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2017/07/26 12:00:03
Subject: Re:Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Some questions:
1) Am I crippling myself by trying to fill a Brigade detachment? Stormboyz are the main outlier that you don't see in other Green Tide lists... but I needed FA to fill the Brigade.
2) Game 1 lost against Tau. Game 2 lost against Deathwatch/Scions. Neither game was close. Are these supposed to be tough matchups?
3) In both games, Turn 1 when I warpath & jump 30 Boyz into their backline they couldn't make the charge. So they sit there without a Painboy or KFF and all die. Are there some games where I simply shouldn't jump Boyz ahead of the tide?
1) Yes, I think you are. KMKs and stormboyz are not bad options, but your list would almost certainly be stronger with more boyz, and most importantly, a warboss with big choppa on a bike. Or two. The waaagh is the single most important buff for a greentide list. All your units should advance every turn until they can get the charge.
2) They can be tough matchups, but I think they are both mid-tier factions like Orks.
3) Jumping them ahead is fine. They will all get killed, but any shooting directed at the teleported squad is not directed at your main army. But if you jump squads ahead, then the KFF meks become redundant. Swap your bike meks for two warboss on bikes with big Choppas. Swap your KMKs for more boyz. Convert half of your Boyz into slugga Boyz. Ditch zagstrukk, he is only efficient if you have very large blobs of stormboyz that needs the fearless buff.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Bigdoza wrote: Been playing 100% of my games at 2000 points, but need 100 PL to participate in FLGS campaign and finding ALL of my lists way above 100PL at that point level.
Do any units really shine in a PL list?
Try this:
With an outrider and vanguard detachment take:
Boss zagstrukk
3x30 stormboyz
Big Mek on bike with KFF 5x15 tankbustas with 5x6 bomb squigs
100 PL.
Have fun insta gibbing landraiders, baneblades and knights with your 30 bombsquigs and 75 tankbustas. And for extra rage quit encircle his transports with your 90 stormboyz before you kill them, so all his embarked units will be autoslain when they are forced to disembark.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/07/26 12:20:20
2017/07/26 13:06:55
Subject: Re:Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Big Mek on Bike [6 PL, 120pts]: Kombi-Skorcha, Kustom Force Field
Big Mek on Bike [6 PL, 120pts]: Kombi-Skorcha, Kustom Force Field
+ Elites +
Nobz on Bike [28 PL, 774pts] . Boss Nob on Bike: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
Nobz on Bike [28 PL, 774pts] . Boss Nob on Bike: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
Nobz on Bike [28 PL, 774pts] . Boss Nob on Bike: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
. Nob: Kombi-Skorcha, Power Klaw
Some questions:
1) Am I crippling myself by trying to fill a Brigade detachment? Stormboyz are the main outlier that you don't see in other Green Tide lists... but I needed FA to fill the Brigade.
2) Game 1 lost against Tau. Game 2 lost against Deathwatch/Scions. Neither game was close. Are these supposed to be tough matchups?
3) In both games, Turn 1 when I warpath & jump 30 Boyz into their backline they couldn't make the charge. So they sit there without a Painboy or KFF and all die. Are there some games where I simply shouldn't jump Boyz ahead of the tide?
1) Yes, I think you are. KMKs and stormboyz are not bad options, but your list would almost certainly be stronger with more boyz, and most importantly, a warboss with big choppa on a bike. Or two. The waaagh is the single most important buff for a greentide list. All your units should advance every turn until they can get the charge.
2) They can be tough matchups, but I think they are both mid-tier factions like Orks.
3) Jumping them ahead is fine. They will all get killed, but any shooting directed at the teleported squad is not directed at your main army. But if you jump squads ahead, then the KFF meks become redundant. Swap your bike meks for two warboss on bikes with big Choppas. Swap your KMKs for more boyz. Convert half of your Boyz into slugga Boyz. Ditch zagstrukk, he is only efficient if you have very large blobs of stormboyz that needs the fearless buff.
1) So you don't feel Ghaz is enough source of Waaagh? I guess an extra Zhadsnark or Bikerboss allows the tide to go in different directions.
