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2018/01/09 12:32:30
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
Yeah, my tzaangor squad is 1 unit of tzaangors, 1 box of Kairic Acolytes, and I mix them together to form a 30 man tzaangor blo, with the idea that they're just warp-tainted, heavily mutated cultists, some more than others.
"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"
2018/01/10 06:42:01
Subject: Re:All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
We now have almost as many Gor units as we do TS units...
Yeah this is BS.
Can't wait to see the overpriced points cost of these new units.
I'm actually fine with it. The Sons are supposed to be a devastated Legion that's a pale shadow of what it used to be in terms of numbers (as opposed to the Death Guard, who are every bit as numerous as they were during the Horus Heresy). It makes sense to me that they'd leverage Tzaangors and other gribblies like the Mutalith to bolster their numbers.
2018/01/10 18:31:17
Subject: Re:All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
We now have almost as many Gor units as we do TS units...
Yeah this is BS.
Can't wait to see the overpriced points cost of these new units.
I'm actually fine with it. The Sons are supposed to be a devastated Legion that's a pale shadow of what it used to be in terms of numbers (as opposed to the Death Guard, who are every bit as numerous as they were during the Horus Heresy). It makes sense to me that they'd leverage Tzaangors and other gribblies like the Mutalith to bolster their numbers.
Ok, so let's run with that. Then how have they survived? Power? Because their models are not very powerful... their sorcs are not very powerful right now. As survivors, they dont have much of a way to showing it. Why havent anyone taken them out and stole their supplies?
Well, presumably the codex will adjust some of the point issues which plague them, as it did for DG. Think about how great it'll be if rubrics get the sort of price drop PM did.
Out of curiosity, how do people feel about tzaangors given the now confirmed incoming horror nerfs? Are they worth running at their current price, or do they need a point drop as well to be useful?
2018/01/10 20:22:20
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
Honestly even with the nerf to Horrors, I'll be including them. 30 pts for a screen is still fantastic. Not to mention that they still have an inv save (despite it being worse, still better than nothing).
The addition of more Tzaangor units is excellent. It adds far more variety than just Rubrics with different weapons. Not only does it support the fluff, but it adds a different aspect. We will have some pretty cool flying units that no one else has access to. I wonder if we will see Spireguard in some form too. Unlikely, but maybe!
While I am hoping for a price decrease, I don't think we will see one. If we do, it will be very small. Just a feeling, I have nothing to base this on
As to how they have survived, I admit I'm a little hazy on the subject, but that might be the point. Here's a few references:
Spoiler:
Legion Recruitment
The XV Legion was initially created from Terran stock. After his genetic-sons of the XV Legion were reunited with their Primarch, Magnus the Red's pact with Tzeentch was sealed; only one in a thousand Battle-Brothers were spared from the further corruption of the Flesh-Change. Throughout the rest of the Great Crusade, the Legion recruited exclusively from Prospero, despite the fact that the isolated world possessed only a small population with low genetic diversity. Though new recruits were only culled for the Legion in small numbers, many of them were psychically gifted. This resulted in the Thousand Sons being a smaller Legion than was common amongst their fellow Astartes.
Currently it is unknown how the Legion is able to maintain its current strength. It was once observed that the Legion has performed what appeared to be some sort of resurrection ritual for a slain Thousand Son Astartes. This magical conjuration allowed the XV Legion's Chaos Sorcerers to summon the spirits of deceased Thousand Sons from the Warp so they could possess a mortal body. The Sorcerers were able to use either a living body or a deceased shell for the embodiment of the dead souls. It made no particular difference for the ritual which was used, as both were effective. These newly possessed bodies then transformed into reborn Thousand Sons Battle-Brothers, maintaining the always small numbers of the XV Legion even after their fall to Chaos.
(source: http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Thousand_Sons)
Spoiler:
Like all of the Legiones Astartes the Thousand Sons were initially made up of Terran marines. In the aftermath of Magnus' deal with Tzeentch to save their lives, only around a thousand of them were left. For the rest of the Crusade, the Thousand Sons recruited from Prospero, a planet of only limited population (although many of them were psychically active). As a result the Thousand Sons were never a large legion.
