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Being free is reason enough. They do provide the kommando carrying it with AP-2 in combat, which is pretty nice against marines and the like.

For the nob a big choppa is ok to harm multi-wound models, but it's the first thing I would drop when I'm short on points.

Shrapnelbait wrote:
I have a question regarding Kommando loadout. It seems that Kommandos are being used as an extra boyz mob that can drop in unexpectedly then charge. If this is the case is there a good reason to equip them with burnas (other than it's free). You land out of range for the burnas so won't get to shoot with them before you charge. Should the Nob be armed with anything other than a choppa?

I'd recommend 5- Orks a unit, free burnas and an ordinary choppa for the nob. The problem is that kommandos cannot take shootas. If they could, sticking them in cover with twin big shootas would probably be a useful option. As is they are kitted out for close-combat, which means that their cover save is difficult to use. When charging from cover you get a -2 to the rolled distance.

malcontent999 wrote:
I've been kicking around the idea of a walker wall for a while now, and I think this would be pretty fun. Who knows? It might even be semi-competative after we get a codex. Care to comment?

Spoiler:

Detachment 1

Big Mek on bike- 81
KFF- 20

Morkanaut- 270
Mega-kannon- 23
Mega-blasta- 9
2 Rokkits- 24
2 Twin-Big Shootas- 28
KFF- 20
-374

Gorkanaut- 295
Skorcha- 17
2 Rokkits- 24
2 Twin-Big Shootas- 24
-364

Deff Dread- 74
2 Klaws- 45
2 Big Shootas- 12
-131

Detachment 2

Big Mek on bike- 81
KFF- 20

Morkanaut- 270
Mega-kannon- 23
Mega-blasta- 9
2 Rokkits- 24
2 Twin-Big Shootas- 28
KFF- 20
-374

4 Kans- 204
4 Rokkits- 48
-252

4 Kans- 204
4 Rokkits- 48
-252

Detachment 3

Big Mek on bike- 81
KFF- 20

Deff dread- 74
2 klaws- 45
2 Big Shootas- 12
-131

5 Kans- 255
5 Rokkits- 60
-315

4 Kans- 204
4 Rokkits- 48
-252

4 Kans- 204
4 Rokkits- 48
-252

3000 pts with 6 CP

The Morkas would protect clusters of Kans, and one of the Meks would protect the Gorka and another kan cluster. The other Meks would zip around providing repairs and force field where needed. If I got around to building something like this, the Mek conversions would have to be based on sentinels so everything could be a walker.

I actually took a list very similar to this to a 2000 point tournament recently. It did extremely badly; in fact, I was tabled every game.

Morkanaut, Gorkanaut, 2 Dreads, 6 Kans, Meka-Dread, Battlewagon, Big Mek on Warbike with KFF.

The idea is that you advance forwards, spraying a few shots in whilst the fast stuff (Mek, Battlewagon, Meka-Dread) comes up a flank. Everything stays under a KFF as they close in.

The problem? It simply doesn't work. My Nauts were focused down first turn every game. A 5++ save simply can't save you from focused Lascannon fire, or anything else that cares to glance your way. Often times I was losing Dreads not to Lascannons and Krak Missiles, but to Heavy Bolters. Shooting is non-existent; my Morkanaut caused more wounds on itself over the day than it did to the enemy. First mission of the day I went against 8 Penitant Engines; I had nothing left bottom of Turn 2. Even when you do make it into melee, your damage isn't that impressive. In Game 3 a lone vanilla Baneblade accounted for my Morkanaut, my Gorkanaut, 2 Deff Dreads and my Meka-Dread; the Nauts it killed by shooting, one dread and a Meka were killed trying to charge it (5+ Overwatch hurts) and the last Dread it ran over (hitting on 2+ with 9 Powerfist attacks turns out to be brutal).

These weren't WAAC lists I was fighting either; I didn't see a single Primarch on my boards all day. They were pretty much all fairly fluffy, casual lists that you'd fully expect to see in a FLGS. Hell the last guy I fought was Dark Eldar and the vast majority of his army could only wound me on 6's. He still tabled me by Turn 4.

