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 amanita wrote:

 Jimsolo wrote:

 WarOne wrote:

Do you think the Tyranid release warrants a "No thanks, I'll take my money elsewhere" kind of approach?

Please do! I despise Tyranids, and honestly couldn't be happier that the new codex is apparently putting people off. I sincerely hope that it becomes the least played army, possibly being replaced in the GW production priority list by Sisters of Battle.

It's an atrocious army, I don't generally enjoy playing games against it, and I'm looking forward to a few years of not having to deal with bugs.

Maybe in the future, if you try REALLY hard, you won't come across as a complete jacka$$. I certainly hope so.

just ignore him, getting to the point of despising 1 faction of a game shows he really have no life or more urgent things to get concerned on, the bugs got the best of him and still beat him, so go hate your neightbour with nids all you want

My nids will be sitting this codex out, much the same as the last codex once the new BRB hit. It's not that the new book is unplayable, it's that I can't play it the way I want to.

Note to GW: The money I would have spent on new nids is instead going into a Skorne army. You have let this customer down, and will not be getting his money.

 kronk wrote:
I had a buddy in Texas that could either run a Swarming nid list, with tons of gaunts (or whatever) or a nid zilla list with lots of big baddies.

You never knew what you'd face, and those were always tough games!

I hope nids don't get completely kicked in the jimmies with this release for his sake.

Edit: He's a decent painter, too

Other than the painting part (and Texas ), that describes my lists, when they were fielded.
I usually brought several and let my opponent pick whichever they wanted to fight.
Because most anything was viable at the time, but I never wanted to field a hard counter to a pick-up list.
Obviously that last line is a hilarious joke on Tyranids now, if taken out of context/time period.

 kronk wrote:
I had a buddy in Texas that could either run a Swarming nid list, with tons of gaunts (or whatever) or a nid zilla list with lots of big baddies.

You never knew what you'd face, and those were always tough games!

I hope nids don't get completely kicked in the jimmies with this release for his sake.

Edit: He's a decent painter, too!

Oh my, that is nice.
I like the talons.

so, from what i understand....

nids gained:
+4 new big monsters across 2 kits.
+some new recuts of old sculpts

but lost
- instinctive behaviour is now more punishing and can aparently kill your own units?
- less 2+ armor
- more points for some stuff with no real improvment
- tervigon nerfing like no tomorrow
- swarmlord nerfing
- no pods
- no doom
- no book psychic powers
- no allies (wich makes sense, sort of, and was the status quo before anyway)

if the above is true, and im not missing anything critical, - like the exocrine/hausprex thing ising totally BAMF, (i assume its a T6/6W/3+ ?) then i really really feel for bug players. i was even considering finally getting my own nids on track, as ive picked up some random kits here and there.. but this dex looks like a pretty solid downgrade. wich is dissapointing considering that the last few dex releases have all been fairly strong, (tau/eldar/crons/sm/chaos/daemons) and when i say strong, i mean a competetive list, thats got good odds on wining is possible. seems to me the only way to do bugs now is the same old tervigons/gaunts/flyrant/dakkafex combos.

unless i am indeed missing something?

youre missing the things that were gone that give tyranids tactical flexibility on aproax an oponent like mycetic spores and some biomorphs are just worst, like scything talons... and new bugs got at most 5 wounds, not 6s... and trygon decreased by 1A which is increased by 2 pairs of scything talons which give him no further rule (previous trygon was better with 6A and re-rolls to hit)

I'm sooooo sad. Seriously. I have never (and will never) play a different faction in 40k.

With that said GW did NOTHING to entice me to buy anything additional for my army...

And here I was sad at the new Sisters "book" (at least Nids get a physical product and plastic models to make a giant sucking sound on the table, amirite?) with bad units getting much worse, stuff getting deleted, etc.

I think we found a codex even more boring that Sisters... I have wanted to play "Midzilla" since I started the hobby. I love Warriors, Genestealers, Lichtors, etc. This book still doesn't give me that, so GW still won't get money from me for Nids.

Also, I chuckled at Pyrovores still vying for one of the worst units in the game. Up there with SoB Repentia and DE Mandrakes.

 TheKbob wrote:
And here I was sad at the new Sisters "book" (at least Nids get a physical product and plastic models to make a giant sucking sound on the table, amirite?) with bad units getting much worse, stuff getting deleted, etc.

I think we found a codex even more boring that Sisters... I have wanted to play "Midzilla" since I started the hobby. I love Warriors, Genestealers, Lichtors, etc. This book still doesn't give me that, so GW still won't get money from me for Nids.

