Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Agreed. Mines aren't really there to kill the enemy.

I know that sounds daft, but bear with me:

A basic mine unit (of either flavour) is only 15 points and either uses a slot we don't need much (fast attack) or counts towards compulsory slots (troops). In addition it never gives away victory points and can't help us with objectives. This means the unit is utterly expendable.

Don't worry about whether the mines actually get to go off. If a 15 point unit can draw fire from a 200+ point unit for a turn, it's done its job.

As a result, use more than one mine cluster for each target unit. You're quite right that a single mine cluster charging a unit will just die to overwatch.....but no-one is forcing you to charge. Unlike hormagaunts or rippers, there's no instinctual imperative driving you on. Just float around, 1" away. If he wants to move the unit, he's got to shoot you off the board then wait for next turn to move into the space you occupied, or else charge you and let the mines go off. If anything does charge the unit, charge in with the mines as well, and either he's stuck letting the mines go off or losing overwatch on a nasty melee threat.

I picked up on using mines for board control with an overlord swarm recently and they're great - mucolids especially, because they're big enough to provide the big guys with cover, even from firers on a hill or in an elevated position. Plus - scary area denial for flyers.



Tervigons beat endless swarms into a cocked hat for two reasons; firstly the spawned unit is spawned in the midfield (or even your opponent's deployment zone) and secondly there are few things in any army which can match the durability of a T6, Sv3+, W6 monster with a decent chance of Feel No Pain dug into cover - stack that with Objective Secured and whilst Tervigons don't kill much, they do board control really, really well - that's the key to a bughouse swarm type tyranid list; flyrants and mawlocs are the killers of a hive fleet, but gaunts, mines and tervigons can flood the board to the point that an enemy army has nowhere to go.

Combine tervigons and tyrannocytes and you can suddenly find a part of the enemy's deployment zone swarming with bugs.

The one way an Endless swarm can compete is with tyrgon(s) in support - once you have a trygon tunnel on the other side of the board you can 'express-line' reinforcements into the enemy's position. I'm still not convinced it's a great plan, though.



I'm not sure how a null deploy list would work - without drop pod assault (or equivalent) the tyrannocyte is good for reserves but not for an alpha strike. Maybe living artillery in the backfield with venomthrope cover?

Living Artillery Node
Hypertoxic Node
Combined Arms Detatchment/Leviathan Detachment

The Hypertoxic Node gives you a Tyrant - take wings and maybe the Miasma Cannon instead of one devourer set to benefit from the special rules. The Venomthrope broods give you decent cover for the living artillery. The Toxicrene goes in a tyrannocyte from the Leviathan Detachment.

The troops are either mines or gaunts to provide bubblewrap for the artillery, and you can drop tervigons and tyrannofex, toxicrene or haruspex by spore into the enemy lines alongside the toxicrene.

Tyranid null deployment would require a bastion with comms relay, a venomthrope inside and a tyrant guard on top of the bastion. Stick this in the corner of the table.

topaxygouroun i wrote:
Tyranid null deployment would require a bastion with comms relay, a venomthrope inside and a tyrant guard on top of the bastion. Stick this in the corner of the table.

What mission format are you trying to null deploy for?

krootman. wrote:

 Iechine wrote:
I got deeestroyed all weekend, I'll do a summary but I only went 2-4, dropped the last day like most people did and just hung out with my family at the event which was a lot of fun.

Your family was wonderful, it was awesome meeting them.

Hey thanks man, glad I took your advice and chilled the last day.

Sup Bugs.

Coming into my first major Tournament was an amazing experience. It was super cool meeting everyone at NOVA this year. For my first Tournament with a slightly modified Lictorshame Tyranid list, I went down a very sad 0-5 drop. I think with enough practice, I could have done a lot better, seeing as I spent the majority of August painting and not playing it all makes sense. I made it to Tier One painting, Second round judging, considering I spent the last four days before NOVA painting the majority of my army and I'm more of a painter than a player, I consider that super high praise and a MAJOR victory. Thanks to all of you for telling me how cool my army looked, it's nothing compared with Lechine's, but that's really what made my weekend.

