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 Savageconvoy wrote:
But there is still the issue that you can only shoot what you have line of sight to. Being sunken into the floor of a raised fortification surrounded by battlements leaves very little to what it can actually draw LOS to.

It's an emplaced weapon, though, which means it's fired by a model in base contact. Said model would likely have a better view of the battlefield than the missile. Or it's barrage, like the Krakstorm battery.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Plus, y'know, plastic C'Tan. No need for FineCost.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Also some pics of it on WD Daily (Scroll down)
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/wnt/blog.jsp?pid=9900026

Ok. So there's a third unit in that box. Not just a C'Tan but a "Transcendant C'Tan", which must be one of the only-if-we-sell-a-kit-for-it new Apoc formations. Interesting.

Transcendant C'Tan is supposedly what happens when the owner of a Tesseract Vault goes "crap, we're losing, better release a C'Tan" and let's the C'Tan out.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
But there is still the issue that you can only shoot what you have line of sight to. Being sunken into the floor of a raised fortification surrounded by battlements leaves very little to what it can actually draw LOS to.

It's an emplaced weapon, though, which means it's fired by a model in base contact. Said model would likely have a better view of the battlefield than the missile. Or it's barrage, like the Krakstorm battery.

The emplacement still needs LOS to the target, measured along the barrel of the weapon being fired much like a Vehicle. Otherwise I can park my ADL's quadgun behind a piece of LOS blocking terrain and have one guardsman sticking his head out to fire it at something.

Truth is we don't know how the missiles will work. They could be indirect fire.

 Enigwolf wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
But there is still the issue that you can only shoot what you have line of sight to. Being sunken into the floor of a raised fortification surrounded by battlements leaves very little to what it can actually draw LOS to.

It's an emplaced weapon, though, which means it's fired by a model in base contact. Said model would likely have a better view of the battlefield than the missile. Or it's barrage, like the Krakstorm battery.

The emplacement still needs LOS to the target, measured along the barrel of the weapon being fired much like a Vehicle. Otherwise I can park my ADL's quadgun behind a piece of LOS blocking terrain and have one guardsman sticking his head out to fire it at something.

and for those reasons you can bet it will work in exactly the same manner as the missile silo on the FoR. you wont need LoS from the emplacement to fire it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:
To be really honest, the entire Aquila Strongpoint looks like the small building from the Fortress of Redemption... What with the missile silos or a turret to be plopped on top. And 'lo and behold, the missile silo will again have LOS issues on anything that isn't a flyer. Too bad you probably can't Vortex a flyer (blast weapon, based on the template they've released)

Vortex Weapons don't work as normal blast weapons, they're "everything under the template" as opposed to inflicting hits, which means they'd work on fliers. It doesn't ever have to inflict a hit on the flier to kill it. That could change though.

i dont think thats how its going to work, in the HH book the vortex missiles cant affect flyers "after determining the final position of the marker, any models and removable terrain features touched by the blast are removed from the game (flyers are not affected). dont even thing of making any saves..."

 ausYenLoWang wrote:

 Enigwolf wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
But there is still the issue that you can only shoot what you have line of sight to. Being sunken into the floor of a raised fortification surrounded by battlements leaves very little to what it can actually draw LOS to.

It's an emplaced weapon, though, which means it's fired by a model in base contact. Said model would likely have a better view of the battlefield than the missile. Or it's barrage, like the Krakstorm battery.

The emplacement still needs LOS to the target, measured along the barrel of the weapon being fired much like a Vehicle. Otherwise I can park my ADL's quadgun behind a piece of LOS blocking terrain and have one guardsman sticking his head out to fire it at something.

and for those reasons you can bet it will work in exactly the same manner as the missile silo on the FoR. you wont need LoS from the emplacement to fire it.

Assuming you can fire indirect using Barrage.

The missiles on the Aquila Strongpoint appear to stick up quite a bit from the surface of the deck. Might be relatively easy to draw line of sight from their tips, past the parapet crenelations to a target, unless the target is right up close to the strongpoint. It'll be interesting to see.

