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I've noticed most people don't care if you land within an inch of an enemy, as long as you can place them decently without it becoming a mess, or without having to move models or terrain out of the way.

But I will notice there are players who watch every step as you begin placing units from deep strike/summoning, they carefully look to see if any base comes within the holy sacred one inch of another model. I usually just let opponents drop their stuff down unless it HAS to land on another model. Other than that, I don't care. Being anal about .3 of an inch could cost someone the game, as the mishap could destroy a 500 point unit. I just don't want to be that guy.

Personally I hate the deep strike rules.

Then don't deep strike your stuff.

Being within an inch is a huge advantage for most of the stuff that deepstrikes since there's basically no way for them to fail their charge next turn and they haven't had to get shot walking up the field nor pay an exorbitant amount for an assault transport. With great reward comes great risk (unless you're vanilla marines, then it's just great reward for no risk).

Might as well not roll for reserves and have everything come on turn 2 while you're at it.

there's basically no way for them to fail their charge next turn

I don't follow this at all. It's no different than being 1.5 inches from something.

Half of the stuff I deep strike doesn't even charge the turn after.

A player places a unit 6" away to deepstrike so they get in melta range if they don´t scatter. They scatter 5" they should now have to peril as something will be within 1". The optimal range is usually 7" away from danger to be safe (but that is out of melta range). Do you care abaout that 1" now. If you don´t then I will use the melta rule when 7" away.

Honestly I don't like the 1 inch rule. In this game 1 inch represents something like 10 feet so it's pretty stupid.

 rawne2510 wrote:
Do you care abaout that 1" now. If you don´t then I will use the melta rule when 7" away.

That makes absolutely no sense.

Honestly I don't like the 1 inch rule. In this game 1 inch represents something like 10 feet so it's pretty stupid.

It's pointless. If they aren't in base to base contact, then who cares. 40k is chocked full of restrictive rules that do nothing but clutter the game up.

If you're within 1", then you're within 1" and mishap. That's like saying "I don't like missing on 2s, so I'm going to ignore it and say I only miss on 1s."

Yup.

If you're within 1", you take that Mishap roll - because them's the rules.

The 1" buffer is there to dissuade close range deepstrike. Ignoring it isn't good sportsmanship, it's your opponent cheating.

Consider this. Downsides to Deep Strike? Most of the time, you can't assault after, so you're a sitting duck for a turn - and there's the chance something will go Pete Tong and you lose the entire unit, or it winds up well out of harms way.

Upsides? You don't have to slog it across the board. You save points on transports that you otherwise might've needed to avoid the footslogging. You can use it to react to your opponents deployment, potentially seizing poorly or undefended objectives.

Now, if it's the merest fraction of a fraction (a baw hair, as my Dad would say) of it being within 1"? That's when good sportsmanship comes in. But 0.3" simply isn't that, and thus enjoy your roll on the Mishap table, and perhaps next time try to pick a less risky deepstrike point, yeah?

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yup.

If you're within 1", you take that Mishap roll - because them's the rules.

The 1" buffer is there to dissuade close range deepstrike. Ignoring it isn't good sportsmanship, it's your opponent cheating.

Consider this. Downsides to Deep Strike? Most of the time, you can't assault after, so you're a sitting duck for a turn - and there's the chance something will go Pete Tong and you lose the entire unit, or it winds up well out of harms way.

Upsides? You don't have to slog it across the board. You save points on transports that you otherwise might've needed to avoid the footslogging. You can use it to react to your opponents deployment, potentially seizing poorly or undefended objectives.

Now, if it's the merest fraction of a fraction (a baw hair, as my Dad would say) of it being within 1"? That's when good sportsmanship comes in. But 0.3" simply isn't that, and thus enjoy your roll on the Mishap table, and perhaps next time try to pick a less risky deepstrike point, yeah?

The biggest thing is it makes Melta even stronger. Deep Striking a unit in and landing outside Melta range is devastating, as that unit is usually toast next turn.

I wasn't saying landing within an inch of a unit was acceptable.

Only that if a AN ATOM OF ONE BASE IS BARELY WITHIN AN INCH of another model, I just let it slide.

When there are models clustered everywhere, and we are trying to get the models placed so we can move through the game, I just don't care if it's perfectly exact.

It just seems like utter BS if just a small smidget of one base is within an inch of another model, then the ENTIRE UNIT HAS TO GO.

The rules should be re-written so that only the models that must be placed within an inch are lost/destroyed (or the unit can choose to go into reserve). Something to that effect.

Well you can't be within 1" of an enemy unit normally, so why should deep striking be an exception?

If you are clearly within 1", then Mishap occurs. If there is debate whether you are within 1", I'd let it fly in casual games and roll-of in tourney games. That's really the only fair way to do it.

 Galef wrote:
If you are clearly within 1", then Mishap occurs. If there is debate whether you are within 1", I'd let it fly in casual games and roll-of in tourney games. That's really the only fair way to do it.

That's basically all I was saying. The problem I've noticed comes down to the initial measure from the spot you were supposed to land. When there is a ton of models/terrain in the way (and when you are trying to keep the game moving), just measuring off even a fraction of an inch incorrectly (either from where they were supposed to land, or where they are NOW landing), can cause this situation to occur. I look back at the original landing spot and realize maybe I measured over too far (or not far enough) because of all the junk in the way.

This is why I mentioned I am not anal about where it scatters. I know nothing is exact. It's not a computer simulation.

I have the same leniency with scattering blast templates, etc.

The objective of the game is to win, the purpose is to have fun.

I dont rulefuk my opponents, i let alot of small things like that slide, because thats the way it should be in my oppinion

Usually when my opponent rolls 1 on mishap i say hey lets call that misplaced instead, because i think its lame i dont even get to fight what he is fielding. In return i simpy expect not to be up against tourney stuff. Warhammer is to me more a story that unfolds instead of pure meta chess.

Whitebeard, your initial post didn't say what Galef said at all. You said that you didn't follow the rule at all and don't care about it. Not only that, but you then insinuated that anyone who DOES actually follow the rule is a "neckbeard". Your topic post was extremely inflammatory.

I'm usually not super picky, I think I've let it fly once or twice when a deep striker was maybe within an inch.

I guess if it's a friendly/beginner game, and it's to the point where I have to measure, I'm not going to be too picky.

But if it's a situation where the 10 man squad initial model landed within what looks like an inch, and placing the remainder of the squad is going to be impossible without moving my models, it's pretty clear.

Honestly, I usually don't even have to say anything. My opponents usually are honest about when they mishap without me saying anything.

However, I certainly wouldn't begrudge anyone for measuring and calling out deep strikers for being within an inch, even if it's just barely. Those are the rules.

I would probably extend extra leniency for deep striking things like stormboyz or gargoyles, though. They are usually hard/impossible to actually place base-to-base, so there's a lot more uncertainty.

Deepstriking units have the potential to change the game, and avoid any thought about counter deploying, so there SHOULD be a high risk. Rules are very clear about this. Don't risk it if you dont want to potentially scatter and die (or just be marines and never have to worry, because marines)





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 Whitebeard wrote:

 rawne2510 wrote:
Do you care abaout that 1" now. If you don´t then I will use the melta rule when 7" away.

That makes absolutely no sense.

This makes absolute sense....

So I am gathering here.. Whitebeards unit deepstrikes and the landing mark is say 7" away from the enemy but it is large enough that 1 model in the unit has to be placed barely within the 1" of my unit. I normally would let it slide

If the unit lands closer and you are looking at several models within that range.. then BL to you and roll on the mishaps

tournament .95 inch is to close.

fun game no problem

 Galef wrote:
If you are clearly within 1", then Mishap occurs. If there is debate whether you are within 1", I'd let it fly in casual games and roll-of in tourney games. That's really the only fair way to do it.

This. If it’s close, I’ll generally just wave it off in normal play and let them land. In tournaments, I’ll be a bit more strict.

For the most part, I’d rather just play then break out the calipers for the precise measurements. But the rules are quite clear on the process of DSing. If I choose to be lenient, that’s on me. And if the shoe is on the other foot, and my DS is a little close, I bear no hard feelings to my opponent for calling me on it. It’s his right. But once he starts being picky on things like that, I’m less likely to let him slide on things. But my default is a fast & loose, fun game to keep things rolling.

 Whitebeard wrote:
I've noticed most people don't care if you land within an inch of an enemy

Nope this is a hard rule for me even a fraction of an inch is within an inch for me when deepstriking this is just part of the risk you take when you choose a spot.
Deepstriking is actually quite predictable in terms of chance and I have never faced an opponent who played it otherwise. This isn't much of a discussion.


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I do however frequently make an exception if somehow a feak accident occurs in the first turn of the game that would cost my opponent the game by letting him use a delayed result.

I tend to bring in Drop Pods on the first turn so my opponent gets to set the level of beardiness.
Most opponents are pretty lax about the mm difference so I tend to be as well.

Only on Dakka is following the rules considered beardy.

