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"Q - Do you still get a bonus Attack when wielding an extra close combat weapon? And if so, do Pistols still count as a CCW now that you can actually use them even when locked in CC?
A - It looks like you get an extra attack when using a chainsword, but doesn't mention it anywhere else...

Q- do pistols still give an extra attack for being an off-hand weapon, or are they now just getting the Shooting phase attacks? Still an extra attack in the turn that you charge, or does that go away, as well?
A - Well, we have shown a pistol stat line already in the Datasheet article (linked below). The pistol stat line does not say "you receive an extra attack in combat" like the chainsword does, so it is safe to assume that a bolt pistol does not give you +1 attack in combat."

So, thats settles the "did pistol still give +1 attack?"

Plus:

Just propaganda but... I'm curious to see Khorne Berzerker rules.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 docdoom77 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Vryce wrote:

 docdoom77 wrote:
Choppas need to be REALLY good. It seems pretty obvious that the extra attack for 2 weapons has been replaced by shooting with a pistol in the shooting phase, which is bad for Orks.

*fingers crossed*

Maybe they'll give Choppa Boyz (or is it Slugga Boyz..? Not much up to date on Ork unit nomenclature), an extra base attack as compensation. I seem to recall that Orks had more base attacks than most other models anyway, right? So maybe they'll keep that going. Otherwise, yeah, they're gonna be in trouble.

Or they can simply give Choppas their own rule...

Or both. It's not like they can't give Orks extra attacks AND give Choppas a special rule.

Balance-wise, making Choppas equivalent to chainswords would work, but it doesn't fit the fluff. they're big, unwieldy weapons. I imagine they figured something out that makes them work. I just wish we could get some Ork previews of some kind!

-1Ap to represent their weight biting through armour?

This would be bad. It is the same effect as giving bolters rend, which is why they didn't. They tried giving choppas better AP in 3rd-4th and it was a mess. You guys are assuming everything needs to be better rather then cheaper. All they need do is make a slugga boy less expensive then a shoota boy and possibly give him them distinct special rules. I'd say giving slugga boys a rule like "Brutal like Mork" (add your benefit, maybe a bonus to charging) and shoota "cunning like Gork" (adda bonus to shooting) would work as well.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Vryce wrote:

Youn wrote:
The pistol rule will make Grey Knights odd. So, assuming a strike squad member stays at 1 attack.

Since, they don't actually have a pistol. We are going to have to rely on single hits to kill our enemies.

Well, they do have a melee weapon capable of doing D3 wounds on a successful hit. They were also always deficient in that category as they never got the bonus 1 attack anyway. So it's not like they really lost anything.

Don't forget that they might get a special kind of Storm Bolter that is classed as a Pistol instead of Assault, Rapid Fire, or whatever.

Same thing goes for the Sanguinary Guard and their similar wrist-mounted guns.

Yeah, something like the old 'True Grit' rule they used to have that allowed them to use their SB's in CC would go a long way here.

 Galas wrote:

"Q - Do you still get a bonus Attack when wielding an extra close combat weapon? And if so, do Pistols still count as a CCW now that you can actually use them even when locked in CC?
A - It looks like you get an extra attack when using a chainsword, but doesn't mention it anywhere else...

Q- do pistols still give an extra attack for being an off-hand weapon, or are they now just getting the Shooting phase attacks? Still an extra attack in the turn that you charge, or does that go away, as well?
A - Well, we have shown a pistol stat line already in the Datasheet article (linked below). The pistol stat line does not say "you receive an extra attack in combat" like the chainsword does, so it is safe to assume that a bolt pistol does not give you +1 attack in combat."

So, thats settles the "did pistol still give +1 attack?"

Plus:

Just propaganda but... I'm curious to see Khorne Berzerker rules.

What a ridiculous assertion, they don't even have enhanced movement.

Honestly Khorne berzerkers should in effect be Ork boys with better armour, higher strength and -1 rend, and I can think of plenty of things scarier than that.

 Red Corsair wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 docdoom77 wrote:
I wonder if Chainfist will be same as powerfist, but d6 damage?

wounding with it will probably be rolling an extra die per and dropping the lowest.