C’mon guys, really? We’re going to argue not only if you need to draw LOS for these missiles but also how you draw LOS from the tips of missiles (which doesn’t even make sense). This is pointless!

Wait. ‘Til. The. Book. Is. Out.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Plus, y'know, plastic C'Tan. No need for FineCost.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Also some pics of it on WD Daily (Scroll down)
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/wnt/blog.jsp?pid=9900026

Ok. So there's a third unit in that box. Not just a C'Tan but a "Transcendant C'Tan", which must be one of the only-if-we-sell-a-kit-for-it new Apoc formations. Interesting.

Transcendant C'Tan is just rules for the C'Tan in the Obelisk if you build it closed and have a leftover C'Tan model. Probably a Gargantuan Creature (Character) unit.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
C’mon guys, really? We’re going to argue not only if you need to draw LOS for these missiles but also how you draw LOS from the tips of missiles (which doesn’t even make sense). This is pointless!

Wait. ‘Til. The. Book. Is. Out.

Of course it doesn't make sense. Needing direct LOS on silo launched missiles doesn't make sense. Having them fire in any way that's not as a barrage wouldn't make sense, either. But if people are going to already get spun up that they are somehow not going to be able to fire them due to lack of LOS, when the only other silo fired weapon DOES fire as barrage (a surprisingly sensible move by GW), why not respond with a nonsensical suggestion on LOS for them in the meantime?

I subscribe to the digital WD and last night when I opened it since the initial download I received a message that it had been "Revised" and needed to be re-downloaded. Does anyone know what they changed?

Anyone notice they raised the crazy Siege of the Angel's Redoubt from $1600 to $1900? What was that all about??

They must have realized that they were giving a discount. That's pretty much a no-no at GW.

 JHall wrote:
Anyone notice they raised the crazy Siege of the Angel's Redoubt from $1600 to $1900? What was that all about??

I noticed that it jumped about $500 on the Australian one as well. Maybe half the new stuff wasn't added in for some reason.

Forgeworld's newsletter just announced that they're coming out with an apoc book and you can pre-order it at the "Enter the Citadel" event at warhammer world on the 13th.

We will also be offering you the exclusive chance to pre-order your copy of Forge World's new Imperial Armour Apocalypse book and will have copies for you to see on the day.

 Foda_Bett wrote:
Forgeworld's newsletter just announced that they're coming out with an apoc book and you can pre-order it at the "Enter the Citadel" event at warhammer world on the 13th.

We will also be offering you the exclusive chance to pre-order your copy of Forge World's new Imperial Armour Apocalypse book and will have copies for you to see on the day.

The biggest problem with the way that FW releases these big (expensive) supplements is that, as time goes on and codices get redone, more and more units get outdated and in need of revision, and they don't have a particularly good way to keep up with them short of waiting a bit and releasing another big (expensive) book to update those units, just in time for the OTHER units in the book to have their parent codices redone, setting up for the next cycle of problems.

 CaptKaruthors wrote:
Besides the Eldar codex that was released...this was the other release that I'm looking forward to. Two back-to-back releases that I've been waiting for. It's been a good couple of months. Sadly, after that...I can only look forward to a 6th Ed. DE codex...which is years away...

Don't you still have a guard army and Templars? They would be fun to play when their new books come out - you shouldn't have much to do with these armies other than pick up some of the newest releases...

shade1313 wrote:
The biggest problem with the way that FW releases these big (expensive) supplements is that, as time goes on and codices get redone, more and more units get outdated and in need of revision, and they don't have a particularly good way to keep up with them short of waiting a bit and releasing another big (expensive) book to update those units, just in time for the OTHER units in the book to have their parent codices redone, setting up for the next cycle of problems.

