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Razerous wrote:
After reading a few reviews, I've come to realise that by trying to squeeze stuff into a Hunter Contingent I've missed out on skyrays, tetras etc & all the mandatory fields do add up.

That issue will become less punishing @ higher pt games (I'm on 1500).

The main benefit of +1BS & markerlights sharing.. I've instead got more intrinsically powerful units. Food for thought.

oh oh. . .
Sounds like a sort of balance,

That's assuming you're using the ITC's ruling. If you're using the CF rule as it is actually written, the choice between HC and CAD is quite a lot harder, especially in your point range. I think that in anything more than 1500, you start being able to pile in enough goodies that the special rule sharing gives HC a marked edge over other options.

MilkmanAl wrote:
That's assuming you're using the ITC's ruling. If you're using the CF rule as it is actually written, the choice between HC and CAD is quite a lot harder, especially in your point range. I think that in anything more than 1500, you start being able to pile in enough goodies that the special rule sharing gives HC a marked edge over other options.

That is correct. I think its a safe assumptions is the vast majority of games I'll be watching, reading about, playing, etc.

I think the value of Skyrays and Tetras has gone down now with the new Drone and Piranha formations, that's not to say they aren't great, it's just that you aren't as hurt by not including them.

I think the biggest factor of which contingent, including the basic cad, you go with is determined by what you're trying to do with the list. I can easily see all three options being correct simply based on what you want your focus and play style to be.

Yeah it definitely seems like there are a TON of options, even at a pretty highly competitive level. You can take a CAD plus a formation or two, or you can pick whichever detachment you like the most and then take a CAD or a formation from the other detachment....the options really are endless. Play what you want and enjoy a golden age of options.

Too bad Vespids still suck :(

Honestly, one thing I'd really love to see is a Tau Auxiliary codex, since one thing I always liked about Chaos was that you could build four or more unique armies, with a ton of different models, that could all look unique but as one whole army at the same time. With Tau it feels a lot more limited since their other races are restricted to all of two squads :/.

You could always try and track down some Gnarlocs. They are so cool. Part of me would love to do a dinosaur riding army

Gnarlocs are pretty cool looking, but I want more of the Vespids, those guys just have so many cool possibilities. I wouldn't mind more Kroot stuff either though.

Oh, and am I the only one that feels like the Tau are kind of visually like the Trade Federation? Remember in the second Star Wars prequel where they're on that planet, and there are those flying bug men that kind of look like Vespids. The Trade Federation leaders also look very much like Tau in some ways, and they are the ones that primarily use drone technology. So you know D:

When i heard Tau were getting an MC in 6th i was expecting a Knarloc related thing, not a gundam suit. Foolish of me to think GW would diversify the Tau with their alien allies.

The FW Knarlocs were cool looking, but thats about it. Joke of an MC....no saves or bulk of wounds so it dies instantly and really had no purpose either.

Edit: What do you guys think are the Signature Systems worth taking for the FSE? Right now the only one I actually like is the Earth Caste Pilot for my Riptide, and the Medallion of Arthas Moloch is an ok option, but the others just seem kind of not worth it. Thoughts?

I looked up the rules for the Knarloc stuff, and the points aren't that bad for what they do, since none of the big beasties cost more than 80pts, but their armaments are so oddly bad. I get it, Kroot aren't the best at shooting, but paying a ton of points just to mount a Krootox Rifle on one of the things is silly :/.

Oh, I thought of something cool too, the Vespid could totally have an assassin group, since they are pretty stealthy and mobile. It's also not uncommon to see assassinations carried out by jet pack wearing flyboys in sci-fi genres.

 Tinkrr wrote:
Edit: What do you guys think are the Signature Systems worth taking for the FSE? Right now the only one I actually like is the Earth Caste Pilot for my Riptide, and the Medallion of Arthas Moloch is an ok option, but the others just seem kind of not worth it. Thoughts?

I looked up the rules for the Knarloc stuff, and the points aren't that bad for what they do, since none of the big beasties cost more than 80pts, but their armaments are so oddly bad. I get it, Kroot aren't the best at shooting, but paying a ton of points just to mount a Krootox Rifle on one of the things is silly :/.

Oh, I thought of something cool too, the Vespid could totally have an assassin group, since they are pretty stealthy and mobile. It's also not uncommon to see assassinations carried out by jet pack wearing flyboys in sci-fi genres.

None of them are worth taking, frees up points for other things.

