Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 kronk wrote:
A single, one-wound biker running around is as useful as a single, one-wound terminator running around, regardless of their special rules. If you can't add them to another unit or upgrade an existing unit, WTF is the point?

Maybe we see some missions for small games in the future (like Kill Teams or the Last Chancers). Obviously these rules are not great or even good in normal 40k - but in a game against a like-minded player (toning down his codex list) or other such special mini FoCs we may see in the future they could be fun (for both sides...).

I hope that the Genestealer Cult gets Killteam rules. I couldn't care less about the rules for the Killteam

Is the Heralds of Ruin list for GCs good to go for the models in the box? I don't really have a clue when it comes to Killteam, I just decided to play it soon.There doesn't seem to be a needle pistol for starters.

Can't be worse than my 7 models Nurgle Marines list (8 with chaos snail, err, hound!).

The Favoured Disciples: troops 17 meltabombs (12 models) .

Can we just write points costs?

beast_gts wrote:
I think I'm going to do something based off one of these:

Spoiler:

Then you have to get and convert up at least... 1 2 3 4... seven familiars.

Yodhrin wrote:Seriously, are you guys living in some weird alternate reality or something? Because there are more people complaining about "haters" on this one page than there are people actually hating on this release in the entire thread...

In the local idiom; get a haud o' yersels, ya bams.

That.

People are astounded by the 'hate', but I'm astounded by how they care so much about it. Folk are allowed to have different opinions, and express them. One good release doesn't mean they can't pick out little, personal could-have-beens; or mean they can't point out that 11 marines in a £100 box (if you just want thuper-duper marines for 40K) is still hardly ideal; or make 40K any better.

Does it taint your enjoyment of the product that much? If it does, maybe it's not all the naysayer's fault.

gorgon wrote:Well...*I* say that I'm going to get tanks, because this is 7th edition and there isn't much that can stop me from doing so.

That too. For a nice wee Hispano Suiza MC-36, I'm thinking low-tech IFV, wheeled.

Tyran wrote:I'm still trying to understand how the hell a Genestealer Cult has access to a Bonesword.

Maybe it's a carved femur from a grox, or a human, rather than an overly-anthropomorphised magically-grown duelling weapon that matters more for it's USRs than than what it 'actually' is.

Or you can say in your own head that it's a fancy ceramic blade, like out of that there Nausicaa thing, or even, wait for it, metal. You can do that, y'know. No, really!

 Big Mac wrote:

 Rainyday wrote:
The models look great, but I have a feeling this will have the same problem Assassinorum had: Once you put the models together, they don't fit back into the game box. Looking at it purely as a board game, storage and transport are quite difficult when the game pieces don't fit back in the box they came out of.

Why the heck would you store these wonderful models back in the boxset? I bought a small new GW zigzag case for my assassinorum figure(to prevent breakage and paint chip since they seem fragile), these would fit in as well.

I was speaking about it purely as a board game. Imagine if there wasn't a compatible miniatures game you were going to use the models for. If it were any other board game, players would cry foul if they had to buy extra boxes to transport their game around. If you bought a copy of Risk, or even a euro game like Carcasonne, and all the little plastic soldiers/meeple couldn't be put back into the box so you could haul it around, you wouldn't be happy.

For assassinorum, I ended up switching the plastic assassins for my old metal ones and installed a magnet in between the chaos lord's legs and body just so I could fit them into a reasonably-sized second box to take to board game club meetings.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 MajorTom11 wrote:
By the layout of the boards, they really should have just made them space-hulk compatible. Shame to miss the opportunity imho.

GW's never found an opportunity they couldn't miss, especially when it comes to leveraging IP/cross-product promotion.

I don't think it would take much to make the genestealers compatible with Assassinorum either, but I doubt they will.

Big Mac wrote:
Why the heck would you store these wonderful models back in the boxset? I bought a small new GW zigzag case

Some might see that as a good enough reason, TBH.

 Rainyday wrote:

I was speaking about it purely as a board game. Imagine if there wasn't a compatible miniatures game you were going to use the models for. If it were any other board game, players would cry foul if they had to buy extra boxes to transport their game around.

Why you gotta a be a hater?

Wait, I don't get it. I mentioned that I thought this was a rather transparent cash grab by GW to create yet another boardgame masquerading as a 40K release, I get called a pathetic hater, shouted down, and generally seen as the bad guy of the thread. Then several people come in here and decry the 40K rules as being lackluster, poorly constructed, and a missed opportunity, and they're greeted with silence. Where's the outrage, guys? Thse guys are totally urinating all over your parade. Let's get 'em!

Frankly, it's no real surprise these rules are terribad. It's not like there's a lot of precedent for inspired writing from GW. Just buy your boxed sets, and shut up about the rules. This is a boardgame, not a 40K release, right?

 the_Armyman wrote:
Wait, I don't get it. I mentioned that I thought this was a rather transparent cash grab by GW to create yet another boardgame masquerading as a 40K release, I get called a pathetic hater, shouted down, and generally seen as the bad guy of the thread. Then several people come in here and decry the 40K rules as being lackluster, poorly constructed, and a missed opportunity, and they're greeted with silence. Where's the outrage, guys? Thse guys are totally urinating all over your parade. Let's get 'em!

Frankly, it's no real surprise these rules are terribad. It's not like there's a lot of precedent for inspired writing from GW. Just buy your boxed sets, and shut up about the rules. This is a boardgame, not a 40K release, right?

You come across as a bitter, angry person in your posts. The kind I avoid at parties and pubs.

 the_Armyman wrote:
Wait, I don't get it. I mentioned that I thought this was a rather transparent cash grab by GW to create yet another boardgame masquerading as a 40K release, I get called a pathetic hater, shouted down, and generally seen as the bad guy of the thread. Then several people come in here and decry the 40K rules as being lackluster, poorly constructed, and a missed opportunity, and they're greeted with silence. Where's the outrage, guys?

I think they got quickly schooled that the 'stop bullying GW' kneejerk was even less useful than usual, here.

 kronk wrote:

You come across as a bitter, angry person in your posts. The kind I avoid at parties and pubs.

Cuts both ways, that does.

 Rainyday wrote:

 Big Mac wrote:

 Rainyday wrote:
The models look great, but I have a feeling this will have the same problem Assassinorum had: Once you put the models together, they don't fit back into the game box. Looking at it purely as a board game, storage and transport are quite difficult when the game pieces don't fit back in the box they came out of.

Why the heck would you store these wonderful models back in the boxset? I bought a small new GW zigzag case for my assassinorum figure(to prevent breakage and paint chip since they seem fragile), these would fit in as well.

I was speaking about it purely as a board game. Imagine if there wasn't a compatible miniatures game you were going to use the models for. If it were any other board game, players would cry foul if they had to buy extra boxes to transport their game around. If you bought a copy of Risk, or even a euro game like Carcasonne, and all the little plastic soldiers/meeple couldn't be put back into the box so you could haul it around, you wouldn't be happy.

For assassinorum, I ended up switching the plastic assassins for my old metal ones and installed a magnet in between the chaos lord's legs and body just so I could fit them into a reasonably-sized second box to take to board game club meetings.

Battle Foam made a foam tray insert that fit inside the game box for Dreadfleet game that held the dice, models, and stuff. Their site is work blocked for me, but you might drop them an email and ask if they are doing one for Execution Force and/or Deathwatch.

 kronk wrote:

Battle Foam made a foam tray insert that fit inside the game box for Dreadfleet game that held the dice, models, and stuff. Their site is work blocked for me, but you might drop them an email and ask if they are doing one for Execution Force and/or Deathwatch.

They literally can't. The box is so slim, that there's no way for the chaos lord and several of the assassins to fit in, even with all the other components removed. The models are dynamic, gorgeous, and very 3-dimensional, but that works against them in this situation.

Ah. I see.

My guess GS Cult will get;

3 HQs, Patriarch, Magos and Primus

2 Troops, 1st/2nd gens and 3rd/4th gens.

2 Elites, Aberants and Purestrains

 dan2026 wrote:
My guess GS Cult will get;

3 HQs, Patriarch, Magos and Primus

2 Troops, 1st/2nd gens and 3rd/4th gens.

2 Elites, Aberants and Purestrains

I think Primus will probably be a unit leader. Can't see any obvious unit leader models in 1st/2nd gen and 3rd/4th gen stuff.

I'm a little disappointed with the raven guard and BA guys.

A RG vanguard vet with the same loadout costs 32 points.
They are identical except that edryc has stealth, is on his own, and costs 3 points more.

For the BA he costs 8 pts more than an assault sergean with the same loadout, and gets "heroic intervention" and 1 more attack with a chainsword.

They're probably fine for smaller games, but I kinda expected a bit more bang for your buck. Even if they had IC then it might be cool, could give a unit +3 to it's cover save on T1, by adding in edryc.

 Rainyday wrote:

I was speaking about it purely as a board game. Imagine if there wasn't a compatible miniatures game you were going to use the models for. If it were any other board game, players would cry foul if they had to buy extra boxes to transport their game around. If you bought a copy of Risk, or even a euro game like Carcasonne, and all the little plastic soldiers/meeple couldn't be put back into the box so you could haul it around, you wouldn't be happy.

