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 McNinja wrote:

Gamgee wrote:I agree the coldstar is a disaster. No explanation needed.

jakejackjake wrote:Because he does. He's a free point to the enemy if they have a good way to take him down and a good list could basically ignore him otherwise. Unless you're going to make him a 300pt buffmander who can't shoot his guns, but that does not sound pts effiecient


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Books is super strong if you drop $600 bucks and start modeling and painting immediately and don't leave your house until 2017 you can play a game using the now outdated 7ed Tau codex. The money doesn't bother me. I was set to buy the limited edition codex and everything. The fact that it will be months before I can even field the full list is insane when I already have like 10 of everything or more from 6th. Its just crazy to me that it's the only book to have this happen

The reason broadsides aren't as good is because firebase isn't as good. Basically it makes you take more riptides per broadsides or forces you to shoot 600 pts or more at one unit. So basically it's worthless

I don't necessarily think he sucks, but running him solo is quite a point investment (like stormsurge points). I mean, you'd need the coldstar, iridium armor, shield generator, stims, although it's not clear to me if you can swap out the coldstar weapons.

What is your plan to have both the coldstar and iridium armor on the commander?

Assuming you can't take sig systems or other weapons, the coldstar blows and isn't even really worth the paper the rules are printed on.

That being the case the FMC commander is practically useless.

 Gamgee wrote:

jakejackjake wrote:
@gamgee I think you actually missed the point I was making. I mean Str D being on the table period makes the game more luck based when a single lucky 6 can remove a 360 pt model. It increases the variance in low pts cost games (anytihng under save 4k) by a massive margin. One lucky shot can end the game in a tournament list. So on a long term basis still lots of skill but in a singular game the variance will be higher. I mean them moving the D over from apoc games was a great ploy to sell models but it's not good for smaller games really. It's good in the sense it's powerful it's bad in the way it impacts the variance of the game. Makes luck have a slightly larger role than it already does.

I know you missed the point because you thought I was saying the SS isn't good when all I've been saying is in the 7th ed book the army is unplayable without it

I'm not here to debate if it was a good idea to implement D weapons in the base version or not. I'm simply using the rules and the ITC guidelines to shape a list that's good in this meta. Also your right I did miss the point.

The thing hurting us the most in tournaments and kicking us down the rankings as a faction was deathstars and GMC/Big Things. We used to be viable before that started happening. We still had trouble with them, but they weren't so insanely powerful that our existing options weren't enough. However as time went by they were no longer enough due to power creep. So i think what this all comes down to is not the Stormsurge being necessary, but a symptom of something deeper with your argument. The SS was made and sold because it filled the only gap left in our army. We still have soft counters in the form of fusion blasters and the stealth suit formations as well.

The SS is not what ails you, it's the way they make the game and market it and have this constant power creep. That's the real thing that needs to bbe solved. Or else there will simply be another SS tomorrow for Tau instead of them sensibly trying to take a look at rules and make changes to the codex on a more broadish level. It affects every army. Not just Tau. So don't blame the SS. Blame GW and their power creep.

Also bringing D weapons is not luck. it's guaranteed damage even on a low hit that makes it through that's a lot od damage with the bonus of basically killing anything. Which is why the SS must be supported so it doesn't rely on luck. But that would be where the Commander takes cover wouldn't and has to logically think how he will finish off things the D shots have wounded. I and no one else can play for a person in that regard.

Edit
The Riptide I plan to drop won't have a Stim Injector. Doesn't need it since it's a flanker and not meant to command the board. My SS will be doing that.

The SS fills that gap terribly. You're relying on 4 shots for that... Against things with invuls typically or 8 wounds so you absolutely need a "remove from play" roll


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 McNinja wrote:

jakejackjake wrote:
If you deepstrike that whole formation you are a TERRIBLE tau player. I'm not even going to elaborate on that. It shouldn't need it.

Do you have to deepstrike the entire formation if you choose to deepstrike? And is that the only way they get relelntless or do they automatically get it? Deepstriking riptides or broadsides is just bad. I find being better at deployment and the movement phase/jetpack thrust planning is far superior for a Rip

Yup. If you choose to do so, you have to deploy the whole formation at the start of your second turn as per deep strike. So, as far as you're concerned, all that formation is good for is the Relentless is grants all of the units in it?

