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 Gallahad wrote:

It has to be said that once your game goes on the clearance rack at MM it is effectively dead.

I swear this forum has more chicken littles....

They’re clearing out the discontinued M2E SKUs. Most of the sale is a dollar or two less than normal, but there’s some solid deals to be had.

I'd imagine it's all the SKUs that are vanishing with the new edition

They are ramping up the game, how did you get the information that the game is dead? Wyrd is trying to get into the large scale game racket, if you haven't been keeping up with information. "The Other Side", The expansions for the factions, new books ALA Codex for factions, the new factions from Europe, and "The Other Side"....

My take on it, is that the game is growing, but the long range, short range, and long term planning is for crap. I am not seeing a solid Project Management angle in their way of doing business, as they cut off their noses to spite their face.

It was said elsewhere in this thread that the game expansion is haphazard, and like it is being done in a vacuum, as a legitimately pretty decent game is being bogged down by willy-lily faction creep, over powered characters, and the rest of the standard issue loser stuff that someone wants to pull out of their fourth point of contact just to get some quick sales figures to make the backers and investors happy.

The game is in it's what, supposed 3rd iteration, so THAT doesn't do it any favors, but the extended universe is spot on that you can actually have some fun with it, if you scale back all of that crazy stuff from intermediate 2d edition, expanded into the RPG line, and then onward into the 3rd edition.

The changes are honestly nothing to write home about, and the excuses by now are really wearing thin as to the how's and why's that Wyrd can't continue development outside of a vacuum. Not to mention the !@#$ hot way in which these guys treat paying customers, and people who purchase their products....

Some of us never forgot how we were treated with the craptastic Crap-Starter they pulled for the RPG.... The old saying holds true, if it ain't broke, don't overpower it and "fix" it.

WYRD, you want advice- Focus on Cultivating the following that you lost from 1st to 3rd, and in between. Get out of your protective zone and go out into the word of real gamers and actually see how bad you crapped on your former winning game... You definatly lost beaucoup good will and players, and if you don't stop shucking and jiving, and acting like your poop don't stink- you are never going to recover.

Miniature Market apparently is being run by people who don't want to bother repackaging their M2E stock with the necessary replacement components that Wyrd has already announced they're providing to retailers.

https://www.wyrd-games.net/news/2019/4/29/wyrd-retailer-newsletter-launch-plans

I don't really know much about the game, it has never interested me. I just saw the sale, and figured I'd post.
From a non player perspective, and from what I've seen with other games, when MM runs discounts across a whole range, including the new stuff(terrain, "Other Side", etc.), it doesn't bode well for the health of the game. Opinions may vary, and I hope the game succeeds with the new edition.

 LunarSol wrote:

 Gallahad wrote:

It has to be said that once your game goes on the clearance rack at MM it is effectively dead.

I swear this forum has more chicken littles....

They’re clearing out the discontinued M2E SKUs. Most of the sale is a dollar or two less than normal, but there’s some solid deals to be had.

It's not even clearance, just a sale but it does look to be the old SKUs.

Picked up the RPG as it was a great price and I've been meaning to get it.

They're halving the number of SKU's and it looks like Mini Market is offering the biggest discount on the ones which are being bundled together. For example, the effigies and emissaries are packaged together going forward as Mysterious Fate, Brutal Fate, etc. Moreover, the MSRP dropped on those from $56 for both units to $40 for both. It makes no sense to hold onto a single boxed emissary for $45 when the newer version is cheaper and has another model.

For the most part, other than the deeper discounts on the august/september re-releases, the prices are about what gamenerdz has every day.

 Grot 6 wrote:

The game is in it's what, supposed 3rd iteration, so THAT doesn't do it any favors, but the extended universe is spot on that you can actually have some fun with it, if you scale back all of that crazy stuff from intermediate 2d edition, expanded into the RPG line, and then onward into the 3rd edition.

