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Nice to see that they kept the Plague Hulks. Lotta folk were worried that one might end up cut.

I just saw the new rules for Chaos Daemons.

Apparently the whole idea of a daemons appearing from the warp all over the place has been thrown out the window. I guess they all just walk around like people now.

Not to mention they removed the Herald of Nurgle on a Palanquin. It was a really cool thing that they were too lazy to make a mini for and now that laziness has finally gotten the better of them. "Palanquins? That's just for Epidemius. Also, Ku'Gath isn't in the game anymore..." Alright. So not only do I not get to play with my conversion, but whoever owns this thing can't play with his, either.



People with conversions these intense tend to be a little miffed when you remove the units that we spent so much time and money making ourselves.

 labmouse42 wrote:
For what it's worth.
Last night to test out the rules I ran 4 Nurgle princes, some soul grinders, and a few nurgle heralds vs Necrons.
The nurgle princes were complete money. They did the vast majority of the heavy lifting of my army. By the end of turn 5, the cron' player was tabled.

I'm going to run another game today and I'm going to take Be'Lakor and 9 princes in a 2k game vs. marines. I'll let you know how it goes.

Cool thanks!
Sounds like big hitting characters are going to be carrying this edition, in general.

I just noticed while putting some lists together I thought I would swap the Lord of Contagion for Typhus to boost Pox Walkers.

Wait, whats this. Typhus with exactly the same stats, a shooting attack, a better Melee weapon, two psychic powers, and the buff to Pox Walkers is cheaper!!!

Lord of Contagion with Plague Reaper 139+45 = 184

Typus (with all wargear included) = 164

Oversight, or is there something I am missing?

C.Straken wrote:
I just noticed while putting some lists together I thought I would swap the Lord of Contagion for Typhus to boost Pox Walkers.

Wait, whats this. Typhus with exactly the same stats, a shooting attack, a better Melee weapon, two psychic powers, and the buff to Pox Walkers is cheaper!!!

Lord of Contagion with Plague Reaper 139+45 = 184

Typus (with all wargear included) = 164

Oversight, or is there something I am missing?

I am guessing it's an oversight. I was disappointed about this as well, as much as I love Typhus, I was looking forward to making Lord Potus, destroyer of worlds, bringer of ruin



But in all seriousness, I had my Lord of Contagion all fleshed out, Lord Dracul de Vrees, but that idea is benched :(

 lindsay40k wrote:

saint_red wrote:
Possessed and Chosen with power weapons are both really solid CC options now. As far as I can tell it's possible for Possessed to be affected by the Daemon psychic powers since they have the Daemon and <Mark> keywords. With an Icon of Slaanesh and a Herald nearby to cast Hysterical Frenzy they'll rip units to shreds in a single turn.

Hmm, in my experience, the best thing about Possessed was Fleet, and a S6 4A Khornate charge. Fantastic reach, able to be joined by a Juggerlord and extend their re-rolled charge distance... now, they don't get the Icon I made (from an OOP Dreadfleet mini), and my WBs don't get to fill Troops slots with them.

Daemon synergy is very WB-ish, though, so I'll be cautiously optimistic on finding a solid niche for them distinct from melee specialist Chosen - whose access to Power Fists and Icons and Pistols makes them look a better use of vehicle capacity. Maybe the extra inch of movement will pay off.

Possessed have the same stats as Chosen armed with Power Axes except they do D3 attacks rather than 2. As you say, Chosen can take Power Fists or other weapons but they are limited to 5 in a squad. Pistols are honestly so unlikely to do damage against MEQs that it's not really worth worrying about in my opinion. Because Possessed have the Daemon invuln and the keyword I think they slightly edge out Chosen but it's basically a wash.

I also collect WBs so will be taking Possessed to begin with but might eventually buy some 30k legionnaires to paint up as Chosen to bring them as well.

I am just going to use the Lord of Contagion model as Typhus. Why would anyone pay 20 extra points for a model that is just completely worse.

I had seen some amount of balance in almost everything so far but this has me completely stumped. All the Special Characters are cheaper except for Abaddon and Magnus.

C.Straken wrote:
I am just going to use the Lord of Contagion model as Typhus. Why would anyone pay 20 extra points for a model that is just completely worse.