Two weeks before I took the same list to another tournament and lost every game there too. I've been playing Orks since 2007, I know how to play the army and I can win with an infantry focused list no problem. But the Dread Mob doesn't work, it's really that simple.

So my advice is that if you really want to do the army because you love the theme and models, go for it. But don't expect it to be competitive. Because it really isn't.

I maintain that kanz, deff dreadz, and naughts do not belong on the table together. They might all look like stompy walkers, but they do not all roll the same.

The best way to make an ork list right now is to pick one toughness and keep it. T7 and T8 play very different, t4/5 and 7 play very different.

T8- Naughts, Wagonz with 'Ardcase. If you choose T8 models then these two units should be the bulk with nothing other then a few disposable purpose built passenger (suicidebustas) and maybe a KFF mek (KFF morka should be KFF in t8)

Saw that nids are getting a specific carnifex unit entry (screamer killer) will be interesting if same happens with other dexes.

Off topic bit does any1 know where these bits go? They look like tabards or something but not really.

 Dr.Duck wrote:
Saw that nids are getting a specific carnifex unit entry (screamer killer) will be interesting if same happens with other dexes.

Off topic bit does any1 know where these bits go? They look like tabards or something but not really.

They look like the orky shoulder pads on the Nobz kit.

Yep, just optional nob shoulder pads, which makes sense now,a s they are 4+ default. I have a bunch...was saving mine for 'ard boyz, but since those unexist I'm just waiting to use them.

 Grimskul wrote:

 Dr.Duck wrote:
Saw that nids are getting a specific carnifex unit entry (screamer killer) will be interesting if same happens with other dexes.

Off topic bit does any1 know where these bits go? They look like tabards or something but not really.

They look like the orky shoulder pads on the Nobz kit.

Ones on the bottom right hand corner, there are 4 of them. They are thinner than the normal pads and also dont have the peg to slot into the hole in the shoulder. I origonally figured they were tabards or Ork seals or something but the curve is throwing me off. Not a bid deal, just really stumped about what they are interned to go on.

Those slimmer pieces go on the back of the neck / higher back, between the shoulder pads

Alkorus wrote:
Those slimmer pieces go on the back of the neck / higher back, between the shoulder pads

Holy thats genius

 Dr.Duck wrote:

 Grimskul wrote:

 Dr.Duck wrote:
Saw that nids are getting a specific carnifex unit entry (screamer killer) will be interesting if same happens with other dexes.

Off topic bit does any1 know where these bits go? They look like tabards or something but not really.

They look like the orky shoulder pads on the Nobz kit.

Ones on the bottom right hand corner, there are 4 of them. They are thinner than the normal pads and also dont have the peg to slot into the hole in the shoulder. I origonally figured they were tabards or Ork seals or something but the curve is throwing me off. Not a bid deal, just really stumped about what they are interned to go on.

Nob Codpieces

Shrapnelbait wrote:

 Dr.Duck wrote:

 Grimskul wrote:

 Dr.Duck wrote:
Saw that nids are getting a specific carnifex unit entry (screamer killer) will be interesting if same happens with other dexes.

Off topic bit does any1 know where these bits go? They look like tabards or something but not really.

They look like the orky shoulder pads on the Nobz kit.

Ones on the bottom right hand corner, there are 4 of them. They are thinner than the normal pads and also dont have the peg to slot into the hole in the shoulder. I origonally figured they were tabards or Ork seals or something but the curve is throwing me off. Not a bid deal, just really stumped about what they are interned to go on.

Nob Codpieces

So... just codpieces then?

Yep. They go between the legs. They're tabards, totally. You'll see that there's a curved end- this goes right up in the crotch.

Shrapnelbait wrote:
I have a question regarding Kommando loadout. It seems that Kommandos are being used as an extra boyz mob that can drop in unexpectedly then charge. If this is the case is there a good reason to equip them with burnas (other than it's free). You land out of range for the burnas so won't get to shoot with them before you charge. Should the Nob be armed with anything other than a choppa?

I did not try but saw in competitive ork lists that they run kommandos in minimum loadout (5 boy, free burna, maybe not even a nob), that is around 45 points or so, and run at least 3 of these. Their purpose in this setup is solely to grab objectives, even like waiting for a turn 3 deployment. That might be a good strategy for multi objective games.