3) But those boys are my main army. If they don't hit their 9" charge then all I've done is siphon off a chunk of my horde to die a painful death without KFF or FNP. So I'm worried that by jumping them I'm flipping a coin, ya know?
2017/07/26 13:30:08
Subject: Re:Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Some questions:
1) Am I crippling myself by trying to fill a Brigade detachment? Stormboyz are the main outlier that you don't see in other Green Tide lists... but I needed FA to fill the Brigade.
2) Game 1 lost against Tau. Game 2 lost against Deathwatch/Scions. Neither game was close. Are these supposed to be tough matchups?
3) In both games, Turn 1 when I warpath & jump 30 Boyz into their backline they couldn't make the charge. So they sit there without a Painboy or KFF and all die. Are there some games where I simply shouldn't jump Boyz ahead of the tide?
1) Yes, I think you are. KMKs and stormboyz are not bad options, but your list would almost certainly be stronger with more boyz, and most importantly, a warboss with big choppa on a bike. Or two. The waaagh is the single most important buff for a greentide list. All your units should advance every turn until they can get the charge.
2) They can be tough matchups, but I think they are both mid-tier factions like Orks.
3) Jumping them ahead is fine. They will all get killed, but any shooting directed at the teleported squad is not directed at your main army. But if you jump squads ahead, then the KFF meks become redundant. Swap your bike meks for two warboss on bikes with big Choppas. Swap your KMKs for more boyz. Convert half of your Boyz into slugga Boyz. Ditch zagstrukk, he is only efficient if you have very large blobs of stormboyz that needs the fearless buff.
1) So you don't feel Ghaz is enough source of Waaagh? I guess an extra Zhadsnark or Bikerboss allows the tide to go in different directions.
3) But those boys are my main army. If they don't hit their 9" charge then all I've done is siphon off a chunk of my horde to die a painful death without KFF or FNP. So I'm worried that by jumping them I'm flipping a coin, ya know?
You don't really want just 1 unit to show up down range, unless you really like to gamble. I'd recommend jumping on the same turn you have kommandos (or deffkoptas, or warbuggies, or w/e) show up, so your opponent is forced to split fire or leave something largely untouched.
Orkz is never beaten in battle. If we win, we win. If we did, we did fighting so it don't count. If we legz it, we just come back for annuver go, see?
2017/07/26 16:08:24
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Turn 1 da jump unit is obviously suicidal in nature.
Shootas work best on these can reach out and touch a lot of stuff nearby.
Then you attempt to charge one threat to your other forces and pile in to as many other units as possible.
If everything else you have is cooking up the field at top speed they won't be too far behind.
Sometimes I drop them on a flank singleing out a big threat using LOS to block off most of their armies view.
Even doing a full wrap of their stuff at max contingency isn't a waste. Unless they have fly they are wrapped up in a nice package for the rest of your army moving up to enjoy.
2017/07/26 16:30:39
Subject: Re:Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Some questions:
1) Am I crippling myself by trying to fill a Brigade detachment? Stormboyz are the main outlier that you don't see in other Green Tide lists... but I needed FA to fill the Brigade.
2) Game 1 lost against Tau. Game 2 lost against Deathwatch/Scions. Neither game was close. Are these supposed to be tough matchups?
3) In both games, Turn 1 when I warpath & jump 30 Boyz into their backline they couldn't make the charge. So they sit there without a Painboy or KFF and all die. Are there some games where I simply shouldn't jump Boyz ahead of the tide?
Regarding 2) while army balance has gotten better, some match ups are still just tough. The Tau have a lot of S5 and S7 weapons, balanced by having lower AP. We have a lot of low armor targets, balanced by having T4 or T6. Unless you are specifically building to beat Tau, or they are trying out something new and fancy, they are always going to have really strong tools to take you down. Make sure you play different folks, or if your friend plays Tau then talk to them about it, see if they're cool playing with a handicap and doing some kind of "face down the horde!" scenario.
