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MonumentOfRibs wrote:
Has anyone noticed the wording on the 2d6 attack relic for world eaters? It seems to be that you take a wound for each 1 you roll as part of the 2d6, not in the roll to hit phase.

I opened a thread in you make da call. I'm not entirely sure when it wound you but it might wound you a hell of a lot more than you think.


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 Latro_ wrote:
Does anyone know if the warband on pg46 would allow Kharn as the chaos lord if you were running a WE legion?

Yes, if it follows Traitor's hate. You may take kharn there or in a maelstrom or as a lord of legion command choice.

 Latro_ wrote:
Does anyone know if the warband on pg46 would allow Kharn as the chaos lord if you were running a WE legion?

why not? The standard warband allows it.

Does anyone know if Blood Slaughterers should be allowed to join a Hellforged Warpack In a world eaters legion? I am assuming they can be taken as a KDK war engine similar to taking a lone helbrute there, as they have M/DoK and are CSM compatible per FW faqs, but since they will be contributing to an actual formation, I feel anther step forward is taken. Thoughts?

There are no rules for it.

On the topic of juggerfriends being buffed by nurgle, I just realized that an escort of spawn that gets buffed by blades can get poisoned 2+. Likely re-rolling because of S5
I still haven't checked points, but the units could have eternal warrior, fnp 4+ on T5 or more (endurance), that should be enough to stop anything short of force weapons or D to remove the fnp roll. And then you'd still not instantly die to force.
Potentially three different powers to restore wounds on a unit consisting of 3-4 wound models with T5 or more.
Prescience would be a bit harder to get but possible, and with that, it could have to hit and to wound re-rolls (blades again). In a unit where every model has rage + d6 attacks, many of which are AP 2 at initiative.
Super fast unit due to talisman and with a lord from maelstrom of gore you could even squeeze out 2 more inch charge range for the unit because the rest could still maintain coherency at least. and then attack after piling in.

Could such a unit be viable?


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NightWinds5121 wrote:
Does anyone know if Blood Slaughterers should be allowed to join a Hellforged Warpack In a world eaters legion? I am assuming they can be taken as a KDK war engine similar to taking a lone helbrute there, as they have M/DoK and are CSM compatible per FW faqs, but since they will be contributing to an actual formation, I feel anther step forward is taken. Thoughts?

No. This book put a big dampener on IA13, because for most legions you really want their decurion, but that makes it rather hard to squeeze in forgeworld too. And the only unit we get to replace is a kytan instead of a lord of skulls.
If FW released a faq that let us exchange all kinds of units....zomg. imagine hell blades instead of heldrakes. Dominate the skies on the cheap while reducing leadership in a bubble.

Great thanks, I'm mostly interested in casual fun games but I want to make sure I'm not over imposing something that is not the norm on any opponents I might ask. Of course, I could always run those models as brutes with two close combat weapons

The Hellforged hunting pack (apoc sized) does include the slaughters with their rules (I did get them to use as is, not to proxy as brutes, and for the awesome models) but it's significantly different as it includes drakes as well, is apoc, and isn't in a "regular" dex

I had a funny thought.

Remember the Helcult? That formation of 1 Helbrute and 2 units of Cultists that trade ObSec for Fearless, which becomes Zealot once that Helbrute bites the dust?

There's nothing preventing that formation from being an Alpha Legion detachment. No Marines, no Veterans of the Long War, just a single Helbrute tax for two giant fearless blobs of Infiltrating Cultists.

Technically, the original Kranon's Helguard dataslate is not actually a Crimson Slaughter formation so you could theoretically apply Legion rules to it too. Sadly, that formation is very much a battleforce and the bonuses are silly, but you "could" apply Legion buffs to it, and make them Night Lords or so. Everything gets Stubborn and Fear, and you get a formation hubble of debuffing Leadership and Ballistic skill, so why not toss some extra fear penalties and stealth on top? It definitely doesn't have the same appeal as the Alpha Helcult however.

