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 Unyielding Hunger wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
As much as I'd hate to say it, but with 8th coming up, it's probably time to retire this thread and to start a whole new one once 8th officially comes out. It may also be time for someone else to carry the torch here on dakka, at least to get things started enough for the new thread to eventually become self-sustaining.

The problem is finding a person whose voice actually carries weight around here for the Tyranid community. There hasn't been much in the way of a professional crew for the army in any recent times beyond yourself. I'm a history buff and critical analyst for Nids, but I don't really follow the comp crowd as much as some do. There are probably enough old timers around to come up with a panel though. The trick is just getting personalities to collaborate.

I don't think it'll be that big of a deal. As long as we had someone to keep the first post updated(if we do the reviews and tactics again anyway) it shouldn't matter.

StarHunter25 wrote:
But right now my thoughts are that the quality of tyranids right now is gong to be totally reliant on what synapse and instinctive behavior do. If their streamline everything approach is taken, I expect every IB to end up as what current Feed is. Something ridiculous like "if out of synapse lose d6-ld models." Or "d6 in morale test always a 6".

I'm thinking it will probably revert to something similar to 5th (Feed = must charge, Lurk = must move to cover), though it also wouldn't surprise me if they completely threw out instinctive behavior and simply used it as a keyword to differentiate from synapse organisms. I doubt they will keep the tables and they already stated moral tests could represent casualties from psychic feedback (ala Dawn of War II).

Also nice to see a bit more information on Trygons. Between the damage buff and the fixing of the tunnel, it seems like they will be one of the more improved units with the new edition.

I'd expect trygons and carnifexes to do D6 damage in close combat. Trygon will probably have 4-5 Att whereas the carnifex 3.

 jy2 wrote:
I'd expect trygons and carnifexes to do D6 damage in close combat. Trygon will probably have 4-5 Att whereas the carnifex 3.

I would hope the Carnifex had at least 4 attacks, and a Trygon feels like it should have at least 6. Hitting on 4+ is bad enough, they don't need to also have so few attacks =/.

Wow, I was expecting Carnifexen to do D3 with 2 -3x attacks, will HOW still be a "thing" I wonder? Carnifex assaults look suitably scarey.

Tyranid Faction Focus:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/21/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-tyranids/

With the Swarmlord's profile:

Synapse = Immunity to Morale Checks

I'm so hyped right now! Seems like Tyranids really got the boost they needed! It seems to me like we got a pretty safe first turn charge if we bring a trygon and a swarmlord. Just bring as many genestealers as we can fit within 3" of the trygon, and 9" from an enemy unit, use "hive commander" on the genestealers that lets them move 8" in the shooting phase. Thats awesome, especially if you read the stats on genestealers.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/21/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-tyranids/

Looking promising....

I wonder if old Swarmy will force invulns to be rerolled like his original form? Also, he still an HQ! Suck it Rowbooty

Power 15 is also very interesting.

With Knight Titans at 23, and a 5 man tactical squad at 5, that puts our Swarmlord around 250-300 points I'd wager.

Assuming power level is about 18 points per power anyways.

YES! YES! YES!

If all Nids at their current level prove to be the "wounded as all hell" version in the new edition, I'm going to be a happy camper. Taking a hit to the Movement, Strength and Attacks is a much better alternative than losing WS and BS. Also shows GW is cool with bouncing around what stat gets hit. My fear was a Tyrannofex or Dakkafex ending up shooting worse than Orks in lategame.

Having Stealers go into Combat at range 8+d6+8+2d6+1 is scary to say the least, and having additional ones pop up with a Trygon, that's almost better than current GSC Cult Ambush, with the almost only coming from Obj saturation. I'm going to interested to see if GSC will have a place in my army at all or if the horde of Purestrains is going to come back home.

So yay, will be def keen to smash out my Tyranids

Now I have the hard choice of will I be better off with my usual 3x8man genestealers with BL or go for the max power of 20 genestealers with BL

Also.. Wow at the speed of a Swarmlord.. Now the real question is how will Tyrant Guard work in the new ruleset

GodDamUser wrote:

Also.. Wow at the speed of a Swarmlord.. Now the real question is how will Tyrant Guard work in the new ruleset

They made mention of Tyrant guard on the latest Q&A. Body guard units will be able to tank wounds that nearby HQ units suffer, I'd assume on a roll of 'x+'. I was wondering what my sword and board lychguard would do now, but they still have their purpose!

I think trygons will be big in 8th. Shooty armies need to shield their most expensive units with cheap troops. Tyrgons let's us get in close from all sides real fast.