I wonder what you think of three ghostkeels with farsight deep striking, then assaulting

if you play farsight you're bad


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changemod wrote:

jakejackjake wrote:
If you deepstrike that whole formation you are a TERRIBLE tau player. I'm not even going to elaborate on that. It shouldn't need it.

Do you have to deepstrike the entire formation if you choose to deepstrike? And is that the only way they get relelntless or do they automatically get it? Deepstriking riptides or broadsides is just bad. I find being better at deployment and the movement phase/jetpack thrust planning is far superior for a Rip

If you want turn 2 arrival, they have to all strike. Otherwise you can pick and choose.

Of course, pairing it with a Stealth Cadre to make an all-suits two formation army gives you two infiltrating homing beacons, so you can just slam down all your units flawlessly anyhow.

deepstriking that many points is the most awful thing I've ever heard unless you have things that come down turn 1 aka marines

jakejackjake wrote:

 Gamgee wrote:

jakejackjake wrote:
@gamgee I think you actually missed the point I was making. I mean Str D being on the table period makes the game more luck based when a single lucky 6 can remove a 360 pt model. It increases the variance in low pts cost games (anytihng under save 4k) by a massive margin. One lucky shot can end the game in a tournament list. So on a long term basis still lots of skill but in a singular game the variance will be higher. I mean them moving the D over from apoc games was a great ploy to sell models but it's not good for smaller games really. It's good in the sense it's powerful it's bad in the way it impacts the variance of the game. Makes luck have a slightly larger role than it already does.

I know you missed the point because you thought I was saying the SS isn't good when all I've been saying is in the 7th ed book the army is unplayable without it

I'm not here to debate if it was a good idea to implement D weapons in the base version or not. I'm simply using the rules and the ITC guidelines to shape a list that's good in this meta. Also your right I did miss the point.

The thing hurting us the most in tournaments and kicking us down the rankings as a faction was deathstars and GMC/Big Things. We used to be viable before that started happening. We still had trouble with them, but they weren't so insanely powerful that our existing options weren't enough. However as time went by they were no longer enough due to power creep. So i think what this all comes down to is not the Stormsurge being necessary, but a symptom of something deeper with your argument. The SS was made and sold because it filled the only gap left in our army. We still have soft counters in the form of fusion blasters and the stealth suit formations as well.

The SS is not what ails you, it's the way they make the game and market it and have this constant power creep. That's the real thing that needs to bbe solved. Or else there will simply be another SS tomorrow for Tau instead of them sensibly trying to take a look at rules and make changes to the codex on a more broadish level. It affects every army. Not just Tau. So don't blame the SS. Blame GW and their power creep.

Also bringing D weapons is not luck. it's guaranteed damage even on a low hit that makes it through that's a lot od damage with the bonus of basically killing anything. Which is why the SS must be supported so it doesn't rely on luck. But that would be where the Commander takes cover wouldn't and has to logically think how he will finish off things the D shots have wounded. I and no one else can play for a person in that regard.

Edit
The Riptide I plan to drop won't have a Stim Injector. Doesn't need it since it's a flanker and not meant to command the board. My SS will be doing that.

The SS fills that gap terribly. You're relying on 4 shots for that... Against things with invuls typically or 8 wounds so you absolutely need a "remove from play" roll


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 McNinja wrote:

jakejackjake wrote:
If you deepstrike that whole formation you are a TERRIBLE tau player. I'm not even going to elaborate on that. It shouldn't need it.

Do you have to deepstrike the entire formation if you choose to deepstrike? And is that the only way they get relelntless or do they automatically get it? Deepstriking riptides or broadsides is just bad. I find being better at deployment and the movement phase/jetpack thrust planning is far superior for a Rip

Yup. If you choose to do so, you have to deploy the whole formation at the start of your second turn as per deep strike. So, as far as you're concerned, all that formation is good for is the Relentless is grants all of the units in it?

I wonder what you think of three ghostkeels with farsight deep striking, then assaulting

if you play farsight you're bad

Can you please stop posting. You are saying the same things over and over again and no one agrees with you. And you always end your posts with how great you are at playing the game and how everyone else who doesn't do you do is terrible. You sound like a cocky little child

 tetrisphreak wrote:

MoD_Legion wrote:

 tetrisphreak wrote:

Plus if you're going second and the enemy kills one of your units (first blood wooo) your entire army in reserve comes into play on your FIRST TURN.

