Robotech® RPG Tactics™-License lost, the end is near!

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**evilsmurf**

I hope that Rifts boardgame isnt the Talisman/Relic ripoff from several years ago which they got called out on. That was by Bellaire too and hes known for copying other people's stuff.

**stanman**

Oh it'll get my $1 alright, but that's it.

**n815e**

What choice did they have? They couldn't fall back on the reliable "Treachery of..." funding scheme without admitting they misspent all the money.
They wouldn't be able to secure a loan.
Poker decks only generate so much change.
They couldn't do another kickstarter under Palladium's brand.
Get sucker Carmen to sign up for complete liability and launch "his own" kickstarter!

**Asterios**

n815e wrote:
What choice did they have? They couldn't fall back on the reliable "Treachery of..." funding scheme without admitting they misspent all the money.
They wouldn't be able to secure a loan.
Poker decks only generate so much change.
They couldn't do another kickstarter under Palladium's brand.
Get sucker Carmen to sign up for complete liability and launch "his own" kickstarter!

wonders if Carmen realizes PB will hang him out to dry and then some.

**Forar**

Palladium Books is gearing up for the relaunch of Robotech® RPG Tactics™ and the release of Wave 2 pieces in 2017. Getting a few quotes and focusing in on a number of areas for Robotech® RPG Tactics™.

Hahahahahahaha, heh, ha, whew...

This ain’t just talk.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I also spoke to some folks about helping us get organized play events together.

So first it was Ninja Division, then it was the Megaversal Ambassadors, now it's 'some folks' who will be doing 'organized play' on a game that 'won't have new releases for at least 2.5-3+ years'.

Good luck with that.

We will be offering details and hard release dates when we have them.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Funny how they're willing to share info with random fans at Gencon, but backer updates haven't had substantial details in years (aside from the token yearly renders or 3D prints/prototypes). Guess giving a Scrooge McDuck money pit of cash wasn't enough, and having expectations of communication and professionalism went beyond the pale. For shame!

UPDATE: Robotech® anime is a Top Rated series on Crackle

Crackle is a rapidly growing, free, digital network that has been airing the original Robotech® episodes with tremendous fan response. The Robotech® TV series has consistently ranked as Crackle’s Number One Anime and often in the overall Top Ten, giving a new generation a chance to discover Robotech®. I wanted to share this information with you so you can binge watch Robotech® from beginning to end or catch your favorite episodes anytime. You can find great inspiration for your Robotech® games watching old episodes.

Oh, goody, people can go binge their favourite Robotech episodes! Find inspiration for their games! As long as their games and dreams would include either the (not quite) dozen figures that are at retail, or 3D modeling courses and a Shapeways account.

I'll believe it when they have more than empty promises of progress to share. But hey, at least they're (presumably) lying to our faces again. Been a while since they even did us the courtesy of that.

Edit: also, this sale being "unprecedented" is factually incorrect. CSI has had as steep and steeper sales in the past, often around Black Friday or Christmas, but occasionally out of the blue an expansion will drop to like 2/3 off (presumably as they catch sight of some stuff sitting on a shelf and decide to try to get it moving, even at a loss).

**Swabby**

I didn't catch this from the report the first time in regards to the gencon SDF-1 game:

"! The SDF-1 was an impressive sight to see, and from all accounts, the five hour long game was epic fun"

????! 5 hours?

**csimian**

So I bought this a while back and don't think I'll get to build it. Willing to sell this for less than HLJ's price plus shipping.

http://hlj.com/product/HSG65830

Slowly starting to get rid of stuff and/or use models for Battletech. Just have to get around the part count...

**warboss**

Swabby wrote:
I didn't catch this from the report the first time in regards to the gencon SDF-1 game:

"! The SDF-1 was an impressive sight to see, and from all accounts, the five hour long game was epic fun"

????! 5 hours?

Just for reference, the typical gencon game "slot" is four hours. While you can go less (they did have 2 hour slots available in the last few years I went but they tended to be board games, card games, and quick demos), the typical game when I was going whether RPG or minis was four hours and ran right up until the time expired even finishing organically.

**Asterios**

what I find interesting is why doesn't PB do the Boardgame Kickstarter themselves? could it be when the kickstarter is done they will have yet to deliver wave 2?

and for those who think the money from that project will be used for wave 2, LoL that is too funny, PB is just using Kickstarter to scam people out of more money plain and simple going for their last hurrah before declaring bankruptcy at the end of next year.