Also, I chuckled at Pyrovores still vying for one of the worst units in the game. Up there with SoB Repentia and DE Mandrakes.

Repentia used to be more useful, that is until they took even their basic Feel no Pain away. That made even me put them on the shelf.

One of the big things I haven't seen talked about is the fact Nids got a boost to their assault prowess (well for some units at least) in Flesh Hooks and Spine Banks. I rather like that because it makes a fair number of units better at assaulting into cover (a long standing issue for the Nids).

Man am i exited to go to my local gw (that just opened up to!) and ask the new store owner about the codex and his thoughts on it. after hereing hor great and wonderfull and cool it is and how much i buy it, ill pretend i know nothing and ask for help to build a list. ill say l like the pyrovores models, and ask how they fair on the battle field.

While doing this i want to have a buddy secretly video taping the whole thing so later when i feel sad i can watch this and laugh like theres no tomorrow.

As a Sisters player I know what its like to be hated by GW. I feel for my brother Nid players.

I guess GW really didn't want people to play Nids.

flesh hooks and spine banks still only apply to the same old bugs on the previous book, aka lictors and carnifexes (which I2 is almost the same as I1 in the carnifex) ohh nvm 1+ nid do it... paying 5pts on an already 40pts more expensive model, the tyranid Prime...

bastion01 wrote:

 Roci wrote:
I think there are some people like me. I don't think the book will down right suck. I think they will be middle of the roadish.. have some unique quirky stuff but they are not going to be knocking anyone off the top of the hill.

I cancelled my preorder only because I only ever had enough bugs to field the "current" standard build with a few changes here an there. The play style will shift quite a lot and with certain units being removed and ones like the terv not really being viable, I would have to spend a lot of money to rebuild the army. I'm not buying a whole new armies worth of models to stay middle of the road. If I could have bought a few models.. the codex and made a run of it.. I likely would have kept it.. I would be fine banishing the nids to the basement to only be played in home rule games.

tihs is it right here... "buy more models"...if you expected something else then...you just haven't been paying attention
I love a good game...but this as long as Games Workshop is involved...it'll never be about the Game....

Except this release does nothing to make you want to buy more models, and especially not the new models that are supposed to be GW's money grab. The flyers are bad, the exocrine is OK, but no one is going to need more than one, the Haruspex is average at best, they nerfed Hive Guard - even after creating a new kit for them, they MIGHT sell some of the new Warrior kits, just so some people can make the Prime, but I wouldn't expect it as we all have plenty of Warriors already that we can (or already have) modify to a Prime. The ONLY model that some of us Nid players may not have enough of already is the Venomthrope as it's the ONLY unit that got any significant upgrade. They didn't even increase the abilities of the Pyrovore, Raveners, or Lictors, which I imagine they have a serious inventory of collecting dust in their warehouses. No, even as a money grab, this 'Dex is an epic fail

Exactly. Even as a cash grab to sell more or new models, it fails because the new ones are so mediocre in rules. Some of the point adjustments seem to either defy logic, or are too little to salvage weak units, like the much maligned Pyrovore which has been useless ever since it was made (hardly a good way to sell the model).

The stuff that didn't need nerfing got nerfed anyway or got point increases (which is a nerf of sorts), while the weak points still remain unaddressed. It really seems the GW design team at times is lost in its own echo chamber, and the bits of feedback that do get through seem to result in overreactions like the massive Tervigon nerf.

Unfortunately, I fear the only thing poor sales would be interpreted as would be "Players just don't want to play Tyranids at all so it's a waste of time to devote more effort to Tyranids in the future" rather than GW designers messed up with poor design that drove down sales.

Enceladus wrote:
Fortunately the hobby isn't all about winning for me. Forging a narrative and having some giggles with fluff are far more important in most of my games. I have an 'Alien' themed Tyranid army with appropriate conversions throughout, and I'll be taking Acid Blood with as many units as I possibly can!! :-D

Wouldn't it be much more fun to forge a narrative with a book that is somewhat competitive? I have played fluffy lists, mostly because I felt the actual competitive build we had previously was vapid and uninspired. I just hate put my army on the table knowing that, unless I deploy and play perfectly, I have almost no chance to win. even for those that love just playing fun and fluffy, the game is better when armies are balanced against each other

Happily downloaded the codex for free, shant be buying more nids after reading the book, deleted codex and am putting nids back on shelf, try before you buy done and wasted no money.

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
Man, am I excited to go to my local gw (that just opened up too!) and ask the new store owner about the codex and his thoughts on it. After hearing how great and wonderful and cool it is and how much I should buy it, I'll pretend I know nothing and ask for help with building a list. I'll say l like the pyrovore models, and ask how they fair on the battle field.