3) Banking your whole game on a Turn 1 jump is risky as hell. It could work if you jump shootas, and back them up with stormboyz, so your whole army is in their face and able to do something. What you want to avoid is staggering your units, so they effectively fight 2 small armies one at a time.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/07/26 16:31:23
Tactics are fairly obvious. Kommandos and koptas deploy off table to threaten opponents back field after they've moved around and provide distractions for my boyz. Some wierdboys for jump, warpath, and smite. Mek gunz and lootas hang out with the void shield and provide fire support. Supa-kannon on the other flank so i dont have just one high toughness model, plus it has the range to possibly force my opponent to move. The boyz do what they do. I'd love to field a stompa. I've been converting one from an old GI Joe armor bot, but at 1000 points for the regular or 1200 for the kustom, i just dont see it being worth while. Similar issues with my dread, morka, and standard battlewagon. Loosing blast weapons is super painful.
If you split the Mek guns you can take another spearhead detachment for an extra CP.
Would trade the smash gun for a bubblechukka though - it`s to orky!
3 squads of boys is not too much. Most of the 2000 point lists have them also.^^
If you want a stompa take the small stompa aka Gorkanaut - or 3 of them for the same points.
The rest looks solid.
I know I'm light on mobs, but if I cut anything for more, it'll basically be a green horde. Lucky for me, I usually play with friends/family, so it's not crazy competitive and I can get away with some fun stuff that may not be the most efficient. The bubble chukka looks fun, but it just doesn't do it for me. The way I'm reading the overheat rules for the kmk, it takes 1 mortal wound max, no matter how many dice are thrown. "If you roll one or more hit rolls of 1, the bearer suffers a mortal wound after shots are resolved." Is this how people are playing it? Do you think it would be worth it to switch the wagon for a gorkanought? My usual opponents are Death Guard and Necrons, so most of the shots coming my way are short/medium range and crossing most of the table isnt too troubling. Eventually I'm gonna have to field that kustom stompa, just can't decide how to support it.
p.s. Thanks for the advice
Yeah thats allright, i prefer mixed lists over green tide as well. So 3 mobs should be ok, especially when not playing totally maxed out.
But a good opponent will try to get all your 3 mobs under 20 models pretty fast so keep them as safe as you can.
And yes, it`s just 1 mortal wound for the KMK.
For what do you use your wagon? Embark all buff characters to have less deployment drops?
With ard case you can`t put anything to shoot in it and just for 4 rokkits it`s a bit expensive.
The Gorkanaut can fire most of the weapons on 36" so it would be ok vs Necrons.
On the one hand yut you need to get some points free for that, on the other you get a lot more firepower and he is better in CC as well.
If you switch the void shield for a plasma obliterator you get some extra firepower and your lootas are even more safe inside.
Just reduce them to 10 cause thats the maximum to fire from inside. Or 9 and put the Mek with SAG with them.^^
The gunz have to survive in cover or swap some of them to lobbas and put them out of sight which would also give you extra points.
Don`t think you can fit a stompa in that list because it`s simply to expensive and you have a lot expensive stuff allready.
Btw you play Bad Moons? All that extra gear is nice and flashy.
Here my suggestion:
Orks: Brigade Detachment - 2283 points
Big Mek + KFF Big Mek + Shokk attack gun
Wyrdboy
30 Boyz, 7 x Shoota, 1 x Big shoota, 2 x Rokkit launcha + Boss Nob w. Big choppa
30 Boyz, 7 x Shoota, 1 x Big shoota, 2 x Rokkit launcha + Boss Nob w. Big choppa
30 Boyz, 7 x Shoota, 1 x Big shoota, 2 x Rokkit launcha + Boss Nob w. Big choppa
10 Gretchin
10 Gretchin
10 Gretchin
Mad Dok Grotsnik
Nob with Waaagh! Banner
5 Kommandos, 2 x Rokkit launcha + Boss Nob, Big choppa
2 Deffkoptas, 2 x Kopta rokkits
2 Deffkoptas, 2 x Kopta rokkits
2 Deffkoptas, 2 x Kopta rokkits
For a 3000 pointer this list is seriously devoid of anti tank.