Except that your opponent will know exactly that that would happen so he just happily lets that one crappy unit live, takes all the objectives and killing the rest of your army while you sit there hoping your stuff comes out of reserves .

Not quite - if they kill anything from the infiltration cadre, the entire army comes in from reserves on our next turn (so turn 1 if going 2nd). The stealthsuits, piranha, and pathfinders will be the only things on the table to start so anything they try to get first blood from will trigger the SUITSTORM. If they decline to remove any of our units from the table, then on our turn 2 the retaliation cadre deep strikes in automatically - using homing beacons from the stealthsuits and recon drones so they don't scatter and mishap. I think it could really work as a null-deploy (kind of) army with a great beta-strike potential. Not to mention that any pathfinders that get 3 or more markerlight hits will cause a free s8 ap3 hit as well.

Okay this rule is actually cool. Not sure if you can build a winning list with it but it at least has awesomesauce in it


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@notredameguy sorry man I just keep trying to talk about how this effects strictly competitive list options and everyone keeps mentionthing things that have never been competitve or couldn't be. This is shown by tournament results that can be googled. Meaning simple google searches for late 2015 tournaments will show that wether or not people agree with me I am right.

Doesn't matter if people agree. If they say fire warriors, missile drones, stealth suits, or farsight are good units they have no idea what they're talking about. I'm trying to talk competitive imacts this book has and everyone keeps bringing up fluffy non competitive things while quoting me

He asked what I thought of three ghostkeels and farsight. I think it's bad because farsight is a huge tax for how terrible he is. I'm not going to lie in my answer

To be honest that's exactly what I am saying there were only 2-3 competitive lists for the last three months so anyone who did it differently was bad actually. Youre right that's exactly what I am saying and anyone playing GT's with Tau would tell you the same from a strictly competitive point of view

It's okay to be a modeler who likes to play friendly games. I play friendly games but I'm not really a modeler. I'm a power gamer. I played strategy based games professionally for three years.Something that has the same concepts of probability and outplaying the opponent.

 McNinja wrote:

Gamgee wrote:I agree the coldstar is a disaster. No explanation needed.

I've been analyzing this pretty heavily. I'm not on board to say the Coldstar rules suck, but I do see other poster's concerns about it. It is surely by no means a "Must have unit" in any army. and if you're taking it, you're most likely doing so out of coolness factor over pragmatic effiency.

Essentially, If one subtracts the inherent weapons cost for the Missile pod and TL burst cannon (35 total), you re essentially paying 25pts for the following:
Pros
-a free hardpoint location(though this is used up by the fairly innefective Twinlinking of the burstcannon.
-an upgrade from assault 4 to Assault 6 for the burst cannon burst cannon(not bad)
-the ability to swoop like a MC.
-can't be assaultted (great)
-moves speedily around the tabletop(great)
-immune to blast tamplate weapons(great)
- can only be hit with Snap fire or skyfire.(great)
-can choose to fire using the Skyfire rules when swooping(great)
-a 4+ jink save (render moot if one takes a shiled generator, and you're insane not to)(useless unless you don't take a shield generator, but jink won't protect you from massed volley arms, which is what likely will Force the letahl Grounded Test)
- a switch from jetpack mobility to jumppack mobility.(interesting)
-gain the move through cover USR (trival)
-coolness factor of being a flying battle suit.(great)

Not too bad so far.

But You also suffer the following:
Cons
-affected by rules affecting Monstrous creatures (interesting)
-While swooping, a failed armor save has a 33% chance to send the Coldstar crashing to the ground. This is a guaranteed fatal result unless you take a shield generator and make the 4+inv save. (str9 hit against toughness 4). This offers massed lasgun fire a decent opportunity to kill a 145pt+ HQ unit (scary bad)
-can't make jetpack moves in the assaault phase. (meh, you're flying!)
-any Drones owned by the Coldstar dissapear while swooping, leaving him alone to recieve damage.(not good)
-seems to lose access to signature systems, and is limited to 2 additional support systems and drones for upgrade.(not good)
-only a few of the support systems have any value while swooping. and if you're not swooping most of the time, why bother taking a coldstar?
-cannot go to ground(trivial)