How the Thousand Sons currently maintain their numbers is unknown, although they have been observed carrying out an apparent resurrection ritual at least once. On this occasion the spirits of deceased Thousand Sons were summoned from the warp into mortal bodies (whether living or dead making no particular difference), bodies which then transformed themselves into reborn Thousand Sons.
At least one Imperial commentator on the subject believes that the Thousand Sons have a cult network that provides potential recruits for the legion.
SilverAlien wrote: Well, presumably the codex will adjust some of the point issues which plague them, as it did for DG. Think about how great it'll be if rubrics get the sort of price drop PM did.
Out of curiosity, how do people feel about tzaangors given the now confirmed incoming horror nerfs? Are they worth running at their current price, or do they need a point drop as well to be useful?
And if Rubrics get a points drop, then every other marine will be complaining that theirs is overpriced in comparison
SilverAlien wrote: Well, presumably the codex will adjust some of the point issues which plague them, as it did for DG. Think about how great it'll be if rubrics get the sort of price drop PM did.
Out of curiosity, how do people feel about tzaangors given the now confirmed incoming horror nerfs? Are they worth running at their current price, or do they need a point drop as well to be useful?
And if Rubrics get a points drop, then every other marine will be complaining that theirs is overpriced in comparison
I mean that's because Space Marines are overpriced, but it's still pretty ridiculous that the Rubric body is more expensive than the Plague body.
2018/01/11 01:34:01
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
I think the body goes down 1pt and the gun 1 pt as well. Paying 2 points for a bolter even one with -2 app is ridiculous. I also think the flamers should go down 3 or 4 points.
2018/01/11 03:38:43
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
ArtyomTrityak wrote: There are some rumors that GW are going to FAQ Daemons deep strike stratagem - it will not allow to DS Magnus :\
Source?
I know there have been internet people complaining about it before it even happens, but other than that, nothing. It's a knee jerk reaction to something that seems OP on paper. Is it powerful? Sure is! Is it broken and needs to be nerfed? Doubt it. Nurglings, Space Marine Scouts, Eldar Rangers... and myriad other units in pretty much every army have a way to counter DS units.
But it could happen by a simple "this does not work on units with the HERETIC ASTARTES keyword". Only time will tell. In the meantime, once the codex is released, you have minimum 2 weeks of deep striking primarchs and super heavy daemon engines. Enjoy
2018/01/11 04:51:04
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
ArtyomTrityak wrote: There are some rumors that GW are going to FAQ Daemons deep strike stratagem - it will not allow to DS Magnus :\
Source?
I know there have been internet people complaining about it before it even happens, but other than that, nothing. It's a knee jerk reaction to something that seems OP on paper. Is it powerful? Sure is! Is it broken and needs to be nerfed? Doubt it. Nurglings, Space Marine Scouts, Eldar Rangers... and myriad other units in pretty much every army have a way to counter DS units.
But it could happen by a simple "this does not work on units with the HERETIC ASTARTES keyword". Only time will tell. In the meantime, once the codex is released, you have minimum 2 weeks of deep striking primarchs and super heavy daemon engines. Enjoy
Here you go. Every time the FLG guys have said to expect something to not work or to be changed, it has been clarified to not work or changed.
2018/01/11 05:43:11
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
So it is a possibility that it will get nerfed. It still might not because while I have tremendous respect for FLG and what they are doing for the hobby, they aren't GW. I've said it before because it's my favorite example but I think 40+ Genestealers charging first turn are scarier than a DPrimarch.
I admit the DS of something like a Brass Scorpion is a little strange, but for someone like Magnus (who did nothing wrong), is much more believable. Honestly we will just have to wait and see! At worst, we gain nothing. At best, more deep striking! Curse you, time & waiting...!
2018/01/11 09:31:21
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
demontalons wrote: I think the body goes down 1pt and the gun 1 pt as well. Paying 2 points for a bolter even one with -2 app is ridiculous. I also think the flamers should go down 3 or 4 points.
