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 ArtyomTrityak wrote:

 Haechi wrote:

 ArtyomTrityak wrote:
Imho terminators are overpriced, deep strriking rubriks should be cool

Points to shots, the Terminators are cheaper than the Rubric, and do not cost CP to deepstrike. I like them better and think they are close to be a must have in the list.

Maybe i played them wrong but usually they deep strike, shoot at something, maybe charge and die next turn because they're too close to enemy army.

You didn't have Glamour of Tzeentch to cast on them, and Weaver of Fate was almost always used for Tzaangors, with a 3++ and -1 to hit drop them in cover your getting 2+ save vs ap -2 weapons and 3+ vs everything else, deep strike in some Tzaangors in front of them and your sitting pretty.

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

demontalons wrote:
Our demon prince got really good, 4++ and 2 powers to cast, exalted are still too expensive for what they do.

Hmmm for 1 cp we can give a vehicle inferno bolts...... almost tempting to field a twin bolter dread now, 114 pts with missile launcher isn’t a bad anti infantry platform.

All in all lackluster strats with the star being the deep strike strat. You won’t see a thousand son army without the deep strike relic or the 5+ reclaim command point one.

Luckily all this is made up for with the psychic powers. Casting the free reroll power first will be critical to staving off the miscasts, as will cabalistic focus.

How do we get a reroll?

The Gaze of Fate power from the Tzeentch discipline. One of your HQ's should be a daemon prince to pick this up, IMO.

Quick question - If I've got 10 warpflamers, do I roll 1D6x10 for the number of shots, or is it 10D6?

I'm assuming it's 10D6, but I couldn't find if it had been clarified in any FAQs.

 ArtyomTrityak wrote:

 Haechi wrote:

 ArtyomTrityak wrote:
Imho terminators are overpriced, deep strriking rubriks should be cool

Points to shots, the Terminators are cheaper than the Rubric, and do not cost CP to deepstrike. I like them better and think they are close to be a must have in the list.

Maybe i played them wrong but usually they deep strike, shoot at something, maybe charge and die next turn because they're too close to enemy army.

I've been using scarab occult terminators in a narrative league right now and even there where the competition isn't that fierce that's been my experience too. My last game with them was especially depressing, they dropped in and killed a few primaris marines, then the primaris librarian that was supporting them charged and soloed the entire unit over the next couple rounds of melee. I'd be more inclined to use them if they at least had force weapons.

I was really hoping to see some options on the SOT - power axes would have been a life saver. But nope, they're still much much better off never getting into CC. To that end, they really want to deepstrike into cover, and cast glamour of tzeentch on themselves. from there they can VOTLW some damage out, and terrain will make it harder for them to be charged. I'm not saying they're great, just that they should be keeping away from cc.

Well, you just need a quick look at their CC weapons to know that's not where they shine.

They are not supposed to shine there, they are supposed to manage to shove off cheap disruption units so they can keep shooting.

There is no terminator unit that can do that, I’ve had good success with my terminators but I never deepstrike them solo, until now I’ve been using a dreadclaw to deposit Ahriman and 9 flamers with my terms.

Terms are only good for providing close range fire support to shred infantry sadly close combat is not where you ever want to be.

With the new dex though there is no reason to ever send them into combat alone. We have the stratagem to deepstrike infantry and we can now deepstrike a demon prince or an infantry unit as well with a relic. If we wanted to we can place up to 3 units anywhere on the board. Units that otherwise would be slow moving.

Pick a flank where the enemy isn’t well prepared and just start to roll it up. It’s particularly effective against large slow moving armies such as orks, or close combat oriented armies. Your 3 units should be able to clear a no charge zone.

My question is if we should start fresh with a new Tactics thread since the codex is out.
It would help people not get confused if they were to look at earlier pages.
Additionally, it may spark new life to this thread if the OP consolidated all the information onto the first couple posts.

I agree. A new thread is warranted

Guys i Need help...

which weapons for my Tzaangors? Pistol +Chainsword or 2 CCW?

I wanna play Tzaangors supported by a shaman and a Mutalith beast.

Tzaangor Blades always, IMO. An autopistol that hits on a 4+ is not competitive with -1 AP.

But arent Pistols on average better than the blades? Cause you can fire them more often than hit with the blades? I have no idea, just my feeling - HELP!

 Arachnofiend wrote:
Tzaangor Blades always, IMO. An autopistol that hits on a 4+ is not competitive with -1 AP.

