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Hey mates, while building my models yesterday, I observed a game where one player was running a Mechanized Space Marine list with Squads in Rhinos, going against Necrons. Throughout the game, the Necron player was going and on on how the SW player should swap out the Rhinos for Drop Pods, as he believes Drop Pods are far superior to Rhinos in every way, while the SW player kept countering that Rhinos are the more efficient choice. Granted I personally believe that Drop Pods are a more solid choice as it is a huge advantage having your army starting out in reserve, but it got me thinking that it would make a good debate, especially with the new SM Codex being released. Anyways, what are your thoughts on which you prefer and let's get this debate up and running.

Drop Pods are a lot less likely to backfire. Sure you can counter deploy, but they'll be in your face regardless.

Depends on a ton of factors. Against most crons pods would probably work better for the wolves so they could get stuck in melee and sweep some warriors in a hurry, which is pretty much the only way to ever get close to tabling them. But pods have their own issues. pod traffic jams start happening when you start dropping in more than 3 or so at a time usually. If you don't actually want to land near the enemy, such as a melee daemonkin army, then rhinos are far superior.

I think in the competitive meta pods are better more often than rhinos are, but they are definitely not "strictly" better.

You need a third option...with the Space Marine Battle COMpany formation, you get free transports. You can get around 10-12, or even more razorbacks with heavy bolters. For Free.

Well if I were you, I'd ask how the Drop Pods are better than Rhinos for a Turn 4 redeployment. They may overlap, and you may have to choose A or B for each unit, but A and B do not serve the same purpose.

General Hobbs wrote:


You need a third option...with the Space Marine Battle COMpany formation, you get free transports. You can get around 10-12, or even more razorbacks with heavy bolters. For Free.

That's what the Other Option is for. If you feel that there is something better then Rhino or Drop Pods then just vote for the Other slot and explain your reasoning mate .

I'm planning on running a mixture of both, so other!

Pods are more reliable. They can land where you want them.
On the other hand, Rhinos often get popped too early in the game.

Pods are good at what they do, but Rhinos/Razorbacks offer mobile protection. Granted, AV11 isn't that hot, but it's better and faster than footslogging across the table after the pods come down. And you can't hide inside an already deployed pod.

Rhinos are excellent defense AGAINST pods, as well. I damn near tabled a Pedor alpha strike list once with BA jumpers leaping over all the wrecked Rhinos.

Rhinos, however, fall apart against most Eldar lists. However, I think most pod lists fall apart against Skyhammer Forces.

"but they'll be in your face regardless."

Yes, but some lists WANT you in their face. And podded units can't assault and are asking to have all kinds of horrible things done to them. Drop pods give you very limited options against those lists.

"s it is a huge advantage having your army starting out in reserve"

I think it's actually a huge disadvantage. You offer yourself up piecemealed or spend a ton of points on empty drop pods. Either way, I'm a happy opponent. I've cut many lists apart that I shouldn't have been able to because they reserved too much.

Martel732 wrote:
Rhinos are excellent defense AGAINST pods, as well. I damn near tabled a Pedor alpha strike list once with BA jumpers leaping over all the wrecked Rhinos.

Rhinos, however, fall apart against most Eldar lists. However, I think most pod lists fall apart against Skyhammer Forces.

"but they'll be in your face regardless."

Yes, but some lists WANT you in their face. And podded units can't assault and are asking to have all kinds of horrible things done to them. Drop pods give you very limited options against those lists.

"s it is a huge advantage having your army starting out in reserve"

I think it's actually a huge disadvantage. You offer yourself up piecemealed or spend a ton of points on empty drop pods. Either way, I'm a happy opponent. I've cut many lists apart that I shouldn't have been able to because they reserved too much.

To be fair, there is a difference between a pod list and reserve shenanigans in general. The fact that some people can hide almost the entire army is a huge way to minimize casualties from alpha strikes.

Both have their uses. I know I'd have different loadouts on the units inside pods vs rhinos. It all depends on what sort of army your trying to run.

Pod lists try for a stronger alpha strike. Rhino lists plan for a more even and constant show of force.

It all depends on what kind of game your going to try and play.