Considering that a new codex is 50 dollars US plus tax, it doesn't seem so bad. Current rate on say Imperial Armour 1 2nd edition puts it at about 82 dollars.if you a few friends can go in a FW order together you can save the shipping. It's not so bad really.

andrewm9 wrote:

shade1313 wrote:
The biggest problem with the way that FW releases these big (expensive) supplements is that, as time goes on and codices get redone, more and more units get outdated and in need of revision, and they don't have a particularly good way to keep up with them short of waiting a bit and releasing another big (expensive) book to update those units, just in time for the OTHER units in the book to have their parent codices redone, setting up for the next cycle of problems.

Considering that a new codex is 50 dollars US plus tax, it doesn't seem so bad. Current rate on say Imperial Armour 1 2nd edition puts it at about 82 dollars.if you a few friends can go in a FW order together you can save the shipping. It's not so bad really.

But it IS really, really annoying when a new codex comes along and it takes a goodly amount of time to update units, or even worse, whole army lists.

 Sidstyler wrote:

 Squigsquasher wrote:
There's already a perfectly serviceable Dark Eldar codex. I think you can last a few more years.

Define "perfectly serviceable", because the current DE codex is absolute trash in 6th edition. Not that it matters because no one gets updated based on "need", but still.

I don't know about DE as a stand alone force but one player I know does get good results using them as an allied contingent for his Eldar army.

shade1313 wrote:

andrewm9 wrote:

shade1313 wrote:
The biggest problem with the way that FW releases these big (expensive) supplements is that, as time goes on and codices get redone, more and more units get outdated and in need of revision, and they don't have a particularly good way to keep up with them short of waiting a bit and releasing another big (expensive) book to update those units, just in time for the OTHER units in the book to have their parent codices redone, setting up for the next cycle of problems.

Considering that a new codex is 50 dollars US plus tax, it doesn't seem so bad. Current rate on say Imperial Armour 1 2nd edition puts it at about 82 dollars.if you a few friends can go in a FW order together you can save the shipping. It's not so bad really.

But it IS really, really annoying when a new codex comes along and it takes a goodly amount of time to update units, or even worse, whole army lists.

Furthermore FW actually does updates in between publications to date lists via PDF, which they do for free.

andrewm9 wrote:

shade1313 wrote:

andrewm9 wrote:

shade1313 wrote:
The biggest problem with the way that FW releases these big (expensive) supplements is that, as time goes on and codices get redone, more and more units get outdated and in need of revision, and they don't have a particularly good way to keep up with them short of waiting a bit and releasing another big (expensive) book to update those units, just in time for the OTHER units in the book to have their parent codices redone, setting up for the next cycle of problems.

Considering that a new codex is 50 dollars US plus tax, it doesn't seem so bad. Current rate on say Imperial Armour 1 2nd edition puts it at about 82 dollars.if you a few friends can go in a FW order together you can save the shipping. It's not so bad really.

But it IS really, really annoying when a new codex comes along and it takes a goodly amount of time to update units, or even worse, whole army lists.

Furthermore FW actually does updates in between publications to date lists via PDF, which they do for free.

Like the Elysians, who got updated via a PDF...oh, wait, no, they got their update with Taros 2.0, along with Tau.

I'm sure the Eldar updates will be along any second now.

Any second.

I don't mind redoing the actual Imperial Armour's every 5+ years.
What I mind is what they do for apoc
Imperial Armour Apocalypse 1
Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2
Imperial Armour Apocalypse 1: Second edition

IAApoc1:2nd Ed was on sale for 3-4 months before it was pulled from the site. Why bother producing a book at that point? Why not just drop an FAQ or something?!

andrewm9 wrote:

shade1313 wrote:

andrewm9 wrote:

shade1313 wrote:
The biggest problem with the way that FW releases these big (expensive) supplements is that, as time goes on and codices get redone, more and more units get outdated and in need of revision, and they don't have a particularly good way to keep up with them short of waiting a bit and releasing another big (expensive) book to update those units, just in time for the OTHER units in the book to have their parent codices redone, setting up for the next cycle of problems.

Considering that a new codex is 50 dollars US plus tax, it doesn't seem so bad. Current rate on say Imperial Armour 1 2nd edition puts it at about 82 dollars.if you a few friends can go in a FW order together you can save the shipping. It's not so bad really.

