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I cheered the church on when they got Cersei cornered. The Nude Walk of shame for her

 easysauce wrote:
Glad I never read the books, im starting to think this might be the one series where the show is the better of the two so should be watched first as opposed to things like the hobbit/LOTR

The first three books are really good. I highly encourage you to read them. Then stop there if you don't want to start getting bogged down.

This show is, in some ways, better than the books only in that it cuts the fat and moves forward. We will see HBO bring the series to a conclusion far before GRRM even finishes the next book.

Seconding this. The first three books are very well-written and easily are the best piece of fantasy literature since Tolkien. Books 4 and 5, however, are bad. Really bad. Boring as hell, nothing happens at all. It's one of the reasons why the current TV season is the worst by a long shot, there just isn't much to work with.

 Sigvatr wrote:
This is the worst season by a long shot so far.

Unfortunately it has been the weakest.

I didn't think anything could be worse than the bore-fest that is the Danny POV, but the Sand Snakes arc is just horrible. Acting is poor and that sword fight was poorly choreographed.

Still better than 90 percent of the other crap on TV, which is reality tv shows on every channel.

 pretre wrote:

 easysauce wrote:
Glad I never read the books, im starting to think this might be the one series where the show is the better of the two so should be watched first as opposed to things like the hobbit/LOTR

The first three books are really good. I highly encourage you to read them. Then stop there if you don't want to start getting bogged down.

This show is, in some ways, better than the books only in that it cuts the fat and moves forward. We will see HBO bring the series to a conclusion far before GRRM even finishes the next book.

sorry i mis spoke, I never read the books before I watched the shows.

Currently on the 2nd book, the intention is to watch it first though, they are good books though! makes me hope for some RA salvatore TV or film adaptions though, drizzt would make for some good watching I bet.

I agree with anyone saying this season has been pretty bad.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Seconding this. The first three books are very well-written and easily are the best piece of fantasy literature since Tolkien. Books 4 and 5, however, are bad. Really bad. Boring as hell, nothing happens at all. It's one of the reasons why the current TV season is the worst by a long shot, there just isn't much to work with.

Easily the best since Tolkien.... is generous.

I'm not going to agree or disagree but it is a commonly held enough belief. The only others that tend to be even held near the same level are 'The Dark Tower' and the Wheel Of Time series.

 Piston Honda wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
This is the worst season by a long shot so far.

Unfortunately it has been the weakest.

I didn't think anything could be worse than the bore-fest that is the Danny POV, but the Sand Snakes arc is just horrible. Acting is poor and that sword fight was poorly choreographed.

Still better than 90 percent of the other crap on TV, which is reality tv shows on every channel.

It could be worse - they could have followed the books faithfully this season - that would have been an actual disaster - terrible pointless plots and characters, sea changes in established characters - the most recent books are some of the worst books I have read for a long time - glad I got rid of them. The first few books are indeed excellent novels and an extremely good fantasy sequence - one, however amongst many - old and new.

The Sand Snakes are pretty poorly done - but everything else is in mine and my various friends opinion brilliant - with the possible exception of Aria's story - which , like the books - seems to be a total indulgence to keep GRM happy and seems to have little chance of actually being relevant.

Dany in the show is three million times better than the pathetic pinning sulky, indecisive teenage that GRM reverted her to in the recent books.....

I would say that Terry Pratchett, Neil Gaiman, Brandon Sanderson, Glen Cook, Joe Abercrombie and R. Scott Bakker all tell a better story and on average write better books than Mr. Martin. Writing two and a half really good books out of five published is not that resounding of an achievement. This just happens to be one of those things that catches in our collective consciousness.

I'm not saying people can't or shouldn't like the series, but lets face it, no matter how much you liked the first three - the last two drag the average down pretty hardcore and pretending otherwise is silly.

No one has said that it's the best SERIES since Tolkien. They said the first 3 books are some of the best since Tolkien (i.e. the last two aren't included). Obviously the last two drag the series down on the overall.

I enjoyed the first 4 seasons of the show because it was about the books. I'm now enjoying the newer seasons because they AREN'T the books

Is anyone else expecting Aemon Targaryen's funeral to have a shock ending next week?

If it does what are they going to do with the body?

 George Spiggott wrote:
Is anyone else expecting Aemon Targaryen's funeral to have a shock ending next week?

If it does what are they going to do with the body?

Didn't the funeral happen this week? They burned the old guy.

 George Spiggott wrote:
Is anyone else expecting Aemon Targaryen's funeral to have a shock ending next week?

If it does what are they going to do with the body?

His watch has ended in the last episode.

I am glad I am not the only one who has seen the decline in quality.

I wonder if it is because the man was decaying and really can't think of a great plot or characters well as he has killed most of the best and most well developed characters.

I mean sir Barristan just dying randomly was just dumb and out of nowhere and is boring. I mean compared to the books tyrion is still trying to meet Dany.