No way they might drop by 1 point if were lucky. If you like to play Rubric Marines then you better strap in because your going to lose almost every game. The change to smite is going to put us in a position of paying 35 points for a model which is worth 25 maybe.
Gors are too expensive right now with the low LD and poor save small arms fire shreds them almost the same as cultists but at almost twice the price and thats if there is no cover for the cultists. This could change with the Shamen though.
What do you guys think it looks like the Rubric is about to go the way of the dodo in this game. Over priced and basically useless when it comes to everything. Aspiring Sorc will have 20 points worth of offensive power that is rarely used. 5 squads will mean your probably wasting 80-100 points of your army or so it seems.
2018/01/12 22:07:39
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
demontalons wrote: I think the body goes down 1pt and the gun 1 pt as well. Paying 2 points for a bolter even one with -2 app is ridiculous. I also think the flamers should go down 3 or 4 points.
No way they might drop by 1 point if were lucky. If you like to play Rubric Marines then you better strap in because your going to lose almost every game. The change to smite is going to put us in a position of paying 35 points for a model which is worth 25 maybe.
Gors are too expensive right now with the low LD and poor save small arms fire shreds them almost the same as cultists but at almost twice the price and thats if there is no cover for the cultists. This could change with the Shamen though.
What do you guys think it looks like the Rubric is about to go the way of the dodo in this game. Over priced and basically useless when it comes to everything. Aspiring Sorc will have 20 points worth of offensive power that is rarely used. 5 squads will mean your probably wasting 80-100 points of your army or so it seems.
You sound like you *really* enjoy the sons
Gors are fine. no small arms fire doesn't kill them anywhere near as fast as cultists What game are you playing??? They are T4 with a 5++ re-rolling ones (assuming they are within 6 of an exalted/Ahriman). If you are competent your large blob has a 4++ re-rolling ones making them almost as tough as a space marine statistically (I believe that is somewhere around a 60% chance to make a save). If they connect with characters that character is probably dead. I own 50 and often field 30+
Rubrics IMO are pretty great but lacking all the bonuses Codex armies get of course were falling behind. I can see them being 18 or so points AFTER gun which brings them near in line with Plauge marines but more dangerous at 12 inchs for us. Once you include a Legion tactic (probably something LD + something else if we can be logical about it for a minute) Warlord traits (some of which may give auras) any auras that GW gives us, And of course Stratagems which will get at least one unique for Rubrics; They will be fine. will they be "tip top tier competitive!" Probably not, but frankly the army list will end up somewhere mid-tier, or mid-upper tier. Their guns are fantastic but they could use some help (it comes with the issue of 8th edition) 8th by in large is NOT an "elite army" edition, so you DO need to mix forces. I regularly take 20 or more Rubrics. I agree that the aspiring DEFINITELY needs a rework of some kind though as they arent really useful past the lucky force weapon "thwap" in combat. wasted spell potential as well.
2018/01/13 04:41:18
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
SilverAlien wrote: Well, presumably the codex will adjust some of the point issues which plague them, as it did for DG. Think about how great it'll be if rubrics get the sort of price drop PM did.
Out of curiosity, how do people feel about tzaangors given the now confirmed incoming horror nerfs? Are they worth running at their current price, or do they need a point drop as well to be useful?
And if Rubrics get a points drop, then every other marine will be complaining that theirs is overpriced in comparison
Plague marines have already dropped in price twice since launch, now 17 from 21. So it doesn't seem unreasonable to suspect they might drop a smudge as well.
2018/01/13 18:23:30
Subject: Re:All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
SilverAlien wrote: Well, presumably the codex will adjust some of the point issues which plague them, as it did for DG. Think about how great it'll be if rubrics get the sort of price drop PM did.
Out of curiosity, how do people feel about tzaangors given the now confirmed incoming horror nerfs? Are they worth running at their current price, or do they need a point drop as well to be useful?
