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Every codex has one or two stinkers. Maybe they used to be a viable option and either changes in edition or tacticshave made them all but useless. Undoubtedly every Ork post or thread will make mention of my two nominees: the cool, but broken Flash Gitz and the beautifully inconsistent kommandos. While kommandos were once a good option, their current state keeps them on the bench and the poor Flash Gitz don't get any love since the 5th edition. So, what are your worst units?

Take your pick:

CSM Possessed. Expensive, overcosted and not very useful on the board.

CSM Warp Talons. Expensive, overcosted, have special rules that don't really matter, only useful in very specific situations.

CSM Thousand Sons. Expensive, overcosted, weird mechanics around the sorcerer, unable to upgrade to heavy weapons. Hard time building an army that fits the fluff.

CSM Mutilators. Expensive, overcosted, too much emphasis on the changing weapons.

CSM Lucius. Duelists have no place in a shooting edition.

CSM Berzerkers. After round one of combat, they are just plain space marines.

CSM Rhinos. Can be glanced to death by bolters.

C:SM Assault centurions - slow, overcosted, low damage output
IG Stormtroopers - can be used only as suicide melta squads, too expensive to field in 10-man units, their super lasguns are only S3
IG Sentinels - fragile, low damage output, waste of FA slot
IG Hellhounds/Banewolfs/Devil dogs - too expensive, too fragile

Flayed ones: Never really were outstanding, now even less so
Triarch Praetorians: They're just....expensive and do bugger all.
Dark Angels: Most new units. Specifically the Nephilim and the plasma based land speeder. Just disappointing.

 techsoldaten wrote:
Take your pick:

CSM Possessed. Expensive, overcosted and not very useful on the board.

CSM Warp Talons. Expensive, overcosted, have special rules that don't really matter, only useful in very specific situations.

CSM Thousand Sons. Expensive, overcosted, weird mechanics around the sorcerer, unable to upgrade to heavy weapons. Hard time building an army that fits the fluff.

CSM Mutilators. Expensive, overcosted, too much emphasis on the changing weapons.

CSM Lucius. Duelists have no place in a shooting edition.

CSM Berzerkers. After round one of combat, they are just plain space marines.

CSM Rhinos. Can be glanced to death by bolters.

Dang bro. You got a lot of options

IG:

Rough Riders: No assault when they come in reserve

Ogryn: Over cost, 6th nerf to Furious Charge hurt

Penal Legion Squad: Only redeeming quality, they have stuborn. No upgrades available.

Easily the worst units in the IG:

Nork Deddog: Overpriced by a few dozen points, meant to add durability to one of the flimsiest squads in the game and does that job poorly at best.

Techpriests: Cost too much, servitors cost too much and the weapons options for those servitors are ludicrously overpriced.

Anything that isn't a vet , chimera , LR , manticore , vendetta , comissar , cmd squad or blob squad . Everything else costs too much, has no resilience or there are other units that do the same things for cheaper . The IG codex does not have good internal balance .

 Avatrass wrote:

IG Stormtroopers - can be used only as suicide melta squads, too expensive to field in 10-man units, their super lasguns are only S3
IG Sentinels - fragile, low damage output, waste of FA slot
IG Hellhounds/Banewolfs/Devil dogs - too expensive, too fragile

Ahem...seriously? Worst in IG codex? All are playable and fun to play. OK, Banewolf and Devildog are very situational and harder to set up, but if you want worst units in IG codex, its Rough Riders. Even if you make room, spend enough points and repeat "its for fun, its for fun", they still get slaughtered by squad of drunken blind grots.

They don't even have models , banewolfs and storm troopers on the other hands do , some even find them nice . That does make the ST and Banewolf a lot worse .

The fact that GW can steal a SW walker and make it bad , also speaks volumes .

As Makumba said, internal balance in IG codex is terrible. Units divide between must have and total trash. You can try to use some weaker units, and even make them work, but it's only merit of your skill/luck. The fact that some of the worst units in IG codex have really good models makes them even worse, because you'd like to see more of them, but the rules are so crappy that noboty wants to use them.

I play two armies so...
Banshees and pyrovores
Just, just no don't even think about including them

Repentia for the Sororitas, Flayed Ones for the Necrons, Cyclops for the Elysians.

