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If it's a straight +1 cover, of course it will.
The real question would be, is it still only at over 12" away?

 Ovion wrote:
If it's a straight +1 cover, of course it will.
The real question would be, is it still only at over 12" away?

That is a good question and also if it is only +1 cover save then does it give an auto 6+ cover save when the vehicle is not in cover otherwise? The WD battle report makes me think it does (because the opponent is all nutty when the guy makes a 6+ DP save, which I presume he needed because he didn't move the Hammerhead?).

The advantage of being just a straight up +1 cover save bonus would be that when night fighting rolls around that +1 cover save is going to combo with the Stealth the vehicle can get from night fighting.

 boy wonder wrote:
apparently plasma rifles are now 15pts.. 20pts TL which is MUCH better.

15 pts plasma? The day keeps getting better and better if i get a hold of the Codex by tomorrow i think i can do some QnA for point cost, im actually looking forward to the Armory, all the special issue and such, if MP and PR got their points reduced to 10 and 15, im the happiest Tau player on the island

Things are looking solid...a lot of good combos in there.

I have one request for everyone reading this thread;

Please go to the forgeworld website, and and email them asking for them to please update their tau units for 6th.

Here is the address:
"If you have any rules suggestions or feedback about Imperial Armour rules then please e-mail them to us at

ImperialArmour@games-workshop.co.uk

Please Note: This e-mail address is not for sales, events enquires or customer service problems. Please use the Forge World e-mail address for any such queries as this will provide a far faster response. This address is for game related feedback and will be read by the Imperial Armour Editors, not the Forge World Customer Service Team."

Please be polite in your email, but also please email them, after all they WANT us to...

I love my fw models, some updated rules for them would be wonderful.

thank you.

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
Oh, just a thing I've seen asked but not answered about the DP . Only +1 cover save now (like stealth, but it's not really "Stealth"...dunno why)

For nightfight.

Backfire wrote:

 YotsubaSnake wrote:
Every time I see someone complaining about how the revealed stats we've seen so far for the codex seem weak, I keep thinking of how little they must have played with or against the old codex.

It's just strange as the new book seems to gone so much to other extreme when it comes to dealing with heavy armour. OK, maybe the old staple of shoveling Broadsides on the board got old real fast, but now the Railgun has all but disappeared from the codex?? Once again, it looks like you need Broadsides and Hammerheads in your heavy support slots, except now you take more Hammerheads at expense of Broadsides, which leaves you with what exactly to put your Sky Rays and Sniper Drones in...? That's right, the trashcan, where they already spent the previous 2 editions. I just don't understand how this is supposed to work.

Maybe it is because I actually enjoyed fielding underplayed units, but I feel that there were plenty of unappreciated options for armor that the old codex could use. Of course, AV10-12 was a cake because you have so many options to deal with it, however AV14 is where it always was a challenge. Basically, what would happen is that if my opponent had a Land Raider on the table, he was going to do everything in his power to make sure my railguns were off the board as soon as possible. This leaves you in a situation where you have to just shoot it out, hope you kill things before they die or hide them and let them advance on you while you kept them safe until the right moment. I elected for a third option, however, and used fusion blasters. On stealth/crisis suits, you could easily jump them into 6" and if you hit they are more likely to blow up than if you hit them with a railgun. Now that I can do that from 9", I have no fear of being caught in the vehicle blowing up, reducing casualties and making it much easier for that unit to escape in the assault phase.

Since this is all happening in your elite/HQ slots, you now are left with more fexibility in your heavy support. I havn't even thrown in the posibilities of the Riptide suit yet, but I'm sure that it will just as awesome in that area.

Are the vespid able to be taken in squads of 12 finally? It's a minor point but an incredibly annoying one that in an army of squads of multiples of 3 (3,6,12) that the vespid could only get to 11. It certainly doesn't help that I have 12 vespid either. It's not game breaking but I'd imagine marine players would find it wierd to have a certain squad be a 9 max instead of 10.

Oh! Pulse Carbines are now Assault 2, so Gun Drones shoot a twin linked Assault 2. Gun Drone squads sound kinda scary for putting some lead in the air now.

 warboss wrote:
Are the vespid able to be taken in squads of 12 finally?