And if Rubrics get a points drop, then every other marine will be complaining that theirs is overpriced in comparison
Plague marines have already dropped in price twice since launch, now 17 from 21. So it doesn't seem unreasonable to suspect they might drop a smudge as well.
Plague marines are seen as less durable then Rubricae even though they are hands down more durable.
Gors are fine. no small arms fire doesn't kill them anywhere near as fast as cultists What game are you playing??? They are T4 with a 5++ re-rolling ones (assuming they are within 6 of an exalted/Ahriman). If you are competent your large blob has a 4++ re-rolling ones making them almost as tough as a space marine statistically (I believe that is somewhere around a 60% chance to make a save). If they connect with characters that character is probably dead. I own 50 and often field 30+
Yeah? 30 man squad? If you lose 16 in 1 turn the rest of the squad runs off the map. 32 wounds in 1 turn against T4 yeah toally doable.
Ahriman21 wrote: Rubrics IMO are pretty great but lacking all the bonuses Codex armies get of course were falling behind. I can see them being 18 or so points AFTER gun which brings them near in line with Plauge marines but more dangerous at 12 inchs for us. Once you include a Legion tactic (probably something LD + something else if we can be logical about it for a minute) Warlord traits (some of which may give auras) any auras that GW gives us, And of course Stratagems which will get at least one unique for Rubrics; They will be fine. will they be "tip top tier competitive!" Probably not, but frankly the army list will end up somewhere mid-tier, or mid-upper tier. Their guns are fantastic but they could use some help (it comes with the issue of 8th edition) 8th by in large is NOT an "elite army" edition, so you DO need to mix forces. I regularly take 20 or more Rubrics. I agree that the aspiring DEFINITELY needs a rework of some kind though as they arent really useful past the lucky force weapon "thwap" in combat. wasted spell potential as well.
There pretty great but there over costed by 2 points? Yes LD bonus perfectly logical to have a LD bonus for an army of Sorcerers. What auras? We are getting 1 HQ which will probably only effect Tzaangors. We might get 1 from traits but thats it. Bet we get at least 1 unique for Tzaangors probably more. If you run more then 2 squads of Rubrics you will be bottom tier, the less Rubrics we run the better our army is. Again, there pretty great but thier Sgt. sucks? Do you know how logic works?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/01/13 19:52:32
2018/01/13 22:23:46
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
SilverAlien wrote: Well, presumably the codex will adjust some of the point issues which plague them, as it did for DG. Think about how great it'll be if rubrics get the sort of price drop PM did.
Out of curiosity, how do people feel about tzaangors given the now confirmed incoming horror nerfs? Are they worth running at their current price, or do they need a point drop as well to be useful?
And if Rubrics get a points drop, then every other marine will be complaining that theirs is overpriced in comparison
Plague marines have already dropped in price twice since launch, now 17 from 21. So it doesn't seem unreasonable to suspect they might drop a smudge as well.
Plague marines are seen as less durable then Rubricae even though they are hands down more durable.
Gors are fine. no small arms fire doesn't kill them anywhere near as fast as cultists What game are you playing??? They are T4 with a 5++ re-rolling ones (assuming they are within 6 of an exalted/Ahriman). If you are competent your large blob has a 4++ re-rolling ones making them almost as tough as a space marine statistically (I believe that is somewhere around a 60% chance to make a save). If they connect with characters that character is probably dead. I own 50 and often field 30+
Yeah? 30 man squad? If you lose 16 in 1 turn the rest of the squad runs off the map. 32 wounds in 1 turn against T4 yeah toally doable.
Ahriman21 wrote: Rubrics IMO are pretty great but lacking all the bonuses Codex armies get of course were falling behind. I can see them being 18 or so points AFTER gun which brings them near in line with Plauge marines but more dangerous at 12 inchs for us. Once you include a Legion tactic (probably something LD + something else if we can be logical about it for a minute) Warlord traits (some of which may give auras) any auras that GW gives us, And of course Stratagems which will get at least one unique for Rubrics; They will be fine. will they be "tip top tier competitive!" Probably not, but frankly the army list will end up somewhere mid-tier, or mid-upper tier. Their guns are fantastic but they could use some help (it comes with the issue of 8th edition) 8th by in large is NOT an "elite army" edition, so you DO need to mix forces. I regularly take 20 or more Rubrics. I agree that the aspiring DEFINITELY needs a rework of some kind though as they arent really useful past the lucky force weapon "thwap" in combat. wasted spell potential as well.
