're running an RPG and one of the players has a revolver.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/08/30 13:06:21
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
A friend had one and carried it for a bit. It was the heaviest pistol I picked up outside of my big model 29. I do believe its the British equivalent of a Mosin Nagant and a tank could run over it without affecting it. Thing had like a 20 lb trigger pull though.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Frazzled wrote: A friend had one and carried it for a bit. It was the heaviest pistol I picked up outside of my big model 29. I do believe its the British equivalent of a Mosin Nagant and a tank could run over it without affecting it. Thing had like a 20 lb trigger pull though.
You may think this is a simple gun thread, but it's more than that. For me, it's a repository of knowledge.
Example. A few months ago, I was reading Custer and Crazy Horse. Wonderful book, highly recommended.
But as you read, simple questions begin to form:
How hard is it to fire a revolver from a horse? How accurate is it? Could you reload it with one hand? And so on and so on.
As you get older, you release that warfare is not easy, and that practical questions take on a life of their own.
Luckily, there are knowledgeable people on dakka who can answer this stuff, becuase they have the practical experience, and of course, it helps me with running my RPGs, and other historical curiosities.
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
I have a webley mark 6 cut for .45 ACP. It is a tank. Trigger pull is heavy so I usually fire it single action.
The problems are largely myth. Don't shoot +P in it and it's fine. The original .455 loads might not get struck hard enough by the firing pin due to the cylinder shaving but regular .45 ACP is fine.
Break-top revolvers (the kind that open like a double barreled shotgun) are something I love to look at. Other than a Webley, has there ever been another Break-top that was double action?
If a modern design was ever introduced I'd buy one up in a heartbeat.
How hard is it to fire a revolver from a horse? How accurate is it? Could you reload it with one hand? And so on and so on.
As you get older, you release that warfare is not easy, and that practical questions take on a life of their own.
:
I never got into the riding + cowboy action shooting, but I knew a few ladies who were top of their class in the country with six shooters in that sort of thing, they make it look easy!
these are not those ladies, but similar idea.
Nostromodamus wrote: I have a webley mark 6 cut for .45 ACP. It is a tank. Trigger pull is heavy so I usually fire it single action.
The problems are largely myth. Don't shoot +P in it and it's fine. The original .455 loads might not get struck hard enough by the firing pin due to the cylinder shaving but regular .45 ACP is fine.
Here's a good video on the Webley, including a pistol that was cut to accept .45ACP
My favorite handgun and my go-to home defense gun is a Ruger Security-Six chambered in .357 Magnum.
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
Okay, I got a new AR type rifle (not allowed to show pictures yet) and am thinking about optics.
I have an Aimpoint PRO with a Vortex 3x magnifier on my HK. I am considering trying something different.
I like the ability to go from magnified to not magnified., so ACOG is probably not the answer.
Any one have any experience with the Elcan Specter? (specifically, can you co-witness at the 1x setting?)
How about Eotech stuff. I know about the issues with extreme heat throwing point of impact off. You can get a set with an EXPS2-2 and G33 3x Magnifier. What do you guys think of Eotech?
Son2 has the option of putting ACOGs or Eotechs on his 'work' rifle and says he likes the Eotech better, but for somethings the magnification of the ACOG is better (not so good for close quarters).
What is the opinion of the various Dakka gun folks?
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
Elcan's optics are insanely expensive but very good. EOtech left a bad taste in everyone's mouth when they gamed the test to land a military contract...I also had one go TU on me so I'm done with them.
One group you might consider is Vortex - they make plenty of variable power scopes. Their Strike Eagle optic is very good for the price point. Peshmerganor, the Instagram celebrity who is in Kurdistan fighting ISIS, runs one of those on his 20" AR.
Also check out the Primary Arms Platinum scopes, they're ~1300 but have a very cool reticle, and true 1-8 variable power.
CptJake wrote: Vortex also has a FANTASTIC discount for LEOs, military and veterans, which is one reason I got the magnifier I have from them.
Do you know if at 1x the Primary Arms will co-witness? Some 1x have a bit too much distortion to use the iron sights.
I don't think it will. Is that a requirement? AFAIK most of these tubed 1-N times scopes won't permit a cowitness.
Probably better to get a LaRue quick disconnect mount and take it off if you want to use the BUIS.
It is a requirement for me, which is one reason I was looking at that Eotech with magnifier package. The magnifier flips out of the way just like my Vortex.
As for offset sights, not a fan, I hate having to use a different cheek weld.
Thanks for the suggestions/comments. Keep 'em coming.
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
Seems like your question is answered. RDS/MAG. Like nuggz said I don't believe any of the 1x-XX are able to cowitness with BUIS. I'm going to double check because now I'm curious.
yellowfever wrote: Seems like your question is answered. RDS/MAG. Like nuggz said I don't believe any of the 1x-XX are able to cowitness with BUIS. I'm going to double check because now I'm curious.
That is one reason I asked about the Eclan Specter. I've heard yes and no, and would like to know the truth. Guess I could see if the manufacturer will answer the question.
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
Nostromodamus wrote: I have a webley mark 6 cut for .45 ACP. It is a tank. Trigger pull is heavy so I usually fire it single action.
The problems are largely myth. Don't shoot +P in it and it's fine. The original .455 loads might not get struck hard enough by the firing pin due to the cylinder shaving but regular .45 ACP is fine.
I don't recall, but I think .45 Auto Rim will also work in a Webley converted over to .45 ACP.
Nostromodamus wrote: I have a webley mark 6 cut for .45 ACP. It is a tank. Trigger pull is heavy so I usually fire it single action.
The problems are largely myth. Don't shoot +P in it and it's fine. The original .455 loads might not get struck hard enough by the firing pin due to the cylinder shaving but regular .45 ACP is fine.
I don't recall, but I think .45 Auto Rim will also work in a Webley converted over to .45 ACP.
Honestly after learning to shoot out to 600m with iron sights on a 20" M16, I will stick with my Aim Points that co-witness. The ACOGs are nice but if you don't have the correct reticle for your specific setup, its kind of a PITA.
Eventually I would like to put a Luepold Mk4 1.25-4x on my M1A Scout.
JSF wrote:... this is really quite an audacious move by GW, throwing out any pretext that this is a game and that its customers exist to do anything other than buy their overpriced products for the sake of it. The naked arrogance, greed and contempt for their audience is shocking.