Opponent will have a lot of armor in that high of a point game and this has no consistent way of removing an armored unit per turn outside of crazy hot rolling and Ghaz.
The Gork will be a complete liability. It's 9" radius d6 mortal wound explosion can really hurt and it will get blown up as there isn't anything else to draw lazcannon fire.
Might have something left by turn 5 if you are lucky. If you go second might not be a lot left by turn two. People have a lot of shots at 3k.
2017/07/26 18:04:36
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
With Shootas you don't have to jump them 9 inches away and assault to be useful. I had Snikrot sneak in before the jump to offer the boyz some moral support (because losing fifteen then rolling morale def is gonna cost you Command Points).
I wouldn't consider jumping Meganobz unless I had a whole army of meganobz and deff dreadz. Forcing an opponent to roll random dice to get fifteen to thirty wounds seems harder then giving them the option to just choose their -3 AP weapons. I think it is better to force your opponent to roll more dice as opposed to making solid choices, in most cases, this is why I would choose the Shoota Boyz. Situations can vary though.
I am the kinda ork that takes his own washing machine apart, puts new bearings in it, then puts it back together, and it still works.
2017/07/26 18:14:31
Subject: Re:Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Tactics are fairly obvious. Kommandos and koptas deploy off table to threaten opponents back field after they've moved around and provide distractions for my boyz. Some wierdboys for jump, warpath, and smite. Mek gunz and lootas hang out with the void shield and provide fire support. Supa-kannon on the other flank so i dont have just one high toughness model, plus it has the range to possibly force my opponent to move. The boyz do what they do. I'd love to field a stompa. I've been converting one from an old GI Joe armor bot, but at 1000 points for the regular or 1200 for the kustom, i just dont see it being worth while. Similar issues with my dread, morka, and standard battlewagon. Loosing blast weapons is super painful.
If you split the Mek guns you can take another spearhead detachment for an extra CP.
Would trade the smash gun for a bubblechukka though - it`s to orky!
3 squads of boys is not too much. Most of the 2000 point lists have them also.^^
If you want a stompa take the small stompa aka Gorkanaut - or 3 of them for the same points.
The rest looks solid.
I know I'm light on mobs, but if I cut anything for more, it'll basically be a green horde. Lucky for me, I usually play with friends/family, so it's not crazy competitive and I can get away with some fun stuff that may not be the most efficient. The bubble chukka looks fun, but it just doesn't do it for me. The way I'm reading the overheat rules for the kmk, it takes 1 mortal wound max, no matter how many dice are thrown. "If you roll one or more hit rolls of 1, the bearer suffers a mortal wound after shots are resolved." Is this how people are playing it? Do you think it would be worth it to switch the wagon for a gorkanought? My usual opponents are Death Guard and Necrons, so most of the shots coming my way are short/medium range and crossing most of the table isnt too troubling. Eventually I'm gonna have to field that kustom stompa, just can't decide how to support it.
p.s. Thanks for the advice
Yeah thats allright, i prefer mixed lists over green tide as well. So 3 mobs should be ok, especially when not playing totally maxed out.
But a good opponent will try to get all your 3 mobs under 20 models pretty fast so keep them as safe as you can.
And yes, it`s just 1 mortal wound for the KMK.
For what do you use your wagon? Embark all buff characters to have less deployment drops?
With ard case you can`t put anything to shoot in it and just for 4 rokkits it`s a bit expensive.
The Gorkanaut can fire most of the weapons on 36" so it would be ok vs Necrons.
On the one hand yut you need to get some points free for that, on the other you get a lot more firepower and he is better in CC as well.
If you switch the void shield for a plasma obliterator you get some extra firepower and your lootas are even more safe inside.
Just reduce them to 10 cause thats the maximum to fire from inside. Or 9 and put the Mek with SAG with them.^^
The gunz have to survive in cover or swap some of them to lobbas and put them out of sight which would also give you extra points.
Don`t think you can fit a stompa in that list because it`s simply to expensive and you have a lot expensive stuff allready.
Btw you play Bad Moons? All that extra gear is nice and flashy.
Here my suggestion:
Orks: Brigade Detachment - 2283 points
Big Mek + KFF Big Mek + Shokk attack gun
Wyrdboy
30 Boyz, 7 x Shoota, 1 x Big shoota, 2 x Rokkit launcha + Boss Nob w. Big choppa
30 Boyz, 7 x Shoota, 1 x Big shoota, 2 x Rokkit launcha + Boss Nob w. Big choppa
30 Boyz, 7 x Shoota, 1 x Big shoota, 2 x Rokkit launcha + Boss Nob w. Big choppa
10 Gretchin
10 Gretchin
10 Gretchin
Mad Dok Grotsnik
Nob with Waaagh! Banner
5 Kommandos, 2 x Rokkit launcha + Boss Nob, Big choppa
2 Deffkoptas, 2 x Kopta rokkits
2 Deffkoptas, 2 x Kopta rokkits
2 Deffkoptas, 2 x Kopta rokkits
1 Mek Gun, 1 x Kustom mega-kannon
1 Mek Gun, 1 x Kustom mega-kannon
1 Big Gun, 1 x Lobba
Orks: Forticication Detachment - 190 points
1 Void shield generator or 1 plasma obliterator
Exact 3000 points, PL 178, and 14 CP instead of your 9 CP before.
Wagon use kinda depends on who my opponent is. The supa-kannon is 2d6 at 60" s8 ap-2 and d3, so it can trade blows with ememy armor. The rokkits discourage deep striking monoliths and the like or it can follow the boyz up the table and provide extra high strength medium range shots.
Definitely going to try to reorganize for those extra CP. I like the void shield because it can cover the lootas and mek gunz while my kff mek covers boyz or a vehicle, but I can see the plasma obliterate as a good option. I'd probably go the 9 lootas and sag.
Are the grots good for anything other than screens? They don't feel like they have a good job to do. Is it worth 90pts for the extra cp?
I'm using the goffs key word and the ghaz special rules to represent a freebooter kaptin and krew. I'm working on modifying him to have a pirate hat and a jolly roger back banner. My wife can sculpt and promised to make me a great coat for him.
I used to have an armored column army (old chapter approved list I think) that I cannibalized, so my mek gunz, loota weapons, and all vehicles and walkers are converted from imperial bits. Even my gun krews are re-purposed guardsmen "slaves." I'd like to think I nailed my theme
Edit: Honestly, the biggest reason I want the wagon is I spent a lot of effort making it out of a pair of Leman russes and a chimera
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/07/26 18:18:07
Orkz is never beaten in battle. If we win, we win. If we did, we did fighting so it don't count. If we legz it, we just come back for annuver go, see?
2017/07/26 19:40:28
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Rismonite wrote: With Shootas you don't have to jump them 9 inches away and assault to be useful. I had Snikrot sneak in before the jump to offer the boyz some moral support (because losing fifteen then rolling morale def is gonna cost you Command Points).
I wouldn't consider jumping Meganobz unless I had a whole army of meganobz and deff dreadz. Forcing an opponent to roll random dice to get fifteen to thirty wounds seems harder then giving them the option to just choose their -3 AP weapons. I think it is better to force your opponent to roll more dice as opposed to making solid choices, in most cases, this is why I would choose the Shoota Boyz. Situations can vary though.
Well it's a good thing you could choose to jump manz to a point where there are not so -3 weapons around........
These arguments against jumping mega armor nobs are ridiculous. So far I have heard its not good because they don't have an invulnerable save and only 2+ armor save, and because you have to jump straight at all -3 weapons lol k
2017/07/26 19:45:35
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Well it's a good thing you could choose to jump manz to a point where there are not so -3 weapons around........