I had seen some amount of balance in almost everything so far but this has me completely stumped. All the Special Characters are cheaper except for Abaddon and Magnus.

I think Typhus will be getting a new model soon, though I will be doing the same. If anyone has a problem with that, I will use the old model who is smaller and therefore harder to be shot at

 Rippy wrote:

C.Straken wrote:
I am just going to use the Lord of Contagion model as Typhus. Why would anyone pay 20 extra points for a model that is just completely worse.

I had seen some amount of balance in almost everything so far but this has me completely stumped. All the Special Characters are cheaper except for Abaddon and Magnus.

I think Typhus will be getting a new model soon, though I will be doing the same. If anyone has a problem with that, I will use the old model who is smaller and therefore harder to be shot at

I have just bought the Box set and a half because I liked thr models so much. Never used Plague Marines before but they are just so disgustingly pretty!

I plan on getting the Nurgle Daemons starter set and extra Plague drones to go running with the Bloat Drones.

For 25pts if you roll a 1 on the moral another one turns up. And I roll alot of 1S. I feel 6 Plague Drones and 2 Bloat Drones should be pretty brutal.

Edit: I changed the list to have two lots of 7 Plague Marines, 14 Poxwalkera, 14 Plague Bearers, and 7 Plague Drones.

Expensive unit at 343 points for the 7, but that is 21 Wounds, and any Moral roll of a 1 gets a full model back. Plus they can advance and shoot, and lastly they will get 7 attacks that can re-roll all Wounds and 28 D2 attacks that can re-roll all Wounds.

Just been to my local GW to try out the new edition.

First of all, dissappointingly, up close I didn't like the new DG models so I didn't pre-order (even if I had liked them £100+ for a starter set!?).

Secondly, Chaos characters are amazing in cc! Someone else was playing with the the new box set so we had a game with the Dark Vengeance set, The cultists, Chosen and Helbrute all died pretty quickly but Kranon and an added Champion of Chaos multched through the bikers, terminators and the Chapter master, they were finally brought down by the DA tac squad. The re-rolling 1s to hit 6" around the Lord was a life saver! Death to the false Emperor was also fun!
We had a second game (chaos vs Tau) where the helbrute and a unit of cultists died pretty quick again but this time the chaos characters and the chosen got into cc and multched through a 10 man kroot unit, half a Tau commander and all of his drones.

I am quite happy with the new rules over all.

So, Chaos Daemon wargear options, or rather lack of options. Anyone else thinking the Daemonic Icons are a waste of points? 35 pts to on average once per game roll a D6 to boost the unit by 3 lesser daemons? Yeah, the math works out but why not just buy 3 more Bloodletter/Daemonttes/Pink Horrors, or 4 Plaguebearers to begin with. Instruments however are useful every turn though, and at only 10 pts you should always take them.

Skimming through the indexes again, I'm noticing the differences between CSM and CD princes.

CSM: T6 W8, which means you can hide them in units! I feel like these guys are what you take if you want a choppy chaos lord.
Be Lakor is also a sneaker at 8W.

CD: T7 W10 (so they can't hide), but they get the fancy proper daemon rules like FNP and charge bonuses.

I kinda wish they called CD Princes "Helbarons" or something, given how different the two are.

 Sersi wrote:
So, Chaos Daemon wargear options, or rather lack of options. Anyone else thinking the Daemonic Icons are a waste of points? 35 pts to on average once per game roll a D6 to boost the unit by 3 lesser daemons? Yeah, the math works out but why not just buy 3 more Bloodletter/Daemonttes/Pink Horrors, or 4 Plaguebearers to begin with. Instruments however are useful every turn though, and at only 10 pts you should always take them.

Because some games you'll do better than average. Risk vs reward.

All the special characters got cheaper. Let's not complain!

Honestly I think my only complaint is that Plague Marines only have 1 attack.

 Kajaki War Pig wrote:
Well for starters, Chosen prices are downright insane now. Only 3 points more for an extra attack, +1 leadership, and way more special weapons type options. The primary reason I could see for taking CSM's would be large squad sizes, but beyond that, there's not much. You'd need to use the Elite-centric force chart obviously, but that will be very doable given the number of detachments these days.

