Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'd prefer an alternate - call it "Visions of the End". A series of "what ifs" dredged from the Black Library, penned by the greatest Farseer of the Eldar. Each book is a vision of which way the Runes of Fate may fall. It pits you in a 12-tiered battle branched campaign as the ultimate lord of one of the two main races in each book, or one of the lesser allies attempting to ensure the survival of your race. The result of each battle swings the balance of fate of each closer towards doom or salvation. Each victory brings the winner closer to his goal, but breeds greater and greater desperation to the loser.

Book 1 - The End of Man: Chaos returns to the homeworld led by Abbadon; as the battle rages on Terra the fate of the Emperor is decided - will the worship of the Emperor dictate he be reborn whole to fend off the legions or will he succumb to become yet another God of Chaos?

Book 2 - Doom of the Eldar: Slaneesh is calling. Through the century it has hunted the Eldar and now it can contain its hunger no longer. The Dark Eldar have unwittingly fallen to the wiles of Slaneesh, and if it has its way it will slake its thirst on both races - and any that fall between it and its prey.

Book 3 - The Devoured Universe: The main thrust of the Tyranid Hive Fleet reaches the galaxy. The Necrons are fully awake; they refuse to allow the universe to fall before they reconquer it. C'tan shards battle Norn Queens and the true terror of both races unfolds as the rest of the galaxy is drawn into the battle.

Book 4 - The Green Tide: Ghazgul unearths an astonishing weapon of the Elder Gods; a weapon that transforms the already war-like race into a savage, murderous Waaagh! The Tau, the last secret ploy of the Elder Gods possess the only secret to stop Ghazguul's reign of terror - if they can unlock the secrets buried away in their racial genes - a secret hidden in the origin of the traitorous Farsight Enclave.

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:
The problem with that is that Abaddon beat Horus' Clone in single combat. While the clone wouldn't have had the combat experience that the real Horus had it's still impressive and this is before abaddon obtained Drach'nyen.

Even the Emperor couldn't recreate the Primarchs after he lost them the first time, so how would a clone made by Fabius Bile be equal to the real Horus?

 EngulfedObject wrote:

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:
The problem with that is that Abaddon beat Horus' Clone in single combat. While the clone wouldn't have had the combat experience that the real Horus had it's still impressive and this is before abaddon obtained Drach'nyen.

Even the Emperor couldn't recreate the Primarchs after he lost them the first time, so how would a clone made by Fabius Bile be equal to the real Horus?

Considering that Fabius Bile was trained by the greatest of all Dark Eldar Homenculus, who tend to cheat death/create fully living clones with an almost alarming rate of regularity, and that the Emperor would never stoop down to asking something akin to that for answers on how to recreate the Primarchs tends to create paths that others wouldn't take.

There's also the fact that it's a Clone, considering that the things to create the Primarchs the first time likely took far more effort I figure.

 EngulfedObject wrote:

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:
The problem with that is that Abaddon beat Horus' Clone in single combat. While the clone wouldn't have had the combat experience that the real Horus had it's still impressive and this is before abaddon obtained Drach'nyen.

Even the Emperor couldn't recreate the Primarchs after he lost them the first time, so how would a clone made by Fabius Bile be equal to the real Horus?

Fabius created a perfect clone of Horus and abbadon did'nt beat it in combat.

... Horus' soul is gone, folks. History. Obliterated. Sir Not-Appearing-In-This-Franchise-Again. He got killed so hard by the Emperor that his soul disintegrated into nothingness. Not even the Chaos Gods can bring him back.

So clone him all you want. It's still not Horus.

 Stormonu wrote:
I'd prefer an alternate - call it "Visions of the End". A series of "what ifs" dredged from the Black Library, penned by the greatest Farseer of the Eldar. Each book is a vision of which way the Runes of Fate may fall. It pits you in a 12-tiered battle branched campaign as the ultimate lord of one of the two main races in each book, or one of the lesser allies attempting to ensure the survival of your race. The result of each battle swings the balance of fate of each closer towards doom or salvation. Each victory brings the winner closer to his goal, but breeds greater and greater desperation to the loser.

Book 1 - The End of Man: Chaos returns to the homeworld led by Abbadon; as the battle rages on Terra the fate of the Emperor is decided - will the worship of the Emperor dictate he be reborn whole to fend off the legions or will he succumb to become yet another God of Chaos?

Book 2 - Doom of the Eldar: Slaneesh is calling. Through the century it has hunted the Eldar and now it can contain its hunger no longer. The Dark Eldar have unwittingly fallen to the wiles of Slaneesh, and if it has its way it will slake its thirst on both races - and any that fall between it and its prey.

Book 3 - The Devoured Universe: The main thrust of the Tyranid Hive Fleet reaches the galaxy. The Necrons are fully awake; they refuse to allow the universe to fall before they reconquer it. C'tan shards battle Norn Queens and the true terror of both races unfolds as the rest of the galaxy is drawn into the battle.

