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 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

 Red Viper wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

Based on that evidence, and using Occam's razor as a guide, you can reasonably conclude that this is shaping up to be a steaming pile of horse gak

Not quite yet. It very well could be... be we really need to see some Warscrolls first.

It sounds like GW is trying to emulate Wrath of Kings, I have no idea if they can pull it off. Unlike some people in this thread, I genuinely hope they do.

I'm firmly in the "wait and see" camp.

A lot of GW defenders criticise their fellow gamers for the flak they give GW, but it's because they LOVE the games so much, that these people react in such an angry manner. People genuinely want the AOS to be a cracking game, only a tiny minority want it to crash and burn.

Sadly, the evidence points to this going downhill, and that's why people engage in nerd rage.

I see more nerd rage from the neckbeards who are already gak talking a game system that even isn't out yet than I do people raging about how good the game is...

I'm looking forward to the game and already have a copy held for me at the LGS and I honestly don't care wether or not anyone on here gets it or not, my store already has its orders booked up with people who are coming back to Fantasy because of AoS. Just seems a lot of people on here like to complain just because they can't deal with change. Ah well, I'll enjoy AoS while everyone keeps crying on this thread pretending that their whining will make a difference.

/rage away now fellas.

 Accolade wrote:

 Flashman wrote:
Nothing GW do these days convinces me they will ever release a decent set of rules again.

Ironically, Dreadfleet may have been the last time they attempted anything fresh, but it just wasn't what people were expecting/wanted, so it sunk (ho ho).

Time to invest in other games methinks. I'm already enjoying X-Wing and Dropzone Commander while Tabletop Gaming Magazine was full of stuff I'd like to have a crack at. Guildball is looking interesting...

Yeah, the Dreadfleet thing kills me.

The models for it were quite nice, but the game seems to have some issues. But worse than any of that, apparently GW didn't do any market research to determine if a one-off fantasy fleet all-stars (since you got one ship per faction) game would be something that would be well-received. The same problem went for WHFB- you had models that look great (i.e. new Wood Elves were quite popular), but there were substantial issues with the game itself, possibly including things such as the game costing too much to get into. It seems that instead of trying to tackle what concerns there might be regarding the game itself, the plan is just to shoehorn all models into purchasability and expect people to jump into it. I don't feel that is the best plan of action by any means.

Wood Elves weren't plagued by the game itself, rather the fact that they had a crummy book with very few stand-out units.

It wasn't until Khaine that I started seeing Wood Elves played, aside from my own, locally.

 Flashman wrote:
Ironically, Dreadfleet may have been the last time they attempted anything fresh, but it just wasn't what people were expecting/wanted, so it sunk (ho ho).

That and the game just didn't sound any fun to play, either. I don't remember seeing very many reviews of it but all I remember is the game was apparently so pointlessly random that you had very little control over what played out on the table, to the point where you couldn't even move where you wanted to as wind currents would just blow you all over the place. Almost like the game played itself, you just set it up and the dice do everything else.

Random, random, random.

 NAVARRO wrote:
Damn, this is still a quite nerve wrecking ride!

Ok so no points but we have not seen the Scrolls yet, also Sales reps are probably clueless with the gaming side of things?

I think there will be 2 outcomes for me on this.

- I enjoy the game and keep on expanding my collections on my own bubble of preferences

- I do not enjoy it and will keep on collecting stuff for other games, prev editions included

GW seems more interested in giving us minis, so as long as there are good minis to buy I will collect them.

Is it sad that all is discarded? Not ideal I can guarantee you that but at the end of the day Im lucky that this is just a hobby for me and I take control to where I want to take it.

They should make 40k rules free too.

That's my stance as well.

I'm "lucky" enough to not have a gaming community large enough to support pick up games.

This means I don't have to worry about having a globally accepted game system. I can collect whatever minis I want and use whatever rules I want with my small group of friends. I will continue collecting WHFB armies. Maybe I'll play 6th edition. Maybe I'll play KoW. Maybe I'll play Mayhem, or Armies of Arcana, or Hail Caesar, or Pike & Shotte. Maybe if I feel like doing a fantasy skirmish I'll play AoS. Or maybe it will be Song of Blades and Heroes or Wrath of Kings or whatever.

To me it looks like AoS will have an evolving story line. As this is really the very beginning of whatever may come. It would be like releasing 40k but starting in the great crusade?