SJ

 jeffersonian000 wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
Edit: What do you guys think are the Signature Systems worth taking for the FSE? Right now the only one I actually like is the Earth Caste Pilot for my Riptide, and the Medallion of Arthas Moloch is an ok option, but the others just seem kind of not worth it. Thoughts?

I looked up the rules for the Knarloc stuff, and the points aren't that bad for what they do, since none of the big beasties cost more than 80pts, but their armaments are so oddly bad. I get it, Kroot aren't the best at shooting, but paying a ton of points just to mount a Krootox Rifle on one of the things is silly :/.

Oh, I thought of something cool too, the Vespid could totally have an assassin group, since they are pretty stealthy and mobile. It's also not uncommon to see assassinations carried out by jet pack wearing flyboys in sci-fi genres.

None of them are worth taking, frees up points for other things.

SJ

I mean the Earth Caste Pilot is actually a huge buff to a Riptide because I'm already taking the FNP item just because of how often you can fail a Nova Charge.

 Tinkrr wrote:
Edit: What do you guys think are the Signature Systems worth taking for the FSE? Right now the only one I actually like is the Earth Caste Pilot for my Riptide, and the Medallion of Arthas Moloch is an ok option, but the others just seem kind of not worth it. Thoughts?

I looked up the rules for the Knarloc stuff, and the points aren't that bad for what they do, since none of the big beasties cost more than 80pts, but their armaments are so oddly bad. I get it, Kroot aren't the best at shooting, but paying a ton of points just to mount a Krootox Rifle on one of the things is silly :/.

Oh, I thought of something cool too, the Vespid could totally have an assassin group, since they are pretty stealthy and mobile. It's also not uncommon to see assassinations carried out by jet pack wearing flyboys in sci-fi genres.

I have not acquired the supplement yet, but the knowledge that the ECPA isn't actually purchaseable has decreased my intention of doing so.

 carldooley wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
Edit: What do you guys think are the Signature Systems worth taking for the FSE? Right now the only one I actually like is the Earth Caste Pilot for my Riptide, and the Medallion of Arthas Moloch is an ok option, but the others just seem kind of not worth it. Thoughts?

I looked up the rules for the Knarloc stuff, and the points aren't that bad for what they do, since none of the big beasties cost more than 80pts, but their armaments are so oddly bad. I get it, Kroot aren't the best at shooting, but paying a ton of points just to mount a Krootox Rifle on one of the things is silly :/.

Oh, I thought of something cool too, the Vespid could totally have an assassin group, since they are pretty stealthy and mobile. It's also not uncommon to see assassinations carried out by jet pack wearing flyboys in sci-fi genres.

I have not acquired the supplement yet, but the knowledge that the ECPA isn't actually purchaseable has decreased my intention of doing so.

I would refuse to play anyone who insists a Riptide cannot purchase a ECPA. They are just being plain stupid. The rules for ECPA specifically say that it allows rerools on Nova Reactor rolls, which only riptides have lol (Besides the fact that in FSE riptides could purchase them and it is an obvious omission on the part of GW)

 carldooley wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
Edit: What do you guys think are the Signature Systems worth taking for the FSE? Right now the only one I actually like is the Earth Caste Pilot for my Riptide, and the Medallion of Arthas Moloch is an ok option, but the others just seem kind of not worth it. Thoughts?

I looked up the rules for the Knarloc stuff, and the points aren't that bad for what they do, since none of the big beasties cost more than 80pts, but their armaments are so oddly bad. I get it, Kroot aren't the best at shooting, but paying a ton of points just to mount a Krootox Rifle on one of the things is silly :/.

Oh, I thought of something cool too, the Vespid could totally have an assassin group, since they are pretty stealthy and mobile. It's also not uncommon to see assassinations carried out by jet pack wearing flyboys in sci-fi genres.

I have not acquired the supplement yet, but the knowledge that the ECPA isn't actually purchaseable has decreased my intention of doing so.

Yeah, currently it's worded so poorly you can't, but it specifically mentions Nova rolls, which wouldn't make any sense... Plus in the fluff O'Vesa is specifically an Earth Caste pilot.

I'm just going to kind of assume the ITC rules that it's fine to put that on a Riptide.

So I am currently still painting up my Ghostkeels and Stormsurge to add to my Tau army (Sadly i take FOREVER to paint) and I am still tinkering with 2 possible army lists. I am in Phoenix Arizona so every single place uses ITC rules (meaning currently CFP is nerfed), so I am trying to decide if Hunter Contingent is still worth it or not.