 Ollivander wrote:
I think my favourite (incredibly situationally useful) upgrade is the alpha legion armour - only useful against ap2 flamers (of which I can only think D scythes...).

super excited about a standard death guard war band with bikes and havocs.

Nightlords's culmative -4 on fear tests looks pretty useful against non marine armies.

word bearers is a shame that their 'troops' slot is just possessed - Games workshop is clearly still trying to push them despite everything. Just give them an extra wound!!

Overall so happy with the supplement!

Glad your happy but just a reminder it says flame weapons. D-scythes are template weapons. Not all template weapons are flame weapons. Currently the armor is only effective against hell drakes and possibly some of the new Tzeentch powers ( I don't know because I haven't seen them) D-sythes will still delete the poor git.

So someone pointed this out in the News and rumors thread and I figured I'm drop it here as I haven't seen it in this thread.

Alpha Legion decurion cultists return on a 4+, they can take Lost and the damned formation as a Aux choice. I'm I reading (and remembering) this right or did AL just get cultists blobs that respawn on a rerollable 4+?

I filtrating hellcult.
Clever! Not obsec, but fearless infiltrating is cool.

 Ir0njack wrote:
So someone pointed this out in the News and rumors thread and I figured I'm drop it here as I haven't seen it in this thread.

Alpha Legion decurion cultists return on a 4+, they can take Lost and the damned formation as a Aux choice. I'm I reading (and remembering) this right or did AL just get cultists blobs that respawn on a rerollable 4+?

nope you should be reading it as two seperate rules XD
cultists in a AL LotD formation dies
Roll one dice for 'Cult uprising'
Roll one dice for 'tide of traitors'

If you roll two 4+'s you just got your self TWO units of cultists.

 Latro_ wrote:

 Ir0njack wrote:
So someone pointed this out in the News and rumors thread and I figured I'm drop it here as I haven't seen it in this thread.

Alpha Legion decurion cultists return on a 4+, they can take Lost and the damned formation as a Aux choice. I'm I reading (and remembering) this right or did AL just get cultists blobs that respawn on a rerollable 4+?

nope you should be reading it as two seperate rules XD
cultists in a AL LotD formation dies
Roll one dice for 'Cult uprising'
Roll one dice for 'tide of traitors'

If you roll two 4+'s you just got your self TWO units of cultists.

I figured that MIGHT be the case but decided to downplay it, as well... thats REALLY good if they both go off, We'll see how the FAQ will treat it.

 Ir0njack wrote:

I figured that MIGHT be the case but decided to downplay it, as well... thats REALLY good if they both go off, We'll see how the FAQ will treat it.

Hopefully an FAQ makes it so that both rules combine for a re-roll, rather than the chance for double units

 Roknar wrote:

 Gordon Shumway wrote:

 Roknar wrote:

 Gordon Shumway wrote:
Just an FYI, the AL cultist bonus stacks on top of the detatchment bonus. So, conceivably, it it 2 units of cultists on two 4+ rolls.

Source?

http://pro.bols.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/traitor-AL-det.jpg

The rule is not redundant with the lost and the damned, it stacks. It is a completely different rule. One is a command bonus, the other is a core detatchment rule. One gets outflank, the other doesn't. Read them carefully, and apply RAW logic.

Add typhus to a cad and you have multiplying zombies if you roll well.

Hmm, yea I would have to agree. Seriously doubt that RAI but so is the rule doing nothing so *shrug*.

Except RAW this doesn't even come close to working. Alpha Legion specifically states no marked units, no unique marked units meaning Typhus would need to be in a separate CAD. Typhus only unlocks Zombies from HIS detachment and only units of cultists from Alpha Legion get to recycle meaning they can't stack since they are not even related to begin with. That isn't even touching on the hurdle that RAW zombies are not cultists meaning if you somehow cheated your way past the initial hurdles you still can only recycle cultists and not zombies.