Currently chainfists are armor bane just like melta. Going by that I'd say you roll two d3 and drop the lowest for damage. Then again it has a chain blade on it now, so perhaps it adds an attack like the chainsword instead.

Why D3? Wounding doesn't use D3s and neither does the melta.

 kestral wrote:
Hmm, generally good, pretty well thought out. Oddly, you might want a chainsword more than a power sword now. I can live with that.

Yea and I like that, makes chainsword wielding nuts great for clearing out a horde while the fancy sword is more for dueling armored opponents.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 docdoom77 wrote:
I wonder if Chainfist will be same as powerfist, but d6 damage?

wounding with it will probably be rolling an extra die per and dropping the lowest.

Currently chainfists are armor bane just like melta. Going by that I'd say you roll two d3 and drop the lowest for damage. Then again it has a chain blade on it now, so perhaps it adds an attack like the chainsword instead.

Why D3? Wounding doesn't use D3s and neither does the melta.

Melta now inflicts D6 wounds per failed armour save, and Powerfists inflict D3 wounds per failed armour save. If a melta weapon was within half its range, it rolled 2D6 for armour penetration, which has been restructed to say that it now rolls 2D6 per failed armour save, discarding the lowest result. Chainfists also rolled 2D6 armour penetration, so extrapolation would say that a Chainfist like rolls 2X for number of wounds per failed save inflicted, where X is the normal number of wounds. In this case, D3

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 docdoom77 wrote:
I wonder if Chainfist will be same as powerfist, but d6 damage?

wounding with it will probably be rolling an extra die per and dropping the lowest.

Currently chainfists are armor bane just like melta. Going by that I'd say you roll two d3 and drop the lowest for damage. Then again it has a chain blade on it now, so perhaps it adds an attack like the chainsword instead.

Why D3? Wounding doesn't use D3s and neither does the melta.

Damage not wounding mate.

@Deadshot
^this, thank you

My bet would on choppas inflicting 2 damage on a 6 to wound.

I'm wondering how multiple melee weapons will be handled. The chainsword rule makes it look like you won't be doing all of your attacks with one weapon anymore

Youn wrote:
The pistol rule will make Grey Knights odd. So, assuming a strike squad member stays at 1 attack.

Since, they don't actually have a pistol. We are going to have to rely on single hits to kill our enemies.

Shush. Your single hits do d3 damage....

 Red Corsair wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 docdoom77 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

Daedalus81 wrote:

 Vryce wrote:

 docdoom77 wrote:
Choppas need to be REALLY good. It seems pretty obvious that the extra attack for 2 weapons has been replaced by shooting with a pistol in the shooting phase, which is bad for Orks.

*fingers crossed*

Maybe they'll give Choppa Boyz (or is it Slugga Boyz..? Not much up to date on Ork unit nomenclature), an extra base attack as compensation. I seem to recall that Orks had more base attacks than most other models anyway, right? So maybe they'll keep that going. Otherwise, yeah, they're gonna be in trouble.

Or they can simply give Choppas their own rule...

Or both. It's not like they can't give Orks extra attacks AND give Choppas a special rule.

Balance-wise, making Choppas equivalent to chainswords would work, but it doesn't fit the fluff. they're big, unwieldy weapons. I imagine they figured something out that makes them work. I just wish we could get some Ork previews of some kind!

-1Ap to represent their weight biting through armour?

This would be bad. It is the same effect as giving bolters rend, which is why they didn't. They tried giving choppas better AP in 3rd-4th and it was a mess. You guys are assuming everything needs to be better rather then cheaper. All they need do is make a slugga boy less expensive then a shoota boy and possibly give him them distinct special rules. I'd say giving slugga boys a rule like "Brutal like Mork" (add your benefit, maybe a bonus to charging) and shoota "cunning like Gork" (adda bonus to shooting) would work as well.

I don't think making Orks cheaper is the answer. They're already dirt cheap and slugga boyz are already cheaper than shoota boys. I don't think it would help. Besides that, people don't want Orks to suck but be super cheap (at least I don't). Their points cost in context to other armies is already fine, but they need to excel in close combat.

