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 ImAGeek wrote:
I've seen some people say 'it's a Saturday, they'll probably make a statement Monday/are waiting for decisions from people who don't work weekends'' surely if you release things on a Saturday, you should have people working Saturdays who can deal with issues like this should they arise? Or release things on a day when people are working?

Through my own personal experience I can say working for a major manufacturing company that produces items for other companies. Plus being a twenty four hour operation there is always some type of management on site at all times.
When something goes wrong, people are called to make a decision, Staff level, Sales, customer service are all called.. But when everyone returns on Monday morning and can see the true damage.. Things change on a dime..(as the old saying)
What was okay over the weekend is now thrown out the window, schedules are gutted and the missing product is now first priority to get done.

I still stand at "let management return a few days at Games Workshop".. I've seen some crazy stuff from them in the last year, changes I thought I would never see.. So this time I am giving the benefit of the doubt;
This will be the true test what the new Games Workshop is made of...

It could be their Chinese supplier under shipped against a hard release date in hopes to back fill..
Also thinking how many wrist bands did they produce for the promo packs?? Everyone of those is a potential customer, Right?.. shouldn't you have matching number of box sets available?

I'm tempted to have a go at recreating the old Necromunda card terrain layout with these kits. Taller levels, support struts instead of bulkheads and a furnace stack instead of the old square tower, but the overall layout should match.

The dumbest thing about this whole thing gw promoted a store campaign and didn't make enough kits to support that campaign. Next dumbest thing is putting certain armies behind a paywall such as guard and have zero ability for people to access those lists when they sold out so quickly. I have a feeling gw expected lost patrol levels of enthusiasm for scouts/boys and didn't realize people want a skirmish 40k game.

Link to step for before and after mission:
http://i.4cdn.org/tg/1491111171788.jpg

I think the people criticizing about the lack of response on the weekend seem to be ignoring the updated Facebook post saying there will be more information soon. I'm not sure what else people expect, even if it was the work week, I'll give them a few day to formulate a plan. Keep in mind even if they want to restock this they surely have to consult with the teams who produce the physical products, get a timetable for production, etc. and those people are surely not working on the weekend right now.

I hope the take away from this for GW is they realize promoting their products at trade shows and conventions creates interest and therefore improves sales, and they adjust accordingly. But most of all, and maybe selfishly, I hope they realize the Necromunda rules set is the best they've ever created and they give us more of it in the future.

GoatboyBeta wrote:
I'm tempted to have a go at recreating the old Necromunda card terrain layout with these kits. Taller levels, support struts instead of bulkheads and a furnace stack instead of the old square tower, but the overall layout should match.

That actually sounds really cool. What do you think it would take for that, maybe 4 kits?

Ahh dammit that makes me want the book more than ever now,really really hope GW listen to there own customers and print some up.

Given the changes and ultimate deletion of FB correspondence, I'd tentatively say things are looking good for either a rule book reprint or a full boxed set reprint.

In short, it's just not in their interest to not do this.

For the printed rules, it's a rare printer indeed that doesn't include additional copies in their quote - even if they sit in warehouse for a while before being pulped, from the printer's point of view (if not the company paying the printer) they're all bought and paid for. So if a reprint demand comes in, you've got stock ready to go right then and there - plus you've got additional copies in case a given run goes wrong.

So whilst boxed sets might be a wee while, rulebooks needn't take that long.

Plus, the page setting and proofs are all signed off, so it's just a matter of making the plates (assuming it's not digital printing which don't require plates, only lithographic need those) your lead times are much reduced, essentially being whenever your chosen printer can fit it in - and that itself is flexible dependant on what then other orders are for, and whether any can justify the additional costs of overtime. Given GW are likely solid customers of A.N.Other & Sons Printers of Wherever, the reprint may take not time at all - depending on who A.N.Other & Sons' other customers might be.

 Starfarer wrote:
That actually sounds really cool. What do you think it would take for that, maybe 4 kits?

Not sure until there in hand. But on top of the shadow war contents probably at least two Ferratonic incinerator sets and three or four of the sets that are mostly walkways, probably more

The biggest concern of course, is that this was planned as a 'one shot' with the single extra pdf on the webpage.

If that really is the case, we're all clamouring for a reprint/reboxing of something that they have no intention of supporting in the future. Is that support likely to change? Other than maybe printing more to make a quick ton of money and have people saying "now GW listen to us", is it going to really adjust their timescale/plans on future releases and any support for this product?

I know that GW are generally in the habit of naming every solo game they release as if it was part of a new line of products, but it seems to me that a completely new boxed set with the same rules but a different bunch of plastic in it might be the way to go. Shadow War: Cytheria or something.

Vorian wrote:

 Dravis wrote:

Vorian wrote:


Core rules look to be exactly the same as the last official version (the one that was free online) - the only real difference as far as I can tell is the 2d6 ammo tests

The scenarios seem to have additional models for Orks in some of the variable missions (eg hit and run) so you'd need to know that

Then there's the new skill that replaces techno (not heard if the others are unchanged)

XP seems to be 1 advance per team per battle, with new recruits needing to play 3 games before they are eligible?