There pretty great but there over costed by 2 points? Yes LD bonus perfectly logical to have a LD bonus for an army of Sorcerers. What auras? We are getting 1 HQ which will probably only effect Tzaangors. We might get 1 from traits but thats it. Bet we get at least 1 unique for Tzaangors probably more. If you run more then 2 squads of Rubrics you will be bottom tier, the less Rubrics we run the better our army is. Again, there pretty great but thier Sgt. sucks? Do you know how logic works?
Okay so first of all; If you build your detachments right you should have an average of about 7-8 command points, 2 points to ignore morale so for the goats its not a terribly big deal IMHO. So that's a moot point the first turn our so of the game. The 30 some odd wounds IS *totally* doable you are absolutely correct, but that is a sizable portion of your opponents army plugging away at (relatively) cheap models. Id be willing to bet that they will get a "herd" stratagem which will make them very fast, they are already well above average speed for infantry. (that is conjecture of course)
The LD bonus id bet will personally be a thing, its to "ignore losses" which Rubrics would in-universe, the Iyanden trait of "ignore past 1 model lost" is a good example of how most people think it will work. If not I am certain something like that will be in effect for rubrics. Something will happen in regards to morale-mitigation.
Id stand a guess that we are getting more then just the 3 auras we see coming. Id bet on it (invul re-rolls, some aura from the shaman, and the daemon prince aura) I doubt we are ending up with just those though we could.
Rubrics ARE good, that doesn't mean they aren't over-costed by a hair. What kind of meta do you play in? It sounds like you obsess over WAAC and point for point efficiency to the point that you want a world-tourney winning army. if so look elsewhere! I *personally* Have had pretty good goes with rubrics on the table. Their guns are dangerous and they output decent damage, once you factor in stratagems they are very dangerous.
The reason as of *Now* that they are weaker is because when the indexs first came out they were pretty great, and when codexs started rolling out that made everything cheaper *and* more dangerous that they started finding themselves on the backfoot more and more. Armies without codexs fighting indexs, the index is going to have trouble and probably lose. Its just the way of things ATM. THAT is my "logic" bud.
You cant look at me with a straight face and tell me that even *If* they stayed the same points cost, (which i doubt) and we then got stratagems and a legion trait, as well as any spells we get, wont give a net positive effect to Rubrics or Scarab Occult overall.
Hardly a big deal when our book is next month. Your negativity is legendary and permeates the inter-webs
2018/01/14 00:59:10
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
I'd also point out the relative durability of PM and rubrics depend heavily on what you are fighting. Against bolters in cover, obviously PM win. Against lasguns in the open, rubrics win. Rubrics generally tend to be better against hordes, who often have low enough str toughness 5 doesn't matter, and the majority of damage will be one. Cover shifts things in PM favor, but both units will likely end up in melee where cover doesn't help and the rubric ability still works, swinging it back around. So they are generally in the same ballpark durability wise.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/14 00:59:33
2018/01/14 02:57:21
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
I've had good success with Rubric Marines in 8th but they definitely don't feel quite right, a points drop to 18 per model and a change to the Aspiring Sorcerers would make me very happy.
I'm not sure what to do with Scarab Occult, while they do better melee than Rubrics they're basically the same in the shooting phase. A points drop is an obvious one.
Curious to see the Legion rule they get.
2018/01/14 03:28:55
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
I've had good success with Rubric Marines in 8th but they definitely don't feel quite right, a points drop to 18 per model and a change to the Aspiring Sorcerers would make me very happy.
I'm not sure what to do with Scarab Occult, while they do better melee than Rubrics they're basically the same in the shooting phase. A points drop is an obvious one.
Curious to see the Legion rule they get.
I learned very quickly to disregard casting with Aspirings. That tiny chance of miscast is enough to deter me from using it blowing up 2+ models.
The scarab occult I have actually had go nuclear kill himself, and then kill the Terminator standing next to him....turn 1 first cast. Fan-freakin-tastic. Praying we get some Perils mitigation lol.
I agree about the Scarab Occult, due to lack of options they definitely need a small points drop (or buff). the guns are great and about right, but the models with limited choice an ability are overcosted. Fixing JUST the sorcerer would help immensely (give him an actual spell to cast, Scarab Occult Sorcerers are actually powerful psykers not random Aspiring-scrubs)
2018/01/14 06:29:41
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
Ahriman21 wrote: Okay so first of all; If you build your detachments right you should have an average of about 7-8 command points, 2 points to ignore morale so for the goats its not a terribly big deal IMHO. So that's a moot point the first turn our so of the game. The 30 some odd wounds IS *totally* doable you are absolutely correct, but that is a sizable portion of your opponents army plugging away at (relatively) cheap models. Id be willing to bet that they will get a "herd" stratagem which will make them very fast, they are already well above average speed for infantry. (that is conjecture of course)
I usually have 10-12 when I build my armies.
Ahriman21 wrote: The LD bonus id bet will personally be a thing, its to "ignore losses" which Rubrics would in-universe, the Iyanden trait of "ignore past 1 model lost" is a good example of how most people think it will work. If not I am certain something like that will be in effect for rubrics. Something will happen in regards to morale-mitigation.
Yes and it will be on the Shaman and will only effect Tzaangors
Ahriman21 wrote: Id stand a guess that we are getting more then just the 3 auras we see coming. Id bet on it (invul re-rolls, some aura from the shaman, and the daemon prince aura) I doubt we are ending up with just those though we could.
Yes we will get 1 more aura some sort of LD buff for Tzaangors.
Ahriman21 wrote: Rubrics ARE good, that doesn't mean they aren't over-costed by a hair. What kind of meta do you play in? It sounds like you obsess over WAAC and point for point efficiency to the point that you want a world-tourney winning army. if so look elsewhere! I *personally* Have had pretty good goes with rubrics on the table. Their guns are dangerous and they output decent damage, once you factor in stratagems they are very dangerous.
Either they are good or they are over priced with a poorly conceived Sgt., they cant be both.
Ahriman21 wrote: You cant look at me with a straight face and tell me that even *If* they stayed the same points cost, (which i doubt) and we then got stratagems and a legion trait, as well as any spells we get, wont give a net positive effect to Rubrics or Scarab Occult overall.
Why would they add anything to buff Rubrics and SOT? They have already done that. They are putting stuff in to buff the multiple Tzaangor units we will be getting.
Ahriman21 wrote: Hardly a big deal when our book is next month. Your negativity is legendary and permeates the inter-webs
Legendary maybe or just realistic they did an enormous release a year ago they, and are porting over a bunch of models from AoS. That doesn't strike me as spend what is needed to get it right it strikes me as they gave us 7 dollars and 2 rolls of toilet paper and we gotta make this work.
I've had good success with Rubric Marines in 8th but they definitely don't feel quite right, a points drop to 18 per model and a change to the Aspiring Sorcerers would make me very happy.
I'm not sure what to do with Scarab Occult, while they do better melee than Rubrics they're basically the same in the shooting phase. A points drop is an obvious one.
Curious to see the Legion rule they get.
I learned very quickly to disregard casting with Aspirings. That tiny chance of miscast is enough to deter me from using it blowing up 2+ models.
The scarab occult I have actually had go nuclear kill himself, and then kill the Terminator standing next to him....turn 1 first cast. Fan-freakin-tastic. Praying we get some Perils mitigation lol.