 Galef wrote:

 Ir0njack wrote:

I figured that MIGHT be the case but decided to downplay it, as well... thats REALLY good if they both go off, We'll see how the FAQ will treat it.

Hopefully an FAQ makes it so that both rules combine for a re-roll, rather than the chance for double units

Hopefully its intentional, fluffy with the whole cut a hydra's head off an all.

Its not 'that' broken. KP's ye not gonna like it. KDK will LOVE it
A savvy opponent will let a unit of them break and run away for the rest of the battle (you could always beam the remnants to death with your own psy powers though XD)
Its a 300pt formation off the bat with a DA that can't infiltrate with the cultists
They're foot slogging back on from a side edge, by the time a unit of them is dead and two come back on (IF you roll 2 4's) its gonna be what another two turns they present anything close to an annoyance/threat by which time the game is midway/close to over

Honestly, I'm not a fan of Typhus, and the mix of Poxwalker Hive and Nurgle now having 6 powers are going to make him even less relevant. 200 points gets you a ML 3 Psyker (that can opt to use other Disciplines) on Palanquin with Spell Familiar, and a Poxwalker Hive. You're T5, FNP, with 4 wounds. The only thing you lose out on is the Destroyer Hive, and Poison/Daemon Weapon. Oh, and you can choose a relevant Warlord trait instead of Fear. Go ahead and take the Power Axe, as with I3, chances are you're striking last anyway.

Plus since you're giving your Cultists Mark of Nurgle, they're now Toughness 4 meaning they actually get a FNP roll against Scatter Lasers...imagine that.

Cultists don't get FNP because they're not VotLW.

I'm talking about the Poxwalker Hive relic, which is 20 points and allows the Sorcerer to turn a unit of Cultists into de-facto Zombies (for the rest of the game) each turn. They lose the ability to shoot or run, but get Fearless and FNP, and they regenerate D3 models at the start of each turn.

And then you can always be cheeky and bless them with Poison...or make them S4 T5...

Artefacts and their Uses

Burning Brand of Skalathrax on Terminator Annihilation Force.

Dimensional Key on Raptor Talon Lord in a Black Legion Speartip.

Blood Mad Chaos Lord from the Maelstrom of Gore using a Jump Pack or Juggernaut to deliver an Axe of Blind Fury on the first turn.

Emperor's Children Lord of the Legion Daemon Prince with the Intoxicating Elixir, for fun mainly.

Anyone also notice how awesome the Glaive relic for World Eaters is? Yeah you lose IC but those benefits and the weapon itself are pretty good. He would be a great bully unit just by himself and take fire from the enemy.

The 2+ save relics all look good on dps of tzeentch .

The mindveil looks great with world eaters. Stick it in a AL sorcerer, buddy with infantry. Never face a turn where you can't get your charge bonuses

I almost read everything here and I still think that the best way to run chaos is the cabal star :( But I am dedicated to this supplement. I thought of a list, although i dont have the points value i think it would be nice. I tried to create a maximum threat overload list with my 2 fav legions : IW and AL. I thought i would use the alpha legion decurion and use as much min/max things. 3 chosen squads with melta. 3 csm with plasma. 2 bike squads with melta. havocs with plasma and a simple lord. tax spawn and then an iron warrior cad with 6x1 oblits and then another 3x1 oblits from heavy support. that list should take care of battle company. if itc lets us take culuxes i would add one in. Thoughts?

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Anyone also notice how awesome the Glaive relic for World Eaters is? Yeah you lose IC but those benefits and the weapon itself are pretty good. He would be a great bully unit just by himself and take fire from the enemy.

yea that one was my go to for my daemon prince! s9 on the charge 6+d6 attacks with fnp and iwnd, i'lll takkkke it

And unlike the 3.5 equivalent, the DP can now have WIngs when wielding the Glavie.

