Whatever happened to Imperial Guard?

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**Asmodai Asmodean**

I've played IG... twice? In the London meta, they're really not that prevalent. Space/transportation issue thing, maybe.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
damn the Germans really enjoy the IG spam no?

**Traffic Conez**

All I see is chaos and space marines :/

**danpieri**

Imperial Guard Here!
Dan's guard!

I dont run any full foot, mech, or leaf blower lists. I run a mixed list.
My newest addition is a scratch built VULTURE for my guard, which is doing well.

Granted I am the only Guard player at my LGS, I am enjoying it!

**Melissia**

I see vendetta spam occasionally myself. I prefer more gropo style guard for my lists.

edit: removed link since it could be perceived as advertising, which wasn't my intent.

**Da Kommizzar**

Bookwrack wrote:
Da Kommizzar wrote:

Can anyone explain why the Imps are apparently hiding under rocks?

They're not. You're making the mistake of assuming that your local area is representative of everywhere.

Griddlelol wrote:

They aren't, it's more likely you are. My FLGS has around 33% IG players. Then just about every imperial army has IG allies. At tournaments I'd be willing to bet I'll see 66% of players with either IG primary or IG allied.

(Be careful about sounding rude mates, it may not seem like it to either of you, but both came off as really crabby and rude. No hard feelings,

)

Well, I guess it is just coincidence that your experience is the opposite then, because out of the three or four different gaming groups/shops and out of all the tournaments I been to (though albeit, they are small tournies in comparison to those huge monsters with 40+ players) Not a single IG army was seen other than a guy who was just converting some models for the hell of it. What I see is a lot of Nidz, Marines, and Tau.

Oh well, thanks Dakkanauts for all the input. I appreciate it.

**JWhex**

Sigvatr wrote:
Last tournament results:

1. Necrons
2. IG
3. Necrons (<- me )
4. IG
5. IG
6. IG
7. Grey Knights
8. Necrons
9. IG
10. IG
11. Tyranids
12. IG
13. Necrons
14. IG
15. Grey Knights
16. Space Wolves
17. IG
18. Necrons
19. Grey Knights
20. IG
21. Space Marines
22. IG
23. Space Marines
24. Blood Angels
25. Space Wolves
26. Blood Angels
27. Necrons (3 Monoliths...lol)
28. Tyranids
29. IG
30. Grey Knights (Henchmen list)
31. Demons of Chaos
32. Demons of Chaos

Good grief that entire list is a sad comment on the state of 40k. I assume those were primary detachments. Were allies allowed?

**Melissia**

Not surprised to see a complete lack of Sisters there. More surprised to see so few Space Marines. Must be hitting a low point in SM participation in tournaments.

**-Loki-**

Nah, you need to pay Sisters to show up.

**Kain**

Melissia wrote:
Not surprised to see a complete lack of Sisters there. More surprised to see so few Space Marines. Must be hitting a low point in SM participation in tournaments.

I think the IG is more of the big thing in Germany. They like their Panzerkampfwagens.

**Sigvatr**

Blaggard wrote:
Which tournament was this?

A bigger tournament with 3 clubs from 3 cities playing, 2 bigger ones and a smaller club.

JWhex wrote:

Good grief that entire list is a sad comment on the state of 40k. I assume those were primary detachments. Were allies allowed?

Yes, I only listed primary detachments, we didn't keep track of allies but about 20-30% used allies rules, a lot of them either packing IG or GK allies.

Melissia wrote:
Not surprised to see a complete lack of Sisters there. More surprised to see so few Space Marines. Must be hitting a low point in SM participation in tournaments.

We normally have 1 Sisters player, but he couldn't participate due to his daughter being sick. He is a vet, but still underperforms...it's Sisters :/ Only having metal miniatures and no official codex simply sucks and it's the main problem for people planning to pick up Sisters. The FLGS where we play gives a 10% sale on GW stuff and even 15% to BT and Sisters stuff because nobody gets it. We have the Sisters "codex" as a club copy aka print and bound .pdf for people who might pick it up....someday!

What might surprise or even make you smile though, Mel: 1 IG player has a fully converted all-girl IG infantry squad! Small story behind it: his daughter came to a tournament (quite some time ago) and asked him why all of the soldiers were men and he was like "That's a good question!". Few weeks later showed up with that girl squad

In regards to IG: a lot of people actually play it for the look because the like their tanks and the "normal" look of the infantry aka them being normal humans, they run balanced infantry / tank lists. I don't need to say what kind of lists the better IG players ran

And guys, "tank" in German is NOT "Panzerkampfwagen". It's just "Panzer".

With the new Tau, we might see a slight meta change as they can be taken as allies by a lot of races and provide effective anti-air. I was really surprised seeing I got 3rd, not fielding a single flyer. Even managed to take one down with my Warrior blob

**Griddlelol**

Sigvatr wrote:

In regards to IG: a lot of people actually play it for the look because the like their tanks and the "normal" look of the infantry aka them being normal human.

Pretty much why I chose them. Although now I feel less like a special snow flake due to the huge number of guard players. It might be time for a change.

And guys, "tank" in German is NOT "Panzerkampfwagen". It's just "Panzer".

I thought it was Pazerhausenfrakenberg...

**Kain**

Sigvatr wrote:
Blaggard wrote:
Which tournament was this?

A bigger tournament with 3 clubs from 3 cities playing, 2 bigger ones and a smaller club.

JWhex wrote:

Good grief that entire list is a sad comment on the state of 40k. I assume those were primary detachments. Were allies allowed?

Yes, I only listed primary detachments, we didn't keep track of allies but about 20-30% used allies rules, a lot of them either packing IG or GK allies.

Melissia wrote:
Not surprised to see a complete lack of Sisters there. More surprised to see so few Space Marines. Must be hitting a low point in SM participation in tournaments.

We normally have 1 Sisters player, but he couldn't participate due to his daughter being sick. He is a vet, but still underperforms...it's Sisters :/ Only having metal miniatures and no official codex simply sucks and it's the main problem for people planning to pick up Sisters. The FLGS where we play gives a 10% sale on GW stuff and even 15% to BT and Sisters stuff because nobody gets it. We have the Sisters "codex" as a club copy aka print and bound .pdf for people who might pick it up....someday!

What might surprise or even make you smile though, Mel: 1 IG player has a fully converted all-girl IG infantry squad! Small story behind it: his daughter came to a tournament (quite some time ago) and asked him why all of the soldiers were men and he was like "That's a good question!". Few weeks later showed up with that girl squad

In regards to IG: a lot of people actually play it for the look because the like their tanks and the "normal" look of the infantry aka them being normal humans, they run balanced infantry / tank lists. I don't need to say what kind of lists the better IG players ran

And guys, "tank" in German is NOT "Panzerkampfwagen". It's just "Panzer".

With the new Tau, we might see a slight meta change as they can be taken as allies by a lot of races and provide effective anti-air. I was really surprised seeing I got 3rd, not fielding a single flyer. Even managed to take one down with my Warrior blob

Doesn't Panzer just mean armor and Panzerkamfwagen refers specifically to tanks as it means Armored fighting vehicle (roughly)? Or do you now use a different word for things like space marine armor and knightly plate? Although to be fair the technical term for Tank is "armored unit".

**Sigvatr**

Panzer = tank, it can also refer to e.g. a turtle's shell.

Armor = Panzerung

**Kain**

Sigvatr wrote:
Panzer = tank, it can also refer to e.g. a turtle's shell.

Armor = Panzerung

Ah, I see.

**Purifier**

Sigvatr wrote:
Last tournament results:

1. Necrons
2. IG
3. Necrons (<- me )
4. IG
5. IG
6. IG
7. Grey Knights
8. Necrons
9. IG
10. IG
11. Tyranids
12. IG
13. Necrons
14. IG
15. Grey Knights
16. Space Wolves
17. IG
18. Necrons
19. Grey Knights
20. IG
21. Space Marines
22. IG
23. Space Marines
24. Blood Angels
25. Space Wolves
26. Blood Angels
27. Necrons (3 Monoliths...lol)
28. Tyranids
29. IG
30. Grey Knights (Henchmen list)
31. Demons of Chaos
32. Demons of Chaos

wow, the diversity

**yeri**

I have to chime in on the "IG as average dudes" as a reason I play them. also my likely future brother in law loves the Starship Troopers movie, so I score some points with him for them being so similar. heck maybe one day I can convince him to pick up some Cadians and play a game, it could be a family thing seeing as I already sold my cousins on SM and IG.

**Glocknall**

Two things about the Imperial Guard.

1) They seem like they are everywhere because they are such efficient allies for other armies, primarily SM chapters. With just one troops FOC selection you can get up to 15 separate troop units. This makes them the best allies in the game. You a tough scoring unit to hold home objectives and get to throw in a vendetta or manticore if you like.

2) You hardly see IG main in the US national tournament scene mainly because half the codex is basically non-competitive and overcosted. The IG codex stands on the strength of its infantry platoons, vendettas and artillery, mainly the manticore. All that can be attained by allies. Vendetta spam lists are simply not competitive because their lousy at killing hordes The troops they deploy from them are fragile and they must give up zooming to do so with any relative safety.

People freak out when they run against IG because their foot blobs are artificially strong due to SM allies. IG has been primarily relegated to a allied codex.

**lambsandlions**

I think a lot of it is you don't make friends with IG. People just don't like playing against it in friendly matches because it is so grossly overpowered. When given the choice I think most opponents will want to play something other than IG. My friend will bring three armies and ask what people want to play against, no one ever picks to play against IG, ever.

In tournaments, I see a lot of IG doing very well because they are so strong. Though I rarely see IG winning best opponent.

**Melissia**

Whether or not an IG list is grossly overpowered depends entirely upon how you build it and how gakky a player your opponent is.

**Glocknall**

lambsandlions wrote:
I think a lot of it is you don't make friends with IG. People just don't like playing against it in friendly matches because it is so grossly overpowered. When given the choice I think most opponents will want to play something other than IG. My friend will bring three armies and ask what people want to play against, no one ever picks to play against IG, ever.

In tournaments, I see a lot of IG doing very well because they are so strong. Though I rarely see IG winning best opponent.

I love it when people say IG are overpowered. IG's power comes from literally 3 units. Vendettas, Artillery tanks, Infantry Platoons. That's it. If you know how to limit/beat those units, IG are an average codex at best.

If you actually learn how to counter these units and learn about the army in general you'll find you are much more successful in playing them. I play against pretty good opponents who know the codex and they always know how to strike at my army's weak points. The target the small command squads for quick First Blood/Slay the Warlord. Deep Strike/Outflank/Infiltrate to gain firing lines on my artillery. They know to put their armor and elite infantry in cover when the vendettas come on or bring their own fliers. Sometimes I anticipate these tactics and foil their plans. Not once from these opponents have they said IG is OP. The complaints I do get are from less experienced players who expect their ADL to defect all incoming fire.

Again allies rules means IG can cover some of these weakness, but they lose points efficacy in the process. Good players know how to deal with IG and that is why you see IG very underrepresented on the leaderboards for national tournaments.

**Trickstick**

Few people use IG where I play anymore, and vehicles less so. I have seen 2v2s where the most anyone brings is a drop pod. I myself have moved away from IG main and started running full ABG or ABG/IG. People ten to fall foul of six russes at 1.8k when they have let their AT power fall by the wayside. Too bad ABG is such a rubbish list overall, it is fun though.

**cdt8401**

I do see loads of beardy IG armys with vendettas galore and loads of Mantigors.

I myself am a devout guard player, but i do favor a more balanced list, with lots of grunts, they are the real hero's after all.

For the Emperor!!!

**lambsandlions**

Glocknall wrote:

I love it when people say IG are overpowered. IG's power comes from literally 3 units. Vendettas, Artillery tanks, Infantry Platoons. That's it. If you know how to limit/beat those units, IG are an average codex at best.

If you actually learn how to counter these units and learn about the army in general you'll find you are much more successful in playing them. I play against pretty good opponents who know the codex and they always know how to strike at my army's weak points. The target the small command squads for quick First Blood/Slay the Warlord. Deep Strike/Outflank/Infiltrate to gain firing lines on my artillery. They know to put their armor and elite infantry in cover when the vendettas come on or bring their own fliers. Sometimes I anticipate these tactics and foil their plans. Not once from these opponents have they said IG is OP. The complaints I do get are from less experienced players who expect their ADL to defect all incoming fire.

Again allies rules means IG can cover some of these weakness, but they lose points efficacy in the process. Good players know how to deal with IG and that is why you see IG very underrepresented on the leaderboards for national tournaments.

Lets say their power comes from those three units, which I agree. You can make a whole list with those three things and a HQ. If vendettas are the most powerful thing you can take 9 of them if you want in your fast attack slot. And they aren't competing with any of your other real strong choices. You can make a whole army that does nothing but drop s10 ap1 large blasts that don't need los and ignores cover. Sounds pretty op to me.

**Blaggard**

There's S10 AP1 barrage large blasts in the IG codex?

**Raxmei**

Blaggard wrote:
There's S10 AP1 barrage large blasts in the IG codex?

Deathstrike missile, though it'd be highly unusual to base your enitre army around three shots. Nothing else in codex is S10, ap1, and ignores cover all at the same time.

**Griddlelol**

News just in, Deathstrikes are the most over powered thing in any codex ever.

All the things in the IG codex to complain about and you chose Deathstrikes?! Oh the irony.

**MajorStoffer**

My local club has about 40 members, of which there are 4 Imperial Guard primary players, though a few other people have them as secondary armies (another 3 I think).

Of those 4, 2 run power lists almost consistently; 5+ fliers, two manticores, aegis line, power axe guard blob with LC and allied special character with basic troop squad. It's rather annoying sometimes, but they're not a huge factor, and one of the two regularly changes his list; it's always a power list, but it's not always flier spam or whatnot.

But then my group is not highly competitive at all; only 4 members are regularly tourney-goers, and most people play lists they enjoy, not one designed to power-game. The only TFG in our group is a daemon player anyways, so it's no big deal.

The most common army, however, is easily Chaos Space Marines. We've only got 1 vanilla marine player, and he doesn't play that often, and one of each marine +1 player, but there's 7 or so CSM players, each of which with completely different armies, which keeps things fresh. One guy actually runs a very successful Thousand Sons army, in spite of the Internet.

That being said, the Guard players have some of the largest collections. There's one CSM guy with 32k points, but the guard players are the only ones aside from him who can run Apoc armies without allies, everyone else is somewhere in the 3-4k range. Kind of amusing actually, the most expensive army is the one with the largest footprint-per-player.

I do know, however, that the tourney scene sees more Guard. It's dominated locally by Necrons and IG, but since that arena doesn't concern me, I don't pay it much heed.

**Ribon Fox**

As of only afew weeks ago I was the only IG player at my FLGS. I did and do play a nasty plasma-vet mech list. but I also run Sentinels in my list as well as alot of custom heavy and super heavy Sentinels (counts as stuff) . I don't win very often but i make it a damn good slog for the other player.
Now there is another IG player at the store (and he'll be playing his as traitor guard) i think tank battles will happen alot more for me

In a word, yes and no. There are still some of us old guard that still fight the good fight.

**Dand218**

It's down to local meta and taste.
I find that IG while not unseen is not overly common at my LGC. Personally we seem to have a preference for all thing Ork, D.E or Chaos.
So basically we like a bit of disorder

**SkaerKrow**

I currently play or spectate at three different stores in my local area. The largest 40k group in the area has two or three Guard players in it, and I'm one of them (out of about sixteen regular players). The smallest 40k group has about seven players, and three of them (again, counting myself) run Guard. The shop in the middle has about twelve regular players, and I've only seen one running Guard. So (in my area at least), they're not poorly represented, but they're less common than Space Marines (Vanilla and Variant Chapters), Chaos Daemons, Dark Eldar and Necrons.