Also entertaining: Warpsmiths. A little pricey, but a couple of them in vics could be very useful to an armord force. Healing D3 wounds, or putting out a mortal wound on a 2+ is substantially better than what they used to be.

I also feel like a single sorcerer, or maybe two will still be useful, it's just not gonna be as overpowering as it once was. I'm definitely gonna throw a jump pack on one and see how he fairs. To be honest he may be a solid addition to a turn one raptor or Warp Talon assault.

The sorcerer plus Icons on raptors can also lead to some fairly brutal stuff. Not sure if Khorne or Slaanesh is the better Icon for raptors. Re-rolling the charge helps ensure more successful deepstrikes, but extra attacks on a to hit roll of five or six is pretty sexy too.

I no longer feel like Raptors are CC unit, more like Seraphin squad from SOB, jump-shoot-be annoying, give them meltas get some shots atvehicles/monsters and try to fight some shooty unit.
We have range and cc Oblits, so I guess we gonna have range and CC raptors.

Question for more rules savy guys, Can I drop Lord of Contagion and than(or next turn) summon some demons on him?

Question for more rules savy guys, Can I drop Lord of Contagion and than(or next turn) summon some demons on him?

Yes, any Chaos Character can summon daemons of their same god. Can't do it on the turn he drops down though. Also, he can't move when he summons, so he'll be stuck standing still for 2 turns, which seems like a bad use for him. Better to do it off a cheaper support character, like a gunline lord, sorcerer, apostate or warpsmith. Or that plague bell guy, seeing as his main job seems to be standing around making noise for his friends.

The return of the Lustwing! Or patience rewarded. Chaos can run our 3.5 Terminator/Daemon Bombs lists again only better!

The 4th Edition CSM codex killed Lustwing:

1. Removal of consolidation into new combats.
2. Removal of icons and personal icons as a means of scatter mitigation for deep striking.
3. HQ units couldn't longer take Terminator retinues.
4. MOS stopped granting fearless.
5. Chaos Terminators couldn't take Sonic Weapons.
6. Chaos Terminators couldn't carry adequate firepower.
7. Chaos Terminators couldn't take two heavy weapon per 5 men.
8. Daemons couldn't be summoned.
9. Daemons couldn't be taken in as your minimum troop requirement.
10. Daemons required a Daemon HQ choice to field.

The 8th Edition either corrects or negates all those issues:

1. Pile in moves can now instigate combat with units you didn't charge and you can consolidate into new combats.
2. The removal of scattering form reserves and guaranteed placement.
3. Characters cannot joins units but cannot be targeted unless they are the closest unit [we will probably still see retinues return at some point].
4. The Chaos Lord, Sorcerer, and Terminator Champions are all LD9 anyway.
5. Chaos Terminators combi-bolters are Rapid Fire 2 giving them more shots at 12", when their drooping in at 9" from there targets.
6. Chaos Terminators combi-weapons are vastly more lethal now that they can fire the special weapon every turn, or even both weapons.
7. The changes to combi-weapons as well as Obliterators correct this problem.
8. Daemons can now be summoned by any character, no longer is a psychic power, and daemons can charge again upon landing.
9. Daemons can again be taken as you sole troop requirement.
10. Daemons no longer required a Daemon HQ choice to field, although you'll want one anyway for their aura abilities.
11. Daemonic Ritual is far more flexible than in 3.5 and doesn't require the sacrifice of a character.

New Synergies:

1. The combination of the Lords 6" aura of re-rolling hit roll of 1, Death to the False Emperor, and the Icon of Excess boosting it to a 5+ roll is brutal.
2. While any Sorcerers taken can't cast power on the turn they land, casting prescience to boost there hit rolls the following turns can turn a combat.
3. Slaanesh Heralds with their +1S to "Slaanesh Daemons" allows daemonettes to wound MEQ on a 4+, and can boost your Obliterators/Mutilators as well.
4. The Masque reduces hit roll to daemonette units within 3" by -1, and if adds +1 to the hit rolls of any friendly unit she's in combat with.
5. While hordes of daemonettes are probably the best unit choice, fiends are very useful since they prevent non-flyers from falling back out of combat.

I know the rules say you can consolidate 3" at the end of a combat but where does it say you can add other units into a combat by coming within an inch?
Tried finding it today but failed.