Well not really; Most of the time those pistols can probably hit on 2's, at least 3's the vast majority of the time.

The Shaman Alone brings them to a 3+. and if i am running a herd ill always have a shaman.

The biggest issue thousand sons had pre-codex is "Volume", I regularly field 20+ Rubrics so the idea of "-1" meaning much when we have so much -2 guns floating around....meh, screw that. I gave them autopistols, beat the enemy twice, and shoot em once.

Following phase if in combat shoot em again then beat em some more!

Not sure if anyone noticed but the terminator sorceror gets a familiar which grants +1 to the first spell in each phase, you could combine that with the +1 psychic test warlord trait and have your first spell be at +2. A poor mans magnus but may be useful for getting off a truly crucial spell when combined with the +2 stratagem as well

A poor mans Magnus is still an A-tier caster ;-)

Did anyone notice with any of the previews or early YouTube reviews if rubric marines had the minimum retirement for Soulreaper cannon match what's in chaos codex or is it still like index where you need 10 before you get the cannon?

demontalons wrote:
Not sure if anyone noticed but the terminator sorceror gets a familiar which grants +1 to the first spell in each phase, you could combine that with the +1 psychic test warlord trait and have your first spell be at +2. A poor mans magnus but may be useful for getting off a truly crucial spell when combined with the +2 stratagem as well

Yeah, that's really awesome. I don't think you make it your warlord because of how powerful you can make a Daemon Prince warlord with the right trait, but a Sorcerer in Terminator armor with the dark crystal is auto include for me. I'd use it as rescue deep strike, holding him for as long as needed, and finally coming in for an emergency warptime, or dark crystal, or whatever.

10 requirement, I'm afraid.

Interesting to hear about your use of autopistol tzaangors, Ahriman21. As you say, I can see them being more viable now with the Tzaangor buffs, but then you're giving up a whole class of viable targets in order to be better chaff clearers. Not sure I like the trade off.

I think the ten requirement will get faq’d. It seems like a copy and paste error.

I’m seriously wondering whether I need 3 casters or 2. Ahriman is still a steal at 131, the DP is a beast and has access to demon spells which we desperately need for that free reroll spell and infernal gateway with the stratagem can be cast on a 6. As noted the terminator sorceror gets +1 to his first cast per turn.

The question is who should be warlord? I personally think the terminator sorceror to get +2 on crucial spells then have Ahriman have the next needed spells and last use the DP for the others. With so many spells and situations I foresee the change spell stratagem getting used a lot.

If we are smart with our spell list we can inflict a huge amount of mortal wounds within a small area, and use our non Psyker units to target chaff

The warlord question is though.
On one hand, the terminator with +2 to first spell is amazing.
On the other, quite a few traits are insane on a prince.

Also, the relic question.
We obviously want the helm and crystal, but who shall carry them?

 BoomWolf wrote:
The warlord question is though.
On one hand, the terminator with +2 to first spell is amazing.
On the other, quite a few traits are insane on a prince.

Also, the relic question.
We obviously want the helm and crystal, but who shall carry them?

The helm goes on someone who doesn't deep strike like a daemon prince, the crystal goes on someone who does like a termi sorc/webway exalted. You want the helm to start off on the table so you can start regenerating CP right away, and the crystal needs to be on someone who can be in position to rescue whatever block needs to be repositioned as easily as possible.

Interested in hearing some thoughts regarding this enlightened idea.....

Now the obvious choice is of course Bows, as statistically they overall seem pretty great both in damage potential (even for D1) and utility, and I will definitely make use of them.

However my thought was regarding spears, 1 point cheaper per model isnt really a big deal, however considering the daemon key word, the flying ability, how fast they move combined with sorcerers and a shaman....I would imagine that we could make a pretty effective Melee module flying around the map.

Take a group of between 6 and 12 enlightened all with spears, Take an Exalted Sorcerer with Seers Bane and the +1 invul warlord trait, take a Tzaangor shaman nearby for bonus to hit rolls without needing to roll for a spell, and the exalted of course provides re-rolls thanks to his lovely new aura.

Of course the enlightened are relatively fragile statistically being at T4, 2 wounds, and 5++ save, so tossing 1-2 buffs on them (see; Weaver and Glamour) would be a requirement.