The injury table is just a 1d6 thing now, so you'd need to know what that is

Then just the rate at which you earn caches in each scenario.

The 6 missions are apparently modifications of the Nercomunda core book: Scavengers, Hit and Run, Raid, Ambush, Rescue and Kill Team Fight.
Each player rolls 2d6 before the mission for Hive exploration and subplots, these can give bonuses after the mission.
The winner of a mission gain D3 Caches, loser 1 Cache.
Everyone gets 100pts to spend after the mission.
Advancement is 2d6:
2/3 +1 W or T, 4 +1 S or A, 5-9 New Skill, 10 +1 M or I, 11-12 +1WS/BS.
You're leader must not go out of action if you want to spend caches after the mission.

And it's just one guy that gets an upgrade each game? And max +1 for any stat?

XP is basically a random upgrade called an "advance" (but if you roll 5-9 on the advance table, you can customize what type of upgrade you get by rolling on a "combat" table, an "agility" table, etc, with its own randomly rolled upgrades. Recruits become "troopers" after 3 games, at which point they can receive advances.

There's no cap to how many increases you can get on a given stat, but it's very random what you do get. More than half of your upgrade rolls won't be stat increases at all, but abilities that they gain. So if you happen to roll a 2 or a 3 twice on the upgrade chart, yeah you could get the same stat increase twice. But otherwise, it's not really an issue.

Injury table is pretty simple - when you lose your last wound, fall over, and at the end of your turn you roll a d6. On a 6, you're out of action (and must subsequently roll on a serious injury table at the end of the round). On a 2-5, you stay down and make another injury roll at the end of your next turn. On a 1, you get back up but with -1 WS and -1 BS.

TBH I don't really care if this turns out to be a one shot release or not. The reason for that is that I look at Necromunda and Mordheim and they've survived perfectly well without any company support and in the case of Shadow War all of the models will be available for years unlike the older specialist games. Yes support from the company would certainly benefit things but if the game is good and players like it there's really nothing to prevent it from entrenching itself with the player base. Players will get copies of the rules and most people don't really need the scouts or ork models to enjoy the game, same with the terrain it's very nice but it'll be available separately so having the big box is nice but you can certainly make due without it.

I hope that GW is able to see the demand and potential money here, much like they did with space hulk and "find" some more copies somewhere or do another print run. I think that'd really help the format reach more players. But at the same time it's not the end of the world as Necromunda will be out soon enough. There's plenty of other limited release items that sold through on pre-order day yet they are still available on the shelves. I can still get Killteam despite it being "sold out" for about a month before they got restocks, Space Hulk has come back twice, it's all just marketing hype and I'm not overly worried that this would be a true one shot item, going by GW's past use of "limited" it'd be the first time if they actually went that route.

So in theory if you played for long enough you could have a 20 wound chaos marine?

 NivlacSupreme wrote:
So in theory if you played for long enough you could have a 20 wound chaos marine?

Presumably no stat can go above 10.

 NivlacSupreme wrote:
So in theory if you played for long enough you could have a 20 wound chaos marine?

Each stat can only be upgraded once

Was the sold out thing an April Fools joke, or is it really sold out? If it's really sold out, are they gonna have PDF rules or anything, or do we just have to wait till we can buy it some day?

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:

 NivlacSupreme wrote:
So in theory if you played for long enough you could have a 20 wound chaos marine?

Each stat can only be upgraded once

Is possible I missed that rule somewhere. I know you can only get any given skill once. But I didn't see anything that said that you have to re-roll your stat upgrade if you roll it a second time.

 luke1705 wrote:

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:

 NivlacSupreme wrote:
So in theory if you played for long enough you could have a 20 wound chaos marine?

Each stat can only be upgraded once

Is possible I missed that rule somewhere. I know you can only get any given skill once. But I didn't see anything that said that you have to re-roll your stat upgrade if you roll it a second time.

that last link with a pic of after mission procedures says a character can only get each stat upgraded once.

 Necros wrote:
Was the sold out thing an April Fools joke, or is it really sold out? If it's really sold out, are they gonna have PDF rules or anything, or do we just have to wait till we can buy it some day?

It sold out in 3 minutes, apparently.

They were initially telling people that there would be a digital release of the rules, but that post has since vanished and now they're telling people to "Be watching the community page for an update".

Worth mentioning that right now the only factions you cannot see details for are Guard, Orks, and vanilla Marines since those are in the main book. The rest are free PDF downloads.

Far right at the very bottom of the Advance table. Only Increase each characteristic once, which considering you can only typically advance one member per game unless you're running a super long campaign you wont get to the point where you have nothing but skills to advance. I really want to see what the skill tables look like so i could get good feel for how to advance my Skitarii team.

Why are people talking like GW should be doing furious damage control right now?