@FTGT - Dope meeting you Evan, I hope we cross paths again soon.
@JY_2 - Thanks for schooling me with CentStar. I'll know a lot better next time I face it.
@Lechine - Thanks for sharing that army, they are simply my favorite looking Tyranids. They're so much cooler in person. I hope you find a better recipe for your wings than "plasticard and tears".

The three of you, if you ever find yourselves in the NYC area, feel free to PM me, look me up. I'd love to play some casuals at my FLGS and drink with you guys.

notbriang wrote:
Sup Bugs.

Coming into my first major Tournament was an amazing experience. It was super cool meeting everyone at NOVA this year. For my first Tournament with a slightly modified Lictorshame Tyranid list, I went down a very sad 0-5 drop. I think with enough practice, I could have done a lot better, seeing as I spent the majority of August painting and not playing it all makes sense. I made it to Tier One painting, Second round judging, considering I spent the last four days before NOVA painting the majority of my army and I'm more of a painter than a player, I consider that super high praise and a MAJOR victory. Thanks to all of you for telling me how cool my army looked, it's nothing compared with Lechine's, but that's really what made my weekend.

@FTGT - Dope meeting you Evan, I hope we cross paths again soon.
@JY_2 - Thanks for schooling me with CentStar. I'll know a lot better next time I face it.
@Lechine - Thanks for sharing that army, they are simply my favorite looking Tyranids. They're so much cooler in person. I hope you find a better recipe for your wings than "plasticard and tears".

The three of you, if you ever find yourselves in the NYC area, feel free to PM me, look me up. I'd love to play some casuals at my FLGS and drink with you guys.

I saw your army at the judging table. It looked great!

 krootman. wrote:

notbriang wrote:
Sup Bugs.

Coming into my first major Tournament was an amazing experience. It was super cool meeting everyone at NOVA this year. For my first Tournament with a slightly modified Lictorshame Tyranid list, I went down a very sad 0-5 drop. I think with enough practice, I could have done a lot better, seeing as I spent the majority of August painting and not playing it all makes sense. I made it to Tier One painting, Second round judging, considering I spent the last four days before NOVA painting the majority of my army and I'm more of a painter than a player, I consider that super high praise and a MAJOR victory. Thanks to all of you for telling me how cool my army looked, it's nothing compared with Lechine's, but that's really what made my weekend.

@FTGT - Dope meeting you Evan, I hope we cross paths again soon.
@JY_2 - Thanks for schooling me with CentStar. I'll know a lot better next time I face it.
@Lechine - Thanks for sharing that army, they are simply my favorite looking Tyranids. They're so much cooler in person. I hope you find a better recipe for your wings than "plasticard and tears".

The three of you, if you ever find yourselves in the NYC area, feel free to PM me, look me up. I'd love to play some casuals at my FLGS and drink with you guys.

I saw your army at the judging table. It looked great!

Thanks a million, Krootman! Evan told me about your list when I saw him watching at the Invitational Final Table on Sunday morning, I wanted to get back to the tables on Sunday to watch it in action, but Roman Lappat was teaching a Metals and Leather Seminar. Loved that list! I can't wait to start playing with Six Flyrants + Random CAD against my friends, just to make them cry. Hehe.

notbriang wrote:

 krootman. wrote:

notbriang wrote:
Sup Bugs.

Coming into my first major Tournament was an amazing experience. It was super cool meeting everyone at NOVA this year. For my first Tournament with a slightly modified Lictorshame Tyranid list, I went down a very sad 0-5 drop. I think with enough practice, I could have done a lot better, seeing as I spent the majority of August painting and not playing it all makes sense. I made it to Tier One painting, Second round judging, considering I spent the last four days before NOVA painting the majority of my army and I'm more of a painter than a player, I consider that super high praise and a MAJOR victory. Thanks to all of you for telling me how cool my army looked, it's nothing compared with Lechine's, but that's really what made my weekend.

@FTGT - Dope meeting you Evan, I hope we cross paths again soon.
@JY_2 - Thanks for schooling me with CentStar. I'll know a lot better next time I face it.
@Lechine - Thanks for sharing that army, they are simply my favorite looking Tyranids. They're so much cooler in person. I hope you find a better recipe for your wings than "plasticard and tears".