Not gonna bother listing the entire CSM codex.

Pyrovores. Hoping it will change, but not holding out on it...

Makumba wrote:
They don't even have models , banewolfs and storm troopers on the other hands do

Admitedly, GW don't sell them anymore judging by the online shop, but just proving they do have models.

Dark Angels - Dark Talon. Followed quickly by the Nephilim. Both fliers are completely garbage and overpriced for what they'll achieve. The sad thing is with a minor tweak or two, the Nephilim would be salvageable. The Dark Talon is a lost cause. Shame - it's a neat looking model.


Tau - Personally while i like the theme, i have no use for drones outside of crisis suit squads or the built in ones on vehicles / sniper squads. I know, i know, there's ways to make them good. It's just that they are pricey to begin with, and require other ancillary stuff on top to be made good.

Both fliers are jank too.


Grey Knights - The champion HQ with the sword stances is all kinds of terrible. I can see what they went for, but man, it fell short of the mark something fierce.

That's the only real and true "stinker" that jumps out at me.

If i had to pick another one .... point costs ? It's an expensive ass codex.

BA: Death Comany w/ Jump Packs. They are almost the price of terminators and the can never be scoring.

ORK: Flash gitz.
SM: Techmarine (simply due the pointcost for a 1wound model)

Daemons: The Burning Chariot of Tzeentch.

Why: Both its shooting options are Heavy type weapons, but they're used by the Exalted Flamer who's counted as riding an open-topped transport, meaning that if you move you can never fire your weapons!
On a vehicle that's about as survivable as a Dark Eldar Ravager, but with the range of a flame template.


It really seems as if the Exalted Flamer was meant to have the Relentless rule, but somehow it was forgotten during the editing phase of things.

DA: LSV. 140pts for a crappy model that can easily kill its itself.

Rough Riders: Need I say more?

 techsoldaten wrote:
Take your pick:

CSM Possessed. Expensive, overcosted and not very useful on the board.

CSM Warp Talons. Expensive, overcosted, have special rules that don't really matter, only useful in very specific situations.

CSM Thousand Sons. Expensive, overcosted, weird mechanics around the sorcerer, unable to upgrade to heavy weapons. Hard time building an army that fits the fluff.

CSM Mutilators. Expensive, overcosted, too much emphasis on the changing weapons.

CSM Lucius. Duelists have no place in a shooting edition.

CSM Berzerkers. After round one of combat, they are just plain space marines.

CSM Rhinos. Can be glanced to death by bolters.

I'd like to throw in

Dark Apostle: Outclassed, expensive for what he does, and generally his effects are poor.

Ahriman: Costs nearly a Land Raider, no effective rules except his warlord trait, and he can spam 'witchfire' spells, which are the worst kind of spells and worst of all he doesn't reroll spells in any fashion so he'll often kill himself by miscasting.

Defiler: Too expensive, Too Schizophrenic in what he does and he's nearly 200+ points of AV12.

Burning chariot-you will never fire it
Nurglings-why would you take them? They do [Mod Edit - Please don't try to get around the expletive filter - thanks. - Alpharius] all
Flamers-unless you take loads your making enemy units more durable and next to never killing them
Furies-have [Mod Edit - Please don't try to get around the expletive filter - thanks. - Alpharius] combat ability and when they lose a combat they die to instability.

Necrons: none.

Eldar:
- Swooping Hawks are too fragile.
- Falcons are mediocre transports/tanks.
- Harlequins and Banshees since they are hard to pull off.
- Iyanden Craftworld is heavily overpriced.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Necrons: none.

Eldar: Swooping Hawks, Falcons, Harlequins. Iyanden Craftworld is heavily overpriced.

You consider flayed ones good?

 Haight wrote:
Dark Angels - Dark Talon. Followed quickly by the Nephilim. Both fliers are completely garbage and overpriced for what they'll achieve. The sad thing is with a minor tweak or two, the Nephilim would be salvageable. The Dark Talon is a lost cause. Shame - it's a neat looking model.

Don't forget the dreaded Land Speeder Vengeance ..... . Like the Nephilim, it is probably a couple tweaks away from being salvageable. Even then though, lots of points for 2HPs, low armour, and a big gun. Just to help the survivability issues it would have to be partnered with the Darkshroud (which has better things it can be escorting).