There are counters to cover it's weaknesses, but these then stifle the coldstar's utilty. Sure you can sticking a Coldstar with a bodygaurd, but then he's not flying, which is what you pay for in the first place.
Best Use
I suspect that his best use is to join him to a Crisis unit and wait for the right time to launch into the sky when the value is greater, and when enemy fire power in his direction is limited.
Wishful thinking
There were a couple rule options I was hoping the rumors missed initially that might have made him more potent. Rumor-hidden access to Toughness 5(Iridium armor) was the most obvious, but there are other rule options they could have included (such as allowing drones to act as ablative armor from grounded tests or creating Coldstar Shas'vre body guard). I was really hoping for Coldstar shas've body guard.(though this seems like less of an option with the squad size increase to 9). I though a Coldstar Commander and 2 wingman Coldstar shas'vre body gaurd would be pretty cool to see and sell more coldstar models. I am okay with the locked-in weapon systems, as I'm sure people would hone in on the 1 or 2 awesome combos (duo flamers,duo meltas) and we'd have non-Tau players crying cheese.
Conclusion
I'll still use the Coldstar more than I won't, as coolness factor goes a long way with me. But I do see the Coldstar's weakness to dying via grounded test a significant risk that comes while paying for an upgrade that imposes more limits(or uses are stifled by) more than it provides actual function. So I understand the complaints.

To McNinja the coldstar is not capable of killing anything that matter or scoring without giving up a free point. Also anything with skyfire its a free point too.

It's the worst HQ in the new book if nothing else changed. Regular commander and ethereal are still the only options unless there is osmething new.

In my friendly games everything is good. I played a 5k game against space wolves with 2200 pts in fire warriors and 1000 pts in fireblades. It was awesome. That's a friendly game. The coldstar is even cool in a friendly. The breachers are good. Heck kroot are good in a friendly game

tetrisphreak wrote:

MoD_Legion wrote:

 tetrisphreak wrote:

Plus if you're going second and the enemy kills one of your units (first blood wooo) your entire army in reserve comes into play on your FIRST TURN.

Except that your opponent will know exactly that that would happen so he just happily lets that one crappy unit live, takes all the objectives and killing the rest of your army while you sit there hoping your stuff comes out of reserves .

Not quite - if they kill anything from the infiltration cadre, the entire army comes in from reserves on our next turn (so turn 1 if going 2nd). The stealthsuits, piranha, and pathfinders will be the only things on the table to start so anything they try to get first blood from will trigger the SUITSTORM. If they decline to remove any of our units from the table, then on our turn 2 the retaliation cadre deep strikes in automatically - using homing beacons from the stealthsuits and recon drones so they don't scatter and mishap. I think it could really work as a null-deploy (kind of) army with a great beta-strike potential. Not to mention that any pathfinders that get 3 or more markerlight hits will cause a free s8 ap3 hit as well.

Didn't think about that. Quasi-null deployment seems awesome, specially on tabels without much impassable terrain.

The problem is if the enemy is smart enough to only kill a few models (and not an entire unit) - leaving you in a bad situation. He'll try to grab objectives instead. Still, cooler than grabbing a comms relay

notredameguy10 wrote:

*snip*

Strongly agree with your assesment, The way I see it what people are saying amounts to "a crisis suit that has a burst cannon and a missle pod is utter garbage" yea ok say that all you want guys.

The problem is that a coldstar commander doesnt really *do anything*. Why do you need a swooping burst cannon? Are S5 shots something that Tau is lacking as opposed to unit wide buffs and different weaponry?

I see no reason that a Tau commander is required to move 24" out on his own as you aren't even gaining that much more additional movement.

i ignored jakejack awhile ago. Hes just flaming the forum needlessly so i suggest you guys do the same and add his name to your ignores.

On the topic of FMC i agree with derling. Hes by no means an autotake and is only amazing in very niche situations, average in the rest. Primarily due to his lack of Iridium armor and weapon variability. But i can ignore that because hes still usable in a lot of ways and hes cool as feth.
I do a lot of crap that a tourny player would scorn me for. I dont care. The people i play arent tourny players, we play because its fun. I know my friends are going to try and make this guy do a horrendous faceplant in the ground, and if it happens im bound to laugh angrily just because of the mental image softening the blow that i just lost that thing to a single shot.

If he had coldstar bodyguards i could see him being a normal inclusion, especially since he isnt a separate datacard he can be included in any of our formations that utilize a commander. If i could make one of my required bodyguard and commander units be a coldstar squad, i'd do it in a heartbeat.