Anytime you come within an inch of an enemy, you are in combat. I don't think it needs a specific rule.

 McGibs wrote:

Question for more rules savy guys, Can I drop Lord of Contagion and than(or next turn) summon some demons on him?

Yes, any Chaos Character can summon daemons of their same god. Can't do it on the turn he drops down though. Also, he can't move when he summons, so he'll be stuck standing still for 2 turns, which seems like a bad use for him. Better to do it off a cheaper support character, like a gunline lord, sorcerer, apostate or warpsmith. Or that plague bell guy, seeing as his main job seems to be standing around making noise for his friends.

But there is no DS option for Bell guy, so he have to walk....ehhh why no bikes or some demony pony?
Besides Bell guy is made for guiding zombies with his advance reroll so they have a chance to get to Objective in number.

But what saddens me the most is how Marks work, Khorn-good and usefull and fluffy, Slanesh-good usefull and fluffy(first time since 3ed), tzeench- meh but kinda fluffy(could be better), Nurgle- mega meh(If I ever see use for it It will be on Raptors and maybe Chosen/Termies since Mutilators or other CC units that can get that icon in to CC, cant take icon-irony is strong in GW) but fluffy.

I cant see reason we cant take Icons on everything even the vehicles if we pay points for it. If I had like 12+ units that Tzeench icon might give me couple 6, MoS on dakkadakka vehicles like Forgfiend would be nice too, or a Khone Defiler. It make CSM feel diffrent than being spiky marines with broken toys.

 McGibs wrote:

Question for more rules savy guys, Can I drop Lord of Contagion and than(or next turn) summon some demons on him?

Yes, any Chaos Character can summon daemons of their same god. Can't do it on the turn he drops down though. Also, he can't move when he summons, so he'll be stuck standing still for 2 turns, which seems like a bad use for him. Better to do it off a cheaper support character, like a gunline lord, sorcerer, apostate or warpsmith. Or that plague bell guy, seeing as his main job seems to be standing around making noise for his friends.

Also, why aren't you taking Typhus, he is cheaper and better.

I just hope the FW index allows TS and DG access to some of these toys.

Interestingly, there's nothing stopping a character from summoning while he's in combat. He's not moving anyways, so might as well make some blood-sacrifices.

 Quarterdime wrote:
I just saw the new rules for Chaos Daemons.

Apparently the whole idea of a daemons appearing from the warp all over the place has been thrown out the window. I guess they all just walk around like people now.

Not to mention they removed the Herald of Nurgle on a Palanquin. It was a really cool thing that they were too lazy to make a mini for and now that laziness has finally gotten the better of them. "Palanquins? That's just for Epidemius. Also, Ku'Gath isn't in the game anymore..." Alright. So not only do I not get to play with my conversion, but whoever owns this thing can't play with his, either.

Spoiler:

People with conversions these intense tend to be a little miffed when you remove the units that we spent so much time and money making ourselves.

Chaos Daemons get Icons that restore Units on Battle shock rolls of 1. Find ways to improve your LD rolls, and you will have Daemons popping in from the warp everyturn.

 Quarterdime wrote:
I just saw the new rules for Chaos Daemons.

Apparently the whole idea of a daemons appearing from the warp all over the place has been thrown out the window. I guess they all just walk around like people now.

Not to mention they removed the Herald of Nurgle on a Palanquin. It was a really cool thing that they were too lazy to make a mini for and now that laziness has finally gotten the better of them. "Palanquins? That's just for Epidemius. Also, Ku'Gath isn't in the game anymore..." Alright. So not only do I not get to play with my conversion, but whoever owns this thing can't play with his, either.

Spoiler:

People with conversions these intense tend to be a little miffed when you remove the units that we spent so much time and money making ourselves.

proabably they will be back when demon codex will be out.

 Rippy wrote:
Forge World List:

No more Chaos Knights only Renegades?

 D6Damager wrote:

 Rippy wrote:
Forge World List:

No more Chaos Knights only Renegades?

Won't that be in regular chaos index?

The renegade knights might have rules to dedicate them to a god, who knows.

 Roknar wrote:
The renegade knights might have rules to dedicate them to a god, who knows.

They don't have that option in the index. The Chaos Knight is a Forgeworld kit.