Yes, they are.
BTW no secret units in the book that need models in a second wave, everything will be released by Saturday, including all characters.
And no Psi-cards, which is good

Still, actually losing 2 points of str on broadsides, for a miraculous drop of 5 points per model, whilst not gaining the "iridium armor" or a natural invuln, makes broads not much more than a dungheap useful only for expensive, fairly uninspiring amounts of AA. I think this codex is going to be a lot more about "how can i get melta over there without losing all of my dudes in the process?", even moreso than most marine armies. Ravagers are better AT than railguns now for feth's sake lol. My prediction of the tau metagame is 3 hammerheads, cadre fireblades & ethereals (dunno how many you can take per slot), 9 helios/fireknife suits, 36+ FW and a token unit of 20 sniperkroot, and some pathfinders & vespids to round it out, plus an ADL - vespids if using fireknifes especially.

Alternative "may win local tourneys but never going to win GT's with regularity" lists will be farsight bomb, lists with 4+ missilesides, 2+ riptides, 2+flyers, and kroot heavy lists. Fish of Fury may see a comeback, but tbh the "stand still for more dakka" stuff will kill that meta right and quick.

This is without seeing any particularly groundbreaking new stuff in the special wargear section for generals. I think it's pretty safe to say Tau haven't lost their army feel, but it's going to be pretty tough to kill 3 predators, even, much less 3+ leman russ, or 3 hellturkeys (still...), and vendettas are now king of long range AT and antiflyer at the same time, whilst blapping their points worth of broadsides/crisis suits each turn because feth tau specifically.

Things may have gotten better for a lot of tau units, but the codex as a whole doesn't give me the "wow" feel GK did, where everything is pretty powerful, or the feeling IG did where you can take a hundred different lists, and fit enough firepower in no matter what you took, or heck, the feeling DE did which was making units that may not even be very great, worth taking simply because of beautiful models or fun rules. Strikes me as being like CSM sans helldrakes and cult marines, or DA sans bikes and terminators. Tau's special snowflakes are crisis suits, who carry special weapons because squads can't (and thus become target #1, as they're very vulnerable units), and pathfinders, who are target #2 and very very squishy now. When the snowflakes of other armies can at least be delivered to their target with a durable, reliable transport, or just stand around shooting because they're armored/costed for it, I feel like tau are missing that element.

Well, glad we've got all that figured out. We can go ahead and pack it in kids. Don't bother actually reading the book, the reviews are in!

On a more serious note the stuff I'm seeing is solid. It fits the 6th mindset they've been going with the last 3 books and also throws a huge wrench (again) in the current way armies will play. Honestly the insane anti-air is going to lead people back to playing more balanced lists. Especially given how popular Tau have always been.

 Hulksmash wrote:
Well, glad we've got all that figured out. We can go ahead and pack it in kids. Don't bother actually reading the book, the reviews are in!

I lol'd

On a more serious note the stuff I'm seeing is solid. It fits the 6th mindset they've been going with the last 3 books and also throws a huge wrench (again) in the current way armies will play. Honestly the insane anti-air is going to lead people back to playing more balanced lists. Especially given how popular Tau have always been.

This is very appealing to me. Flyer spam may have a hard counter now.

 Kroothawk wrote:

 warboss wrote:
Are the vespid able to be taken in squads of 12 finally?

Yes, they are.
BTW no secret units in the book that need models in a second wave, everything will be released by Saturday, including all characters.
And no Psi-cards, which is good

All in line with the rest of the 6th Edition releases...Chapterhouse definitely caused them to get their act together.

That being said, I do see second waves as a possibility...perhaps to give armies new sprues or models for ones carried over from previous editions (i.e. Crisis suits, FWs, etc.). One can hope, at least...lol

 pretre wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
Well, glad we've got all that figured out. We can go ahead and pack it in kids. Don't bother actually reading the book, the reviews are in!

I lol'd

Glad I could help make the day less tedious

Tau vs Tau battles are going to be bloody, with all the S7 Ap4 and AP2/3 ion shots going around

 Kroothawk wrote:

BTW no secret units in the book that need models in a second wave, everything will be released by Saturday, including all characters.
And no Psi-cards, which is good

Fantastic.

