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ClockworkZion wrote:

MajorWesJanson wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Do we have any rumors about what the 6 relics do? The relic Storm Shield sounds intriguing; what's better than a 3++? Part of me hopes it's Eternal Warrior so that the legacy of the Adamantine Mantle Marshal can live on. That could also explain why they felt they had to change Lysander a bit.

Disclaimer: The above is purely my own speculation, which ought to be obvious. If you repost this as a "rumour you heard", angry gremlins will devour you in your sleep.

The relic banner is probably the relic that grants a 6+ inv save. Storm Shield could be either Eternal Warrior, or it could be like the Space Wolf guy and grant you an extra attack in CC.

Who knows, maybe you can throw the shield too, like that one guy does his hammer!

That'd be 2 Avengers down!

What, is Calgar Iron Man due to his fist-guns? Lysander Thor due to his S10 Hammer?

Crazyterran wrote:

ClockworkZion wrote:

MajorWesJanson wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Do we have any rumors about what the 6 relics do? The relic Storm Shield sounds intriguing; what's better than a 3++? Part of me hopes it's Eternal Warrior so that the legacy of the Adamantine Mantle Marshal can live on. That could also explain why they felt they had to change Lysander a bit.

Disclaimer: The above is purely my own speculation, which ought to be obvious. If you repost this as a "rumour you heard", angry gremlins will devour you in your sleep.

The relic banner is probably the relic that grants a 6+ inv save. Storm Shield could be either Eternal Warrior, or it could be like the Space Wolf guy and grant you an extra attack in CC.

Who knows, maybe you can throw the shield too, like that one guy does his hammer!

That'd be 2 Avengers down!

What, is Calgar Iron Man due to his fist-guns? Lysander Thor due to his S10 Hammer?

Space Wolf guy is Thor, relic shield with throw could be Captain America.

Lelith as Black Widow?

Hulk is Ghazzy. Accept no substitute

Saythings wrote:

Quark wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:
Yeah, I know. People are going to freak out no matter what. Then once things actually come out and have had time to circulate for awhile, 75% of what people were freaking out over turns out to be fine. It's the same pattern every time.

Howling Banshees best achievement: being in the 25%!

I am a bit worried about Tigurius being so insane, but I'll see when I can read the complete entry myself.

I'm thinking Tigurius is going to be ridiculous. 3 powers, any discipline, reroll to powers, reroll to reserves (I think). Oh, and BTs (so far) have no restrictions for allied Pskyers... looks at Tigurius...

I hope my brothers don't read this or I'll get a flogging for mentioning an allied witch.

Yeah, but he's still a T4 W2 3+ no invul dude who dies to the first double tap plasma or melta wound that hits him. So while he's got some insane-good Psyker abilities...at some point he has to get out of the car, and then he will be toast rather quickly.

I've followed the thread pretty closely, but has there been any information/speculation on non-updated kits getting a price raise?

With GW's new raise at release/update policy, I'm wondering if any of the other plastic kits will be going up. Or has GW hit their threshold for now?

dkellyj wrote:

Saythings wrote:

Quark wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:
Yeah, I know. People are going to freak out no matter what. Then once things actually come out and have had time to circulate for awhile, 75% of what people were freaking out over turns out to be fine. It's the same pattern every time.

Howling Banshees best achievement: being in the 25%!

I am a bit worried about Tigurius being so insane, but I'll see when I can read the complete entry myself.

I'm thinking Tigurius is going to be ridiculous. 3 powers, any discipline, reroll to powers, reroll to reserves (I think). Oh, and BTs (so far) have no restrictions for allied Pskyers... looks at Tigurius...

I hope my brothers don't read this or I'll get a flogging for mentioning an allied witch.

Yeah, but he's still a T4 W2 3+ no invul dude who dies to the first double tap plasma or melta wound that hits him. So while he's got some insane-good Psyker abilities...at some point he has to get out of the car, and then he will be toast rather quickly.

That's what ablative wounds are for. (combat squads)

But really, other than sitting far enough away to cast Misfortune and stuff that isn't prescience, since who needs that as Ultramarines... maybe give him and his escort a 4+ invuln... (he has a reasonable chance at getting it if you put all 3 powers into Divination). Misfortune, Precog, Forewarning, and Perfect timing will all be great powers to get without having to really worry about Prescience.

Tigirius with a 4 Plas Cannon dev squad casting Perfect Timing would be pretty scary for some things, I imagine.

@Clockwork.... thanks for being the ambassador for the 40k Radio Q&A!

Any hints on what the Warlord Traits are?

So I am not going to dig threw 100+ pages to find this answer if there is one. So my question is when? And is all hope for CSM lost?

AHReese wrote:I've followed the thread pretty closely, but has there been any information/speculation on non-updated kits getting a price raise?