Pretty sure that is WAAAYYY too complicated for this edition. You probably get to pick.

Finally we'll get to see chain swords do what we've always imagined they would!

Zustiur wrote:
I'm wondering how multiple melee weapons will be handled. The chainsword rule makes it look like you won't be doing all of your attacks with one weapon anymore

I'm guessing you choose a weapon to make your attacks with and then make all of your attacks, and if you have a weapon that gives bonus attacks like a chainsword you can use those in addition to anything you already have with the primary weapon.

No idea if paired weapons will still give bonus attacks though. If they do then a SGT with two chainswords would be pretty good. 2 attacks base, +1 for 2 ccws, + 2 bonus attacks from the chainswords themselves = 5 attacks on what is basically a regular model. He,d be like a tiny blender if tossed into a horde.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Razdalan wrote:
Finally we'll get to see chain swords do what we've always imagined they would!

RIP AND TEAR,

*ahem*

Yes, I agree, they're a lot closer to what they should be, though they're supposed to chew into things as well so they should be -1 Ap and doing like D3 damage to match the lore. But for balance this is good.

Knights are up and lots of juicy details!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/19/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-imperial-knights/

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/19/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-imperial-knights/

The thunderstrike gauntlet also has the ability to chuck a destroyed Monster or Vehicle at another enemy unit within 9″ to do D3 mortal wounds on a 4+. Splat!

I love it. I-LOVE-IT


And the Titanic Feet appears to be just a weapon like in AoS dragons and all have the "Clans and tail" or those kind of things. No more special rules for giant beasts/Robots.

It's fairly clear +1a for 2 ccws is gone, going by the Q and A

I'm disappointed that the LoW detachment grants +3 Command points. I was sure it would be +0, like the Patrol detachment.

Oh well.

 Galas wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/19/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-imperial-knights/

The thunderstrike gauntlet also has the ability to chuck a destroyed Monster or Vehicle at another enemy unit within 9″ to do D3 mortal wounds on a 4+. Splat!

I love it. I-LOVE-IT

I'm glad corpse chukkin, is still an option!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Bull0 wrote:
It's fairly clear +1a for 2 ccws is gone, going by the Q and A

Still 4 attacks on a sergent for very few points is still good. Cheap as chips is always handy.

That's it, i want 3 Trygons, NOW!!

Confirmed?

Damage table steps are half wounds and then half wounds again (rounded down).

Morkanaut was 18->9->4
Knight is 24->12->6

I'd rather see combat orks get a Mork related rule while shooting orks get a Gork special rule. I am not a fan of EVERY weapon needing a unique ability. A choppa is literally junk metal tied to a pole, if monomolecular (their word lol) edged combat blades that your standard marine carries are bog standard gear I don't like giving trash on a stick a special rule. So I would push for a difference in rule between the two ork troop choices but I would take cheaper combat then shooty before hamfisted gear rules any day.

"the cannon gets D6 shots vs units with 5 or more models"

edit derp nvm im dumbs.

ugh i bet that SH detachment means 2 knights is a no no.... just did my second one for my iron warriors noooo

Just the ability for knights to stride over infantry is so fething cool.

I'm more interested in what it says about Trygons there!

"Multiple attacks each with D6 damage"

I have a feel between that and "Assault from deep strike" they got given, Trygons are going to be ferocious

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Galas wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/19/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-imperial-knights/

The thunderstrike gauntlet also has the ability to chuck a destroyed Monster or Vehicle at another enemy unit within 9″ to do D3 mortal wounds on a 4+. Splat!

I love it. I-LOVE-IT

I'm glad corpse chukkin, is still an option!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Bull0 wrote:
It's fairly clear +1a for 2 ccws is gone, going by the Q and A

Still 4 attacks on a sergent for very few points is still good. Cheap as chips is always handy.

No idea how wargear works now, but in 7e for a sergeant to have two chainswords you'd have to give up his bolter and his bolt pistol, which would be a bit... Limiting

Well the Trygon looks even scarier than before.

The new knights look great! Still massively powerful but now reasonable too.