The three of you, if you ever find yourselves in the NYC area, feel free to PM me, look me up. I'd love to play some casuals at my FLGS and drink with you guys.

I saw your army at the judging table. It looked great!

Thanks a million, Krootman! Evan told me about your list when I saw him watching at the Invitational Final Table on Sunday morning, I wanted to get back to the tables on Sunday to watch it in action, but Roman Lappat was teaching a Metals and Leather Seminar. Loved that list! I can't wait to start playing with Six Flyrants + Random CAD against my friends, just to make them cry. Hehe.

Thanks man, it did pretty well. A lot of people were confused at 6 flyrants not 5. The daemon summoning really put it over the top. It gave bugs the ground presence they were lacking, and allowed me the ability to keep my flyrants in the air and not on objectives.

 krootman. wrote:

notbriang wrote:

 krootman. wrote:

notbriang wrote:
Sup Bugs.

Coming into my first major Tournament was an amazing experience. It was super cool meeting everyone at NOVA this year. For my first Tournament with a slightly modified Lictorshame Tyranid list, I went down a very sad 0-5 drop. I think with enough practice, I could have done a lot better, seeing as I spent the majority of August painting and not playing it all makes sense. I made it to Tier One painting, Second round judging, considering I spent the last four days before NOVA painting the majority of my army and I'm more of a painter than a player, I consider that super high praise and a MAJOR victory. Thanks to all of you for telling me how cool my army looked, it's nothing compared with Lechine's, but that's really what made my weekend.

@FTGT - Dope meeting you Evan, I hope we cross paths again soon.
@JY_2 - Thanks for schooling me with CentStar. I'll know a lot better next time I face it.
@Lechine - Thanks for sharing that army, they are simply my favorite looking Tyranids. They're so much cooler in person. I hope you find a better recipe for your wings than "plasticard and tears".

The three of you, if you ever find yourselves in the NYC area, feel free to PM me, look me up. I'd love to play some casuals at my FLGS and drink with you guys.

I saw your army at the judging table. It looked great!

Thanks a million, Krootman! Evan told me about your list when I saw him watching at the Invitational Final Table on Sunday morning, I wanted to get back to the tables on Sunday to watch it in action, but Roman Lappat was teaching a Metals and Leather Seminar. Loved that list! I can't wait to start playing with Six Flyrants + Random CAD against my friends, just to make them cry. Hehe.

Thanks man, it did pretty well. A lot of people were confused at 6 flyrants not 5. The daemon summoning really put it over the top. It gave bugs the ground presence they were lacking, and allowed me the ability to keep my flyrants in the air and not on objectives.

Batreps?

 Tyran wrote:

 krootman. wrote:

notbriang wrote:

 krootman. wrote:

notbriang wrote:
Sup Bugs.

Coming into my first major Tournament was an amazing experience. It was super cool meeting everyone at NOVA this year. For my first Tournament with a slightly modified Lictorshame Tyranid list, I went down a very sad 0-5 drop. I think with enough practice, I could have done a lot better, seeing as I spent the majority of August painting and not playing it all makes sense. I made it to Tier One painting, Second round judging, considering I spent the last four days before NOVA painting the majority of my army and I'm more of a painter than a player, I consider that super high praise and a MAJOR victory. Thanks to all of you for telling me how cool my army looked, it's nothing compared with Lechine's, but that's really what made my weekend.

@FTGT - Dope meeting you Evan, I hope we cross paths again soon.
@JY_2 - Thanks for schooling me with CentStar. I'll know a lot better next time I face it.
@Lechine - Thanks for sharing that army, they are simply my favorite looking Tyranids. They're so much cooler in person. I hope you find a better recipe for your wings than "plasticard and tears".

The three of you, if you ever find yourselves in the NYC area, feel free to PM me, look me up. I'd love to play some casuals at my FLGS and drink with you guys.

I saw your army at the judging table. It looked great!