Trasvi wrote:
Tau vs Tau battles are going to be bloody, with all the S7 Ap4 and AP2/3 ion shots going around

All simulated blood in training skirmishes

uberjoras wrote:
Still, actually losing 2 points of str on broadsides, for a miraculous drop of 5 points per model, whilst not gaining the "iridium armor" or a natural invuln, makes broads not much more than a dungheap useful only for expensive, fairly uninspiring amounts of AA.

Well, let's take a look at the changes to Railgun Broadsides:

- lost 2 S from their primary weapon as well as 12" of range.
- 5 pt cost reduction per model
- Shas'vres got a +1 LD
- Plasma Rifles upgrade is 5 pts cheaper
- can get skyfire upgrades
- any suit can take up to two drones without eating a slot for a drone controller now

So overall, they took a substantial reduction in effectiveness against heavy armor and super high toughness MCs as well as lost some range. They still will pretty easily destroy almost any light armor at range and standard MCs and can cover most of the board. They are as resilient as ever, even more so when you consider that the charge protection the rest of the army can provide now. They are cheaper and give you more options to outfit them. Overall I think that they are still a very solid unit, and the changes to their railguns are better for the health of the game as they were a big deterrent to any TAC list utilizing heavy armor (certainly not the only deterrent, but definitely one of the primary reasons).

I agree Maelstrom. How often in this edition to really come across av14? Not much. With the range extension of fusion blasters I think they will become the weapon of choice for av14 and w/ all the S7 everywhere now we'll be glancing everything else to death.

Anyone seen the price of the pathfinder yet? I'm trying to think if they outweigh tetras yet.

uberjoras wrote:
This is without seeing any particularly groundbreaking new stuff in the special wargear section for generals. I think it's pretty safe to say Tau haven't lost their army feel, but it's going to be pretty tough to kill 3 predators, even, much less 3+ leman russ, or 3 hellturkeys (still...), and vendettas are now king of long range AT and antiflyer at the same time, whilst blapping their points worth of broadsides/crisis suits each turn because feth tau specifically.

I couldn't dissagree with you more. In fact, I showed some of these spanish-confirmations to my IG playing best friend this morning, he had nothing but lighthearted disdain for our new units. He's not excited to fight me now, considering other things, such as the new access to other str 8 weapons.

Sure, we lost ONE S10 option, but we gained how many other options did we get for S8 or more? We're still a huge threat against armor. Infact, I'd argue we're more dangerous now because of our improved general access to high strength weaponry.

But my opinion is forged from the fact that I've played Tau for 5 years, and last week I finished building my third (and final) broadside. So I'm a bit biased. I've always been a hammerhead man, and I know that many Tau players spam broadsides... my hunch is that's why broadsides had their gun nerfed. They were too good and all the tau players spammed them. It was boring and cheesy. Good riddace.

But then again, I disdain tournements and lists tailored for such things. I play what is fun.

Hulksmash has this one.

Not sure what all the lamentation is, this army will be able to blow airplanes out of the air, and if you don't see it you are blind. Tank-hunting str 8 ap 1 skyfire railguns (attach the commander with the Puretide Engram and pick tankhunter).

Riptide with fusion blaster/heavy guass with skyfire.

Crisis suits with winlinked fusion and skyfire.

Skyray.

I can't see how this list won't be a hard counter to air units. In addition even heavy armor can be dealt with. The LR is the only with with all direction armor 14. Run pirhana's with seekers up a side, fire the markerlights with no cover, str 8 on side armor 11 or 10 on vehicles.

Also, even landraiders you will be able to move up to 9 inches in, fire some markerlights and if your commander is present, use tank hunter. I don't know about you but I am already seeing twin fusion and plasma as my weapons of choice on the crisis suits.

As for tournament viable? We'll find out when I take them to Wargames Con in two months.