Avatrass wrote:
IG Stormtroopers - can be used only as suicide melta squads, too expensive to field in 10-man units, their super lasguns are only S3
IG Sentinels - fragile, low damage output, waste of FA slot
IG Hellhounds/Banewolfs/Devil dogs - too expensive, too fragile

I have to disagree with this. While maybe not the most effective option, and would benefit from a points drop, Stormtroopers have a great deal of utility. With meltas, they can be precision AT units, with flamers they can drop in and burn hordes. Never underestimate the ability to allocate wounds from behind, if someone's left the sergeant or special weapons at the back thinking they'll be safe, stormtroopers can fix that. Used en masse, Stormtroopers can do a great job of opening a second front wherever you want them, taking a lot of heat off your advancing troops and countering IG's mobility issues. They are also effective when used as part of a carapace hore with 50+ grenadier vets and 30 stormtroopers.

Sentinels of both varieties can also be useful. While outclassed by the Vendetta, in most games 2 vendettas will be enough. Armoured Sentinels can provide some more AV12 in a mech list, or some more durable heavy weapons for a foot list. Scout Sentinels can get outflanking lascannons or autocannons, which, when hitting side armour, can do a lot of damage. I'm not going to say they are as good as a Vendetta, but that doesn't relegate them to uselessness.

Hellhounds are also a great asset. Direct comparison to the Vendetta in this case is a fallacy, as the two perform entirely different roles. The ability to throw a high-S AP4 template out to 12" can be very effective at clearing infantry, especially in metas where tau/crons/eldar are prominent. The Bane Wolf suffers from short range, and the Devil Dog provides AT better found elsewhere, but the Hellhound itself is far from ineffective.

martin74 wrote:IG:

Rough Riders: No assault when they come in reserve

Ogryn: Over cost, 6th nerf to Furious Charge hurt

Penal Legion Squad: Only redeeming quality, they have stuborn. No upgrades available.

I agree about the Rough Riders, the lack of assault from reserves does relegate them from a counter-charge unit (although with that ability they would be very good with a high threat range).

Similarly, Penal Legion have very few merits, 8 ppm for a Guardsmen with no upgrades is far to expensive. At 60 points a squad, I'd take a squad or two in most games, but 80 is too much.

Ogryn, however, are good. Yes, the change to FC hurt, but they still have a great deal of durability, something the rest of the infantry options lack, and at short range throw around a lot of S5 firepower. They couple well with a Primaris Psyker rolling on Biomancy, who at worst adds some more high-S attacks and at best gets them Endurance for FNP and IWND. They have good force concentration, something also lacking in other areas of the codex, and are a good option, especially in a foot-list.

To answer the question for myself, I do believe there are very very few truly useless units, and I will never just dismiss a unit without testing it first. Most things can be made to work, and even if not the best choice, can perform. There are, however, some I've just not found a use for:

Nork Deddog: potentially useful in a CC CCS, but far too expensive.

Sergeant Bastonne: 50 points to give a vet squad 1 bonus order and a power weapon, when I could get another CCS and get two orders and a bunch more wounds. If he could be added to Stormtroopers, who are often outside orders range, then he might be useful if pricy, but as it stands he's largely useless and hugely overcosted.

That's about it, I think there is at least some use for any unit in the IG and various SM codexes I play.

GoingtoHell wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Necrons: none.

Eldar: Swooping Hawks, Falcons, Harlequins. Iyanden Craftworld is heavily overpriced.

You consider flayed ones good?

They are slightly better in the special Necron List in IA.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

GoingtoHell wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Necrons: none.

Eldar: Swooping Hawks, Falcons, Harlequins. Iyanden Craftworld is heavily overpriced.

You consider flayed ones good?

They are slightly better in the special Necron List in IA.

And yet still suck. They are the worst.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

GoingtoHell wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Necrons: none.

Eldar: Swooping Hawks, Falcons, Harlequins. Iyanden Craftworld is heavily overpriced.

You consider flayed ones good?

They are slightly better in the special Necron List in IA.

This.

In fact, Flayed Ones are very situational.