**Genoside07**

I really worry because the current miniatures they have for Rifts are really bad..
Even with someone else doing it..

Also I originally backed the RRT in the mind that only involvement Palladium had with the game
was insuring licencing for robotech, I am sure the direction Ninja Division was going would spend the most
money and get it the best result and fastest.. Then big Kevin stepped in and said how hard could it be
we can do it better and cheaper...so I can use the "extra" money to buy more cartoon movie cells..

We are exactly a year off from Gen Con.. most manufactures try to have new product release for it.
I really don't see it happening... I would gamble to say... we will see a bankruptcy instead

**Mike1975**

Manchu wrote:
Some thoughts ... on Part 2

The scale debate seems to be over even before Kevin bothered to ask KS supporters about it. IMO it is obvious that Southern Cross and especially New Generation need to be in a larger scale. But of course this is not obvious to everyone. The real issue is, Kevin has clearly already made a decision here. It is IMO the right decision. It just kind of rankles that he's framing an attempt to explain the decision he already made as an invitation to discuss what the right decision should be.

That style is behind a lot of the troubles with this KS.

Similarly, here we have promises for all kinds of new stuff from GHQ ...

... but where is the evidence? Where are the scultps? Are they complete? If so, why not show them? If not, why not and when will the be done? If there are sculpts, are the molds ready? If so, where are the samples? Anything painted? If not, why not?

There may be very good reasons for not having any of this information to go along with the promises.

But KS backers don't know those reasons.

Explaining this sort of thing is called transparency. My take-away from Part 2 is this "re-started" conversation is probably not going to involve much transparency beyond "here's my decision and why I made it" despite the lip service to those of us who gave him so much money years ago.

Thinking over Parts 1 and 2, my overall conclusion is ...

Did anyone edit this update/these updates? I mean, someone outside of the same old confidants. My feeling is, PB continues to be a closed system and this update shows Kevin is not actually open to perspectives beyond his inner circle.

I have some Southern Cross 1/285 and it works perfectly fine.

**warboss**

Mike, that post you replied to is over a year old, lol. You might be better off pming him.

**Asterios**

was looking thru all those pictures on the PBWU and realised I think I have more RRT(official and not official) minis then all the ones shown in those pics

**Mike1975**

warboss wrote:
Mike, that post you replied to is over a year old, lol. You might be better off pming him.

Weird, probably because I answered while on my cell phone.

**BobtheInquisitor**

JohnHwangDD wrote:
BobtheInquisitor wrote:
JohnHwangDD wrote:
BobtheInquisitor wrote:
brettness37 wrote:

I guess one good thing about this colossal cluster is that I've been able to go to a local store and buy extra expansion sets for $12-15 Canadian on a whim for the last 6 months. The stock hasn't changed except for what I've taken since they put it on clearance, so I've been in no rush.

My local store is extremely slow adding stuff to clearance. They have an unchanging stock of RTT, DUST Tactics, and even Starship Troopers, all taking up shelf space at full MSRP.

Brookhurst, War House, or both?

Brookhurst. Where is war house?

War House is on WIllow in Long Beach. It's the one that feels like you're in an old-timey adult bookstore, not one of the newer "couples-friendly" stores.

Brookhurst, I'll wait for Thanksgiving. First, if I'm still interested. Second, because everything goes on sale at that time. Last year, Brookhurst moved some RTT sets - there were more on the shelf when I arrived, than when I left!

I'll hold out some hope for a sale, then. Funnily enough, Brookhurst's collection of DUST just disappeared, yet RTT still sits there, knitting her clearance blanket all day and undoing the stitches all night.

Are you saying War House is even seedier than Brookhurst? My wife feels more comfortable shopping at Spanky's alone than entering Brookhurst with me. The place creeps her out.

**JohnHwangDD**

I swung by BH yesterday. Looks like they're getting more serious about clearing Malifaux 1E, and I may bite anon anon.

**BobtheInquisitor**

JohnHwangDD wrote:
I swung by BH yesterday. Looks like they're getting more serious about clearing Malifaux 1E, and I may bite anon anon.

What time were you there? I stopped by mid afternoon but had to leave in a hurry due to the boy's behavior.

Oh, and uh Robotech something. Some sort of progress? or not?