With GW's new raise at release/update policy, I'm wondering if any of the other plastic kits will be going up. Or has GW hit their threshold for now?

Haven't seen word on any prices raises beyond the new releases.

Lobukia wrote:@Clockwork.... thanks for being the ambassador for the 40k Radio Q&A!

Any hints on what the Warlord Traits are?

No problem! I love digging into rumors so it's just a good deal for everyone!

Now both Warlord Traits and Relics are things they're saving for their 1 Sep show.

 Wrecker wrote:
So I am not going to dig threw 100+ pages to find this answer if there is one. So my question is when? And is all hope for CSM lost?

Yes. Chaos Marines are done. burn your models and try again...

/sarcasm

 Wrecker wrote:
So I am not going to dig threw 100+ pages to find this answer if there is one. So my question is when? And is all hope for CSM lost?

When Marines get released? First Saturday of September: the 7th.

And all hope is only lost if you subscribe to such doomsaying. The CSM book is more playable than people give it credit for still, I just see complaints from people who refuse to use anything but the simplest combos.

ClockworkZion wrote:

 Wrecker wrote:
So I am not going to dig threw 100+ pages to find this answer if there is one. So my question is when? And is all hope for CSM lost?

When Marines get released? First Saturday of September: the 7th.

And all hope is only lost if you subscribe to such doomsaying. The CSM book is more playable than people give it credit for still, I just see complaints from people who refuse to use anything but the simplest combos.

Personally my gripes are primarily TS still being a let down, inability to really create a legion, lack of agressive vehicles (drop pods), the stupid USSR, daemons with marks, and the undervalued pricing of ANSKNF and a free extra bonus ability.

dkellyj wrote:

Saythings wrote:

Quark wrote:

 Maelstrom808 wrote:
Yeah, I know. People are going to freak out no matter what. Then once things actually come out and have had time to circulate for awhile, 75% of what people were freaking out over turns out to be fine. It's the same pattern every time.

Howling Banshees best achievement: being in the 25%!

I am a bit worried about Tigurius being so insane, but I'll see when I can read the complete entry myself.

I'm thinking Tigurius is going to be ridiculous. 3 powers, any discipline, reroll to powers, reroll to reserves (I think). Oh, and BTs (so far) have no restrictions for allied Pskyers... looks at Tigurius...

I hope my brothers don't read this or I'll get a flogging for mentioning an allied witch.

Yeah, but he's still a T4 W2 3+ no invul dude who dies to the first double tap plasma or melta wound that hits him. So while he's got some insane-good Psyker abilities...at some point he has to get out of the car, and then he will be toast rather quickly.

There at least some chance he will be allowed to hold some of the chapter relics...

 StarTrotter wrote:

ClockworkZion wrote:

 Wrecker wrote:
So I am not going to dig threw 100+ pages to find this answer if there is one. So my question is when? And is all hope for CSM lost?

When Marines get released? First Saturday of September: the 7th.

And all hope is only lost if you subscribe to such doomsaying. The CSM book is more playable than people give it credit for still, I just see complaints from people who refuse to use anything but the simplest combos.

Personally my gripes are primarily TS still being a let down, inability to really create a legion, lack of agressive vehicles (drop pods), the stupid USSR, daemons with marks, and the undervalued pricing of ANSKNF and a free extra bonus ability.

Hehe, yeah. GW is all about "create your own awesome army with a cool theme and tons of background and history!" - then when you pick one of the most iconic CSM armies, the Thousand Sons, you're left with "oh sorry, this new codex really has nothing viable for your army - but here, buy three daemon engines and paint them blue!"

ClockworkZion wrote:

AHReese wrote:I've followed the thread pretty closely, but has there been any information/speculation on non-updated kits getting a price raise?

With GW's new raise at release/update policy, I'm wondering if any of the other plastic kits will be going up. Or has GW hit their threshold for now?

Haven't seen word on any prices raises beyond the new releases.

Wasn't there a rumor that the rhino box would go away in favor of the razorback kit?

 prowla wrote:

Hehe, yeah. GW is all about "create your own awesome army with a cool theme and tons of background and history!" - then when you pick one of the most iconic CSM armies, the Thousand Sons, you're left with "oh sorry, this new codex really has nothing viable for your army - but here, buy three daemon engines and paint them blue!"

"Imho" the CSM codex already has a lot of options, do you really want a codex for every sub-force of CSM? Then everybody would whine "Why can't I take a Khorne Berserker squad with my Thousand Sons army?" - really, I would never ever trade that flexibility away for some additional new mediocre units.

Only problem that I see is that Mark of Nurgle is underpriced for what it does in 6E, of course every Troop has a Mark of Nurgle. Heldrake is just "lol", an AP3 flamer that wounds Marines on 2+ who can move 36" before shooting as 360" Torrent - it's obviously broken.