The feast of crows was a long book and one of the worst in the series.

 Asherian Command wrote:


I mean sir Barristan just dying randomly was just dumb and out of nowhere and is boring. I mean compared to the books tyrion is still trying to meet Dany.

Barristan served exactly zero unique purpose that can't be replaced when Tyrion becomes an advisor.

And the fact that Tyrion is still trying to meet Dany is a part of what makes those most recent two books so meandering and insufferable.

Thank goodness they sped that up in the show.

 cincydooley wrote:

 Asherian Command wrote:


I mean sir Barristan just dying randomly was just dumb and out of nowhere and is boring. I mean compared to the books tyrion is still trying to meet Dany.

Barristan served exactly zero unique purpose that can't be replaced when Tyrion becomes an advisor.

And the fact that Tyrion is still trying to meet Dany is a part of what makes those most recent two books so meandering and insufferable.

Thank goodness they sped that up in the show.

Yeah but Sir Barristan just randomly died.

Like there was no foreshadowing there was no build up he just randomly died.

The worst part is that the series breaks with the entire lore...again. Not only the lore the books established, but also the one it established itself. If you first introduced a character as a badass swordsman and then have him die to a bunch of thugs, then you're a bad writer (team). The entire scene was just dumb to begin with, established nothing and was just a filler segment.

 Sigvatr wrote:
The worst part is that the series breaks with the entire lore...again. Not only the lore the books established, but also the one it established itself. If you first introduced a character as a badass swordsman and then have him die to a bunch of thugs, then you're a bad writer (team). The entire scene was just dumb to begin with, established nothing and was just a filler segment.

No one has mentioned him since.

I thought it was dumb. It broke from the canon so much that I was like "This is stupid."

Why? WHY?

Barristan was a great swordsman. One of the best the 7 Kingdoms had ever seen. Emphasis on was.

He was unamored. He rushed to the aid of a friend/companion killing around a dozen men who appear to be in their prime that had just slaughtered a partrol of elite troops. I'd say they did just fine with that scene. Being amazing is no substitute for being massively outnumbered in real life.

As for him dying he was a moral compass when you're going to get another moral compass. Add in the fact that reasonably if Dany doesn't trust a Lannister AND Barristan is there to support that thought then Tyrion logically dies. This glaring issue is now resolved as she won't have a reinforcing opinion for her distrust.

Seems like pretty good story telling to me...

 Hulksmash wrote:
Barristan was a great swordsman. One of the best the 7 Kingdoms had ever seen. Emphasis on was.

He was unamored. He rushed to the aid of a friend/companion killing around a dozen men who appear to be in their prime that had just slaughtered a partrol of elite troops. I'd say they did just fine with that scene. Being amazing is no substitute for being massively outnumbered in real life.

As for him dying he was a moral compass when you're going to get another moral compass. Add in the fact that reasonably if Dany doesn't trust a Lannister AND Barristan is there to support that thought then Tyrion logically dies. This glaring issue is now resolved as she won't have a reinforcing opinion for her distrust.

Seems like pretty good story telling to me...

Or really remarkable deus ex machinia.

Where everything goes exactly as planned. Just imagine if he survived and the strife between the two characters and two being at odds with each other.

 Asherian Command wrote:
Just imagine if he survived and the strife between the two characters and two being at odds with each other.

Dany: Barristan, look who I found! It's Tyrion Lannister.
Barristan: My Queen, he is your mortal enemy. I suggest you execute him.
Dany: Ooh, yeah, good call.
Tyrion: Waitaminute! Gurrghk.

Exactly. We don't get tension between those two characters if Barristan is alive. It's be unbelievable that the man excused from his lifetime service by the Lannisters and a young woman whose family was betrayed by the Lannisters would let him live. It's barely possible with Varys and Mormont supporting him that she alone might.

 Asherian Command wrote:


Or really remarkable deus ex machinia.

Where everything goes exactly as planned. Just imagine if he survived and the strife between the two characters and two being at odds with each other.

The show is GoT "light". A lot of it has been dumbed down to appeal to TV series fans, e.g. important characters cut ad their story lines slapped on others.

/e: Just to point out, that isn't a bad thing. I really like Arrow and it's really...shallow.

 Sigvatr wrote:

 Asherian Command wrote:


Or really remarkable deus ex machinia.

Where everything goes exactly as planned. Just imagine if he survived and the strife between the two characters and two being at odds with each other.

The show is GoT "light". A lot of it has been dumbed down to appeal to TV series fans, e.g. important characters cut ad their story lines slapped on others.

/e: Just to point out, that isn't a bad thing. I really like Arrow and it's really...shallow.

Like alot of the characters in this show have slowly become more and more dull over time. I mean we have lost alot of good characters and it has gotten to the point where the show is starting to suffer.