**JohnHwangDD**

I was there right after lunch, maybe a half hour around 1 pm?

I saw the lone RRT starter box, too.

**warboss**

Two star crossed Robotech gamers.. Like ARMD platforms silently passing each other at night...

**Stormonu**

warboss wrote:
Two star crossed Robotech gamers.. Like ARMD platforms silently passing each other at night...

Kinda like the two ships full of Robotech, with the Australian backers shipping from New York and the UK backers shipping from Los Angeles?

**Talizvar**

Saw a person providing links to the PB Rifts cards on the Savage Worlds: Rifts KS.
I mentioned the RRT backer issues and to "try" not to send money directly to PB.
Usual comments to not "wreck people's fun" and "this KS has nothing to do with it", then I reminded them the items are NOT KS but PB's "me too!" product.
It boils down to views of "that is your problem, don't make it mine"... fair enough I guess.
Makes me hesitant to bother with the impending board game.
I suspect with miniatures involved it will launch in a similar fashion to RRT.

I think Palladium had found the perfect niche for their work ethic: fan-boys will ignore and do many things to get what they covet.
"It is like you want them to close their doors or something, then you would NEVER get your stuff."
That is the point if they cannot keep a consumer agreement: they DESERVE to be shut down for coercing money from me and keeping it without the agreed compensation.

**jaymz**

Taking not coercing.....as loathe as i am to say anything in palladiums favour, none of us were coerced.

**Asterios**

jaymz wrote:
Taking not coercing.....as loathe as i am to say anything in palladiums favour, none of us were coerced.

well technically coerced, we were coerced with the promise of mouth watering detailed minis that PB would not be involved in except to insure the IP of the product and that the project would be handled by another company, now which game KickStarter was I talking about again I forget?

**warboss**

@jaymz

True.. although it was taken under false pretenses (98% done, coming in roughly 8-9 months, and Palladium would be hands off). Even *if* Palladium didn't actually lie but rather were simply full of gak in their promises, that level of ignorance is willful and doesn't indicate a good faith effort on their part prior to taking the money. I can google a few things online and promise folks that I'll take pics for them next year of the lunar surface after arriving on my popsicle stick and rubber band spacecraft but that doesn't mean I'm not being honest about the situation nor responsible for refunds 5 years from now when I'm still "working" on the project (yum... ice cream!).

**jaymz**

Taken under false pretense or any other reason is still not coersion and rick you of all people should not be arguing it, especially with all you "legal expertise".

In the end we all CHOSE to give them.our money. We were not forced which is what coersion is.

Dammit now i have had to say something twice to palladiums benefit. You guys suck lol

Automatically Appended Next Post:
And to add no we were not technically coerced. The word you are looking for is enticed....or duped....or lured. Not coerced.

**Talizvar**

jaymz wrote:
Taking not coercing.....as loathe as i am to say anything in palladiums favour, none of us were coerced.

You are quite right the proper definition for "coercing" is by threat now that I looked.
I was meaning around the line of being told untruths for them to get what they wanted.
People are really touchy about the word "lies" but with Trump about, the new words are "strategically spread false information" or "unbound optimism".
<edit> To be fair to the candidates, Hillary would say that they had fully planned to do as promised back then but cannot seem to find evidence of them now.

**jaymz**

I am merely making sure proper terms are used. You try to tell a judge you were coerced and you will be coerced to leave the courtroom for wasting the judges time

**Talizvar**

Hmmm...
Doing a bit of word lawyering.
There was the "threat" we would never see Robotech as a tabletop game unless the KS was supported.
But "threat" in the definition is bodily harm not being made upset we do not get our man toys.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Glad we have that word meaning clear.
I would hate to be coerced into letting this off-topic be dropped.

**Asterios**

jaymz wrote:
I am merely making sure proper terms are used. You try to tell a judge you were coerced and you will be coerced to leave the courtroom for wasting the judges time

once again it is a technicality, we wanted Robotech miniatures and the only way it seems to get them at the time was thru the RRT project (here is where the coercion part comes into play) in other words if we did not back the project we would not get the minis, it was an either/or? they basically held us up at gun point and said back this project or nothing.

thing about coercion is it is the act of forcing and or threatening someone to do something they would not do, now how many would have given PB money if they said they were in charge of the project?

**warboss**

edit: Nevermind.