 Roknar wrote:

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NightWinds5121 wrote:
Does anyone know if Blood Slaughterers should be allowed to join a Hellforged Warpack In a world eaters legion? I am assuming they can be taken as a KDK war engine similar to taking a lone helbrute there, as they have M/DoK and are CSM compatible per FW faqs, but since they will be contributing to an actual formation, I feel anther step forward is taken. Thoughts?

No. This book put a big dampener on IA13, because for most legions you really want their decurion, but that makes it rather hard to squeeze in forgeworld too. And the only unit we get to replace is a kytan instead of a lord of skulls.
If FW released a faq that let us exchange all kinds of units....zomg. imagine hell blades instead of heldrakes. Dominate the skies on the cheap while reducing leadership in a bubble.

On that note... I suppose that's a reason to use a CAD alongside one of the great new legion formations. I will be running a Black Legion Spearhead backed up with Conversion Beamer Rapiers for long range firepower.

The fortunate thing about IE:13 is it does make somethings cheap. Like Sicarans.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 luke1705 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I'd recommend just doing cultists in your allied detachment. The Marines really won't be adding anything to the list so you can save some points.

I thought about it, but the marines get fearless, furious charge, adamantium will, rage and counter-attack.....that's 2 attacks base since i swapped out their gun, 4 on the charge at str 5...i'll take that for 35 points

Think about this rationally though. Are they really going to be at the enemy any time soon to make use of those bonuses, or would they likely be stuck on an objective keeping it?

You'll enjoy the saved points in the long run.

Yea lets think about it rationally, are you playing against yourself or a complete moron that will sit in his deployment and take in in the he haw OR might they also have options including mobility and reserves and if they are intelligent will disrupt your back field and force you to back peddle? I am thinking personally I would tear up cultists like wet tissue and own his deployment if that was all the resistance I faced. However, marines out of LOS with fearless that can counter charge my units and hit like a ton of bricks and at the very least tar-pit my stuff and contest will make me at least think about my moves. 35pts is nothing for all the durability and offense they provide.


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Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Anyone also notice how awesome the Glaive relic for World Eaters is? Yeah you lose IC but those benefits and the weapon itself are pretty good. He would be a great bully unit just by himself and take fire from the enemy.

Well it is a relic from the 3.5 codex and I always put it on a demon prince back then and I would now since you don't care about independent character since you don't have it.


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As someone who finished painting an EC army on november 18th for a tourny on the 19th (see my gallery for the army pics) I am super excited for this supp0lement but I think people are suffering from amniesia when they keep suggesting EC got a massive buff. They got a buff in the 6+ FNP and most importantly that their troops CSM gained everything noise marines have for 2PPM cheaper if you don't want the sonic weapons but thats really it aside from some fluffy options and flavor. The combat drugs only work in their detachment which in order to take has MASSIVE taxes in the CWB unless you take the Kakaphoni, problem is the kakaphoni causes them to lose OBSEC. Sonic blasters suck, they could be salvo 4/3 and still would be incredibly situational, they suck because now not only are you paying 2 ppm more then marked marines, you also are paying +3 points for the blaster. Whats worse is you need to take a full 6 units to get the strength boost. At least the plague colony has a decent benefit before maxing the formation, the EC kakaphoni only gets a marginal benefit if you get taxed up the ass paying for mandatory champions on all 6 units. Ugh.

Even looking at the combat drugs most of the drugs along with their mark bonus to initiative are all combat related..... on a shooting army. 2 results help, the toughness and the BS. If I want t5 and FNP i'll play death guard and automatically get t5 alonng with better FNP and relentless.

Heck while we are at it it puzzles me that so many are crapping on the iron warriors because their least important perk the reroll to scatter isn't more then situational. Jesus fellas, they have the SAME FNP boost as EC while getting oblits as fething troops. Their marines are 13ppm rather then 15 for MOS and while they lack fearless they have stubborn lol. Pretty sure unmodifiable ld 9/10 is close enough to fearless. Those oblits and even havocs also gain tank hunter.