Im the guy that has very little complaint about Hammerheads, Devilfish, Piranhas, or Sniper Drones. So its kinda hard for me to dislike the coldstar as much as i do Vespid or Stealth Suits (stealth suits cost too much outside the formation to be worth it)

 Vineheart01 wrote:
i ignored jakejack awhile ago. Hes just flaming the forum needlessly so i suggest you guys do the same and add his name to your ignores.

Doesn't talking negatively about someone you're ignoring (including telling them that you are) both defeat the purpose of ignoring them as well as flame bait simultaneously?

 warboss wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
i ignored jakejack awhile ago. Hes just flaming the forum needlessly so i suggest you guys do the same and add his name to your ignores.

Doesn't talking negatively about someone you're ignoring (including telling them that you are) both defeat the purpose of ignoring them as well as flame bait simultaneously?

Now that you mention it...

This site doesn't have all that many rules:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/forum_rules.jsp

Everyone - please be sure to follow all of them, all the time.

Especially Rule #1.

The Coldstar should never be your Warlord choice outside of small point games where skyfire will be minimal. As a secondary HQ choice, I love him. Sure S5 and S7 aren't exactly things Tau are in short supply of, but as a harassment unit the Coldstar is pretty good. You're not gonna be sending him after big MCs or vehicles with better than AV11, that's not his job. His job is to fly forward and deliver that S5 and S7 fire to the enemy troops camping on objectives in his deployment zone out of line of sight. Not many troops units in this game can really handle 6 S5 twin-linked shots plus 2 S7 shots at BS5 coming from an FMC.

I don't see this guy as a killer. He has 2 jobs. 1. Make enemy troops units take enough casualties that they fail a morale test and fall back off an objective for our troops in Hunter Contingents to take (since they don't have Ob Sec they can't contest normal troops). With his manuveurability, he can put his firepower into units we otherwise wouldn't be able to hit without several turns of movement. 2. Anti-flyer. Not many flyers in this game have better than AV11 (I think only the Stormraven and Space Wolf flyers have it all around? Even Valkyries and Vendettas have AV10 rear). Since our flyers aren't exactly the best and VTs can get very expensive very quickly, use this guy to clear the skies.

Is he the super OP auto-take HQ for Tau? Of course not. Is he totally useless and should never have been thought up? Absolutely not. He has a specific job. Outside of that job he will probably underperform, but within that job, while other units can do it too, he's the only one who can do it with that kind of mobility.

Plus the Coldstar model is fantastic.

 GI_Redshirt wrote:
The Coldstar should never be your Warlord choice outside of small point games where skyfire will be minimal. As a secondary HQ choice, I love him. Sure S5 and S7 aren't exactly things Tau are in short supply of, but as a harassment unit the Coldstar is pretty good. You're not gonna be sending him after big MCs or vehicles with better than AV11, that's not his job. His job is to fly forward and deliver that S5 and S7 fire to the enemy troops camping on objectives in his deployment zone out of line of sight. Not many troops units in this game can really handle 6 S5 twin-linked shots plus 2 S7 shots at BS5 coming from an FMC.

I don't see this guy as a killer. He has 2 jobs. 1. Make enemy troops units take enough casualties that they fail a morale test and fall back off an objective for our troops in Hunter Contingents to take (since they don't have Ob Sec they can't contest normal troops). With his manuveurability, he can put his firepower into units we otherwise wouldn't be able to hit without several turns of movement. 2. Anti-flyer. Not many flyers in this game have better than AV11 (I think only the Stormraven and Space Wolf flyers have it all around? Even Valkyries and Vendettas have AV10 rear). Since our flyers aren't exactly the best and VTs can get very expensive very quickly, use this guy to clear the skies.

Is he the super OP auto-take HQ for Tau? Of course not. Is he totally useless and should never have been thought up? Absolutely not. He has a specific job. Outside of that job he will probably underperform, but within that job, while other units can do it too, he's the only one who can do it with that kind of mobility.

Plus the Coldstar model is fantastic.

I agree. I think Coldstar is also the only model I'd put an Advanced Targeting System on to snipe out those heavy weapons.

