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Now just to clarify;

Can a store buy used armies from a customer, then resell them, since that doesn't constitute removing components from original packaging?

Even though it does constitute reselling items to consumers without original packages.

See I read that google doc as all good stuff. Devaluing the product? Brilliant. Removing expensive labeling? Even better!

They still wont pass the savings onto you.
Sometimes i wish i didnt go onto the Rumors.
It really makes me hate GW sometimes.

I think the whole thing stinks! Living in an area where the nearest retailer is over an hour away, it is much more convenient for me to buy on-line, save 20% or so over the GW price and do it all from the comfort of my home. As an avid GW gamer since 1987, who owns more than 8000 minis from GW alone, I hope this back fires on them in every nasty way possible.

How will they have proof they got them from OOTB??
Who cares if they cant sell to someone under 14? thats good IMO

 pretre wrote:
I want to start a 'GW prohibits Heroin Use in store employees' thread to see what happens.

This has been a non issue since page one. Lol

It's an issue to most indy retailers I've known as they've been opening and splitting the boxed set games since there have been boxed set games, that is now verboten under these new rules.

It's this kind of crap that makes me glad i'm selling out of the hobby.

remember plent of other retailers are prevented from splitting 'box sets' they have bought

especially in the food retail ares

eg multipacks of crisps or chocolate, or soft drinks

What if this does mean they are brining back the Bitz service.
Hotsauceman1 said naively.

As long as Ebay continues to sell bits and used armies I will be happy. From what I read it doesnt effect EBay so all good.

@Orlando: Usually because the packs they sell have a lower cost per unit than the same product sold as a single item, exactly the same than in GW.... errrr not

M.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

overkongen wrote:
Different countries might have different rules, but surely once you buy something you own it and can resell it however you like.

It depends, In america you cant modify your phone to do what you want it to.

incorrect, you cant modify your service providers phone. If you bought the phone, then its yours. If however you paid 85 cents for your phone then you have to abide by the terms put forth by the people who agree'd to eat a 400 dollar loss on that phone.

GW could have contacted ebay years ago and instructed them not to allow anyone to sell any bits. Period.

I imagine they didn't is because ebay would laugh in their faces...

All bitz people have to do is legally seperate their businesses and supply from one to the other for breaking up. Job done. I can't imagine the bitz provider is legally obliged to give GW any details of their trading address, owner or supplier unless they are sued.

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
remember plent of other retailers are prevented from splitting 'box sets' they have bought

especially in the food retail ares

eg multipacks of crisps or chocolate, or soft drinks

The vast majority of goods you can. Most soft drinks can be split and sold as single cans or bottles. Many things like crisps and chocolates are available in single serving sizes from vending machines or gas stations. They frown on opening up a big bag of chips and selling those by the handful, but even there...you can find delis that do as much with anything from chips to pickles to drinks from large containers.

Food manufacturers do what they do for compliance issues (marking nutritional data for example). Beyond that, they dont care.

Um.... Isn't GW already back in the Bitz business?

I mean, at least 1/3 of the FW Horus Heresy releases have been weapons packs, shoulder pads, command squad and vehicle upgrades...

Looks like Bitz to me...

@Balisong - 4-5 years ago (or was it more?) GW had an awesome bits service. You could literally buy any single component from any one of their miniatures, so of course anything that is around these days is going to pale in significance compared to that - even overpriced packs of FW bolters and the like.

 TheContortionist wrote:
It's this kind of crap that makes me glad i'm selling out of the hobby.

They want you to think they are the Hobby. Actions like the one described in this thread makes you think their upper management must genuinely believe it as well; only a company that genuinely existed within a monopoly situation would be so customer unfriendly and seemingly constantly declaring war on the independent shops that sell their products.

But, nothing could be further from the truth. There is a whole world of other wargames out there, many of which have pretty good discussion here on Dakka and their own section: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/369662.page Another good way of finding a new game is by looking on a big wargaming store website, and just spending half an hour clicking on random stuff!

Thanks in part to the internet, there is a wide range of high quality wargames, many of which offer something different, that are growing and more popular now than ever (with apparently a 20% growth in the industry last year).

hotsauceman1 wrote:They still wont pass the savings onto you.
Sometimes i wish i didnt go onto the Rumors.
It really makes me hate GW sometimes.

I still play the occasional game of 40k, but I'm not really into it that much at the moment. If I was, you're right, I wouldn't want to visit some of the forums and read about this kind of stuff. Simply because I'm principled, and don't find it easy to want to be part of, or give money to, a company that is run by a bunch of arseholes.

Well, TBH if i followed all my principles, i would would even be on the internet. I would have to be hunting wild bears with a knife and bow to feed myself.
You have to give up some princibles to live.

haha yes you are right mate, although in this situation it's easy - there is only one company that goes on in this way in the industry, you can take your pick from any one of the others that are generally far more conscientious.

Why are people complaining about GW prices? If you have to complain about GW prices (which I do as well, guilty as charged) then you are not part of GW demographic for sales.

Why are we not complaining about the prices of Ferraris and other high priced cars? Because most of us don't make the money to get them, so we don't complain about it.

GW is not for the common gamer. It's a luxury item just like Ferraris and other high performance cars or any other luxury expensive items. They are not made for us. Just like GW is not made for us either.

So to keep complaining about prices and going else where, GW doesn't care, because their sales were never intended for us in the first place. If we buy it's just a bonus. If we don't buy, it's no loss to GW in the first place, because they don't expect a sale from us anyways.

So while it sucks that GW is preventing Bitz sales, that is what we should be complaining about, not their overpriced minis and how expensive they are to get.

 Pacific wrote:

They want you to think they are the Hobby. Actions like the one described in this thread makes you think their upper management must genuinely believe it as well; only a company that genuinely existed within a monopoly situation would be so customer unfriendly and seemingly constantly declaring war on the independent shops that sell their products.

Games workshop is a Oligopoly in a very niche market, and does own the majority of the market share for this industry.

 Lockark wrote:

 Pacific wrote:

They want you to think they are the Hobby. Actions like the one described in this thread makes you think their upper management must genuinely believe it as well; only a company that genuinely existed within a monopoly situation would be so customer unfriendly and seemingly constantly declaring war on the independent shops that sell their products.

Games workshop is a Oligopoly in a very niche market, and does own the majority of the market share for this industry.

That is true. If GW ceased to exist today, I am sure, while the other market share will see a small increase, the "Hobby" will be dead because all the GW players just want GW and nothing else. The Hobby is only big as it is, is because of GW.

Only reason why a lot of FLGS exsist, is because of Magic the Gathering. GW sales are second after that. (At least over here). So if there is no Magic, GW is not strong enough for these FLGS to open. So if GW can't even keep a FLGS open how is the other market share going to do it?

 Grimstonefire wrote:
GW could have contacted ebay years ago and instructed them not to allow anyone to sell any bits. Period.

I imagine they didn't is because ebay would laugh in their faces...

All bitz people have to do is legally seperate their businesses and supply from one to the other for breaking up. Job done. I can't imagine the bitz provider is legally obliged to give GW any details of their trading address, owner or supplier unless they are sued.

This is covered in the retailer policy, too. Basically retailers are prohibited from selling to anyone who is not a consumer. Selling to other retailers, services, companies,etc is verboten.

Now, it'd be easy to get around this as they couldn't force you to open your books, but if they caught wind, they could shut you down and point at existing policy.

Under section 1, general requirements:

Retailers are permitted to resell GAMES W ORKSHOP products to Consumers only.
Retailers are prohibited from reselling GAMES W ORKSHOP products to other Retailers,
distributors or any other non-Consumer customers.

 WarOne wrote:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Despite GW ordering them not to come onto forums, many will be store employees, fully topped up with righteous zeal, programming from the little red book and love for the company, well, until they get fired in the next wave of 'commissar summary executions' or 'exterminatus' or whatever creepy fictional crossover term they are applying to their repulsive corporate practices this week...

I like to think former GW employess become honorary squats...

Heh. I still have that vaunted 'little red book' and give it a read from time to time and giggle.

Davor wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 Pacific wrote:

They want you to think they are the Hobby. Actions like the one described in this thread makes you think their upper management must genuinely believe it as well; only a company that genuinely existed within a monopoly situation would be so customer unfriendly and seemingly constantly declaring war on the independent shops that sell their products.

Games workshop is a Oligopoly in a very niche market, and does own the majority of the market share for this industry.

That is true. If GW ceased to exist today, I am sure, while the other market share will see a small increase, the "Hobby" will be dead because all the GW players just want GW and nothing else. The Hobby is only big as it is, is because of GW.

Only reason why a lot of FLGS exsist, is because of Magic the Gathering. GW sales are second after that. (At least over here). So if there is no Magic, GW is not strong enough for these FLGS to open. So if GW can't even keep a FLGS open how is the other market share going to do it?

Lots of shops in the US have dropped or nearly dropped GW products from their inventory. Of the 4 in the area around where I live, only 2 carry any GW products and one of those has so little GW stock on hand, I could quite easily carry it all out without a need for a cart. The one that carries a bit more actually only has the minimum stock levels to maintain their GW trade account...otherwise they too would have cut back. Other companies games and products get the lion's share of the space, whether it is a mix of smaller games like those from Wyrd or the full PP line or even a full wall dedicated to Reaper figures.

If GW were to disappear, I don't think it would be nearly as bad as some people seem to think it would be.

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
I think this is aimed at retail outlets. for example, I went to one store that will remain unnamed that was selling the Dark Vengeance box broken up into its individual parts (hellbrute, cultists, etc.) He was buying the boxes straight from GW than selling the models off piecemeal.

I bet without a doubt thats what Gw is trying to clamp down on.