Thanks a million, Krootman! Evan told me about your list when I saw him watching at the Invitational Final Table on Sunday morning, I wanted to get back to the tables on Sunday to watch it in action, but Roman Lappat was teaching a Metals and Leather Seminar. Loved that list! I can't wait to start playing with Six Flyrants + Random CAD against my friends, just to make them cry. Hehe.

Thanks man, it did pretty well. A lot of people were confused at 6 flyrants not 5. The daemon summoning really put it over the top. It gave bugs the ground presence they were lacking, and allowed me the ability to keep my flyrants in the air and not on objectives.

Batreps?

I think one of my games were on the tof stream. Ill be testing some changes to the list pre bfs (tho I wont be able to make it this year) Ill take notes for a bat rep.

For nova format (bfs) there are 2 lists ill be trying out

Both are levi levi daemon allies

List 1 is
6 flyrants, malenthrope, 6 mucloids 2 heralds of Tzeench on discs lvl 1 and a unit of 10 horrors.

The lvl 2 hot on foot was kind of a waste most games I still cant figure out for the life of me why I never considered putting both of them on discs.

list 2 is
6 flyrants, malenthrope, 6 mucloids 2 heralds of Tzeench on discs lvl 1 and 2 units of nurglings.

The pinks were giving up a lot of points in the 2ndaries in nova and they were hard to hide. I am hoping 2 units of nurglings will be much easier to hide. Gives me 1 less dice and only 2 lvl 1 hearlds to summon off but I feel like it could be more difficult to get 2ndareis from.

@krootman, I literally just made a list of my Battlescribe app this morning in response to my Nova list that resembles your new list. xD

5 Flyrants, 5 Spores, 2 ML3 Heralds of Discs (1 with Exalted reward), 11 Horrors, and 8 Screamers.

My lack of ground presence at Nova was concerning. I even had a Tervigon and 30 gants to start with. But she usually ended up spawning gants as bubble wraps and sitting in a corner to deny Marked for Death or kill all enemy troops.

Please refrain from flaunting our Six Flyrant/Daemon love child all over the internet Krootman.

 997Turbo wrote:
Please refrain from flaunting our Six Flyrant/Daemon love child all over the internet Krootman.

Moannnnnnnnnnn

I'm just taking what was 75% your idea (that you also did all the testing for) and taking all the credit for it since I finished higher then you


Turoxxxxxxxxxxx


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Saythings wrote:
@krootman, I literally just made a list of my Battlescribe app this morning in response to my Nova list that resembles your new list. xD

5 Flyrants, 5 Spores, 2 ML3 Heralds of Discs (1 with Exalted reward), 11 Horrors, and 8 Screamers.

My lack of ground presence at Nova was concerning. I even had a Tervigon and 30 gants to start with. But she usually ended up spawning gants as bubble wraps and sitting in a corner to deny Marked for Death or kill all enemy troops.

I tried a 5 flyrant list with fatey and more daemons, but found I needed the firepower of 6 flyrants. Let me know how your list does!

Flicker Fire not good enough eh ?

 Dozer Blades wrote:
Flicker Fire not good enough eh ?

Oh it is, I casted it about 20 + times over the course of the event lol, but I cant tell you how many times that 6th flyrant was clutch.

Here's a major reason why 6-flyrants don't work IMO....Ravenwing. Go up against true Ravenwing or even the semi-RW build with TWC allies and flyrant-spam will have a hard time. RW might not be as common yet in the NOVA format, but i guarantee you that they will dominate in the ITC format.

 jy2 wrote:
Here's a major reason why 6-flyrants don't work IMO....Ravenwing. Go up against true Ravenwing or even the semi-RW build with TWC allies and flyrant-spam will have a hard time. RW might not be as common yet in the NOVA format, but i guarantee you that they will dominate in the ITC format.

You still have e grubs and vector strikes to get the no cover hits, and 6 flyrants can probably push through with those depending on the list they are running.

 krootman. wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
Here's a major reason why 6-flyrants don't work IMO....Ravenwing. Go up against true Ravenwing or even the semi-RW build with TWC allies and flyrant-spam will have a hard time. RW might not be as common yet in the NOVA format, but i guarantee you that they will dominate in the ITC format.