An inch is an inch. I'm not going to give you fractions. You knew the risk when you deployed there. As others have already pointed out Deep Strike already have a pile of benefits. A lot of reward.

So accept your risk and deal with it. If you put all your eggs in one basket and drop the basket...whoops. That's a risk you knew you were going to have to take and you took it. You may not like the fact it potentially costs you the game but at the same time a resounding success can win you the game.

So you actually enjoy arguing every clipping template?

In a casual game I won't nickel and dime someone if they do the same with me. In a tournament? Not even a millimeter.

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
So you actually enjoy arguing every clipping template?

That's the great thing about these particular rules...they are very cut and dry. Is the template touching the base? If yes, in any amount, it is a hit. Same goes with deepstriking, if you cannot place the model, or its 1" or closer to an enemy, it suffers a mishap. No room for interpretation, its clear and if following the rules when they are this cut and dry is beardy to people, I wouldn't want to play against them anyways.

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
So you actually enjoy arguing every clipping template?

That's the great thing about these particular rules...they are very cut and dry. Is the template touching the base? If yes, in any amount, it is a hit. Same goes with deepstriking, if you cannot place the model, or its 1" or closer to an enemy, it suffers a mishap. No room for interpretation, its clear and if following the rules when they are this cut and dry is beardy to people, I wouldn't want to play against them anyways.

If it's so tight that it's genuinely ambiguous whether or not it's actually within an inch, it's no skin off my nose to give it to my opponent. On the other hand, if it's clearly in range, even by a tenth of an inch, well I'm sorry it that hurts the OP's fee-fees, but it's not like the rules are unclear. It'd be just the same as if a model was trying to take a critical shot, and juuuuust out of range.

Of course, I guess I'm just blase about the whole thing because I've been playing Necrons since 3rd ed, and the number of times I've lost a third of my army due to stupid deep stirke tricks... You either get salty, or you learn to deal with the fact that sometimes you lose out over a fraction of an inch.

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
So you actually enjoy arguing every clipping template?

That's the great thing about these particular rules...they are very cut and dry. Is the template touching the base? If yes, in any amount, it is a hit. Same goes with deepstriking, if you cannot place the model, or its 1" or closer to an enemy, it suffers a mishap. No room for interpretation, its clear and if following the rules when they are this cut and dry is beardy to people, I wouldn't want to play against them anyways.

There's the rub though, especially with borderline rulings - your opponent will take some convincing that it is actually clipping or that you have actually measured with your eyes open.

That's why I use the Drop Pods to find out how argumentive my opponent plans to be on these matters - drop that nice little Drop Pod base template and slide it towards their 1" zones, if they make the tells like reaching for their tape measure prepare to argue every borderline result.
If they don't make any tells slide that pod template back away from the borderline and enjoy the game, most your opponent will want is a look through your blast and flame remplates.

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
Only on Dakka is following the rules considered beardy.

No, it's a problem offline as well. I haven't encountered people that bad in 40k, but I've definitely had people get resentful in X-Wing when I wouldn't let them have range/arc on my ship even though the template/laser line clearly show that they don't. Somehow I'm the bad guy for playing "too competitively" and not letting them take the shot.


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 Dakka Wolf wrote:
That's why I use the Drop Pods to find out how argumentive my opponent plans to be on these matters - drop that nice little Drop Pod base template and slide it towards their 1" zones, if they make the tells like reaching for their tape measure prepare to argue every borderline result.
If they don't make any tells slide that pod template back away from the borderline and enjoy the game, most your opponent will want is a look through your blast and flame remplates.

IOW, try to cheat and if your opponent shows any sign of objecting to you taking a little extra distance to your advantage then argue them on everything? You sound like you're lots of fun to play against.


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 Whitebeard wrote:
Being anal about .3 of an inch could cost someone the game, as the mishap could destroy a 500 point unit.

Great, then I win. Fortunately there's an easy way to avoid this situation: don't deep strike 500 point units close enough to potential mishaps that you could lose the game with a bad roll. I don't see why you think there's any obligation to ignore a mishap (and 0.3" is a large enough distance to measure clearly, so there's no argument that it isn't a mishap) just because the consequences are going to be bad. Would you also ignore a 6 on the damage table that destroys a key unit on turn 1 and potentially costs someone the game? Would you ignore a failed morale roll that sends a key unit fleeing off the table? At that point why even bother playing a game, just play with your toy soldiers and tell everyone how awesome they are.

"If you won't let me cheat, then you're TFG who's taking the game way too seriously!"

wat?

I can't, like, even...