I am not crapping on EC, I love them, I just built an army a month ago, all conversions. They pretty much play exactly the same as a month ago besides the nifty relics and the FNP 6+ though. You still want naked min blastmasters in rhinos to fire out of the hatch preferably from a CAD so you have OBSEC. Icon of excess is still garbage on anything but a maxed out bike unit, no way I am running 10 guys in a single unit with an icon that comes to 305 pts for 10 guys with a rhino, two blastmasters and an icon only, slowed expensive for 2 small blasts that can hit a single target. However 160 for 5 in a rhino with a blast master isn't bad at all since you can force multiple pinning checks on multiple targets.

Either EC needed relentless or they needed to make sonic blasters come stock OR be an upgrade for a weapon with a 36/24 salvo 3/2 profile. BTW they used to be similar to that.

What all ingredients for Chaos Superfriends do we have now? I'm thinking stuff that can be attached to a big unit of KDK Hounds since those are the models I've got and it's still the toughest unit with the most wounds that you can attach Chaos IC's to I believe.

I'm assuming unmarked in a cabal are still the best psykers for it.

Then you've got the Khorne Lord with the Blood Talisman (+3" to move, run, and charges)

Then another unmarked Lord or Sorc with the Mindveil (3D6 move can use to move out of combat)

What else?

 Red Corsair wrote:

 Ollivander wrote:
I think my favourite (incredibly situationally useful) upgrade is the alpha legion armour - only useful against ap2 flamers (of which I can only think D scythes...).

super excited about a standard death guard war band with bikes and havocs.

Nightlords's culmative -4 on fear tests looks pretty useful against non marine armies.

word bearers is a shame that their 'troops' slot is just possessed - Games workshop is clearly still trying to push them despite everything. Just give them an extra wound!!

Overall so happy with the supplement!

Glad your happy but just a reminder it says flame weapons. D-scythes are template weapons. Not all template weapons are flame weapons. Currently the armor is only effective against hell drakes and possibly some of the new Tzeentch powers ( I don't know because I haven't seen them) D-sythes will still delete the poor git.

I'm not sure if it technically works, but it certainly seems like it should also apply to the Tau Y'vahra battlesuit's flamer-type weapon.

I don't know what to do with all that salvo too. But the mishmash of melee and shooting is probably the way to go as combat drug's 4 out of 6 results buff cc and T is universally good.
Do they get +str and shred for their noize flamer?

 koooaei wrote:
I don't know what to do with all that salvo too. But the mishmash of melee and shooting is probably the way to go as combat drug's 4 out of 6 results buff cc and T is universally good.
Do they get +str and shred for their noize flamer?

Yea the doom siren is a sonic weapon. I just don't think the kakaphoni is worth it. I'd rather go CAD or CWB and keep obsec. Doom sirens are decent for drive by rhinos already but they pale compared to the blastmaster which doesn't want to move all game since it is 48" range. The +1 strength isn't that great either since it is already in ID territory for t4, shred is ok for those 1's but again, no way that is worth the tax of 6 units and another chaos lord and all losing obsec. I am speaking as someone that playtested the crap out of EC all summer, and the new stuff isn't change much when you are looking at noise marines. What it did do however is make regular marines viable since they are now fearless as well and have access to traditional special weapons, same with havocs and raptors etc. But to me noise marines were always one of the more viable cult troops since they are only 17ppm and that hasn't changed. Personally I like blastmasters, they bust the meta where everything jinks or has rerollable cover all the time, they also pin which is huge so for me this release gave WAY more variety in ways to skin the same cat which is good but EC are by no means second to death guard. Personally I think world eaters alpha legion and iron warriors are ahead of EC who tie with black legion. Word bearers I havn't decided on yet, too many people have written them off. To me their relics work VERY well on demon princes but also don't forget they can take marks, meaning they also can take the axe of blind fury. You could take an AOBF demon prince as well as won with their relic crozius and even a third with the black mace rocking different marks summoning pink horrors. But I am not sure how well they will work yet.