My guess is its GW fighting its greatest weakness, the second hand market. They've been doing it for years, ever since they claimed that having a shopping cart for their products online in the US some how violated their IP to the embargo is Australia. We're now looking at a second embargo on Australia (US stores being banned from shipping to OZ) and an attack on bitz, second hand, and after market.

Clearly all our money is going to their lawyers, jeez.

 Sean_OBrien wrote:

Davor wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 Pacific wrote:

They want you to think they are the Hobby. Actions like the one described in this thread makes you think their upper management must genuinely believe it as well; only a company that genuinely existed within a monopoly situation would be so customer unfriendly and seemingly constantly declaring war on the independent shops that sell their products.

Games workshop is a Oligopoly in a very niche market, and does own the majority of the market share for this industry.

That is true. If GW ceased to exist today, I am sure, while the other market share will see a small increase, the "Hobby" will be dead because all the GW players just want GW and nothing else. The Hobby is only big as it is, is because of GW.

Only reason why a lot of FLGS exsist, is because of Magic the Gathering. GW sales are second after that. (At least over here). So if there is no Magic, GW is not strong enough for these FLGS to open. So if GW can't even keep a FLGS open how is the other market share going to do it?

Lots of shops in the US have dropped or nearly dropped GW products from their inventory. Of the 4 in the area around where I live, only 2 carry any GW products and one of those has so little GW stock on hand, I could quite easily carry it all out without a need for a cart. The one that carries a bit more actually only has the minimum stock levels to maintain their GW trade account...otherwise they too would have cut back. Other companies games and products get the lion's share of the space, whether it is a mix of smaller games like those from Wyrd or the full PP line or even a full wall dedicated to Reaper figures.

If GW were to disappear, I don't think it would be nearly as bad as some people seem to think it would be.

That's good to know. I guess it's my area then. My city has nobody selling minis, I have to drive 1/2 min, to buy them now.

And yet I still feel compelled to buy their models.
I think their mold relase has an addictive oderless smell on it.

Wotc allows their retailers to break apart the product and sell singles. Sports card retailers have been breaking apart product for years and selling singles. The argument that other retailers don't allow their product to be broken up and sold is silly.

This is nothing more than a cash grab and an attempt to control the secondary market. Usual gw silliness, nothing to see here. The smart will still find ways to sell melta guns for $10 a pop.

Davor wrote:Why are people complaining about GW prices? If you have to complain about GW prices (which I do as well, guilty as charged) then you are not part of GW demographic for sales.

Why are we not complaining about the prices of Ferraris and other high priced cars? Because most of us don't make the money to get them, so we don't complain about it.

GW is not for the common gamer. It's a luxury item just like Ferraris and other high performance cars or any other luxury expensive items. They are not made for us. Just like GW is not made for us either.

So to keep complaining about prices and going else where, GW doesn't care, because their sales were never intended for us in the first place. If we buy it's just a bonus. If we don't buy, it's no loss to GW in the first place, because they don't expect a sale from us anyways.

So while it sucks that GW is preventing Bitz sales, that is what we should be complaining about, not their overpriced minis and how expensive they are to get.

No.
Everything there is wrong, even GW admit they are trying to sell toys to kids.
The hobby itself is a bit of a luxury, it's a hobby after all, something you spend your spare time and extra income on but GW like to pretend they ARE the hobby. They want the 12 years olds to wander in, pick up a starter set, a codex and a battleforce before they've even played a game.
You can't compare GW to a Ferrari when they are trying to be the first and only stop in the hobby, in reality they are a used Ford dealership that likes to think they are selling Ferraris.

Davor wrote:

 Lockark wrote:

 Pacific wrote:

They want you to think they are the Hobby. Actions like the one described in this thread makes you think their upper management must genuinely believe it as well; only a company that genuinely existed within a monopoly situation would be so customer unfriendly and seemingly constantly declaring war on the independent shops that sell their products.

Games workshop is a Oligopoly in a very niche market, and does own the majority of the market share for this industry.

That is true. If GW ceased to exist today, I am sure, while the other market share will see a small increase, the "Hobby" will be dead because all the GW players just want GW and nothing else. The Hobby is only big as it is, is because of GW.

Only reason why a lot of FLGS exsist, is because of Magic the Gathering. GW sales are second after that. (At least over here). So if there is no Magic, GW is not strong enough for these FLGS to open. So if GW can't even keep a FLGS open how is the other market share going to do it?

I think FLGS will suffer, but as you say it's Magic that seems to keep most of them afloat. Warmahordes and the sudden interest in non-GW games would hopefully be enough to keep most of them in business.

There are ways of configuring things to be bought and sold in the used market. No one, not even GW can keep you from buying and selling things "used". I think they want to give more money to China. They could care less about GW's new little policy. Bits will be fine. It will just take a month or so for them to ship....from China.

I have not bought from the Resin dealers because it is just wrong. However, they are looking better and better everyday.