List 1: Formation Detachment
Drone Net
4 x 4 Marker Drones

OSC
3 Stealthsuits (one with TL and FB)
3 Stealthsuits (one with TL and FB)
3 Ghostkeel (3 CIR, 3 TL FB, 2 TL, 3 BKR)

Riptide Wing
1 Riptide (HBC, EWO, VT)
1 Riptide (HBC, EWO, VT)
3 Riptide (3 IA, 3 EWO, 2 TL, 3 BKR)


List 2: Hunter Contingent
Hunter Cadre
1 Commander (2 Missile Pods, DC, TL, Iridium, 2 MD)

1 Riptide (IA, EWO)
1 Riptide (IA, EWO)

6 Marker Drones

1 Storm Surge (Pulse Driver Cannon, TL AFP, EWO, ATS, SG)

5 Strike Team
5 Strike Team
5 Strike Team


OSC
3 Stealthsuits (one with TL and FB)
3 Stealthsuits (one with TL and FB)
3 Ghostkeel (3 CIR, 3 TL FB, 2 TL, 3 BKR)


Only problem with List 1 is I currently only own 2 Riptides so would need 3 more lol

The Arthas Molloch thing got super nerfed. i ws bummed about that.

 Tinkrr wrote:
Edit: What do you guys think are the Signature Systems worth taking for the FSE? Right now the only one I actually like is the Earth Caste Pilot for my Riptide, and the Medallion of Arthas Moloch is an ok option, but the others just seem kind of not worth it. Thoughts?

ECPA is good, of course it's up to TO if you can use it at a tourney.

I love fusion blades. Stupid expensive for what they are. But they are a lot of fun. Being able to flatten Chapter masters and dreadnaughts alike is also a ton of fun!

The talismon is ok. I personally like it for the free slot 5++ rather then the deny bonus. You don't have enough dice anyway to make it totally worth it.

My issue with FSE relics is that not only they cost too much, and not only they are mostly situational, but that there is also nobody I want to have in a FSE that can wear any.

I don't really need dronemander with the drone net, I don't have a buffmander or tankmander as possible builds. Every commander. I must take (retaliation cadre tax) is auto regulated to coldstar in my FSE lists, meaning they can't even take relics.

I don't even get a chance to consider them, even of they were good. (and they are silver bullets, at best.)

 Tinkrr wrote:

 jeffersonian000 wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
Edit: What do you guys think are the Signature Systems worth taking for the FSE? Right now the only one I actually like is the Earth Caste Pilot for my Riptide, and the Medallion of Arthas Moloch is an ok option, but the others just seem kind of not worth it. Thoughts?

I looked up the rules for the Knarloc stuff, and the points aren't that bad for what they do, since none of the big beasties cost more than 80pts, but their armaments are so oddly bad. I get it, Kroot aren't the best at shooting, but paying a ton of points just to mount a Krootox Rifle on one of the things is silly :/.

Oh, I thought of something cool too, the Vespid could totally have an assassin group, since they are pretty stealthy and mobile. It's also not uncommon to see assassinations carried out by jet pack wearing flyboys in sci-fi genres.

None of them are worth taking, frees up points for other things.

SJ

I mean the Earth Caste Pilot is actually a huge buff to a Riptide because I'm already taking the FNP item just because of how often you can fail a Nova Charge.

The are all too expensive, and apparently written for the wrong book as none are particularly useful. The only one that is useful cannot be tsken by the only unit that can use it. That pretty much makes them all garbage.

SJ

I probably won't give in to that level of hyperbole. But I will say that the relics were less than I hoped. At the same time, we are not talking about a weak faction here. So it may be somewhat understandable if our relics are situational. After all there is only one situation we are normally equippd to handle and one that we are not. So the one we are not does beg an answer and some of the relics help fill in a little bit. So I'm torn on their value. As in all things the list decides what you need. Terrain, dice and enemy lists make you look brilliant...or like an idiot. I dont see a 25 point ecision being the reason someone loses though so there's also that.

 Jancoran wrote:
I probably won't give in to that level of hyperbole. But I will say that the relics were less than I hoped. At the same time, we are not talking about a weak faction here. So it may be somewhat understandable if our relics are situational. After all there is only one situation we are normally equippd to handle and one that we are not. So the one we are not does beg an answer and some of the relics help fill in a little bit. So I'm torn on their value. As in all things the list decides what you need. Terrain, dice and enemy lists make you look brilliant...or like an idiot. I dont see a 25 point ecision being the reason someone loses though so there's also that.

Can you restate? I have no idea what point you were trying to make.