 Sigvatr wrote:

 Asherian Command wrote:


Or really remarkable deus ex machinia.

Where everything goes exactly as planned. Just imagine if he survived and the strife between the two characters and two being at odds with each other.

The show is GoT "light". A lot of it has been dumbed down to appeal to TV series fans, e.g. important characters cut ad their story lines slapped on others.

/e: Just to point out, that isn't a bad thing. I really like Arrow and it's really...shallow.

er which important character has been left out?

I can't think of any other than the dull, useless ones that have been cut out or had their stories replaced with actual important characters so for instance Sansa has something to do other than twiddle her thumbs?

I think you are mistaking "dumbing down" for decent editing - something the last few books could have benefited from - in fact any kind of editing would have helped the turgid nonsense they became.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:

 Asherian Command wrote:


Or really remarkable deus ex machinia.

Where everything goes exactly as planned. Just imagine if he survived and the strife between the two characters and two being at odds with each other.

The show is GoT "light". A lot of it has been dumbed down to appeal to TV series fans, e.g. important characters cut ad their story lines slapped on others.

/e: Just to point out, that isn't a bad thing. I really like Arrow and it's really...shallow.

er which important character has been left out?

I can't think of any other than the dull, useless ones that have been cut out or had their stories replaced with actual important characters so for instance Sansa has something to do other than twiddle her thumbs?

I think you are mistaking "dumbing down" for decent editing - something the last few books could have benefited from - in fact any kind of editing would have helped the turgid nonsense they became.

Where the helk is Gendry?

Or a whole slew of other characters that just walked out of the light. Sir Dondarion and his men. Where the helk are they?

Of course we also have....

Below is a pretty big spoiler: DO NOT READ UNLESS YOU WANT TO HAVE STUFF RUINED FOR YOU!

 Sigvatr wrote:

 George Spiggott wrote:
Is anyone else expecting Aemon Targaryen's funeral to have a shock ending next week?

If it does what are they going to do with the body?

His watch has ended in the last episode.

Yes but the scene cuts just as they start the fire. Although there is the scene with Sam after that so if it had happened I guess someone would have noticed.

 Asherian Command wrote:


Where the helk is Gendry?

Or a whole slew of other characters that just walked out of the light. Sir Dondarion and his men. Where the helk are they?

I agree that it would be nice to know what these folks are up to. At this point we have no idea on either, which is frustrating, but hardly gamebreaking. They're all plot devices, not major characters...

Young Griff being completely cut out of the story. And being removed is quite stupid. One of the martells just disappearing from the earth. Connington disappearing,

Unless Martin has told the showrunners that they're ultimately an unimportant red herring. We have no idea in the novels if Griff matters at all. If he did, he'd be represented in the story.

Lady Stoneheart being removed,

What does she actually add to the story? Anything?

Magic not being at all represented in the story as well as it should be the red priests are just shown to be religious fanatics instead of warriors.

You mean aside from the blood magic that Melisandre referenced just last episode and...oh...the Dragons?

Also killing King of the Wildings was pretty dumb. As it killed a pretty good character.

He was a good character, I agree, but isn't the story better served by getting rid of all the "glamoring" BS? I really think it is

And where is his replacement character? WHERE?!?!?!?

Tormund?

 Asherian Command wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:

 Asherian Command wrote:


Or really remarkable deus ex machinia.

Where everything goes exactly as planned. Just imagine if he survived and the strife between the two characters and two being at odds with each other.

The show is GoT "light". A lot of it has been dumbed down to appeal to TV series fans, e.g. important characters cut ad their story lines slapped on others.

/e: Just to point out, that isn't a bad thing. I really like Arrow and it's really...shallow.

er which important character has been left out?

I can't think of any other than the dull, useless ones that have been cut out or had their stories replaced with actual important characters so for instance Sansa has something to do other than twiddle her thumbs?

I think you are mistaking "dumbing down" for decent editing - something the last few books could have benefited from - in fact any kind of editing would have helped the turgid nonsense they became.

Where the helk is Gendry?

Or a whole slew of other characters that just walked out of the light. Sir Dondarion and his men. Where the helk are they?

Of course we also have....

Below is a pretty big spoiler: DO NOT READ UNLESS YOU WANT TO HAVE STUFF RUINED FOR YOU!

Spoiler:

Young Griff being completely cut out of the story. And being removed is quite stupid. One of the martells just disappearing from the earth. Connington disappearing, Vary's Plan being swept under the rug. Lady Stoneheart being removed,

Magic not being at all represented in the story as well as it should be the red priests are just shown to be religious fanatics instead of warriors.

Also killing King of the Wildings was pretty dumb. As it killed a pretty good character. And where is his replacement character? WHERE?!?!?!?

None of those mattered to me tbh - they were /are irrelevant or distractions from the actual plot - its like why is Tom Bombwhatsit not in LOTR - because his story is in no way needed or relevant.

specifics: