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I get nervous not having something to immediately hit a rhino or chimera is my issue. Yeah you have gauss, but if you regularly played with Necrons you'll know that it isn't something to rely on.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
adamsouza wrote: Is the Rhino going to somehow hurt the Destroyers ? Umm. No.
Who's taking Rhino's anyways ?
Not a lot of people, but I see them. They're a great cheap way to up your breaktest limit, and more importantly, act as a mobile pillbox that can shunt your footsloggers up the board pretty quickly. Plus a relentless heavy weapon marine turns it into a cheaper razorback.
Now Chimeras on the other hand, that's probably what he's most concerned about. Chimeras can really do work in kill team if you use them right.
'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader
"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell
Just played a game VS Corsairs (lots and lots of guys with jump packs). I ran a Favoured Disciples (12 Acolyte Hybrids), and 8 Purestrain Genes (1 with Scytals). Was running a leader gene with FNP, and specialist genes with Shred, Hatred and Assault nades.
Played the default mission and boy was it brutal. I Cult Ambushed the Genes in first turn around his position castled up in a corner - got 7 3-5s and one rolled a 1, so was way back. Unfortunate that there were no 6s, but hey ho. I had first turn and moved as close as I could, and then his first turn of shooting (tons of double pistols and the odd lasblaster) managed to take out 6 of the 7 genes with some pretty awful saves from me.
From then on it was a game of cleanup - I was unfortunate enough to not make a single charge in the entire game - my acolytes shot and killed two corsairs but there were still around 10 left. The jumping 6+D6" after shooting was absolutely brutal against a melee list like mine, and unfortunately he had two objectives on his side of the board.
Amusingly, pretty sure any other Cult list of those I have drafted (14 genes; Chimera and Sentinel with neophytes; Goliath and Sentinel with metamorphs; tons of neophytes) would have probably done a lot better. With more genes I would've been more likely to get those crucial 6s, and would have still had something like 6 genes left near him to attempt a charge initially. Basically, whilst taking the Favoured Disciples shored up my numbers, they simply aren't fast enough to pose a threat and back up the genes, so I may as well max them out. The vehicles would've proved tough to crack, whilst sheltering my infantry.
So yeah, lesson here seems to be to go the whole hog on melee if you're going that route, and that Corsairs can be absolutely ridiculous against melee-focused lists!
10x Neophyte Hybrids
1x Flamer or G. Launcher
Chimera w/ Heavy Flamer
2x Armored Sentinels
200pts.
3 AV 12 vehicles. 9 or 10 S6 shots with decent mobility. 1 Heavy Flamer with the potential for another flamer. I think it looks good on paper but need to get some games in with it.
My current list is AM and is pretty similar to the above list
10x Veterans w/ Krak Grenades
2x G. Launchers
3x Armored Sentinels
It doesn't have quite the same mobility, or the mobile pillbox feature, of the Cult version.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/15 00:31:35
All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I've been thinking of just doing 3 Destroyers answer 1 Heavy Destroyer, with the latter being the leader and just make the former three specialists.
Which skills have you guys found the most handy?
Automatically Appended Next Post: I should clarify I'm leaning towards Ignores Cover on one and extra range on the other. Would the last one be best with Spitfire or something else?
One of The things that makes kill team interesting is you shoot at a model as opposed to a unit, so wounds don't carry over to other models. This allows things to be much more durable in kill team than they would be in other game types, but when you take multi-wound units at the expense of number of models, you negate much of that advantage. Any multi shot weapon is going to be great against destroyers, because instead of only being able to kill one person at a time, they effectively get to kill 2 at a time. I watched this happen on saturday with Nobz on bikes, 4 of them with 2 wounds apiece, died in 2 shooting phases to a marine squad with a heavy bolter.
The trick to figuring out a good kill team is finding the right balance of individual ability and number of models. Destroyers are incredibly capable, but are only able to shoot one unit per destroyer per round, so will get swamped by high model count kill teams, and their high price means you'll have very few of them. Compare them to Tomb blades who come in about half the cost of a destroyer, are arguably as effective at shooting, and point for point are tougher than destroyers. For marines the model to beat in KT is the scout, for necrons it's the tomb blades.
I mention this only for completeness since your list isn't OP, but the only other concern when making a list is will it be fun to play against. Kill team is less balanced than 40k, the restrictions on slots and armor value leave a lot of units without a counter, and unfortunately that has to factor into your list building. A nine tomb blade list is legal and effective, but is probably not going to be a fun one to play against. Anyway good luck!
Constantly being negative doesn't make you seem erudite, it just makes you look like a curmudgeon.
The problem with making a Necron list is all their best stuff is in Fast Attack so you can't really make a mixed team of really good stuff, you're stuck with one really good thing and then filler.
Wanna go Wraiths? Well, you can take 3, then all you've got points left for are Flayed Ones (so no shooting for you, I guess).
Wanna try Destroyers? You have a little more leeway here, but similar situation to Wraiths (though 3x Destroyers and 5x Flayed Ones would make a good team).
Best bet would be Tomb Blades. Most flexibility. Can go anywhere from minimal unit of 3 plus various other support, up to a unit of 9.
Personally, I feel the 3x TB + 5x Praets list is the strongest. 8 fast tough bodies with decent shooting and CC is a no brainier.
skoffs wrote: The problem with making a Necron list is all their best stuff is in Fast Attack so you can't really make a mixed team of really good stuff, you're stuck with one really good thing and then filler.
Wanna go Wraiths? Well, you can take 3, then all you've got points left for are Flayed Ones (so no shooting for you, I guess).
Wanna try Destroyers? You have a little more leeway here, but similar situation to Wraiths (though 3x Destroyers and 5x Flayed Ones would make a good team).
Best bet would be Tomb Blades. Most flexibility. Can go anywhere from minimal unit of 3 plus various other support, up to a unit of 9.
Personally, I feel the 3x TB + 5x Praets list is the strongest. 8 fast tough bodies with decent shooting and CC is a no brainier.
The 3 TB and 5 Praets is my exact list.
I give one Praet Hatred, another Shred, and one TB Ignores Cover. (One has Nebuloscopes and Shield Vanes, another (with Ignores Cover) has Shield Vanes, and one is naked.)
Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne!
list, but I know it just wouldn't perform as well...
(Though, if one were to take it, would you spend the last 10 points to upgrade the Destroyer to a Heavy in case of vehicles, or keep him regular for that sweet sweet S5 AP3 magic?)
Not sure why you used the ???, because TBs pretty much are the best KT unit.
T5/3+ armour jetbikes with Ignores cover and a variety of weapons, the most likely of which is a Str5 AP4 rapid fire gun that always glances AV on a 6.
Fast, durable and able to affect any enemy unit possible in KT. And they are cheap enough to fit 9 into 200pts.
Not sure why you used the ???, because TBs pretty much are the best KT unit.
T5/3+ armour jetbikes with Ignores cover and a variety of weapons, the most likely of which is a Str5 AP4 rapid fire gun that always glances AV on a 6.
Fast, durable and able to affect any enemy unit possible in KT. And they are cheap enough to fit 9 into 200pts.
And on top of all that, also FNP+. And they're a direct counter to one of the other top units in kill team - Space Marine Scouts.
Peregrine wrote: What, you don't like rolling dice to see how many dice you roll? Why are you such an anti-dice bigot?
Tomb blades are undercost, have awesome and inexpensive wargear, so they are certainly the best necron unit in kill team. Are they the best overall unit in kill team, I'm not sure, The problem is the units that would compete with them are hard countered by them. For instance Scouts have great range, scout, infiltrate, can hit at AP 2, and with Camo cloaks can be fairly tanky.
If I was playing SMEQ, I'd much rather fight tomb blades, I always get an armor save, and they have to come into my range to shoot at me. Between infiltrate and scout, SM Scouts could start all over hell's half acer, counter deploy me, and have a turn or two of shooting before I could respond with more than a shot or two.
If I was playing Save 4+ or worse (most horde armies, and SM scout forces) I'd take scouts any day of the week. Tomb blades would ignore my cover and armor, as opposed to occasionally ignoring my armor. Given their speed and guns you could probably expect them to kill about twice as many per round as scouts.
I'm not saying their equivalent, I'm just saying I'd have a hard time making that call.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/11/17 03:53:08
Constantly being negative doesn't make you seem erudite, it just makes you look like a curmudgeon.
I take a Rhino in Deathwatch regularly. They're about the same cost as anything else I could take and provide some options for my otherwise homogenous survivability profile.
adamsouza wrote: Is the Rhino going to somehow hurt the Destroyers ? Umm. No.
Who's taking Rhino's anyways ?
Imagine, for a moment, you're looking at a Grey Knight army. You could spend 40pts on two Strike Squad Marines, get two T4/3+ armour wounds, two storm bolters, and two one-Attack AP3 melee weapons that can go 6" in the Movement phase. You could instead spend 40pts on a Rhino with an extra storm bolter, get the rough equivalent of three T7 wounds with no armour (improved somewhat by being immune to S4- attacks, which real T7 wounds wouldn't be), two storm bolters, and the ability to force the enemy to attack the Rhino to get at the psycannon inside that's shooting at them from the top hatch.
It's a lot tougher for the cost than extra bodies in most lists that can use it, and doesn't come with much of a drop in firepower.
LunarSol wrote: Is the extra Storm Bolter really worth it? Doesn't it have to shoot at the same target as the base one?
It was there to make a point about how you don't lose any shooting by taking the Rhino, it's optional (in practice the durability and the ability to be a heavy weapon bunker is more valuable). They're pretty useful if you're already taking the Rhino to be a heavy weapon bunker since the marginal cost of an entire extra model's worth of shooting is all of 5pts, but it's not enough to take the Rhino just for that and it's far from essential if you can't fit it in.
No offense, but if your taking Grey Knights in Kill Team, I'd be questioning your choice of army instead of it's inclusion of a Rhino. Power Armored GK are considered to be Sub Par in general 40K, and they get to use Psychic powers in general 40K. In Kill Team I'd imagine they are worse.
No offense, but if your taking Grey Knights in Kill Team, I'd be questioning your choice of army instead of it's inclusion of a Rhino. Power Armored GK are considered to be Sub Par in general 40K, and they get to use Psychic powers in general 40K. In Kill Team I'd imagine they are worse.
I would imagine you take a Rhino because most players assume little to no AV, so a Rhino is a decently tough way to hide your army turn 1 and get into decent positions
I don't even play Marines in regular 40K, but have enough for a Kill Team and will probably get a Rhino eventually.
adamsouza wrote: No offense, but if your taking Grey Knights in Kill Team, I'd be questioning your choice of army instead of it's inclusion of a Rhino. Power Armored GK are considered to be Sub Par in general 40K, and they get to use Psychic powers in general 40K. In Kill Team I'd imagine they are worse.
I've used the Rhino bunker once with success, although it was against a close combat oriented enemy. Relentless is also a great option for the on-board heavy weapon trooper.
Follow the White Scars Fifth Brotherhood as they fight in the Yarov sector - battle report #7 against Eldar here!
AnomanderRake wrote: So Rhinos are bad because PAGK are bad now? What are the other six Codexes that use them, chopped liver?
The other six codexes are not paying for psychic powers they can't use, and have a better selection of heavy and special weapons to shoot out of them, so in effect, yes Rhinos are worse in Kill Team for Grey Knights than they are for pretty much anyone else who can use Rhinos.
AnomanderRake wrote: It's a lot tougher for the cost than extra bodies in most lists that can use it, and doesn't come with much of a drop in firepower.
I'll give you that it's likely more durable than another MEQ, but in my experience, I've seen those points spent on Plasma Guns and Missle Launchers, which just seem more useful, especially, and ironically, for taking out vehicles, like Rhinos.
I would imagine you take a Rhino because most players assume little to no AV, so a Rhino is a decently tough way to hide your army turn 1 and get into decent positions
It is also the best way to make sure a Tactical Marine Heavy weapon can be mobile and safe. Depending on the weapon that's huge (aka Grav Cannon).
Those are honestly good answers, I hadn't thought about.
May have already been answered but how do flat upgrades effect squads in kill team?
For example, my renegades and heretics get most of their unit upgrades for say 10pts, and it effects the entire squad. In kill team, would i purchase the squad, then the 10pt upgrade, then split them into single models, or would I (in theory) have to purchase that 10pt upgrade for each member of the squad?
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