You still have e grubs and vector strikes to get the no cover hits, and 6 flyrants can probably push through with those depending on the list they are running.

Egrubs and VS is just not reliable enough. Assuming you can hit 3 bikes with Egrubs, it'll take you 2 flyrants just to kill 1 biker with it. VS is slightly more reliable, wit the flyrant netting .67W per VS. With 6 flyrants, that is 4 dead bikes a turn, assuming no FNP or invuln saves from characters. However, the problem with either methods is that it can take the flyrant grossly out of position in 1 turn, thus forcing them to either fly off or to possibly go into Glide mode in order to turn around.

Finally you run into the problem of board control (or rather, the lack of) in the ITC format. Keep in mind that there will be NO daemon summoning Tyranids in the ITC. Honestly i'm having a rather tough time building a 6-flyrant list in the ITC format.

 jy2 wrote:
Here's a major reason why 6-flyrants don't work IMO....Ravenwing. Go up against true Ravenwing or even the semi-RW build with TWC allies and flyrant-spam will have a hard time. RW might not be as common yet in the NOVA format, but i guarantee you that they will dominate in the ITC format.

This new super friend build was very popular at ATC. It's kind of broken.

I am sorry this is getting crazy The list Now revolve around 6 Flyrants and is considered competitive play? I can't believe we are even calling this a tactic!!!! Last year 5 was questionable and being jerk. Now its a must to be competitive really...????

This is not even playing the codex it's more like playing AoS 40k style with war-scrolls.


We are already seeing armies with 6+ unit of drop centurions. The codex's are starting to be played with only the best unit in each codex. This is really sad. It's not 40k anymore it Codex best unit.

Raven wing is a hard counter to flyrants spam.
If the 2+ re-roll is allowed you should just shake hands and say good by. The volume of fire from the raven wing should kill a tyrant or two a game. All that twin-linked plasma just eats you alive. Or mass grave units.

I like the ITC, but I have a feeling that the Ard'boys style of play that is developing is going to hurt the hobby more then not.

I hate my self for saying this but I think some form of comp will have to happen in the future with GW rule development style.

Sorry playing VS just 6 Tyrants, spores, and maybe Mawlocs. Is not playing Tyranids. As playing VS Multi centerions drop list is not playing SM.

It is boring to play VS these armies as you either have the counter or you don't. Their is no stratagem involved here. No real skill.

notbriang wrote:Sup Bugs.

Coming into my first major Tournament was an amazing experience. It was super cool meeting everyone at NOVA this year. For my first Tournament with a slightly modified Lictorshame Tyranid list, I went down a very sad 0-5 drop. I think with enough practice, I could have done a lot better, seeing as I spent the majority of August painting and not playing it all makes sense. I made it to Tier One painting, Second round judging, considering I spent the last four days before NOVA painting the majority of my army and I'm more of a painter than a player, I consider that super high praise and a MAJOR victory. Thanks to all of you for telling me how cool my army looked, it's nothing compared with Lechine's, but that's really what made my weekend.

@FTGT - Dope meeting you Evan, I hope we cross paths again soon.
@JY_2 - Thanks for schooling me with CentStar. I'll know a lot better next time I face it.
@Lechine - Thanks for sharing that army, they are simply my favorite looking Tyranids. They're so much cooler in person. I hope you find a better recipe for your wings than "plasticard and tears".

The three of you, if you ever find yourselves in the NYC area, feel free to PM me, look me up. I'd love to play some casuals at my FLGS and drink with you guys.

I appreciate it a lot man, I was blown away by how well my army was received at NOVA and it makes the effort and time spent on it worth it.

It was great hanging out with all of you, I've been posting here since I started 40k and Tyranids so it's always great to meet everyone in person.





Automatically Appended Next Post:
NOVA left me wanting to try something new. I've essentially used the same list since Killadelphia. I told Jim at NOVA that I wasnt going to be buying anything new till a new dex, and I've already managed to fail at that by buying 15 Warriors off ebay to field this list.