 Klowny wrote:

GodDamUser wrote:

Also.. Wow at the speed of a Swarmlord.. Now the real question is how will Tyrant Guard work in the new ruleset

They made mention of Tyrant guard on the latest Q&A. Body guard units will be able to tank wounds that nearby HQ units suffer, I'd assume on a roll of 'x+'. I was wondering what my sword and board lychguard would do now, but they still have their purpose!

The question is not if Tyrant guard can take wounds. They will. Ablative wounds is their job. The question is their M attribute. Will they be able to keep up?

That's pretty much it..

Swarm Lord is mega fast.. I am wondering how the Guard will keep up

Just make sure he's shielded by cheap troops,

Maybe the tyrant guard will have some rule that allows them to piggy back on the m of a tyranid character they are protecting and move when they move, but otherwise have a reletively slow m for nids so if they get separated from a character they just really diminish.

Dunno. They will need to be quick to be worth a damn.

GodDamUser wrote:
That's pretty much it..

Swarm Lord is mega fast.. I am wondering how the Guard will keep up

There are a lot of possibilities, though the most simple one would be to just use Hive Commander on the Guard to sling them up the board and run/advance with Swarmy until you're in range to assault. Just because he has the potential to move 18'' in a single turn doesn't mean it wise to always do so.

 Lance845 wrote:
Maybe the tyrant guard will have some rule that allows them to piggy back on the m of a tyranid character they are protecting and move when they move, but otherwise have a reletively slow m for nids so if they get separated from a character they just really diminish.

Dunno. They will need to be quick to be worth a damn.

Just like how they work in Dawn of War.

Anyone think Swarmy with t6 and a 3+ save is underwhelming defensively?
Sure we havent seen his special rules, he might have an inv but seeing as how that new Primaris captain is t5, 6w and a 3+, what then are the marine special characters or chapter masters going to have
Isnt Swarmy supposed to be the absolute pinnacle of Nid evolution - both offensively and defensively.

 Ratius wrote:
Anyone think Swarmy with t6 and a 3+ save is underwhelming defensively?
Sure we havent seen his special rules, he might have an inv but seeing as how that new Primaris captain is t5, 6w and a 3+, what then are the marine special characters or chapter masters going to have
Isnt Swarmy supposed to be the absolute pinnacle of Nid evolution - both offensively and defensively.

He has a 5+ invulnerable save, improved to 4+ in melee. Plus he is a psyker and Catalyst still exists so add a 5+ FNP on top of that.
Oh and 12 wounds.

As for Space Marine characters or Chapter Masters, Guilliman, the pinnacle of the Ultramarine stats, is equal or inferior to the Swarmlord in most stats except BS and saves, so I doubt the others will be anywhere close to the Swarmlord.

I expect the Primaris Captains to be as good as it comes in terms of stats, and superior to most Chapter Masters or special characters.

Curious that no one has mentioned that with the changes to Assault weapons, we can run (Advance) and shoot with a -1 to hit.

I would imagine the only way to play Swarmlord will be to pod him in and use hive commander and other deep-strikers to seriously threat overload. He is paper thin for the (assumed) massive points cost. Do the math on a couple lascannons hitting him at D6 wounds a pop or some rapid fire plasma. Poof!

I have a feeling the best monstrous creatures are going to be ones with 9 wounds or that are super cheap and can be spammed. A heavy point units like Swarmlord simply go down too easily.

Could be wrong, but my guess based on what is known.

It's a fair assumption to make, but it also depends on how much Tyrant Guard cost and how fast they are. If they move fast enough to keep up with Swarmy then you have alot of ablative wounds.

Plasma is not great against the Swarmlod, poor range and single damage. The overcharged mode is considerably more dangerous, but it is risky.

The Swarmlord needs 27 normal plasma hits to be killed, 40.5 if FNP is active. Halve those numbers for the overcharged mode (13.5 and 20.25)

That's a massive improvement over the 7.5 hits (11.25 with FNP) needed for the current Swarmlord.

As for Lascannons, you need 7.7 Lascannon hits to kill it, 11.6 with FNP activated. Again an improvement over the 6 (9 with FNP) hits needed against the current Swarmlord,.

Of course now the Swarmlord will suffer damage degradation, but the only problematic one is its movement.

Also is should be protected by Guards.

Tyran wrote:
Curious that no one has mentioned that with the changes to Assault weapons, we can run (Advance) and shoot with a -1 to hit.

That's because we have no idea what our weapons will actually be yet. Likely still assault. But whos to say? We haven't seen a single nid weapon profile yet.

For some reason now I have the mental image of Tyranid Warriors with 4 Spinefists.