Well, that's a problem with most boardgames that contain larger multi-piece models. Even if they're snap-fit the desire to put them back to pieces stops once you painted them.

I guess if you don't want to buy another box you just have to wrap the models, put them in the box and use a simple bag for the tiles, counters and cards.

Hmm, I don't know.. I like that the DW got a formation for 40k, but all those super specialised troopers, all in the same unit and can't shoot at their own targets? Seems like a huge waste of so many weapons. And they all have one wound except for Crassius and T4 except the biker? So one Battle Cannon blast over these guys and they're basicly all dead. 535 points gone.

I expected them to be individual units that come in one formation, and they could run around doing whatever, all with Stealth and multiple wounds. Sort of like Kill Team rules. How exactly are these going to be used? I can't really image a good use for them to be honest.

 alleus wrote:
Hmm, I don't know.. I like that the DW got a formation for 40k, but all those super specialised troopers, all in the same unit and can't shoot at their own targets? Seems like a huge waste of so many weapons. And they all have one wound except for Crassius and T4 except the biker? So one Battle Cannon blast over these guys and they're basicly all dead. 535 points gone.

I expected them to be individual units that come in one formation, and they could run around doing whatever, all with Stealth and multiple wounds. Sort of like Kill Team rules. How exactly are these going to be used? I can't really image a good use for them to be honest.

you can take cassius + squad donatus as a allied detachment for 270 points. That's the best use i see for them right now (librarian could be better than cassius, dont know his rules yet)

 the_Armyman wrote:
Wait, I don't get it. I mentioned that I thought this was a rather transparent cash grab by GW to create yet another boardgame masquerading as a 40K release, I get called a pathetic hater, shouted down, and generally seen as the bad guy of the thread. Then several people come in here and decry the 40K rules as being lackluster, poorly constructed, and a missed opportunity, and they're greeted with silence. Where's the outrage, guys? Thse guys are totally urinating all over your parade. Let's get 'em!

Frankly, it's no real surprise these rules are terribad. It's not like there's a lot of precedent for inspired writing from GW. Just buy your boxed sets, and shut up about the rules. This is a boardgame, not a 40K release, right?

The rules for the 40k Killteam are pretty lackluster, granted. But me disliking the Killteam rules doesn't mean I'm no longer allowed to like the models provided in the box. Nor am I forced to "defend" the boring 40k rules provided just because I like the models. The world isn't just black and white.

The models themself are still pretty sweet, and the price - IMHO - is fine considering it's both a boardgame and a bunch of VERY good miniatures usable in multiple other game systems, including one where the rules to use them will be provided for free. If you're choosing to limit yourself to seeing it purely as "the boardgame" that's your choice. It's a valid opinion, but most people on a wargaming - dare I say 40k centric - board WILL see the opportunities outside of the pure boardgame.

Did the box loose somewhat in percieved value to me due to the lackluster rules? Sure. Is it enough to discourage me from buying the set? Nope. Still going to pick it up for the models, and I'll probably get a few games of DW:Overkill out of it, too. Looks fine to me for the price (I expect about 100 euro at online resellers)

 kronk wrote:

You come across as a bitter, angry person in your posts. The kind I avoid at parties and pubs.

And yet, dripping with bitterness and anger, I've somehow managed to not insult anyone. Strange. As I've said two times, now, I love the miniatures, but I hate the execution here. They could have presented this boardgame as a standalone campaign box, and it would have sold at the $165 pricepoint.

 the_Armyman wrote:
Wait, I don't get it. I mentioned that I thought this was a rather transparent cash grab by GW to create yet another boardgame masquerading as a 40K release, I get called a pathetic hater, shouted down, and generally seen as the bad guy of the thread. Then several people come in here and decry the 40K rules as being lackluster, poorly constructed, and a missed opportunity, and they're greeted with silence. Where's the outrage, guys? Thse guys are totally urinating all over your parade. Let's get 'em!

Frankly, it's no real surprise these rules are terribad. It's not like there's a lot of precedent for inspired writing from GW. Just buy your boxed sets, and shut up about the rules. This is a boardgame, not a 40K release, right?

Because most of the excitment was for the Cultists anyway, and their rules are starting to look pretty decent. They also make up 4/5ths of the model count.

I also wander what people were expecting of these guys, I mean there effectively a group of Marine Sgts seconded to the Deathwatch, really not enough reason to make them all the equal of Lysander, Draigo or Dante adn they do have some interesting rules.

As for the board game/40k thing, it's both and their have been enough people in here saying they're buying it for the board game aspect to make that a reasonable prospect. I mean is it really such a bad thing to make it duel purpose?

 the_Armyman wrote:

 kronk wrote:

You come across as a bitter, angry person in your posts. The kind I avoid at parties and pubs.