Book 4 - The Green Tide: Ghazgul unearths an astonishing weapon of the Elder Gods; a weapon that transforms the already war-like race into a savage, murderous Waaagh! The Tau, the last secret ploy of the Elder Gods possess the only secret to stop Ghazguul's reign of terror - if they can unlock the secrets buried away in their racial genes - a secret hidden in the origin of the traitorous Farsight Enclave.

Can this be a thing? It allows massive plot advancements, while still allowing the game as it stands to function.

Though personally, I wouldn't mind the Hrud, Squats, and various other fluff-only factions coming in if they focus on past events.... Give me my Hrud!

The more I think about it, the more I want an end times. Bring it on!

Cool to have russ and the thirteenth company come back and magnus to repent and fight together agent chaos on terra. Sanguineous and gulliman to rise and other lost primarchs to come back with genetic material bring back legions and face off against daemon primarchs.

Why would Magnus repent? He was loyal until Russ set his planet on fire.

If they do it like WHFB, DE and CWE part of the same detachmemt, PFP and BF for everybody!

hopefully not.

...the Eldar factions are already Battle-Brothers, arent they?

 Psienesis wrote:
Why would Magnus repent? He was loyal until Russ set his planet on fire.

I have always liked the idea that Russ realized how terribly stupid his actions during the heresy were & went to the EoT to apologize to Magnus & bring him back. Horribly not canon but with how much of 40ks canon runs off of 'shhhh, forge the narrative harder' it really doesn't feel as ridiculous as it otherwise would be.

Russ? Realize he's being a bone-head? Heresy!

Magnus, since that time, has directly attacked Fenris (and apparently forgot that he can crack planets with his mind from orbit) and thrown away much of the remaining Thousand Sons in so doing.

He's also now a Daemon Prince. That's not really something that one stops being.

Magnus hasn't done much of anything. TS warbands are operating independently of him, and have since Ahriman cast his rubric

It's far more likely to see Ahriman stand against Chaos in some final battle; his character has always held that underlying resentment of Tzeentch's manipulation of him and his legion. My own headcanon has him seeing a way to undo the damage of both his own Rubric and Tzeentch, and he won't let anything stand in his way; Imperial, Eldar, Chaos or even his own Primarch.

Not that he's a nice guy by any stretch of the imagination, but in some kind of end times scenario, I can see him quite happily stabbing Abaddon in the back, giving Tzeentch the finger and carving out a domain for himself once the dust settles.

 TranSpyre wrote:
Magnus hasn't done much of anything. TS warbands are operating independently of him, and have since Ahriman cast his rubric

He broke Frenris at the Fang, so that's close enough to doing stuff. The Space Wolves were crippled thanks to his actions.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MajorStoffer wrote:
It's far more likely to see Ahriman stand against Chaos in some final battle; his character has always held that underlying resentment of Tzeentch's manipulation of him and his legion. My own headcanon has him seeing a way to undo the damage of both his own Rubric and Tzeentch, and he won't let anything stand in his way; Imperial, Eldar, Chaos or even his own Primarch.

Not that he's a nice guy by any stretch of the imagination, but in some kind of end times scenario, I can see him quite happily stabbing Abaddon in the back, giving Tzeentch the finger and carving out a domain for himself once the dust settles.

Do I smell a 40k Tomb Kings faction with Space Nagash?

 EngulfedObject wrote:

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:
The problem with that is that Abaddon beat Horus' Clone in single combat. While the clone wouldn't have had the combat experience that the real Horus had it's still impressive and this is before abaddon obtained Drach'nyen.

Even the Emperor couldn't recreate the Primarchs after he lost them the first time, so how would a clone made by Fabius Bile be equal to the real Horus?

becauee he's Fabius Bile. He also creates several clones of Ferrus Manus during the heresy. And yes the clone,chile not having the combat experience of Horus, is still intelligent and killed a company of Rubricae before Abaddon stepped in.

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:

 EngulfedObject wrote:

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:
The problem with that is that Abaddon beat Horus' Clone in single combat. While the clone wouldn't have had the combat experience that the real Horus had it's still impressive and this is before abaddon obtained Drach'nyen.

Even the Emperor couldn't recreate the Primarchs after he lost them the first time, so how would a clone made by Fabius Bile be equal to the real Horus?

becauee he's Fabius Bile. He also creates several clones of Ferrus Manus during the heresy. And yes the clone,chile not having the combat experience of Horus, is still intelligent and killed a company of Rubricae before Abaddon stepped in.

It doesn't matter, it still needs the soul of the Primarch, as the Primarchs are creations of the Warp, not flesh. Which also explains how Abaddon went toe to toe with one and won.