Flyrant w/Reaper, ScyTal, Adrenal, Old Adversary Electroshock

Venomthrope
Venomthrope

Mucolid
Mucolid

3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands
3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands
3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands

Flyrant w/LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal, Old Adversary Electroshock
Flyrant w/LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal, Old Adversary Electroshock

Mucolid
Mucolid

3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands
3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands
5x Spore Mines

Tyrants are responsible for 2+ threats and heavier vehicles, Shrikes gang up on everything else. I initially had Rending Claws on the shrikes as well, allowing them to also target 2+ armor and heavier AV, but that means less Shrikes and striking at I4. Venomthropes sprint into the center to give cover bubbles to the paper thin Shrike armor.

An alternative to this looks the same as a Leviathan, but 3 units of 5/4/4 shrikes. I think the MSU nature of this one works better, but what do you all think?

TL/DR, I'm sick of Dakkaflyrants and gants, running a wannabe Tyranidkin army.

notbriang wrote:
Sup Bugs.

Coming into my first major Tournament was an amazing experience. It was super cool meeting everyone at NOVA this year. For my first Tournament with a slightly modified Lictorshame Tyranid list, I went down a very sad 0-5 drop. I think with enough practice, I could have done a lot better, seeing as I spent the majority of August painting and not playing it all makes sense. I made it to Tier One painting, Second round judging, considering I spent the last four days before NOVA painting the majority of my army and I'm more of a painter than a player, I consider that super high praise and a MAJOR victory. Thanks to all of you for telling me how cool my army looked, it's nothing compared with Lechine's, but that's really what made my weekend.

@FTGT - Dope meeting you Evan, I hope we cross paths again soon.
@JY_2 - Thanks for schooling me with CentStar. I'll know a lot better next time I face it.
@Lechine - Thanks for sharing that army, they are simply my favorite looking Tyranids. They're so much cooler in person. I hope you find a better recipe for your wings than "plasticard and tears".

The three of you, if you ever find yourselves in the NYC area, feel free to PM me, look me up. I'd love to play some casuals at my FLGS and drink with you guys.

Hey Brian.

Wow, you picked quite a tournament for your 1st event to attend. It is one of the most competitive 40K events around! I'm glad you were able to enjoy yourself despite the "education" you received there.

Honestly I felt a little bad playing against you. My army was meant to compete at the top tables but a little bad luck here and a mistake there put me in the lower tables. I felt a little dirty running my list there but still, i don't pull any punches in such an event. Besides, that is probably the best way for newer players to learn to play. In any case, sorry for the schooling but i'm glad you didn't take it personally.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

shadowfinder wrote:
I am sorry this is getting crazy The list Now revolve around 6 Flyrants and is considered competitive play? I can't believe we are even calling this a tactic!!!! Last year 5 was questionable and being jerk. Now its a must to be competitive really...????

This is not even playing the codex it's more like playing AoS 40k style with war-scrolls.


We are already seeing armies with 6+ unit of drop centurions. The codex's are starting to be played with only the best unit in each codex. This is really sad. It's not 40k anymore it Codex best unit.

Raven wing is a hard counter to flyrants spam.
If the 2+ re-roll is allowed you should just shake hands and say good by. The volume of fire from the raven wing should kill a tyrant or two a game. All that twin-linked plasma just eats you alive. Or mass grave units.

I like the ITC, but I have a feeling that the Ard'boys style of play that is developing is going to hurt the hobby more then not.

I hate my self for saying this but I think some form of comp will have to happen in the future with GW rule development style.

Sorry playing VS just 6 Tyrants, spores, and maybe Mawlocs. Is not playing Tyranids. As playing VS Multi centerions drop list is not playing SM.

It is boring to play VS these armies as you either have the counter or you don't. Their is no stratagem involved here. No real skill.

Spam has always existed and will always continue to so. However, i think there is a point where spamming will exceed a certain threshold where the army actually becomes less efficient the more of the same unit you add to it. Personally i draw the line at Pentyrants. Any more and it becomes just too much of a RPS build to be able to consistently win a GT.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Dozer Blades wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
Here's a major reason why 6-flyrants don't work IMO....Ravenwing. Go up against true Ravenwing or even the semi-RW build with TWC allies and flyrant-spam will have a hard time. RW might not be as common yet in the NOVA format, but i guarantee you that they will dominate in the ITC format.