But it IS really, really annoying when a new codex comes along and it takes a goodly amount of time to update units, or even worse, whole army lists.

Furthermore FW actually does updates in between publications to date lists via PDF, which they do for free.

Proof? I am not familiar with this practice. Please send me a link to all of these updates.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

andrewm9 wrote:

shade1313 wrote:

andrewm9 wrote:

shade1313 wrote:
The biggest problem with the way that FW releases these big (expensive) supplements is that, as time goes on and codices get redone, more and more units get outdated and in need of revision, and they don't have a particularly good way to keep up with them short of waiting a bit and releasing another big (expensive) book to update those units, just in time for the OTHER units in the book to have their parent codices redone, setting up for the next cycle of problems.

Considering that a new codex is 50 dollars US plus tax, it doesn't seem so bad. Current rate on say Imperial Armour 1 2nd edition puts it at about 82 dollars.if you a few friends can go in a FW order together you can save the shipping. It's not so bad really.

But it IS really, really annoying when a new codex comes along and it takes a goodly amount of time to update units, or even worse, whole army lists.

Furthermore FW actually does updates in between publications to date lists via PDF, which they do for free.

Proof? I am not familiar with this practice. Please send me a link to all of these updates.

They haven't done any for 6th, but in the 5th ed release cycle, all their 4th ed books got updated army lists, with some notable revisions. As it stands, right now they're re-releasing their oldest books with some of their older army lists re-done, or with entirely new ones. They've stated that, for instance, the Seige Regiment will be done as a PDF, because the Vraks books are still fairly recent.

 Foda_Bett wrote:
IAApoc1:2nd Ed was on sale for 3-4 months before it was pulled from the site. Why bother producing a book at that point? Why not just drop an FAQ or something?!

TBH it was probably just a case of bad timing. IA:A(2nd) was a legitimate and badly needed book when it was published, and FW probably committed to it before GW decided to make Apocalypse this year's big release. Now between Apocalypse and 6th edition (remember this was a 5th edition book) large parts of it are probably invalid, so FW declined to make another print run after the first books sold out.

It's tempting to see this as greed, but look at it this way: why put your resources into publishing a book that will only be sold for 3-4 months before you replace it with another book? That's a lot of redundant effort that could be better spent on getting the next Heresy book out ASAP.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Proof? I am not familiar with this practice. Please send me a link to all of these updates.

They did a bunch of them in 5th. Unfortunately in 6th this seems to have stopped, as demonstrated by how they lied for months about how an Elysian drop troops update would be "soon" until we found out they were just stalling until IA3 could be published and we could pay $90 for the update. I'll leave it to you to decide whether this is their own greed or a direct order from GW management to stop putting out free rules.

 Peregrine wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Proof? I am not familiar with this practice. Please send me a link to all of these updates.

They did a bunch of them in 5th. Unfortunately in 6th this seems to have stopped, as demonstrated by how they lied for months about how an Elysian drop troops update would be "soon" until we found out they were just stalling until IA3 could be published and we could pay $90 for the update. I'll leave it to you to decide whether this is their own greed or a direct order from GW management to stop putting out free rules.

It turns out there's a downloads tab that I somehow missed

It seems there are some updates for sixth ed, but they all stop after July.

So does anyone have any legitimate news about what some of these formations do? How about the Finest Hour or Divine Intervention special rules? Exemplar Traits?

It seems Apoc is getting its own range of supplements called War Zones

War Zones are self-contained supplements for Warhammer 40,000: Apocalypse and they detail some of the most famous campaigns of the 41st Millennium. This section provides you with the necessary formations you need to relive these epic moments.

http://pinsofwar.com/war-zones-supplements-for-warhammer-40k-apocalypse/

yeah,
The collectors edition of Apocalypse gives you early acces to the second warzone Pandorax.

- Two Warzone compendiums containing background and additional formations for the wars of Armageddon and Pandorax. Both Warzones are styled as Imperial dossiers, of the sort you may find on a General's desk, and Pandorax is only currently available in this Collector's Edition.

Panic...