One other tactics question - objective placement

I often find that placing objectives in my own deployment zone is a waste. Usually the whole army rolls forward (I don't really play big gunz or lootaz), so I usually place them even close to mid table where my army supposedly will be at the end of the game. However, that works on paper, but I rarely managed to grab extra VP-s like that.

How do you play this with your orks?

As dr duck said those shoulder pads go between regulars pads, behind the nobz neck. Their purpose is to make the nob look more armored.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Shrapnelbait wrote:
I have a question regarding Kommando loadout. It seems that Kommandos are being used as an extra boyz mob that can drop in unexpectedly then charge. If this is the case is there a good reason to equip them with burnas (other than it's free). You land out of range for the burnas so won't get to shoot with them before you charge. Should the Nob be armed with anything other than a choppa?

Min squads of 45 points, take all the free upgrades you can. So basically 2 regular kommandos, 2 kommandos with burnas and a nob with slugga & choppa. Their role is to harass, tarpit or to sit on a lone objective. I sometimes deployed them on the table just to screen my units against nasty deepstriking enemy units, forcing them to arrive far from where they wanted to land or in another less appropriate spot.

Bigger squads could work but you have to build some tactics around them. I've only tried 2-4 min squads in this edition.

pismakron wrote:

Shrapnelbait wrote:
I have a question regarding Kommando loadout. It seems that Kommandos are being used as an extra boyz mob that can drop in unexpectedly then charge. If this is the case is there a good reason to equip them with burnas (other than it's free). You land out of range for the burnas so won't get to shoot with them before you charge. Should the Nob be armed with anything other than a choppa?

I'd recommend 5- Orks a unit, free burnas and an ordinary choppa for the nob. The problem is that kommandos cannot take shootas. If they could, sticking them in cover with twin big shootas would probably be a useful option. As is they are kitted out for close-combat, which means that their cover save is difficult to use. When charging from cover you get a -2 to the rolled distance.

I have mine as a 5 man unit with 2 big shootas. This makes them very flexible as I can infiltrate them on objectives both far back and far forward. With 36"range they can harass infantry in both cases. Them not having shootas has never been a problem for me, the nob can already take one or a kombi weapon and the other two shootas would not make a real difference. With big shoota load out the +2cover becomes easy to use. Sure burnas would be free but I think misses the big picture to think of this as the only option. 2 big shootas are 12 points, it's still a bargain.

If points are not considered, then burnas would be what I consider the least usefull special weapon on kommandos. This because poor synergy with burna range, deep strike, and cover bonus.

I would even say the rokkits can be good. This makes a cheap throw away unit like kommandos more of a target priority, and then they can dish out pain at range with some luck. I just prefer tankbustas in trukks for that role.

Just thought of a bizarre alternative to Nobz in Truks...Runtherds! They cost the same as big choppa Nobz and get a free grot prod (s6 vs s7..no biggie usually). They have 4 wounds instead of 2, but worse armor.

Best part about it is the entire trukkful are characters, so no targeting, or at least you force your opponent to split fire amongst each of the individuals. Also 48 wounds total per trukk.

One other potential advantage is that each runtherd can throw a grenade (they are separate units.) About twice as effective at very close range than pistols, against GEQ anyway.

And the unit can split 12 ways to grab objectives. Just don't play killpoints...:(

ETA: Also, super cheap way to fill out elite slots. 3 runtherds + weirdboy is 140.

Or you put 3 or 4 units of nobz in there. But that is still less wounds. Still good point though!

Another thought...

The trukk can visit objectives, dropping off non-targetable runtherd "eggs" that have to be collected the hard way. Even a sniper can't shoot more than one runtherd at a time (correct me if I'm wrong on that.)

Imagine clearing a few non-targetable 4-wound orks with a decent cc weapon from a needed objective.Once are trukks get their point drop this might be a very annoying strategy!

The grot-prod is only damage 1. The big choppa is D2. A nob with that stupid harpoon thingy is 20 points, and hits
with 3 (S5, AP-2, D1) attacks.

If you want an annoying character on an objective you might instead go for a mini-mek with KM-blasta for 31 points.