These arguments against jumping mega armor nobs are ridiculous. So far I have heard its not good because they don't have an invulnerable save and only 2+ armor save, and because you have to jump straight at all -3 weapons lol k
I understand what they mean though. Versus a Speese Mehreen Player, Deep Striking Meganobz will draw Lascannon or Plasma Cannon Fire, whichever they have nearby, and those shots will drill those Meganobz and easily make their points back on that turn alone. A Single Lascannon will hit 2/3rds of the time, wound 5/6ths of the time and roll a 3+ 2/3rds of the time. So a unit of 4 will likely decimate i not outright kill 3 Meganobz.
At the same time, that goes along with target saturation, (kind of sucks we can only do this 1 time a turn) but if you also have some Kommandos showing up and some Deff Koptas popping around the enemy rear you can probably pull off a good amount of surprise.
Edit: Honestly, the biggest reason I want the wagon is I spent a lot of effort making it out of a pair of Leman russes and a chimera
Ha! I know that feeling. Then just go for it and shoot da gitz.
Are the grots good for anything other than screens? They don't feel like they have a good job to do. Is it worth 90pts for the extra cp?
Screening vs deepstriking stuff and late game objective grabbing.
In maelstrom they are important to get victory points from objectives in your deployment zone so you can bring the rest to the enemy.
But since everybody can hold objectives and you have some shooty stuff you should be allright.
I personally take them often because it fits the Bad Moons and they proved good for me.
But we play with a lot terrain + maelstrom which is both good for grot.
I like your grot slaves count as.
IG is perfect for converting for us orks.
2017/07/26 20:08:56
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
With the turn 1 Da Jump, don't get so aggressive. Put the Boyz in charge range at the closest point to the main body of your horde, then trail Boyz back to get the banner and Painboy buffs. Don't jump if they are all the way pushed back towards their table edge; they are ceding the table and scenario to you, so just take that and stay in KFF.
2017/07/26 20:34:30
Subject: Re:Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Edit: Honestly, the biggest reason I want the wagon is I spent a lot of effort making it out of a pair of Leman russes and a chimera
Ha! I know that feeling. Then just go for it and shoot da gitz.
Are the grots good for anything other than screens? They don't feel like they have a good job to do. Is it worth 90pts for the extra cp?
Screening vs deepstriking stuff and late game objective grabbing.
In maelstrom they are important to get victory points from objectives in your deployment zone so you can bring the rest to the enemy.
But since everybody can hold objectives and you have some shooty stuff you should be allright.
I personally take them often because it fits the Bad Moons and they proved good for me.
But we play with a lot terrain + maelstrom which is both good for grot.
I like your grot slaves count as.
IG is perfect for converting for us orks.
Good point. Thanks, you've given me a lot to consider. I'll give my list a rework when I've got some time
Orkz is never beaten in battle. If we win, we win. If we did, we did fighting so it don't count. If we legz it, we just come back for annuver go, see?
2017/07/26 22:09:19
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
3 Killa Kans with Grotzookas and Deff Dread with 2x Skorcha
Or
3 Killa Kans with Big Shoots and Deff Dread with 2x Claws and Mek.
Rest of the list is Warboss, 2x Weirdboys, 2x30 Boyz with Power Klaws or Big Choppas and 10 Gretchin. (For battalion and possibly Spearhead, unsure whether to keep those Kans separate or grouped).
YMDC = nightmare
2017/07/26 23:07:41
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
LiMunPai wrote: With the turn 1 Da Jump, don't get so aggressive. Put the Boyz in charge range at the closest point to the main body of your horde, then trail Boyz back to get the banner and Painboy buffs. Don't jump if they are all the way pushed back towards their table edge; they are ceding the table and scenario to you, so just take that and stay in KFF.
This. Another disadvantage of Da Jumping into their deployment zone is it puts all their back units in range or rapid fire. If anything, put them on the flank but on the same side as your biggest blobs, overloading that side. The watch your opponent squirm!
2017/07/27 04:07:11
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
3 Killa Kans with Grotzookas and Deff Dread with 2x Skorcha
Or
3 Killa Kans with Big Shoots and Deff Dread with 2x Claws and Mek.
Rest of the list is Warboss, 2x Weirdboys, 2x30 Boyz with Power Klaws or Big Choppas and 10 Gretchin. (For battalion and possibly Spearhead, unsure whether to keep those Kans separate or grouped).