Zwan1One wrote:
To me it looks like AoS will have an evolving story line. As this is really the very beginning of whatever may come. It would be like releasing 40k but starting in the great crusade?

Or moving the Warhammer World forward, starting with the return of Nagash.

 Sidstyler wrote:

 Flashman wrote:
Ironically, Dreadfleet may have been the last time they attempted anything fresh, but it just wasn't what people were expecting/wanted, so it sunk (ho ho).

That and the game just didn't sound any fun to play, either. I don't remember seeing very many reviews of it but all I remember is the game was apparently so pointlessly random that you had very little control over what played out on the table, to the point where you couldn't even move where you wanted to as wind currents would just blow you all over the place. Almost like the game played itself, you just set it up and the dice do everything else.

Random, random, random.

That's a huge exaggeration. Yes, the wind direction changes randomly, but it's just a Speed bonus/penalty depending on a ship's orientation. And half the ships in the game don't even move under wind power. Yes, there are maaaybe 6 random event cards that can cause one or both fleets to just explode. Remove those and you have a fun game with exemplary clean mechanics.

 TheAuldGrump wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
Based on that evidence, and using Occam's razor as a guide, you can reasonably conclude that this is shaping up to be a steaming pile of horse gak

With a shovel.

For folks to use when looking for the pony.

I can't even build up a whole lot of enthusiasm for the figures in the box. There are just not enough of the ones I can even tolerate to make me willing to spend the money. (After painting up an island of Blood set for a commission, I had to admit that the Elves included were damned spiffy. The Skaven... with a few exceptions, were not all that good.)

The Auld Grump

The thing that surprises me is people's reaction to unbound being in this game. 40k has unbound, it sold reasonably well, why wouldn't GW transfer that over to fantasy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Flashman wrote:
Nothing GW do these days convinces me they will ever release a decent set of rules again.

Ironically, Dreadfleet may have been the last time they attempted anything fresh, but it just wasn't what people were expecting/wanted, so it sunk (ho ho).

Time to invest in other games methinks. I'm already enjoying X-Wing and Dropzone Commander while Tabletop Gaming Magazine was full of stuff I'd like to have a crack at. Guildball is looking interesting...

What's everybody got against Dreadfleet? I swear to God, I must be the only person on Dakka that actually enjoyed playing it

Yes, I made loads of money snapping up copies and selling them later on at vastly inflated prices

But I do genuinely enjoy dreafleet, and I still have a copy that I bring out now and again.

 Sidstyler wrote:

 Flashman wrote:
Ironically, Dreadfleet may have been the last time they attempted anything fresh, but it just wasn't what people were expecting/wanted, so it sunk (ho ho).

That and the game just didn't sound any fun to play, either. I don't remember seeing very many reviews of it but all I remember is the game was apparently so pointlessly random that you had very little control over what played out on the table, to the point where you couldn't even move where you wanted to as wind currents would just blow you all over the place. Almost like the game played itself, you just set it up and the dice do everything else.

Random, random, random.

Jake Thornton's Review of Dreadfleet is a classic

http://quirkworthy.com/2011/10/08/dreadfleet-review-2-more-ships-more-battles/

WD free mini on sprue, for the curious:





- Salvage

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
The thing that surprises me is people's reaction to unbound being in this game. 40k has unbound, it sold reasonably well, why wouldn't GW transfer that over to fantasy.

Which part is surprising?

It doesn't surprise me if we get unbound in WHFB. I won't like it, but it won't surprise me if we get it.

Also, what makes you think "it sold reasonably well"? It seems to me that GW's financials were pretty flat in the period when 7th came out and it seemed there were plenty of people who didn't like it and didn't buy it.

 Boss Salvage wrote:
WD free mini on sprue, for the curious:
>snipped image<

- Salvage

Interesting, so the split does go right down the middle of the shoulder pad. I thought they tried to avoid that sort of thing.

Sweeeeeeeet, free miniiiiiis.

The fluff about the demi-gods being past champions but each time they die they are brought back a little 'less,' is that a rumour/wishlisting or is that confirmed? That would be some awesome fluff, wonder if we get to see some of the past heroes reveal themselves.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
The thing that surprises me is people's reaction to unbound being in this game. 40k has unbound, it sold reasonably well, why wouldn't GW transfer that over to fantasy.

Which part is surprising?

It doesn't surprise me if we get unbound in WHFB. I won't like it, but it won't surprise me if we get it.