You say this like its a 6th edition situation. M2E has been around since 2013, which is a pretty standard, even rather lengthy 6 year gap.

I say that exactly like a 6th edition situation, because that is exactly what it is. I'm, talking a whole game shop that was playing the game consistently, buying figs and having a campaign type situation to one where it has been abandoned, and the left over figs are gathering dust on my game establishments rack. They even came out with a Other side set, and it doesn't even get a look. WHY? Because of the drastic changes. BEFORE. The game is unplayable, NOW.

So your area didn’t transition to m2e? Is that the issue? I mean, it happens but it’s not like the games been dead for 6 years. By all accounts m2e has been fairly successful. It might not have kept your locals but it’s certainly not been a failure. It had a lengthy run but was in need of a revamp like any system.

The Other Side is a harder sell. I hear good things but it’s competing in a harder market with less room for competition. I don’t see the point of raging about it though. It’s young and will find a following a die off. It’s far from a bad attempt at cracking into larger scale games though. Just if anything really poorly timed.

Wyrd died with M2E here as well. Probably just because people don’t like change.

Miniaturemarket is local for me, the guys running it do a great job of looking for deals and passing them on. I’m sure they approached Wyrd and offered to take the slow moving stock off their hands for a good price which helps them reinvest the money which is taking up warehouse space and costing rent. I don’t see this as the dumpster fire sales of confrontation and sedition wars.

 Theophony wrote:
Wyrd died with M2E here as well. Probably just because people don’t like change.

Definitely happens. Honestly I think longer editions might make it worse as around year 5 the games seem to struggle to pull in new or casual players and start to revolve around a hardcore fanbase that is often too invested to respond to major changes well.

The M3E release announcement has generated some excitement here, now we know what we're looking at. I had my first game of M3e last night and had a blast, and already have a shopping list fo what I need to expand my Sonnia crew.

 LunarSol wrote:

 Theophony wrote:
Wyrd died with M2E here as well. Probably just because people don’t like change.

Definitely happens. Honestly I think longer editions might make it worse as around year 5 the games seem to struggle to pull in new or casual players and start to revolve around a hardcore fanbase that is often too invested to respond to major changes well.

Pretty much this. The change was too fast, and too drastic, especially when the Avatars came to play. then it became the usual arms race with a skirmish game. The story transition wasn't thought through other then push lickies and chewies for the sake of funding that RPG, then they ignored the RPG... Combine that with the ill will generation with the RPG fiasco, and they lost more then they realized locally.

 Grot 6 wrote:

Pretty much this. The change was too fast, and too drastic, especially when the Avatars came to play. then it became the usual arms race with a skirmish game. The story transition wasn't thought through other then push lickies and chewies for the sake of funding that RPG, then they ignored the RPG... Combine that with the ill will generation with the RPG fiasco, and they lost more then they realized locally.

What went wrong with RPG?
Not (necessarily) disagreeing, I actually do't know.

Very mismanaged Kickstarter,

 LunarSol wrote:
At least locally though, the game went from borderline unplayed to one of our biggest communities over the course of the beta. The focus on clearly defined playstyles and consistent rules across crews has opened it up in a way I've not seen since MK2 Warmachine.

Mmmmmmmm, MK2 Warmachine . You are speaking my language (that period was my favorite gaming experience ever, of any system!). Just wish I had more time to take advantage of this

But M3E really does look to be pushing all my buttons... very interested in checking it out!

 DarkBlack wrote:

 Grot 6 wrote:

Pretty much this. The change was too fast, and too drastic, especially when the Avatars came to play. then it became the usual arms race with a skirmish game. The story transition wasn't thought through other then push lickies and chewies for the sake of funding that RPG, then they ignored the RPG... Combine that with the ill will generation with the RPG fiasco, and they lost more then they realized locally.

What went wrong with RPG?
Not (necessarily) disagreeing, I actually do't know.