 GI_Redshirt wrote:
The Coldstar should never be your Warlord choice outside of small point games where skyfire will be minimal. As a secondary HQ choice, I love him. Sure S5 and S7 aren't exactly things Tau are in short supply of, but as a harassment unit the Coldstar is pretty good. You're not gonna be sending him after big MCs or vehicles with better than AV11, that's not his job. His job is to fly forward and deliver that S5 and S7 fire to the enemy troops camping on objectives in his deployment zone out of line of sight. Not many troops units in this game can really handle 6 S5 twin-linked shots plus 2 S7 shots at BS5 coming from an FMC.

I don't see this guy as a killer. He has 2 jobs. 1. Make enemy troops units take enough casualties that they fail a morale test and fall back off an objective for our troops in Hunter Contingents to take (since they don't have Ob Sec they can't contest normal troops). With his manuveurability, he can put his firepower into units we otherwise wouldn't be able to hit without several turns of movement. 2. Anti-flyer. Not many flyers in this game have better than AV11 (I think only the Stormraven and Space Wolf flyers have it all around? Even Valkyries and Vendettas have AV10 rear). Since our flyers aren't exactly the best and VTs can get very expensive very quickly, use this guy to clear the skies.

Is he the super OP auto-take HQ for Tau? Of course not. Is he totally useless and should never have been thought up? Absolutely not. He has a specific job. Outside of that job he will probably underperform, but within that job, while other units can do it too, he's the only one who can do it with that kind of mobility.

Plus the Coldstar model is fantastic.

I'm still wondering about the supposed ability to give him a drone controller then attach a unit of gun drones/marker drones onto him. Drones do not seem to stop his movement and now you have some ablative wounds and a whole crap ton of S5 dakka anywhere on the table you need it.

This Tau release is pretty amazing. Question, does the tau box with etheral have the same booklet as raven guard box?

 Jayden63 wrote:


I'm still wondering about the supposed ability to give him a drone controller then attach a unit of gun drones/marker drones onto him. Drones do not seem to stop his movement and now you have some ablative wounds and a whole crap ton of S5 dakka anywhere on the table you need it.

Drones are removed from table when Coldstar is flying - they won't be there to soak damage for him. Unless you plan to use him as a jump infantry, then that's ok (but then the Drones WILL hamper his movement)

There is a bit of a perk to making the coldstar commander take a drone controller. If he attaches to a drone squad, his rule about them simply "disappearing" when he takes to the air doesnt mention a model limit or that it has to be the ones he bought.
You can attach him to a large squad of drones, take to the air and fly to an objective, drop down and unload some insane amount of BS5 dakka in some troops face. Then you can either take off and leave the drones in that side of the board or do it again for another location.

Kinda like precision deepstriking with 0 risk. Aside from the obvious bad dice luck and getting tabled when hes on the ground lol

 Vineheart01 wrote:
There is a bit of a perk to making the coldstar commander take a drone controller. If he attaches to a drone squad, his rule about them simply "disappearing" when he takes to the air doesnt mention a model limit or that it has to be the ones he bought.
You can attach him to a large squad of drones, take to the air and fly to an objective, drop down and unload some insane amount of BS5 dakka in some troops face. Then you can either take off and leave the drones in that side of the board or do it again for another location.

Kinda like precision deepstriking with 0 risk. Aside from the obvious bad dice luck and getting tabled when hes on the ground lol

Actually the rule says the following:

If the Commander has any Drones, they form a unit with him while he is Gliding. When he is Swooping, the Drones are removed from the battlefield.

As worded, you would not be able to remove a unit of drones that the Coldstar is attached to by switching to Swooping mode. The context of the rule clearly only applies to the Commander's drones (i.e., those purchased as an upgrade for the Commander).

It says "if the commander has any drones". That would be drones he purchased. A unit of drones are not owned by anyone, and are not "his drones".

EDIT: ninja.

I would much rather just have a Commander in iridum with stims, a shield, and two plasma rifles/fusion blasters than a coldstar. For me, who has terrible luck with dice, my commander would get grounded by a stray bolter shot and die turn 1. Not worth the risk.

 Ghaz wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
There is a bit of a perk to making the coldstar commander take a drone controller. If he attaches to a drone squad, his rule about them simply "disappearing" when he takes to the air doesnt mention a model limit or that it has to be the ones he bought.
You can attach him to a large squad of drones, take to the air and fly to an objective, drop down and unload some insane amount of BS5 dakka in some troops face. Then you can either take off and leave the drones in that side of the board or do it again for another location.