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:

 EngulfedObject wrote:

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:
The problem with that is that Abaddon beat Horus' Clone in single combat. While the clone wouldn't have had the combat experience that the real Horus had it's still impressive and this is before abaddon obtained Drach'nyen.

Even the Emperor couldn't recreate the Primarchs after he lost them the first time, so how would a clone made by Fabius Bile be equal to the real Horus?

becauee he's Fabius Bile. He also creates several clones of Ferrus Manus during the heresy. And yes the clone,chile not having the combat experience of Horus, is still intelligent and killed a company of Rubricae before Abaddon stepped in.

It doesn't matter, it still needs the soul of the Primarch, as the Primarchs are creations of the Warp, not flesh. Which also explains how Abaddon went toe to toe with one and won.

*Citation Needed*

The Emperor used Arcane Science and Forbidden Lore, not literal Warp. They are genetic (Flesh) made from the Emperor.

There will not be an End Times for 40K, as the Horus Heresy expansions are the equal of such as the End Times. There is too much in 40k that could be stuffed up, which is why they are expanding on an already silent 'campaign' already established in the fluff.

 traonis wrote:
There will not be an End Times for 40K, as the Horus Heresy expansions are the equal of such as the End Times. There is too much in 40k that could be stuffed up, which is why they are expanding on an already silent 'campaign' already established in the fluff.

Just because there is alot they could stuff up, doesn't mean they wont do an End Times for 40k. You seem very sure of the fact they wont do one, though I am sure alot of people would have said the same thing about Fantasy not long ago.

Would it make GW money? Would it prompt people to buy expensive resin Primarch models from Forge World? Could they create new gigantic plastic kits that they could sell for huge amounts (and if you didn't buy them you couldn't really compete or play the "new" game)?

Oh.

Well, then, yes, I think they will do it.

 pantheralegionnaire wrote:
Would it make GW money? Would it prompt people to buy expensive resin Primarch models from Forge World? Could they create new gigantic plastic kits that they could sell for huge amounts (and if you didn't buy them you couldn't really compete or play the "new" game)?

Oh.

Well, then, yes, I think they will do it.

I would sell my firstborn to get my hands on a Mortarion model if he became useable in 40k.
Games Workshop would stand to make a lot of money if there was an End Times

 TranSpyre wrote:
Magnus hasn't done much of anything. TS warbands are operating independently of him, and have since Ahriman cast his rubric

Battle of the Fang? Magnus showed up personally to kill the Space Wolves.

Failed, of course, because GW forgot that he was a psyker of god-like power, but, then, they couldn't have the Wolves lose, now, could they?

 Psienesis wrote:

 TranSpyre wrote:
Magnus hasn't done much of anything. TS warbands are operating independently of him, and have since Ahriman cast his rubric

Battle of the Fang? Magnus showed up personally to kill the Space Wolves.

Failed, of course, because GW forgot that he was a psyker of god-like power, but, then, they couldn't have the Wolves lose, now, could they?

I wouldn't call it a failure. Magnus failed to destroy them, but he crippled their leadership by physically ripping apart their command and obliterated their research project to create stable Space Wolf gene-seed so they could create successors.

"Secondary Objective achieved" is still failure to attain the Primary Mission, which was to wipe out the Space Wolves, destroy the Fang, and avenge Prospero.

I wish for the Primarchs that are still alive to come back!

End Times for 40k has been great. GW has managed to rejuvenate the entire franchise of Fantasy with theirs, and the stories have been genuinely entertaining. 40k feels obsolete and boring by comparison.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:

 EngulfedObject wrote:

 Veteran of The Long War wrote:
The problem with that is that Abaddon beat Horus' Clone in single combat. While the clone wouldn't have had the combat experience that the real Horus had it's still impressive and this is before abaddon obtained Drach'nyen.

Even the Emperor couldn't recreate the Primarchs after he lost them the first time, so how would a clone made by Fabius Bile be equal to the real Horus?

becauee he's Fabius Bile. He also creates several clones of Ferrus Manus during the heresy. And yes the clone,chile not having the combat experience of Horus, is still intelligent and killed a company of Rubricae before Abaddon stepped in.

It doesn't matter, it still needs the soul of the Primarch, as the Primarchs are creations of the Warp, not flesh. Which also explains how Abaddon went toe to toe with one and won.

*Citation Needed*

The Emperor used Arcane Science and Forbidden Lore, not literal Warp. They are genetic (Flesh) made from the Emperor.

agreed not "literal" warp, but the warp was 100% used in there creation as for citation, fulgrim was a floating ball of energy when he landed on chemos... good enough.

 Harriticus wrote:
End Times for 40k has been great. GW has managed to rejuvenate the entire franchise of Fantasy with theirs, and the stories have been genuinely entertaining. 40k feels obsolete and boring by comparison.

I agree with this statement. Time to make 40k storyline exciting with some big change ups!