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Essentially, strip him down to his boxer shorts, leave all the organs there, how effective would he be without the technology behind him? Could he function or is the black carapace as vital to his function as his own skin?
I'm a little light on info here and was just curious!
Basically I wondered if a marine was captured, sent to Commoragh and stripped of everything he externally had, could he still walk around and kick arse? I don't doubt that he'd still be man+, though am curious about how vital those components are in his ability to, for instance, arm wrestle (just to give a simple.example)
He could still kick some serious ass. Space Marines are uber tough and uber quick even without the PA.
Thought for the day: Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
30k Ultramarines: 2000 pts
Bolt Action Germans: ~1200 pts
AOS Stormcast: Just starting.
The Empire : ~60-70 models.
1500 pts
: My Salamanders painting blog 16 Infantry and 2 Vehicles done so far!
Absolutely. They are essentially "Master Chiefs", genetic superhumans. They wouldn't be as strong as say Orkz or Nidz, but they are stronger than the average human.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
jreilly89 wrote: Absolutely. They are essentially "Master Chiefs", genetic superhumans. They wouldn't be as strong as say Orkz or Nidz, but they are stronger than the average human.
Pfft, they're way better than Spartans.
Ultimately, the PA is only icing on the cake for a marine. They're still formidable warriors even without their armor.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
The Black Carapace isn't external per say. There's ports that can be seen, but it's not like you could remove it without removing all of a marine's skin first.
If you mean before the Black Carapce is installed, well that's just a scout marine. Of course they're still effective.
Without Power Armor Astartes can still do stuff like bench a thousand pounds with little effort or turn people into mist with punches, you wouldn't want to be on the opposite side. Plus they still have the extremely good training of the Chapter, making them excellent marksmen (virtually all the standard space marine does is pray, sleep, train, pray, and train more).
Plus the ribcage is fused and provides excellent protection against ballistic weapons, and their blood clots instantly and develops scar tissue in seconds.
Basically an Ork Nob, only speedier with less strength.
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
They also eat and they eat lots. They are like race-horses. They are the top of human evolution, but it comes at a great cost. Hundreds of lives might be lost just to make a simple Space Marine. Of course they are superhuman in battle with great aim, speed and strength often added by centuries of experience.
As for black cerapace I would look here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjaYW5Cnr5k even though it's unofficial. It's grafted into not just the skin but skeleton. So good luck removing it.
If you have nothing nice to say then say frakking nothing.
Still very effective. Able to kill an ork with his bare hands, or a group of men for that matter, from what I've gathered from the novels. His anatomy still affords resilience to gunfire, but without the armour he's not bulletproof against small arms, so if a squad of guardsmen, or eldar guardians caught him int the open and got a volley in, he'd be brought down, if not killed.
No reason to remove the black carapace, it does nothing but allow interface to the power armor. Leaving it will not help the marine.
Also, you might want to read the webcomic Eat-a-tau!
"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1
Beaviz81 wrote: They also eat and they eat lots. They are like race-horses. They are the top of human evolution, but it comes at a great cost. Hundreds of lives might be lost just to make a simple Space Marine. Of course they are superhuman in battle with great aim, speed and strength often added by centuries of experience.
As for black cerapace I would look here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjaYW5Cnr5k even though it's unofficial. It's grafted into not just the skin but skeleton. So good luck removing it.
Wat?
Space Marines barely need to eat at all to stay combat effective and can go days, even a week without a meal and not suffer problems (although part of that is probably due to armor. But if they need calories, they can do crazy stuff like eat rocks or metal for substance.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
thegreatchimp wrote: Still very effective. Able to kill an ork with his bare hands, or a group of men for that matter, from what I've gathered from the novels. His anatomy still affords resilience to gunfire, but without the armour he's not bulletproof against small arms, so if a squad of guardsmen, or eldar guardians caught him int the open and got a volley in, he'd be brought down, if not killed.
Normal gunfire like 7.62 or 5.56 shouldn't be that lethal at all, but stuff like Eldar shurikens shred unarmored flesh. Lasguns as well.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/02 01:00:49
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
Beaviz81 wrote: They also eat and they eat lots. They are like race-horses. They are the top of human evolution, but it comes at a great cost. Hundreds of lives might be lost just to make a simple Space Marine. Of course they are superhuman in battle with great aim, speed and strength often added by centuries of experience.
As for black cerapace I would look here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjaYW5Cnr5k even though it's unofficial. It's grafted into not just the skin but skeleton. So good luck removing it.
Wat?
Space Marines barely need to eat at all to stay combat effective and can go days, even a week without a meal and not suffer problems (although part of that is probably due to armor. But if they need calories, they can do crazy stuff like eat rocks or metal for substance.
How effective do you think they would be over time if just subsisting on the basics? They can do that for a while, but eventually their superhuman bodies would break down. Heck it's even established in fluff that their dinners are like a feast for us, while it's barely a meal for them. And sure they can scrape by on a diet consisting of bare stuff, but in the end they need something more.