They made some stuff, and sold it all really quickly. Now they have an opportunity to earn *more* money if they act fast.

They're not exactly going to be calling a crisis meeting.

It's not like they can just order a new run as a snap decision - wether they want to do one or not they still have to look at costs, how big a run to do, the current runs of production etc. Probably not the call of Billy running the FB page. A quick meeting at the start of the week to check it is doable from a resource point of view and then we are likely to hear.

Atia is saying a 2nd run is planned and they will add an"email me" button on the shop. [its not there yet FYI].

 Bull0 wrote:
Why are people talking like GW should be doing furious damage control right now?

They made some stuff, and sold it all really quickly. Now they have an opportunity to earn *more* money if they act fast.

They're not exactly going to be calling a crisis meeting.

But that is exactly what damage control is. They hyped up a project, it was snapped up too fast so many people that wanted it couldn't get it, and people that went to GW and asked to get more got a copy paste reply of 'its gone, but we will sort out a digital alternative'- which is not what people want.

They need to clear this mess up, otherwise what happens when the next big game comes out- no one will want to bother with it, due to remembering this mess.

Instead, GW have taken down the 'we will fix something' post (no surprising considering how rude and toxic this fan base can be, but beside the point, they could have just removed the bad comments) and are now advertising the thing they want to flog us next (classic BB teams infact) They couldn't supply me with the item I am desperate for yesterday, but they want me to consider buying older models next week? People are already asking in the comments is there any point in buying as they might not be able to meet demand. Of course, this is the made to order thing, so they will make enough to supply, but the damage is done and people are questioning their ability to do what they offer.

This might not be life or death stuff, but damage control is needed desperately, before people loose interest in GW again.

 RexHavoc wrote:
People are already asking in the comments is there any point in buying as they might not be able to meet demand. Of course, this is the made to order thing, so they will make enough to supply, but the damage is done and people are questioning their ability to do what they offer.

GW can't be held responsible for the portion of their customer base that cannot understand basic information, or assumes the worst possible outcome from every situation.

 RexHavoc wrote:


They need to clear this mess up, otherwise what happens when the next big game comes out- no one will want to bother with it, due to remembering this mess.

People have such vivid imaginations.

I find it amusing how deeply conditioned some people are by old GW practices. Hype? I have no idea how anyone could call this rather bog standard release of a product 'hyping' anything, unless you're judging it by the standards set forth by Dark Lord Kirby.

 Kovnik Obama wrote:

 RexHavoc wrote:
People are already asking in the comments is there any point in buying as they might not be able to meet demand. Of course, this is the made to order thing, so they will make enough to supply, but the damage is done and people are questioning their ability to do what they offer.

GW can't be held responsible for the portion of their customer base that cannot understand basic information, or assumes the worst possible outcome from every situation.

No, just for utterly failing to anticipate demand for a product.

Again.

 Dravis wrote:
Link to step for before and after mission:
http://i.4cdn.org/tg/1491111171788.jpg

Seems weird that there's a 100 point cap on the recruits you can add to your kill team after a mission.

So a Tyranid Warrior team will never be able to grow beyond it's starting size, and never be able to replace a dead fighter?

Also not thrilled about unused equipment disappearing instead of going to a persistent armory.

 Altruizine wrote:

 Dravis wrote:
Link to step for before and after mission:
http://i.4cdn.org/tg/1491111171788.jpg

Seems weird that there's a 100 point cap on the recruits you can add to your kill team after a mission.

So a Tyranid Warrior team will never be able to grow beyond it's starting size, and never be able to replace a dead fighter?

Also not thrilled about unused equipment disappearing instead of going to a persistent armory.

Not to mention the Ravener special operative seems to be one wound?

(Btw is your screen name a reference to the stanislaw lem short story?)

They said this in the comments section on FB-
" To be honest, the huge popularity of Shadow Wars: Armageddon took us by surprise too - I mean.. we know it would be a hit, but we are quite taken aback by just how popular it has been.

I can say that right now, there are folks looking into the possibility of bringing this awesome game to everyone that wants it. We have no news on what that looks like, but as soon as we do, we will let folks know on this page."

Zachectomy wrote:

 Altruizine wrote:

 Dravis wrote:
Link to step for before and after mission:
http://i.4cdn.org/tg/1491111171788.jpg

Seems weird that there's a 100 point cap on the recruits you can add to your kill team after a mission.

So a Tyranid Warrior team will never be able to grow beyond it's starting size, and never be able to replace a dead fighter?

Also not thrilled about unused equipment disappearing instead of going to a persistent armory.

Not to mention the Ravener special operative seems to be one wound?

(Btw is your screen name a reference to the stanislaw lem short story?)

It is! And you're the first person in 5+ years of internetting under this name to recognize it.

I also overlooked something in the Recruit rule; you can trade a Promethium Cache for another 100 points of margin. Still means Warriors can never hire a gun-beast mid-campaign, so I guess you'd need to decide beforehand whether you want to go shooty or not.