This new super friend build was very popular at ATC. It's kind of broken.

It's not as bad in the ITC format, where the deathstar can only attempt 1 of the same psychic powers. But in the ATC/NOVA format where you can have seer councils casting 5 Psychic Shrieks or where you can cast Invisibility again after your first psyker botches casting it (assuming the unit has 2 psykers with Invis), it just becomes bonkers.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Iechine wrote:
NOVA left me wanting to try something new. I've essentially used the same list since Killadelphia. I told Jim at NOVA that I wasnt going to be buying anything new till a new dex, and I've already managed to fail at that by buying 15 Warriors off ebay to field this list.

Flyrant w/Reaper, ScyTal, Adrenal, Old Adversary Electroshock

Venomthrope
Venomthrope

Mucolid
Mucolid

3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands
3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands
3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands

Flyrant w/LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal, Old Adversary Electroshock
Flyrant w/LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal, Old Adversary Electroshock

Mucolid
Mucolid

3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands
3x Shrike w/Flesh Hooks, LW/BS, ScyTal, Adrenal Glands
5x Spore Mines

Tyrants are responsible for 2+ threats and heavier vehicles, Shrikes gang up on everything else. I initially had Rending Claws on the shrikes as well, allowing them to also target 2+ armor and heavier AV, but that means less Shrikes and striking at I4. Venomthropes sprint into the center to give cover bubbles to the paper thin Shrike armor.

An alternative to this looks the same as a Leviathan, but 3 units of 5/4/4 shrikes. I think the MSU nature of this one works better, but what do you all think?

TL/DR, I'm sick of Dakkaflyrants and gants, running a wannabe Tyranidkin army.

Woohoo! Can't wait to see how that army turns out.

Just 2 advice. 1) Run some of those shrikes with rending claws. It makes them slight better (and cheaper) against vehicles. 2) I still prefer 1 malanthrope over 2 venoms. What's more, the malan can actually buff up the close-combat prowess of your cc-army.

^ I may drop a Shrike unit for a Gargoyle squad and some rending claws. One thing that I enjoyed with my gants and I think will be more effective with the Gargoyles is constantly shifting bubble wraps to deny charges that I dont want (looking at you, White Scars).

Shrikes are an interesting unit. Six of them with LW/BS can cut down a Wraithknight with ease in one turn, yet they will struggle against a lot of common models.

I do like the Malanthrope, but with this army I see myself potentially splitting my deployment into corners instead of the traditional castling. I encountered so many drop pod Centurions that made that 3+ save not as desirable as two separate 5+'s , especially if spread across the board. I see needing my shrikes and tyrants to have venoms in ruins that they can get to throughout the game if they intend on staying alive.

Saythings wrote:@krootman, I literally just made a list of my Battlescribe app this morning in response to my Nova list that resembles your new list. xD

5 Flyrants, 5 Spores, 2 ML3 Heralds of Discs (1 with Exalted reward), 11 Horrors, and 8 Screamers.

My lack of ground presence at Nova was concerning. I even had a Tervigon and 30 gants to start with. But she usually ended up spawning gants as bubble wraps and sitting in a corner to deny Marked for Death or kill all enemy troops.

Yeaaa we tried that a long time ago and it just wasn't working. I tried less flyrants with more daemons but I just found that I really liked the 6th flyrant. (thanks turbo 997) (I tried 5 with fateweaver, and it was eehhhhhh). The 230 pts of daemons in the list worked so well and fixed a lot of issues. I was 1 dice roll from the top 8 (lost on tiebreakers on turn 6, had it won on 5). The list worked really really well. I also only had 1 practice game with it before nova (spent the last few months playing gladius) so I feel like maybe some more games would have made a difference in the knock out rounds.

jy2 wrote:

 krootman. wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
Here's a major reason why 6-flyrants don't work IMO....Ravenwing. Go up against true Ravenwing or even the semi-RW build with TWC allies and flyrant-spam will have a hard time. RW might not be as common yet in the NOVA format, but i guarantee you that they will dominate in the ITC format.