You don't have to start your units in pods, nor do you have to drop right in front of a melee-based army. What you can do, however, is drop AV12 obsec on every objective on the table. They'll get shot at, but that draws fire off your marines. It's a great way to start the game ahead if you're playing a maelstrom mission.

 greyknight12 wrote:
You don't have to start your units in pods, nor do you have to drop right in front of a melee-based army. What you can do, however, is drop AV12 obsec on every objective on the table. They'll get shot at, but that draws fire off your marines. It's a great way to start the game ahead if you're playing a maelstrom mission.

This turns your list into footsloggers. I'm cool with that. Welcome to the turkey shoot.

"Pod lists try for a stronger alpha strike"

If they neuter your alpha strike, you are in for a long game. This is obviously much harder to do against Skyhammer, which is why it is amazeballs. But against things like Sternguard-combis, people have been doing this since 5th. 30+ppm meqs are not very good, imo.

Martel732 wrote:

 greyknight12 wrote:
You don't have to start your units in pods, nor do you have to drop right in front of a melee-based army. What you can do, however, is drop AV12 obsec on every objective on the table. They'll get shot at, but that draws fire off your marines. It's a great way to start the game ahead if you're playing a maelstrom mission.

This turns your list into footsloggers. I'm cool with that. Welcome to the turkey shoot.

I'm specifically referencing your comment about dropping in front of an army that "wants you in their face". Your footslogging marines can still grab backfield objectives for you. Sure against eldar you're probably hosed either way, but just pointing out that you don't HAVE to start in the pods.

 greyknight12 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

 greyknight12 wrote:
You don't have to start your units in pods, nor do you have to drop right in front of a melee-based army. What you can do, however, is drop AV12 obsec on every objective on the table. They'll get shot at, but that draws fire off your marines. It's a great way to start the game ahead if you're playing a maelstrom mission.

This turns your list into footsloggers. I'm cool with that. Welcome to the turkey shoot.

I'm specifically referencing your comment about dropping in front of an army that "wants you in their face". Your footslogging marines can still grab backfield objectives for you. Sure against eldar you're probably hosed either way, but just pointing out that you don't HAVE to start in the pods.

Right, I understand. I've just seen VERY few people actually do that. Most actually come in and try to alpha anyway. It's psychologically very interesting. It's really interesting with my BA, because nearly everyone outside my inner play group banks on the horrible reputation of BA and try the alpha and then act stunned when they start dying.

STEEL REHN > METAL BAWKSES imo

Pods let you deploy on the board how you want to giving extremely good tactical advantage while also preventing the enemy from getting a round of shooting into your units before they get to shoot. Its a very powerful option to be able to null deploy to waste a turn of enemy shooting then dropping in to start bringing the pain. In a blind matchup I think the pods are going to be at least decent against anything while rhinos run the risk of getting torn apart by a strong alpha strike and your stuck with foot slogging through heavy gunfire (granted not every rhino will die horribly unless its something like a firebase cadre with split fire tank hunter broadsides).Rhinos do make good bullet shields for marines which is something the pod can't really do and Rhinos have the added benefit of being mobile after the turn they deploy while the pod just sits there.

For Space Wolves in particular its nice to drop into the thick of it, shoot with your 2x special weapons, and dare the enemy to charge you with your chainsword, pistol, bolter Grey Hunters with counter attack. (if that unit is still alive ) Rhinos are good for shooting units but they aren't that great for CC units. A Rhino getting to a ranged focused army would move up turn 1, unload turn 2, be able to charge turn 3. A pod unit can unload turn 1, charge turn 2. Space wolves (outside blood claws) don't really care if they charge or get charged so unloading in charge range of even Orks isn't a bad thing if that means you can get some heavy duty rapid fire shooting in to soften them up (obviously don't drop next to a green tide and expect the unit to still be in one piece next turn).

I still think that apart from Skyhammer, SW are THE drop pod list.

" run the risk of getting torn apart by a strong alpha strike"

I run Rhinos to block LOS and then have jumpers and bikes behind it. The whole point is that the alpha strike gets poured into Rhinos, and not anything I care about.