But this grouping has potential to cause some real havoc on flanks, fly up a flank, deny one side of the table completely to anything that gets in the way, and due to having D2 weapons could feasibly destroy a vehicle or assassinate a character relatively easily.

Each of the Tzaangors swings twice (3 for Aviarch) with a STR 5 -1 ap weapon that is D2 on charge. Meaning the charge turn they would be super accurate and deal decent damage, If they come up against truly "hard" targets (elite squads, powerful tanks) those units will have Ld 9 and the exalted goes in with them and goes to town.

This unit would almost always be the one GETTING the charge given easy access to Warp Time, sling-shoting them across the map to support other sections of the army or harrass another vehicle/character would also be very easy to do.

I suppose the best part regarding that is the *relatively* cheap cost PPM of the enlightened are *relatively* low and their damage potential is very good. High Volume weaponry would be a large concern for the enlightened so making a point of a defensive buff on them would be important.

Thoughts? Comments? Criticisms?

I think it depends on how you plan on using them. If you want to use them alone to hunt isolated units then definitely the bows, but if you plan to use them as part of a larger whole I think the spears give you something the bows don’t and that is D2.

If you’re going to deepstrike some tzaangors and terminators and use the relic to get a demon prince in there as well then I think the spears are a good choice because you’re overloading with dangerous CC units while the termis thin the chaff.

As for where relics go for each I think it depends on what you want to use it for, if you think of the crystal as a way to rescue units then put it on the termi sorc or a jumppack sorc. Personally I see it as a free way to deepstrike a demonprince or a unit of infantry without spending an extra 2 cp.

So demon prince gets the relic and can either commit to the battle or wait til an opening pops up and get behind enemy lines and start picking off backline units. While the termi sorceror has the helm. Yes you lose out on a few cp if you don’t stay ds immediately but I think it’s worth the trade off to get a deepstriking demon prince.

I just ordered 9 Enlightened myself and I'm not sure if I'm gonna give them spears or bows.

The spears are decent and allows them to go after pretty hard targets (vehicles, monsters) and characters.

The bows on the other hand gives them some solid shooting and they can still go after shaff and GEQ's with their normal 3 S4 attacks each. The bow also synergizes well with Fly.
Shoot, charge in, then leave and shoot something else.

Let's do some math:
(Not counting the attacks from the disc as it's the same regardless of wargear. Also not bothering with buffs other than the +1 to hit from the mandatory Shaman.)



Spears against MEQ: 6,33 wounds (12,66 if D2 is utilized)
Spears against REQ: 4,75 wounds (9,5 if D2 is utilized)

Bows (and regular attacks) against MEQ: 9,69 wounds.
Bows (and regular attacks) against REQ: 7,67 wounds.

Basically the spears performs the best against targets where D2 comes into play (Monsters, Vehicles, Characters, etc) and Bows and regular attacks perform the best against targets with only 1 wound.
The bows offer more utility, with their 24" range and the ability to shoot one unit and charge another.

What's best? Neither and both, it's like comparing an apple to an orange, or a plasmagun to a meltagun.
It depends on how you plan to use them and against what.

I'm personally leaning towards giving bows to mine, but I might very well buy 9 more in the future and give them spears.

So today I went to an event using pure thousand sons sans magnus as a final hurrah before the new codex (als0 my first game with my newly painted thousand sons.)

My list was:
Exalted on disk
Exalted on foot
9 rubrics-soulreaper cannon, 2x flamers
2x 5 rubrics with 3 flamers and flame pistol
20 tzaangor: instrument
19 Tzaangor: instrument
5 Scarab termis-soulreaper and missiles.
2 rhinos.

Long story short I went 3-0 and won the event pretty comfortably.
Played space wolves twice and deathwatch once. Weird field with zero xenos at all.

Beat my first opponent 18-10 then tabled both my other foes.

Looking forward to the codex with 6 skyfires and a shaman on my paint station.

Scarabs + Rubric with flamers + Terminator Sorcerer Warlord deepstriking all together = Warptime with +4 to cast for those Rubric ^^. Costs only a couple CP too. It's a fun combo for sure.

Yea but you’re definitely going to have to pick your spot wisely, if you drop them in front of an army they’re goijg to die quick, make sure you pick a side that will be out of range of most guns and that you can clear out within a reasonable amount.

Nothing will ruin your day more than having those units in combat with chaff

You need another dude around to use the cabal casting stratagem though.

No with a rubric squad a term squad and a sorceror you have the additional 2 Psyker