Kinda like precision deepstriking with 0 risk. Aside from the obvious bad dice luck and getting tabled when hes on the ground lol

Actually the rule says the following:

If the Commander has any Drones, they form a unit with him while he is Gliding. When he is Swooping, the Drones are removed from the battlefield.

As worded, you would not be able to remove a unit of drones that the Coldstar is attached to by switching to Swooping mode. The context of the rule clearly only applies to the Commander's drones (i.e., those purchased as an upgrade for the Commander).

Well... there's also the fact that if you're forming a unit with the drones you've purchased, you can't join another unit. Since you're already in a unit.

 SilverDevilfish wrote:


Well... there's also the fact that if you're forming a unit with the drones you've purchased, you can't join another unit. Since you're already in a unit.

I thought drones were exempt from this, at work so can't confirm in my rulebook.

Lusiphur wrote:

 SilverDevilfish wrote:


Well... there's also the fact that if you're forming a unit with the drones you've purchased, you can't join another unit. Since you're already in a unit.

I thought drones were exempt from this, at work so can't confirm in my rulebook.

Right, ignore that, I need caffeine.

Jeez I stop playing for 3 months and I can't remember anything.

The Codex specifically states Drones do not prevent a character from joining another unit. However if the Character dies the drones stay in that unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit...Ninja posters

 Fishboy wrote:
The Codex specifically states Drones do not prevent a character from joining another unit. However if the Character dies the drones stay in that unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit...Ninja posters

Can a IC join a group of Drones do they form one unit to were you can then join it to another unit?

 Vash108 wrote:

 Fishboy wrote:
The Codex specifically states Drones do not prevent a character from joining another unit. However if the Character dies the drones stay in that unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit...Ninja posters

Can a IC join a group of Drones do they form one unit to were you can then join it to another unit?

Only drones purchased as wargear allow the characters to drag them along into other units. Same as fenrisian wolves in the space wolves codex.

Drone units bought alone (ie from their dataslate in the fast attack slot or a formation) are their own unit.

 tetrisphreak wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:

 Fishboy wrote:
The Codex specifically states Drones do not prevent a character from joining another unit. However if the Character dies the drones stay in that unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit...Ninja posters

Can a IC join a group of Drones do they form one unit to were you can then join it to another unit?

Only drones purchased as wargear allow the characters to drag them along into other units. Same as fenrisian wolves in the space wolves codex.

Drone units bought alone (ie from their dataslate in the fast attack slot or a formation) are their own unit.

Thanks, I was curious if I could do anything extra with the drones that come with O'Ralai. I Just had him leave that unit do he doesn't get the toughness loss and hide him in terrain.

 Vash108 wrote:

 tetrisphreak wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:

 Fishboy wrote:
The Codex specifically states Drones do not prevent a character from joining another unit. However if the Character dies the drones stay in that unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit...Ninja posters

Can a IC join a group of Drones do they form one unit to were you can then join it to another unit?

Only drones purchased as wargear allow the characters to drag them along into other units. Same as fenrisian wolves in the space wolves codex.

Drone units bought alone (ie from their dataslate in the fast attack slot or a formation) are their own unit.

Thanks, I was curious if I could do anything extra with the drones that come with O'Ralai. I Just had him leave that unit do he doesn't get the toughness loss and hide him in terrain.

Poor R'Alai has as special rule that prevents him from joining any units whatsoever. Until one of his piddly drones dies his unit is majority T4.

 tetrisphreak wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:

 tetrisphreak wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:

 Fishboy wrote:
The Codex specifically states Drones do not prevent a character from joining another unit. However if the Character dies the drones stay in that unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit...Ninja posters

Can a IC join a group of Drones do they form one unit to were you can then join it to another unit?

Only drones purchased as wargear allow the characters to drag them along into other units. Same as fenrisian wolves in the space wolves codex.

Drone units bought alone (ie from their dataslate in the fast attack slot or a formation) are their own unit.

Thanks, I was curious if I could do anything extra with the drones that come with O'Ralai. I Just had him leave that unit do he doesn't get the toughness loss and hide him in terrain.

Poor R'Alai has as special rule that prevents him from joining any units whatsoever. Until one of his piddly drones dies his unit is majority T4.

Yeah I just have him leave the drones behind. Wish I could have someone else Scoop them up.