But there are other choices too, and I don't think they are bad ... they are just not that cost-effective as the others - a shame, I admit.
But e.g. the Forgefiend ... 2 Hades Autocannons, okay ... it's 175 points, but I think it's a fair price for having a Dreadnought with It Will not Die that shoots double the amount as a Grey Knight Psyfleman with Pinning - Hello?

Of course nobody takes it, because those points are reserved for the flying circus. *boring*

 d-usa wrote:
So all you really need to play whatever you want is magnetized shoulderpads and you can play with the best traits and ally with the other best chapter based on who you are playing!

Start out by painting all your Space Marines Green and magenize the shoulder pads for all the different chapters.Then just put the appropriate shoulder pad on the model for the game you are playing today!


Problem solved!

That's still over complicating it.

You freelance your chapter, paint it whatever way you want, and its played under whatever chapter rules you decide it is when you draw your list up.

daisho wrote:

 prowla wrote:

Hehe, yeah. GW is all about "create your own awesome army with a cool theme and tons of background and history!" - then when you pick one of the most iconic CSM armies, the Thousand Sons, you're left with "oh sorry, this new codex really has nothing viable for your army - but here, buy three daemon engines and paint them blue!"

"Imho" the CSM codex already has a lot of options, do you really want a codex for every sub-force of CSM? Then everybody would whine "Why can't I take a Khorne Berserker squad with my Thousand Sons army?" - really, I would never ever trade that flexibility away for some additional new mediocre units.

Only problem that I see is that Mark of Nurgle is underpriced for what it does in 6E, of course every Troop has a Mark of Nurgle. Heldrake is just "lol", an AP3 flamer that wounds Marines on 2+ who can move 36" before shooting as 360" Torrent - it's obviously broken.

But there are other choices too, and I don't think they are bad ... they are just not that cost-effective as the others - a shame, I admit.
But e.g. the Forgefiend ... 2 Hades Autocannons, okay ... it's 175 points, but I think it's a fair price for having a Dreadnought with It Will not Die that shoots double the amount as a Grey Knight Psyfleman with Pinning - Hello?

Of course nobody takes it, because those points are reserved for the flying circus. *boring*

at bs3 meaning half the shots will miss miserably. To be honest bigger problem is that Autocannon Havocs and lascannon predators tend to be better in general. And yes. Yes I would love to actually have a CSM codex that lets me play a World Eater army. Hey if I pick the World Eaters they get universal fearless and all these passives on all models so that when my berzerker grabs terminator armour they automatically lose their power armour berzerker abilities. And no not everybody would whine. The biggest complaints coming up for the SM is that you cannot use some of the UM chars to make up for your lack of unique characters for Iron Hands and the sorts. Why not make it work like the SM codex (rumours wise). YOu can ally TS and Berzerkers. Make a renegade section that lets you do things as usual but then give segments so people can play the legions they love. Would some people still complain when Ahriman is limited to TS or something? Yes but not everybody would complain. The world is expansive and I assume many would be happy that at the very least they wouldn't have to build their World Eater list by only deploying Berzerkers and Kharn. Also, what rubs this individual is that the CSM army represent a more diverse brevity of legions/warbands than SM yet (and this could be said to be something CSM share with IG and many others) SM are the ones that let you play your army in multiple ways (also can you really say re-rolling ones on all to hits on guns and then all tacticals having twin-linked all guns bad?)

Right now GenCon is going on-- it's the largest gaming convention on the planet (though there might be one in Germany that is technically bigger, but I think it's also about toys in general) and companies are there showing off their latest and upcoming stuff. Apparently GW has a booth there this year. Anyone stop buy to see if they are actually showing any new models in person? Or have they just gone for a sales booth approach?

daisho wrote:

"Imho" the CSM codex already has a lot of options, do you really want a codex for every sub-force of CSM? Then everybody would whine "Why can't I take a Khorne Berserker squad with my Thousand Sons army?" - really, I would never ever trade that flexibility away for some additional new mediocre units.

The point really is that you should be able to field a functional Thousand Sons army without having to take units that don't fit in. CSM is one of the most fluffbunny friendly factions, as there's tons of cool background (especially with HH books) and flavor, with plenty of unique fluffy forces to choose from. The codex not catering to building functional and fluffy armies is pretty huge shot in the leg, in that sense.

You also have to remember that GW could create a CSM codex that would represent both mixed warbands and traitor legions, if they wanted to put some effort in it. It might take a bit of fiddling with special characters etc., add a few pages to the codex, but it would make everyone sort of happy.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 plastictrees wrote:
Does anyone have the page number for the last list of chapter traits or a link?

Here is a link for you.

Can we get this on the first page please chaps?

The Division Of Joy wrote:

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 plastictrees wrote:
Does anyone have the page number for the last list of chapter traits or a link?

Here is a link for you.

Can we get this on the first page please chaps?