I agree about the Scarab Occult, due to lack of options they definitely need a small points drop (or buff). the guns are great and about right, but the models with limited choice an ability are overcosted. Fixing JUST the sorcerer would help immensely (give him an actual spell to cast, Scarab Occult Sorcerers are actually powerful psykers not random Aspiring-scrubs)
I don't think we will get anything crazy regarding that probably 6 in total 2 geared towards Tzaangors, 1 for Rubrics, 2 for casting, and 1 for anti-tank (probably replacing the lance ability Exalted Sorcerers had)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/14 06:38:39
2018/01/14 07:58:18
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
The Tzaangor Shaman aura will probably be +1 to hit rolls. That's what it in Age of Sigmar, at any rate (though the effect is listed on the datasheet for the skyfires/enlightened for some reason??? AoS rules are weird).
In other news, trying to build a daemonkin list using the new codex is a serious effort in frustration. Everything in the Tzeentch list is just so much better than what Thousand Sons have to offer, and Tzeentch Daemons aren't exactly this crazy god mode army either. It really drives in the point that the only A grade unit we have is Magnus.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/14 08:02:12
2018/01/14 09:15:50
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
Arachnofiend wrote: The Tzaangor Shaman aura will probably be +1 to hit rolls. That's what it in Age of Sigmar, at any rate (though the effect is listed on the datasheet for the skyfires/enlightened for some reason??? AoS rules are weird).
In other news, trying to build a daemonkin list using the new codex is a serious effort in frustration. Everything in the Tzeentch list is just so much better than what Thousand Sons have to offer, and Tzeentch Daemons aren't exactly this crazy god mode army either. It really drives in the point that the only A grade unit we have is Magnus.
Scarab occult gives you a deepstriking unit you don't have to use CP or that weird daemon summoning rule for, and tzneetch daemons are probably the one daemon faction who doesn't have any particularly impressive melee beatsticks outside the prince.
You can also use tanks or even daemon engines for some longer range shooting and anti tank which still barely exists for tzneetch.
Lastly, psyker HQs to use some of the tasty heretics spells, but that'll probably just be Magnus as you mentioned.
2018/01/14 12:53:05
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
Arachnofiend wrote: The Tzaangor Shaman aura will probably be +1 to hit rolls. That's what it in Age of Sigmar, at any rate (though the effect is listed on the datasheet for the skyfires/enlightened for some reason??? AoS rules are weird).
In other news, trying to build a daemonkin list using the new codex is a serious effort in frustration. Everything in the Tzeentch list is just so much better than what Thousand Sons have to offer, and Tzeentch Daemons aren't exactly this crazy god mode army either. It really drives in the point that the only A grade unit we have is Magnus.
Scarab occult gives you a deepstriking unit you don't have to use CP or that weird daemon summoning rule for, and tzneetch daemons are probably the one daemon faction who doesn't have any particularly impressive melee beatsticks outside the prince.
You can also use tanks or even daemon engines for some longer range shooting and anti tank which still barely exists for tzneetch.
Lastly, psyker HQs to use some of the tasty heretics spells, but that'll probably just be Magnus as you mentioned.
People are reporting that a LoC with the Impossible Robes, the sword option, and the right Warlord trait is surprisingly tanky and does good damage in close combat. It also seems to me that the dagger replacement for a Herald in a Burning Chariot is a nice option. It basically means the Herald will be doing mortal wounds in close combat (-5 AP and ignores inv saves), plus the lamprey bites.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/01/14 13:01:58
2018/01/14 13:56:25
Subject: All is dust! All is dust! 8th Ed. TSons tactics!
LoC is exciting - he looks like a pretty tanky choice now. Pink Horrors are going to be legit - dropping 30 near a herald and a DP, and casting flickering flames on them, results in *serious* dakka. against Boyz, for example, expected kills is 29! This will be a thing in Thousand sons I reckon, as we really need some options to deal with hordes...
Hopefully we'll get some explicit synergy between 1kSons and Tzeentch Daemons in the codex.
Finally, Tzaangors are going to have to be pretty tasty to let them compete with what Daemons can bring to the table now...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/14 14:02:05