While doing this I want to have a buddy secretly video taping the whole thing so later when I feel sad I can watch this and laugh like there's no tomorrow.

This.
P.S. There is no tomorrow, at least for 'nids.

Derp, nevermind. Misunderstood.

 Battlesong wrote:

Wouldn't it be much more fun to forge a narrative with a book that is somewhat competitive?

The narratives are already forged. Every White Dwarf batrep shows Nids getting beaten, its much easier to do with a crap codex. Even the newest one gave Nids 200 points over Tau and they still almost got wiped.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:


EDITED TO NOT SOUND TOO EXCITED ;-)

What are you talking about? You did read the bottom of that .pdf right? Its from JUNE 2012... Must be trolling ;-)

Hah, ninja edit! Good one.

I keep looking through the codex and finding it worse and worse.
The Zoanthropes and many other units have Very Bulky / Bulky in their rulesets despite 'nids having no transports of any kind anymore.
What a sloppy mess of a codice.

roxor08 wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:


EDITED TO NOT SOUND TOO EXCITED ;-)

What are you talking about? You did read the bottom of that .pdf right? Its from JUNE 2012... Must be trolling ;-)

Hah, ninja edit! Good one.

Yeah, I only read the small print after I posted >.<

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Derp, nevermind. Misunderstood.

lol this is the 5th codex faq. I dont even play nids and i knew that.

 FastusMustachius wrote:
I keep looking through the codex and finding in worse and worse.
The Zoanthropes and many other units have Very Bulky / Bulky in their rulesets despite 'nids having no transports of any kind anymore.
What a sloppy mess of a codice.

In all fairness, if the R'Varna is anything to go by, there could be cases in future where bulky makes a difference.

 FastusMustachius wrote:
I keep looking through the codex and finding it worse and worse.
The Zoanthropes and many other units have Very Bulky / Bulky in their rulesets despite 'nids having no transports of any kind anymore.
What a sloppy mess of a codice.

It's called being "future-proof".

Imagine they would bring back some kind of transport, then needing to FAQ all that "bulkiness" back into the Codex for all units.

The Harridan is a transport although currently limited to gargoyles.

Picking up my Codex tomorrow but this does not look very promising :(

 Zweischneid wrote:

 FastusMustachius wrote:
I keep looking through the codex and finding it worse and worse.
The Zoanthropes and many other units have Very Bulky / Bulky in their rulesets despite 'nids having no transports of any kind anymore.
What a sloppy mess of a codice.

It's called being "future-proof".

Imagine they would bring back some kind of transport, then needing to FAQ all that "bulkiness" back into the Codex for all units.

how about entering bunkers or imperial strongpoints?

 DarthSpader wrote:
so, from what i understand....

nids gained:
+4 new big monsters across 2 kits.
+some new recuts of old sculpts

but lost
- instinctive behaviour is now more punishing and can aparently kill your own units?
- less 2+ armor
- more points for some stuff with no real improvment
- tervigon nerfing like no tomorrow
- swarmlord nerfing
- no pods
- no doom
- no book psychic powers
- no allies (wich makes sense, sort of, and was the status quo before anyway)

if the above is true, and im not missing anything critical, - like the exocrine/hausprex thing ising totally BAMF, (i assume its a T6/6W/3+ ?) then i really really feel for bug players. i was even considering finally getting my own nids on track, as ive picked up some random kits here and there.. but this dex looks like a pretty solid downgrade. wich is dissapointing considering that the last few dex releases have all been fairly strong, (tau/eldar/crons/sm/chaos/daemons) and when i say strong, i mean a competetive list, thats got good odds on wining is possible. seems to me the only way to do bugs now is the same old tervigons/gaunts/flyrant/dakkafex combos.

unless i am indeed missing something?

We actually only got 3 new units across 4 kits. The Haruspex/Exorcine is new, but we already had the Harpy in the Harpy/Crone kit.

Otherwise, no, you're really not missing anything. The Exorcine is really the only good option of the new monsters. The Haruspex could have been decent, but overall isn't great for its points.

The crone though. Oh man the crone. So bipolar and bad.

 FastusMustachius wrote:
I keep looking through the codex and finding it worse and worse.
The Zoanthropes and many other units have Very Bulky / Bulky in their rulesets despite 'nids having no transports of any kind anymore.
What a sloppy mess of a codice.

Nids have two transports, they're just Apoc-only. Harridan can carry Gargoyles and the Hierophant can take 20 infantry as an assault transport (with an upgrade).

Out of curiosity, was this the first book credited to the "GW Design Team"?