Also, what makes you think "it sold reasonably well"? It seems to me that GW's financials were pretty flat in the period when 7th came out and it seemed there were plenty of people who didn't like it and didn't buy it.

I was under the impression that 40k was propping up the whole company, and if that starts to sink, GW will be looking for a parachute.

 Boss Salvage wrote:
WD free mini on sprue, for the curious:

Spoiler:

- Salvage

I realy look forward to converting thisone come Saturday!

 streamdragon wrote:

 Boss Salvage wrote:
WD free mini on sprue, for the curious:
>snipped image<

- Salvage

Interesting, so the split does go right down the middle of the shoulder pad. I thought they tried to avoid that sort of thing.

They need to sell liquid green stuff somehow!

Also, not sure why they did not put one of the sigmarines as the free model, since it is the "newest" look, and presumably the mary-sue-marine of the new fantasy world (also, strange that they seem to have some kind of Necron reanimation protocol memory drain thing going on when they get killed... kind of sad when you just resurrect your entire army after it has been killed and turn what were once mighty heroes into even more mindless zombies).

No details on the legs is a shsame, but for a free mini its quite nice.

Okay looks usable for something I guess.

I remember once playing an asteroid crewed with a kingdom of minotaurs crossing the cosmos in D&D's Spelljammer.

Never once imagined I'd be able to do the same in Warhammer!

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Sweeeeeeeet, free miniiiiiis.

The fluff about the demi-gods being past champions but each time they die they are brought back a little 'less,' is that a rumour/wishlisting or is that confirmed? That would be some awesome fluff, wonder if we get to see some of the past heroes reveal themselves.

Sounds like the Beric Dondarrion concept from A Song of Ice and Fire.

 Pacific wrote:
I remember once playing an asteroid crewed with a kingdom of minotaurs crossing the cosmos in D&D's Spelljammer.

Never once imagined I'd be able to do the same in Warhammer!

Yeah but spelljammer was good.

BAM: http://document.li/V0v0

(Though mostly confirming I need to see those unit cards to know anything )

- Salvage

 Boss Salvage wrote:
BAM: http://document.li/V0v0

(Though mostly confirming I need to see those unit cards to know anything )

- Salvage

Nice!

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
The thing that surprises me is people's reaction to unbound being in this game. 40k has unbound, it sold reasonably well, why wouldn't GW transfer that over to fantasy.

Just because Unbound is in the rules for 40K does not mean that it was a primary reason people chose to buy the rulebook. I don't know anyone in my circle of friends that play unbound, I haven't heard of any tournaments in my area (Seattle) that use unbound. From my perspective, the rules for Unbound might as well not be in the book for all the impact they have on my local metagame.

I really would like to see a scale picture of that model assembled next to a plastic Chaos Warrior and some State Troops (preferably a Greatsword).

"Lightning hammers"

 ImAGeek wrote:


People are saying maybe the game will be balanced by how many models are on each scroll, like 3 chaos warriors = 10 goblins or whatever, but surely that only works for units? Because a Skaven Cheiftain would be one scroll, and a high elf Lord on dragon would be one scroll (maybe two? One for the Lord and one for the dragon) but there's no way 1-2 Cheiftains would be equal to a dragon elf Lord...

Couldn't they be equal though? People are familiar with old metrics... but if said Dragon Elf Lord is a close-combat monster, while the Skaven Chief buffed the hell out of all Skaven within 12" (and buffed them enough to have an interesting chance against said Elf Lord), aren't they earning the battle-field value in potentially "equal" but different ways?

I'm definitely filing this all under the reasonable "wait and see". If Warscroll interactions really do resemble Warmachine or Malifaux, this could yet work out just fine. I think those most confident that this will be unplayable are just doing so being their context is so deeply rooted in the old WHFB, which sadly, is just plain GONE.

Luckily a lot of very good rules sets exist to be mass-battles homes for the exact models already in your collections, and hopefully this game does something interesting. Again... all we can do now is wait a week.

 Boss Salvage wrote:
BAM: http://document.li/V0v0

(Though mostly confirming I need to see those unit cards to know anything )

- Salvage

Img'd up

Hmm, looks like roundbases are a thing!

Would be cool to see a multi-tiered system where they roll points values in to size 'o game. For example, <500 play as Mordheim (awesome game!), 500-2500 as 8th, >2500 apocalypse/endtimes-esque. I don't care what happens rules wise provided I can still play a mass fantasy game.

One of those pictures looks like it is being sucked into the warp.