I think there is some legitimacy to the complaining about having lost access to some of our S10 stuff. Personally I think it would have been a better change to make Skyrays the Anti-Air of choice, and keep Broadsides' S10 but without Skyfire. I mean the seeker missile on their back would have been enough sky fire, imo.
Now we have too much anti-air, but maybe one good anti heavy armor shot per turn, IF we chose a Railgun over an Ion Cannon, which is a big 'if' now with the massed SM gibbing capacity of the Ion Cannon.
So now we have to glance LRs to death? Perhaps that was their intention behind the quantity of S8 stuff we get.

I'm actually not that bothered. I just think it would have made more sense to give us just a tiny bit more heavy tank busting and a tiny bit less sky fire. But it is what it is. I'll reserve my final assessment until after I take in all the info of the dex.

To be fair, I always had an issue with the Broadside and the Hammerhead Railguns having the same statline. The Hammerhead's railgun is significantly larger than the Broadside's railgun. Getting 40% larger just to gain submunitions seemed a little odd.

And Str8 AP1 skyfire is NOT something to be taken lightly. People will take Tau allies just for that.

New Tau bomber looks almost exactly like a NASA concept plane. I wish they would have stuck with the roots of tau design and followed something along the lines of a barracuda or tigershark form...

-Nikolakhs

looks like a B1 with a tail

I know this has been asked a few (4-5?) pages back, but can we get some confirmation as to the rumored FO limitations are with O'Shovah based lists? I have been doing my best to spot any sign of limitations from the pic of the O'Shovah pages but I am not seeing any and I don't speak Spanish

Also, has it been confirmed that Crisis Commanders can take Bodyguards and what the size limits are to the number of bodyguard (outside of O'Shovah 7)? I have not seen a picture of that page on the Spanish website, so any confirmation there would be helpful.

First in am a Marine Player [Space Wolves, Dark Angles mostly] and I don’t see the issue with the S8 AP 1 Weapons. Sure you can only glance a Land Raider on a 6, but everything else is going to vaporize on a 4+ on the damage charts. We don’t have a single weapon that can do that at 60”.
A Lack of AP 3, we don’t have a lot of AP 4 weapons out there. Yes we have them, but not a whole of them if we take a lot of AV 14.
You have whole squads armed with mobile “Heavy Bolters” [as far as Power Armor is concerned]. This is going to make them a very strong Shooty Army. With your 30” I am going to have to come out of my cover to shoot at you while you don’t have to.

I think you are going to have a good strong codex that will have more than one or builds to take on most armies, this actually makes me happy even as a Marine Player.

As a Tau player, I'm glad for all the changes. I was so sick of the 4x6 FWs in devilfish with max broadsides lists. BORING! Now there are several viable lists to make. Yeah we lost some strength 10. So what? it just means we have to be more manuverable to get those side/back armour shots; just the way Tau should be played.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 spaceman spiff wrote:
I know this has been asked a few (4-5?) pages back, but can we get some confirmation as to the rumored FO limitations are with O'Shovah based lists? I have been doing my best to spot any sign of limitations from the pic of the O'Shovah pages but I am not seeing any and I don't speak Spanish

Also, has it been confirmed that Crisis Commanders can take Bodyguards and what the size limits are to the number of bodyguard (outside of O'Shovah 7)? I have not seen a picture of that page on the Spanish website, so any confirmation there would be helpful.

There are no farce org restrictions for Farsight. Also, commanders can have 3 bodyguards, while Farsight gets 7.

I don't know what some are complaining about. This codex opens up so many more ways for Tau to be even more strategic then before. In all honesty they seem borderline OP imo. Way more S5 AP5 pulse shots than before from the same amount of units, 20 infitrating snipers per kroot squad shots per turn, skyfire on anything and everything pretty much, more S7 AP4 missiles than you can count, fusion at 18" now, several different kinds of S8 or S9 large blast templates w/ ap2/3, cheaper more massed markerlights,the list goes on. No wonder they sold out, they went from middle to Extremely TOP Tier in one afternoon it seems so far. Not a big fan of playing other Tau armies but it's likely we all will see them everywhere in the coming weeks and months.

Im just glad it seems everything that i already have and modeled will be 100% relevant. and that i don't have to buy 20 new shinys to stay competitive. at least from current information.