Grotzookas aren't as good as they used to be. I'd go with big shootas or rokkits for the kans and the double claws for the dread.
40k drinking game: take a shot everytime a book references Skitarii using transports.
2017/07/27 08:26:47
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Jumping meganobz could be ok only if you run a mechanized list, in order to let them soak the anti tank. Meganobz are very good against anti infantry weapons since their 2+ and 3W will absorb a lot of firepower before losing a single model. But a single round of anti tank firepower is enough to cripple them badly if not completely wiping them out. A charge from deep strike is difficult, so they will likely get the attention of the enemy for a turn before having the possibility to charge.
I prefer a BW to deliver meganobz to be honest, but if the list has good synergy they may work.
2017/07/27 09:47:00
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
What are the pros and cons of meganobz vs nobz in a mech list? Nobz seem to be having more damage for points but manz are much more durable vs small arms and d2 weapons.
2017/07/27 10:47:40
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
koooaei wrote: What are the pros and cons of meganobz vs nobz in a mech list? Nobz seem to be having more damage for points but manz are much more durable vs small arms and d2 weapons.
Nobz has a durability advantage because they can take a couple of plain nobz and an ammo runt or two for ablative wounds. On the other hand they have a worse armour save.
Meganobz can take twin killsaws which is good, but probably does not make up for their higher price and extra transport space requirements. I think kombiweapons are too expensive.
Nobz also has the advantage, that a min-squad can fit in a trukk with a min squad of tankbustas + two bombsquigs. With meganobz you only get one bombsquig. In a gorkanaut a minsquad of nobz can ride besides a bannernob. Bannernobs buffs both walkers and infantry considerably.
2017/07/27 13:26:09
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
3 Killa Kans with Grotzookas and Deff Dread with 2x Skorcha
Or
3 Killa Kans with Big Shoots and Deff Dread with 2x Claws and Mek.
Rest of the list is Warboss, 2x Weirdboys, 2x30 Boyz with Power Klaws or Big Choppas and 10 Gretchin. (For battalion and possibly Spearhead, unsure whether to keep those Kans separate or grouped).
Ended up going with the Grotzookas and Skorchas.
Killa Kans didn't do much but they did tie up an enemy unit and kept it out my deployment.
Deff Dread was clutch. Skorched some Pox Walkers and threatened the Dark Apostle and caused it not to charge Boyz.
YMDC = nightmare
2017/07/27 17:24:56
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
I'm just waiting for FW to release the mega dread datasheet.
and I don't think dread is our strongest list but I do think you can make it work and be fun.
With something like a
zhardsnark
weird boy w da jump (use da jump on mega nobs)
Bigmek on bike w kff (covers killkans)
a meka dread with kff (covers dreads and gork first few turns)
a mega dread with double supa skorcha and mega charga
2x deff dreads w 3xklaw and skorcha
6x killkans w 6xbigshootas
gorkanaut (place meganobs inside gorkanaut first turn)
3x double kill saw mega nobs
Turn 1 should have the meganobs and megadread and zhardsnark in your opponents face.
the gorkanaut, mekadread and 2x dreads should be dropping support fire and progressing for a turn 2 charge w a 5+ invul protecting them.
The rear line has the big mek on bike, weirdboy and 6x killkans with a 5+ invul dropping support fire and it can also progress down the field if needed.
Everything but the weirdboy is toughness 5 or higher with a 3+ sv and 5+ invul. lots of str5 or better shooting and lots of str8 or higher atks. Issue is low model count (17) and high drops (10). Also has 9 command points to reroll charges or reroll ramshackle or saves.
2017/07/27 17:28:16
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
From the space marine codex news thread, it says that power fists went down 8 points.
For those of you changing an masse to big choppas - how does that 17 point fist compare to the big choppas if the update carries over to the ork codex once it drops?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/07/27 17:29:54
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
2017/07/27 18:24:34
Subject: Making Orks Competitive in 8th - Waaaagh!
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.