Shrapnelbait wrote:
It seems that Kommandos are being used as an extra boyz mob that can drop in unexpectedly then charge. If this is the case is there a good reason to equip them with burnas (other than it's free). You land out of range for the burnas so won't get to shoot with them before you charge.

You lose x1 pistol shot by choosing the burna. However, unlike true burna boyz, the burna does not replace the choppa. This means that you get the same number of attacks in melee, but two of the attacks become -2 AP (from the burna being used in melee). That sounds like a good exchange for an inaccurate pistol.

Caveat: post based on the Index list. This might change based on the codex.

Gitdakka wrote:
Them not having shootas has never been a problem for me, the nob can already take one or a kombi weapon and the other two shootas would not make a real difference.

I maybe misunderstood you, but Kommandos' Boss Nob can't replace his slugga for Shooty or Souped-up Weapons, only choppa for another thing from Choppy Weapons list.

 JimOnMars wrote:
Just thought of a bizarre alternative to Nobz in Truks...Runtherds! They cost the same as big choppa Nobz and get a free grot prod (s6 vs s7..no biggie usually). They have 4 wounds instead of 2, but worse armor.

Best part about it is the entire trukkful are characters, so no targeting, or at least you force your opponent to split fire amongst each of the individuals. Also 48 wounds total per trukk.

One other potential advantage is that each runtherd can throw a grenade (they are separate units.) About twice as effective at very close range than pistols, against GEQ anyway.

And the unit can split 12 ways to grab objectives. Just don't play killpoints...:(

ETA: Also, super cheap way to fill out elite slots. 3 runtherds + weirdboy is 140.

That's hilarious! So insane it might actually work!

I love the runtherd spam too The only problem about that combo is to field the models, who the hell actually owns 12 runtherds????

Maybe a trukk with 5 nobz + 2 ammo runts + 3 runtherds + 2 meks with KMB/rokkit?

Grot prod is just 1 damage though. So, not exactly a big choppa. But this guyz can definitely be used to fill free spaces in transports for relatively cheap.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
they won't wreck vehicles but can be much more effective vs 1-wound infantry cause it's very jard to kill a whole runtherd suicide squad.

I know we talk a lot about list building, but does anyone have any good strategies?

My current favorite is bomaz and kommandos. Use the bomba to clear a hole for the kommando's to show up where that unit was.

Runtherd are kind of interesting, they’re the same cost as a BC nob per model, and while their save isn’t as good they have twice as many wounds and character status. They’re almost too expensive to fulfill their nominal purpose as support for grots, but as characters on their own they could be interesting...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 koooaei wrote:
Grot prod is just 1 damage though. So, not exactly a big choppa. But this guyz can definitely be used to fill free spaces in transports for relatively cheap.

The problem is that many units you want to transport can get ammo runts or other expendable things to fill transport capacity.

Azhday wrote:

Gitdakka wrote:
Them not having shootas has never been a problem for me, the nob can already take one or a kombi weapon and the other two shootas would not make a real difference.

I maybe misunderstood you, but Kommandos' Boss Nob can't replace his slugga for Shooty or Souped-up Weapons, only choppa for another thing from Choppy Weapons list.

I see. No you understood me right. It was I, who misunderstood the Kommando nob wargear options. Weird that they disallow shooty gear for the nob.
well my point still stands though. two big shootas infiltrating in cover is good for 57 points. The fact that the remaining 2 orks and nob has pistols instead of shootas does not invalidate that option.

Lots of talks of orks being not competitive/ too expensive, but is there a risk that some unites will get nerfed with new codex? Candidates would be the boyz, weirdbiyz and maby the Mob Rule?

Nora wrote:
Lots of talks of orks being not competitive/ too expensive, but is there a risk that some unites will get nerfed with new codex? Candidates would be the boyz, weirdbiyz and maby the Mob Rule?

Seeing what other codexes have received recently I'd say there is zero chance of any nerfs for Orks. Yet to play my first game with my Orks but based on battle reports and forum discussions I don't think there is anything remotely overpowered in the Index. If they somehow rework Ork shooting (unlikely) and/or make Shootas assault 3 or otherwise better there's a chance of them becoming +1pt but that's it probably. Just because the successful Ork lists run a lot of Boyz doesn't mean Boyz are OP, they are just the least crappy choice there is.