If you have nothing nice to say then say frakking nothing.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
They can go a while without eating, but only to a point. They cannot eat rocks or metal for energy, their skeletons does require some inorganic compounds that they do eat, but its not a substitute for carbs, protein, and fat. They can eat a lot of things a normal human would find inedible though. They probably have the ability to digest fiber, so they could live off of wood and other plant material for a while.
Having the ability to enter a torpid state also allows long periods without eating, but when they wake up they will need food and lots of it.
Marine food has been described as being insanely nutrient dense, likely because lots of normal food simply wouldn't have enough calories unless you were constantly eating them. They'd need to eat foods very high in carbs and fat to meet energy requirements. They'd also need a lot of protein, they'd be scarfing down a lot of red meat.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/02 01:18:34
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Beaviz81 wrote: They also eat and they eat lots. They are like race-horses. They are the top of human evolution, but it comes at a great cost. Hundreds of lives might be lost just to make a simple Space Marine. Of course they are superhuman in battle with great aim, speed and strength often added by centuries of experience.
As for black cerapace I would look here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjaYW5Cnr5k even though it's unofficial. It's grafted into not just the skin but skeleton. So good luck removing it.
Wat?
Space Marines barely need to eat at all to stay combat effective and can go days, even a week without a meal and not suffer problems (although part of that is probably due to armor. But if they need calories, they can do crazy stuff like eat rocks or metal for substance.
How effective do you think they would be over time if just subsisting on the basics? They can do that for a while, but eventually their superhuman bodies would break down. Heck it's even established in fluff that their dinners are like a feast for us, while it's barely a meal for them. And sure they can scrape by on a diet consisting of bare stuff, but in the end they need something more.
They don't break down in the sense that they need a lot of special food, as much as the gene seed is volatile and they need the supervision of the apothecarion.
But they can spend a lon period of time without any resources. Shrike and the rest of his company was stuck behind Ork lines for months without any food from the Chapter. Although they could have eaten orks for nutrients.
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
You can't extract energy out of stones/minerals because they dont contain usable substances like carbohydrates. They might have carbon in them however that is in bound form which is energy intensive to break up, and carbon isn't carbohydrate either. Guess why nobody uses minerals for energy extraction. And they have to eat way more then regular humans do, alone from the body mass they have to move around, and also to keep it at acceptable temperatures (core temperature). If they want to be powerfull they need energy, and energy can only be aquired by consuming actual food.
Their strength is to be able to eat stuff that humans would propably die off. And their waste products are recycled by their suit to extract the nutritient parts that are still in it. They still have to consume food. You can't just live from your own gak for a month, no, not even genetically engineered superhumans.
They are the top of human evolution
No they are not, because they are genetically enhanced. They didnt evolve through nature.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/02/02 01:26:56
They just take turns guarding each other as they graze while behind enemy lines, like they do with Cavalry. Probably eat their victims too, and probably eat whatever they can bite while wandering the battlefield. Maybe they have huge fat storage, it could explain their stupidly large shoulder pads? To maintain their muscle and so on they would need to be on pretty strict diets, so after a battle they would need time to readjust their eating habits. But during battle the only way they could last more than days is if they could eat like animals (grass, leaves, maybe even some wood?)
In a city though it would be like trying to keep a farm going in a city.
They must defecate a lot too. I wonder how many chapters have been defeated because their enemies followed their huge poop trails and huge foot craters?
I wonder how many chapters have been defeated because their enemies followed their huge poop trails and huge foot craters?
rofl... PA propably compresses the filtered dung into a brick (it wouldnt contain any water or nutritient, so it would be quite hard ) , then they could dig a hole and stack the bricks/ build fortifications from them... lol In all seriousness, i'm positive that marines just bite into everything that could sustain them if they don't have access to supplies. Every human would do that, but marines just can do it better (like everything else)
Keep wrote: You can't extract energy out of stones/minerals because they dont contain usable substances like carbohydrates. They might have carbon in them however that is in bound form which is energy intensive to break up, and carbon isn't carbohydrate either. Guess why nobody uses minerals for energy extraction. And they have to eat way more then regular humans do, alone from the body mass they have to move around, and also to keep it at acceptable temperatures (core temperature). If they want to be powerfull they need energy, and energy can only be aquired by consuming actual food.
Their strength is to be able to eat stuff that humans would propably die off. And their waste products are recycled by their suit to extract the nutritient parts that are still in it. They still have to consume food. You can't just live from your own gak for a month, no, not even genetically engineered superhumans.
They are the top of human evolution
No they are not, because they are genetically enhanced. They didnt evolve through nature.
Yep. Evolution happens to a population not to an individual despite what Pokemon might say.
Thought for the day: Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
30k Ultramarines: 2000 pts
Bolt Action Germans: ~1200 pts
AOS Stormcast: Just starting.
The Empire : ~60-70 models.
1500 pts
: My Salamanders painting blog 16 Infantry and 2 Vehicles done so far!