And yet, dripping with bitterness and anger, I've somehow managed to not insult anyone. Strange. As I've said two times, now, I love the miniatures, but I hate the execution here. They could have presented this boardgame as a standalone campaign box, and it would have sold at the $165 pricepoint.

Isn't it $165 anyway? What's the difference? You can use them in 40k either way, and this way you get a board game out of it too.

Some of these reactions are damned embarrassing.
This is a boardgame first, 40k models second.
The rules are not a missed opportunity, they are pretty much the same as the rules for Stormclaw and everything else was.
Krom sucked, his units sucked.
When (IF) they release the stand alone release people will get what they want.
Instead people did what they always do, they set themselves up with huge expectations and now are all salty when things are good but not living up to their Sugar Plum Faerie dreams,
We are getting Deathwatch AND Genestealer Cult in the same week brought back.
And people are squabbling over petty crap.
Embarrassing.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 kronk wrote:

You come across as a bitter, angry person in your posts. The kind I avoid at parties and pubs.

And yet, dripping with bitterness and anger, I've somehow managed to not insult anyone. Strange. As I've said two times, now, I love the miniatures, but I hate the execution here. They could have presented this boardgame as a standalone campaign box, and it would have sold at the $165 pricepoint.

But it's both. There will be rules for using the models in 40k for those that don't want a board game and there is a board game for those that don't play 40k and both for people that want both.

Just like Betrayal at Calth.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 kronk wrote:

You come across as a bitter, angry person in your posts. The kind I avoid at parties and pubs.

And yet, dripping with bitterness and anger, I've somehow managed to not insult anyone. Strange. As I've said two times, now, I love the miniatures, but I hate the execution here. They could have presented this boardgame as a standalone campaign box, and it would have sold at the $165 pricepoint.

So you're mad that you're getting some cardboard and dice + a fun little board game to play when you're bored extra for your 165$? Or does it remind you that you have no friends to play said board game with? Must suck to be you, well at least you can try to ruin the fun for everyone else

Plenty of those leaked rules are half wrong huehuehue ^^

Exactly 5 people are buying this as a boardgame. I took a worldwide survey, and those were the numbers I got. The other 45,329 people are purchasing this for 40K. 40K. The game that makes all these other experiments like AOS and boutique boardgames possible. Wouldn't you prefer for $165, that this boxed set contained rules for 40K instead of some foreign cardstock filler? A 48 page campaign booklet with the full rules included (not another $8 and two issues of WD over 2 weeks)?

If I seem angry, it's because people don't seem to get this. Except for the 5 people I've already mentioned (all of whom will chime in on this thread and let me know how wrong I am), this is a 40K release. A 40K release that a lot of you seem okay to believe is a boardgame because you're paying for cardboard tiles and 3 pages of game rules.

Space Hulk was a boardgame. A good one, with game pieces that could be used in 40K. This is a sham.

 kronk wrote:
You come across as a bitter, angry person in your posts. The kind I avoid at parties and pubs.

You must go to different kind of parties than me.

I think I'd be a BIG HIT if I could tell people that this one time on a toy soldier message board that there were these really cool figures that everyone liked but I said whoa everyone these guys are expensive and then they said no they're not and I say they are too and what's more I don't know what they're for and the company is dumb but people still didn't like that until later when some people weren't as happy about everything regarding the really cool figures and that vindicated me but not really.

 the_Armyman wrote:
A 40K release that a lot of you seem okay to believe is a boardgame because you're paying for cardboard tiles and 3 pages of game rules.

No, I believe it is a board game because it is a board game.

 the_Armyman wrote:
Exactly 5 people are buying this as a boardgame. I took a worldwide survey, and those were the numbers I got. The other 45,329 people are purchasing this for 40K. 40K. The game that makes all these other experiments like AOS and boutique boardgames possible. Wouldn't you prefer for $165, that this boxed set contained rules for 40K instead of some foreign cardstock filler? A 48 page campaign booklet with the full rules included (not another $8 and two issues of WD over 2 weeks)?

If I seem angry, it's because people don't seem to get this. Except for the 5 people I've already mentioned (all of whom will chime in on this thread and let me know how wrong I am), this is a 40K release. A 40K release that a lot of you seem okay to believe is a boardgame because you're paying for cardboard tiles and 3 pages of game rules.

Space Hulk was a boardgame. A good one, with game pieces that could be used in 40K. This is a sham.

The rules will be available for free from the GW site... learn to read, or at least take the time to read up on something before spewing gak about it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 aracersss wrote:
Plenty of those leaked rules are half wrong huehuehue ^^

How so? And which ones?