I think the obvious answer is to air transport marines with stormravens and thunderhawks!


...... ok maybe not the obvious one but certinly the one that's gonna be remembered

BrianDavion wrote:
I think the obvious answer is to air transport marines with stormravens and thunderhawks!


...... ok maybe not the obvious one but certinly the one that's gonna be remembered

I really wish this worked better. Conceptually it's so cool.

Pods will do damage if you don't have total bad luck with rolls. It can only be lessened slightly by positioning and again... lucky (or unlucky on your part) rolls.

Rhinos can be removed before they become a threat. Their cargo can be destroyed shortly after the metal bawkes is wrecked, if done correctly and with some luck the Rhino rush could in theory do no damage or very little.

 Ironwolf45 wrote:
Hey mates, while building my models yesterday, I observed a game where one player was running a Mechanized Space Marine list with Squads in Rhinos, going against Necrons. Throughout the game, the Necron player was going and on on how the SW player should swap out the Rhinos for Drop Pods, as he believes Drop Pods are far superior to Rhinos in every way, while the SW player kept countering that Rhinos are the more efficient choice. Granted I personally believe that Drop Pods are a more solid choice as it is a huge advantage having your army starting out in reserve, but it got me thinking that it would make a good debate, especially with the new SM Codex being released. Anyways, what are your thoughts on which you prefer and let's get this debate up and running.

Interesting story for me since I saw a pair of marine players prepping for a tournament running pods against a Necron army. The pods came on strong at first, but from turn three on the Necrons had managed to use vehicles and flyers to get on one end of the marine line and roll it up. The marines couldn't match the speed of the Necrons after the initial deployment.
How did the match you watch finish out?

I like a mixture of both. I run my Tactical Squads in Rhinos and Sternguard in Drop Pods.

 Engine of War wrote:
Pods will do damage if you don't have total bad luck with rolls. It can only be lessened slightly by positioning and again... lucky (or unlucky on your part) rolls.

Rhinos can be removed before they become a threat. Their cargo can be destroyed shortly after the metal bawkes is wrecked, if done correctly and with some luck the Rhino rush could in theory do no damage or very little.

Rhinos aren't meant to be a threat in my lists. They are walls.

Martel732 wrote:

 Engine of War wrote:
Pods will do damage if you don't have total bad luck with rolls. It can only be lessened slightly by positioning and again... lucky (or unlucky on your part) rolls.

Rhinos can be removed before they become a threat. Their cargo can be destroyed shortly after the metal bawkes is wrecked, if done correctly and with some luck the Rhino rush could in theory do no damage or very little.

Rhinos aren't meant to be a threat in my lists. They are walls.

Yup. Disembark troops. Have troops shoot. Flat out rhino in front of them to stop return fire.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

 Engine of War wrote:
Pods will do damage if you don't have total bad luck with rolls. It can only be lessened slightly by positioning and again... lucky (or unlucky on your part) rolls.

Rhinos can be removed before they become a threat. Their cargo can be destroyed shortly after the metal bawkes is wrecked, if done correctly and with some luck the Rhino rush could in theory do no damage or very little.

Rhinos aren't meant to be a threat in my lists. They are walls.

Yup. Disembark troops. Have troops shoot. Flat out rhino in front of them to stop return fire.

Or cower in them to weather alpha strikes.

Pods supported with fast and heavy units.

Well, scouting rhinos with Khan (although I don't like him because it's a fragile WL IMO) have their merits, they can bunker down midfield turn 1, can refuse flank or outflank.
In conjunction with bikes they work quite good.
I second Draco, a pod supporting the advance of scouting bikes isn't that bad.

I personally find the idea of a 6 pod list supported by 6 razorbacks scouted up by Kahn in a Gladius to be the best option.

Pods have their advantages. Rhinos have their advantages.

I usually play against Dual Heldrakes and a Sonic Dreadnought. So loads if S6+ Ap3 Ignore Cover.
Drop Pods let me alpha strike, but I'll be mopped up afterwards very, very quickly.
Rhinos provide the protection versus the mobility of the pods - so using both at the same time looks dandy to me.
My 5th Company will use about 8 pods and 4 Rhinos.