Evolution is not necessarily natural though -- artificial selection still produces separate species by purposefully select desirable genotypes in a subject's gene pool.
What makes space marines not a viable evolutionary step is that they cannot reproduce by themselves.
See: corn/maize and bananas (yes)...
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/02/02 01:41:32
I wonder how many chapters have been defeated because their enemies followed their huge poop trails and huge foot craters?
rofl... PA propably compresses the filtered dung into a brick (it wouldnt contain any water or nutritient, so it would be quite hard ) , then they could dig a hole and stack the bricks/ build fortifications from them... lol In all seriousness, i'm positive that marines just bite into everything that could sustain them if they don't have access to supplies. Every human would do that, but marines just can do it better (like everything else)
Is the poop brick factory in their shoulder pads too? Or does their body do this?
Even so, brick poop would still be track-able. Im surprised brick poop isnt used as their ammo. They could have guns with cartridges designed to fit their compressed poop bricks, and then use a mass driver system to launch chunks of it at the enemy with killer speeds. They will just have to get over the fact they might be eating someones poop when they feast on their victims.
They just take turns guarding each other as they graze while behind enemy lines, like they do with Cavalry. Probably eat their victims too, and probably eat whatever they can bite while wandering the battlefield. Maybe they have huge fat storage, it could explain their stupidly large shoulder pads? To maintain their muscle and so on they would need to be on pretty strict diets, so after a battle they would need time to readjust their eating habits. But during battle the only way they could last more than days is if they could eat like animals (grass, leaves, maybe even some wood?)
In a city though it would be like trying to keep a farm going in a city.
They must defecate a lot too. I wonder how many chapters have been defeated because their enemies followed their huge poop trails and huge foot craters?
So many unanswered questions.
Considering their extremely potent stomach acids and saliva, I doubt they actually do so at all. I wouldn't be surprised if an Astartes GI tract resembled something more like a chemical fire where virtually everything is processed.
Also, we in the modern day have figured out how to safely extract and make water from dung, or food.
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
They just take turns guarding each other as they graze while behind enemy lines, like they do with Cavalry. Probably eat their victims too, and probably eat whatever they can bite while wandering the battlefield. Maybe they have huge fat storage, it could explain their stupidly large shoulder pads? To maintain their muscle and so on they would need to be on pretty strict diets, so after a battle they would need time to readjust their eating habits. But during battle the only way they could last more than days is if they could eat like animals (grass, leaves, maybe even some wood?)
In a city though it would be like trying to keep a farm going in a city.
They must defecate a lot too. I wonder how many chapters have been defeated because their enemies followed their huge poop trails and huge foot craters?
So many unanswered questions.
Considering their extremely potent stomach acids and saliva, I doubt they actually do so at all. I wouldn't be surprised if an Astartes GI tract resembled something more like a chemical fire where virtually everything is processed.
Also, we in the modern day have figured out how to safely extract and make water from dung, or food.
I dont think digestive systems can work like that... Even so, that does not mean they would not be eating most of their lives. It would take a long time for them to break up rocks and eat them that its probably not worth their effort given their dietary needs.
Extracting water etc from our feces only lasts so long. You simply cant keep filtering and drinking/eating what comes out of your body over and over. Its something you can do every so often. For example, a rock is of little to no nutritional value, so say they ate the rock, they would get far less from that rocks round 2 in the stomach.
They still need to eat a lot mate, even if they can eat anything. They would also need dentures early.
They will just have to get over the fact they might be eating someones poop when they feast on their victims.
So? If you wanna survive you can't go "meh i don't like the taste of that". In cases like that they develop into oversized bear grylls.
it's getting late, better drink my own piss /bear grylls signing off
Have you seen a heard of cows and the poop that follows? Its nasty. But yes with time and effort they can cover their trails.
Yea I simply said they would have to get over it. I agree on the grylls analogy. Except grills can live off some zebra fat and a few grubbs. Space Marines would need trees and whole zebras.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/02 01:53:24
... the PA is powered by a nuclear reactor. Once the suit has extracted all of the nutrients it can out of their waste, it probably just feeds it into the reactor to break it down on the atomic level to continue providing power.
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
The Marine would still be strong enough to crush a man or Eldar's skull with their bare hands, fast enough to do so before the former could fully process a thought, and tough enough to have a wooden baseball bat broken over his forehead without feeling it.
So pretty effective in your scenario. Not as fast as an Eldar, or as tough as an Ork (probably stronger than all but a Nob though), but overall more effective than either even without powered armour.
Swastakowey wrote: Maybe they have huge fat storage, it could explain their stupidly large shoulder pads?
So Pauldrons would be like camel humps?
Yes exactly, great for long distance operations where food is scarce. Frankly I think its a great idea and would solve the huge food issue temporarily.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
The Empire 
1500 pts
: 
~1.5k
) , then they could dig a hole and stack the bricks/ build fortifications from them... 
!