You still have e grubs and vector strikes to get the no cover hits, and 6 flyrants can probably push through with those depending on the list they are running.

Egrubs and VS is just not reliable enough. Assuming you can hit 3 bikes with Egrubs, it'll take you 2 flyrants just to kill 1 biker with it. VS is slightly more reliable, wit the flyrant netting .67W per VS. With 6 flyrants, that is 4 dead bikes a turn, assuming no FNP or invuln saves from characters. However, the problem with either methods is that it can take the flyrant grossly out of position in 1 turn, thus forcing them to either fly off or to possibly go into Glide mode in order to turn around.

Finally you run into the problem of board control (or rather, the lack of) in the ITC format. Keep in mind that there will be NO daemon summoning Tyranids in the ITC. Honestly i'm having a rather tough time building a 6-flyrant list in the ITC format.

Welp that is the big issue, that really hurts. We were actually looking at 7 flyrants for itc (5 with e grub) but honestly it has the same problems the 6 build list has in a non cta format, aka no ground presence. However outside of itc format or any other cta banning format, bugs daemons can beat thunderwolf star. For nova Turbo 997 and myself made this list because it can counter the death star lists. (he knocked out Alex Fennel in the invitational who was running wolf star) Eventually they have to split to grab objectives and that's when the flyrants shine.

shadowfinder wrote:I am sorry this is getting crazy The list Now revolve around 6 Flyrants and is considered competitive play? I can't believe we are even calling this a tactic!!!! Last year 5 was questionable and being jerk. Now its a must to be competitive really...????

This is not even playing the codex it's more like playing AoS 40k style with war-scrolls.


We are already seeing armies with 6+ unit of drop centurions. The codex's are starting to be played with only the best unit in each codex. This is really sad. It's not 40k anymore it Codex best unit.

Raven wing is a hard counter to flyrants spam.
If the 2+ re-roll is allowed you should just shake hands and say good by. The volume of fire from the raven wing should kill a tyrant or two a game. All that twin-linked plasma just eats you alive. Or mass grave units.

I like the ITC, but I have a feeling that the Ard'boys style of play that is developing is going to hurt the hobby more then not.

I hate my self for saying this but I think some form of comp will have to happen in the future with GW rule development style.

Sorry playing VS just 6 Tyrants, spores, and maybe Mawlocs. Is not playing Tyranids. As playing VS Multi centerions drop list is not playing SM.

It is boring to play VS these armies as you either have the counter or you don't. Their is no stratagem involved here. No real skill.

Nobody is making you play in these events. You are perfectly free to avoid this kind of play and these types of lists. It may be boring to you, but I very much enjoy playing competitive 40k. I never understood why people like to talk about how boring it is to play or how its bad for the game. Last I checked I never heard gt players complain how bad casual lists are for the game...

Last I checked there are multiple ways to play this game

How did you model your Shrike wings can I aks jy2 or are they the old FW models?

 Ratius wrote:
How did you model your Shrike wings can I aks jy2 or are they the old FW models?

I don't actually run shrikes but I do have some of the models with the FW wings. If I were to go about converting them, the easiest way to do so would probably be to snip off the wings of some gargoyles and then put them on your warriors.

My Shrikes are going to be pretty pretty.

 Iechine wrote:
My Shrikes are going to be pretty pretty.

More plasticard and tears ... you poor man.

Where are my jy2 reports on Nova?!! hehe.

I briefly introduced myself as a fan of jy2 at Nova. I was the guy with the 5 unpainted (I am ashamed) Flyrants with the unique insect-styled wings. We talked Thursday night and asked you how your games went Friday night after Round 2. (Very vague I know!) xD

That being said, when I saw jy2 at Nova, the only thing I was thinking was... can't wait to see his army pics and reports!! HAHAHA. Thanks for making those reports btw. It's always nice getting that first person thought process that we see in your reports.

I just released he brought Centstar to Nova this year, regardless, respect for all your help with the Nids tactica.

JY2 is on vacation in Eurpoe for a bit (though I've still seen him posting) and that's actually partly why he didn't take his nids to NOVA from what we talked about.