It went from one of the most anticipated RPG's to one of the most despised over the course of the project. Lost control of the project halfway through, mismanaged on the most basic level, and then when it came out, it was a work in progress.


To leave it on a high note-
One thing I can say that was one of the best sets to come out of the RPG/ tabletop was the make your own figure range. Absolutely stunning sculpts. The Male and the Female sets are both great.
I honestly want to give 3d edition a chance, based on the mass of stuff I have for this game. Then I saw some of that plastic scenery the other day, and I honestly got a bug for the game back for that alone.

wasn't it they released 2nd edition only like a year or two after the RPG's release?

 Grot 6 wrote:

 DarkBlack wrote:
What went wrong with RPG?

It went from one of the most anticipated RPG's to one of the most despised over the course of the project. Lost control of the project halfway through, mismanaged on the most basic level, and then when it came out, it was a work in progress.

To leave it on a high note-
One thing I can say that was one of the best sets to come out of the RPG/ tabletop was the make your own figure range.

IOW, they did a lesser Soda Pop / Ninja Division, where the business / managerial side didn't do a good job of herding & wrangling the artistic / creative talent; however, they did deliver at some level.

The lesson here is that Wyrd should recognize that they have more of a creative / artistic focus, and should therefore shift to a somewhat different model, where they deliver more against real world deadlines than unattainable "perfection". To that end, a simpler rules system is preferable, because people are really in it for the models, anyways! Fewer levers and fewer moving parts means fewer things can break.

If I remember right they pulled the bloke who was meant to be managing the RPG off it so he could do a bunch of other stuff first/instead

The undercover reporter looks awesome:

https://www.wyrd-games.net/news/2019/5/29/waldos-weekly-if-thats-really-your-name?fbclid=IwAR0axun-gjYfnwSn62zsk1hhl01i8WgPguEZOEX3UoGrAB72WKrO26dA5lA

Wyrd's update this week says that shipping embargoes / trade wars / associated Trump ****ery has delayed some future deliveries of M3e stock, but not the initial rulebooks and factions decks.

Also the bad Things Happen app is going to be discontinued. It will be replaced later this year by a new free M3E app.

In the meantime, M3E Analyzer works just fine.

What’s going on with The Other Side? The manual and starter boxes (specifically gibbering hordes and burning man) seem impossible to find, and it seems like Miniature Market doesn't even carry a lot of the range anymore. Is the game dead on arrival or something? I was really interested in it, but I wasn’t in a hurry, but now it seems to be gone.

That news made me quite sad. I was really looking forward to having some new Malifaux goodies waiting for me when I get home.

Now I'm just going to have to wait impatiently... more.

The Other Side stuff I slowly picked up bit by bit off of eBay. Nobody else seems to carry it and the stuff I've got so far has been way below MSRP.
Good for me, sad for the game.

I'd really like to see some of the stuff they hinted at in the rulebook too.

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
That news made me quite sad. I was really looking forward to having some new Malifaux goodies waiting for me when I get home.

Apparently the models are also not delayed. So far I'm just reading that it's the fluff books.

 .Mikes. wrote:

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
That news made me quite sad. I was really looking forward to having some new Malifaux goodies waiting for me when I get home.

Apparently the models are also not delayed. So far I'm just reading that it's the fluff books.

That's how I read it too. Doesn't look like anything really important will be delayed thankfully.

I, too, agree that the miniatures are the only Wyrd products that matter.

I'm willing to actually give 3E a try though. The cards look a lot more streamlined than all the info that ended up on some of the later 2E models.

My biggest issue with Malifaux is the information overload, a problem I also had with Warmachine, where I had to know not only how all my models interacted with each other, but also all of my opponents models and all the shenanigans they could get up to.

Yeah, I think that there were a decent number of changes to improve that in 3e (like dropping upgrades), but I'm suspicious of multimaster games and still, ultimately, I feel pretty thoroughly burned by the faction and keyword shuffling nonsense.