SJ

Someone needs to do me a spreadsheet on 4x 4x Marker Drones, average number of marker hits on units firing singly or using one unit's hits to boost another's BS.

^^ Agreed, if anyone tells me I can't use the ECPA on a Riptide I'm going to tell them they can go shove it politely and see if they don't like it they don't have to play me. It was clearly meant and designed for Riptide so I will continue to use it.

On another note I was curious to ask if anyone else has tried running a team of x3 Crisis Suits each with x2 Airbursting Fragmentation Projectors and Target Lock? I ran this yesterday against Space Marines, Eldar and a Tyranid player and holy cow did these guys just wreck face!

on the relic note, I totally forgot about the warscaper drone. I take one every game, it is great. Yes a little pricey, like others, but giving ignore cover to a squad of crisis suits.. or in my case a squad of deepstriking broadsides now is really good. Such a large surface area to land, ignoring terrain tests is nice.

Also, want to note that the earthquake node (forget its real name) I have never tried, but it seems like it could be really effective in a terrain heavy map. And if you roll that it continues multiple turns.

 gmaleron wrote:
^^ Agreed, if anyone tells me I can't use the ECPA on a Riptide I'm going to tell them they can go shove it politely and see if they don't like it they don't have to play me. It was clearly meant and designed for Riptide so I will continue to use it.

On another note I was curious to ask if anyone else has tried running a team of x3 Crisis Suits each with x2 Airbursting Fragmentation Projectors and Target Lock? I ran this yesterday against Space Marines, Eldar and a Tyranid player and holy cow did these guys just wreck face!

I used to run a single suit with an airburst and flamer, and he was awesome. I can only imagine that a squad of 6 would be devastating to a horde army.

 BoomWolf wrote:
My issue with FSE relics is that not only they cost too much, and not only they are mostly situational, but that there is also nobody I want to have in a FSE that can wear any.

I don't really need dronemander with the drone net, I don't have a buffmander or tankmander as possible builds. Every commander. I must take (retaliation cadre tax) is auto regulated to coldstar in my FSE lists, meaning they can't even take relics.

I don't even get a chance to consider them, even of they were good. (and they are silver bullets, at best.)

I actually see the ECPA as an effective 30pt+ discount to the Riptide Wing!

Regarding the ECPA : Rule wise ists clear that with th Mont'ka Book a normal Riptide cant get it. Fact. There is also no ambiguity here. As a normal Riptide has no access to FE relics...

O'Vesa on the other side get that ECPA. perhaps... just perhaps its RAI that only he geths this one and such ECPA has its Nova Rules ...

 _ghost_ wrote:
Regarding the ECPA : Rule wise ists clear that with th Mont'ka Book a normal Riptide cant get it. Fact. There is also no ambiguity here. As a normal Riptide has no access to FE relics...

O'Vesa on the other side get that ECPA. perhaps... just perhaps its RAI that only he geths this one and such ECPA has its Nova Rules ...

I thought this might be the case as well. Unfortunately, if it is intended this way, they went about it in the worst possible way: Taking away a relic (not replacing it), taking away the option to take O'vesa (only in the eight formation now).

I also don't like it the way it is now. but insisting on using it on a usual riptide would simple be against clear written rules.

 _ghost_ wrote:
Regarding the ECPA : Rule wise ists clear that with th Mont'ka Book a normal Riptide cant get it. Fact. There is also no ambiguity here. As a normal Riptide has no access to FE relics...

O'Vesa on the other side get that ECPA. perhaps... just perhaps its RAI that only he gets this one and such ECPA has its Nova Rules ...

The problem is that RAW, O'Vesa has an illegal loadout. He, as defined in the eight formation, is just a normal riptide with all of his upgrades and the associated special rules. None of those rules allow him to take an ECPA if a normal riptide could not (which is the case). Definitely a simple oversight as there is no current way to approach the rules that make sense. It's like Ravenwing HQ level of bad. Any FSE Riptide will definitely be able to take the ECPA, as there is no other way to satisfy O'Vesa's item requirements.

So go ahead in good conscience and run a riptide with an ECPA, since even if you think that it's only meant for O'Vesa, then why does it have a cost in the relic section? Who can actually purchase and use it for 30 points?

That being said, I think it's kind of moot since the Riptide wing is so much better. Although, I really don't plan on fielding the wing. We're not quite at 4 source format yet for the ITC, which is what I would need to field it. The other option would be the 4 or 5 riptides the Notre Dame has outlined, and I really am not about that life. 3 is pushing it for me. More likely, I'll just grab a stormsurge and call it a day.