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/278011-new-codex-space-marines-rumor/?p=3423612

Is the most up to date post, the one Mimicry posted is a bit out of date.

 prowla wrote:

The point really is that you should be able to field a functional Thousand Sons army without having to take units that don't fit in. CSM is one of the most fluffbunny friendly factions, as there's tons of cool background (especially with HH books) and flavor, with plenty of unique fluffy forces to choose from. The codex not catering to building functional and fluffy armies is pretty huge shot in the leg, in that sense.

You also have to remember that GW could create a CSM codex that would represent both mixed warbands and traitor legions, if they wanted to put some effort in it. It might take a bit of fiddling with special characters etc., add a few pages to the codex, but it would make everyone sort of happy.

You could already field some Chaos Space Marines with Mark of Tzeentch, Cultists fit in every detachment, Chaos Sorcerers and Thousand Sons. Convert/Paint your Rhinos, Predators, Land Raiders to fit that theme. I don't know why they removed Dreadnoughts though?

We all have dreams, I would also like a combined Inquisition codex with Ordo Xenos, Malleus and Hereticus in one book - having a lot of options to choose. But no, I've got C:SM, Codex Grey Knights which is completely nonsense (wish I could have an updated Codex Daemonhunters back) and incorporates Ordo Xenos and Hereticus Inquisitors incl. Karamazov which now doesn't exist in the White Dwarf toilet paper called Sisters of Battle

So Flakk Missiles for the Missile Launcher.

Is the only way to get them via Devastator Squads, or can Tactical Squad Missile Launchers get them as well?

 d-usa wrote:
So Flakk Missiles for the Missile Launcher.

Is the only way to get them via Devastator Squads, or can Tactical Squad Missile Launchers get them as well?

I bet they will be available on both, would make no sense to not have them on tacticals (imho).

daisho wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
So Flakk Missiles for the Missile Launcher.

Is the only way to get them via Devastator Squads, or can Tactical Squad Missile Launchers get them as well?

I bet they will be available on both, would make no sense to not have them on tacticals (imho).

Well, Fluff wise they could argue that Devastators are more of the "anti vehicle/tank/flyer" squad and that specialization makes them better at taking out flyers than Tacticals".
In a codex writing mindset it would be a way to force you to make decisions when building lists and what to put in your Heavy slot.

I hope that Tacticals/Scouts/etc have access though.

I will need to figure out a way to differentiate units from different codexes/chapters. I am thinking either casting a sort "holster for the base" and color it with the chapter color or a marker with the chapter symbol. Ideally i lean towards the holster, but its a bit more work. Im thinking Playing my wolves ultras with an allied detachment of white scars, which will essentially be a captain with a bike squad and an assault squad.


What other ideas do you guys have to differentiate your forces?.

xxvaderxx wrote:
I will need to figure out a way to differentiate units from different codexes/chapters. I am thinking either casting a sort "holster for the base" and color it with the chapter color or a marker with the chapter symbol. Ideally i lean towards the holster, but its a bit more work. Im thinking Playing my wolves ultras with an allied detachment of white scars, which will essentially be a captain with a bike squad and an assault squad.


What other ideas do you guys have to differentiate your forces?.

Different company markings. I already paint my Bikes as 6th Company, for example.

So, if i Ally in Salamanders, and I decided to take combi-weapon Sternguard, all the models would be first company. (and probably scouts, who wouldn't have markings. or flame weapons... or meltas...)

 d-usa wrote:

daisho wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
So Flakk Missiles for the Missile Launcher.

Is the only way to get them via Devastator Squads, or can Tactical Squad Missile Launchers get them as well?

I bet they will be available on both, would make no sense to not have them on tacticals (imho).

Well, Fluff wise they could argue that Devastators are more of the "anti vehicle/tank/flyer" squad and that specialization makes them better at taking out flyers than Tacticals".
In a codex writing mindset it would be a way to force you to make decisions when building lists and what to put in your Heavy slot.

I hope that Tacticals/Scouts/etc have access though.

If they give them to Scouts, that's just another advantage for Ultramarines over the other chapters, since only they can take Telion now.

 d-usa wrote:

daisho wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
So Flakk Missiles for the Missile Launcher.

Is the only way to get them via Devastator Squads, or can Tactical Squad Missile Launchers get them as well?

I bet they will be available on both, would make no sense to not have them on tacticals (imho).

Well, Fluff wise they could argue that Devastators are more of the "anti vehicle/tank/flyer" squad and that specialization makes them better at taking out flyers than Tacticals".
In a codex writing mindset it would be a way to force you to make decisions when building lists and what to put in your Heavy slot.

I hope that Tacticals/Scouts/etc have access though.

Not that it's definitive, but CSM only get Flakk missiles on Havocs and iirc DA didn't get them on tacticals either.

I stand corrected by Shadox.