Sisters of Battle 8th Edition Tactica

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**Niiru**

Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
davidgr33n wrote:
@niiru
The reason most people take fewer than 10 Seraphim, and as you mentioned it's typically 8, is twofold: 1. points, since 8 will do what 10 can do and provide enough ablative wounds for the heavy pistols to do their work, and 2. If they lose enough models and fail a morale test you will lose extra models regardless, so it's better to keep the squad smaller as far as morale tests go.
Inferno pistols are the go- to weapon for Seraphim due to the need for more melta. Seraphim usually accompany Celestine and use an AoF for rapid movement to get into melta range.

@jbeil
Crusaders are not the most competitive unit but if you need an assault force they are not a bad option.

Did everyone notice in the new FAQ the Knights' Thermal Cannons got a nice bump from Heavy D3 to Heavy D6, I just hate they don't take the initiative to do the same for our poor Exorcist missile launcher!! I want to love the Exorcist and they beg me to bring them off the shelf and include them in my games, I just can't see myself bringing 160 points of fail in my list for one of them. I have a feeling once we get our Codex they'll bring the gun in line with reality.

The Leman Russ is being reduced in cost by 10 points and getting 2d6 shots, so I'd expect at lest some change to the Exorcist.

The fact that the Leman Russ will still probably be bad notwithstanding, it would at least be an attempt.

Except that the Exorcist would be in a SoB specific codex, which wont be released for a long time yet more than likely.

Your only hope is if they remember it exists, and put an alteration in Chapter Approved at the end of the year. But how likely is it that GW will remember it exists?

**Mmmpi**

Remember it exists? Very high. Do anything? Depends on how hard it's poor stats affect it's sales I'd say.

**deviantduck**

Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
davidgr33n wrote:
@niiru
The reason most people take fewer than 10 Seraphim, and as you mentioned it's typically 8, is twofold: 1. points, since 8 will do what 10 can do and provide enough ablative wounds for the heavy pistols to do their work, and 2. If they lose enough models and fail a morale test you will lose extra models regardless, so it's better to keep the squad smaller as far as morale tests go.
Inferno pistols are the go- to weapon for Seraphim due to the need for more melta. Seraphim usually accompany Celestine and use an AoF for rapid movement to get into melta range.

@jbeil
Crusaders are not the most competitive unit but if you need an assault force they are not a bad option.

Did everyone notice in the new FAQ the Knights' Thermal Cannons got a nice bump from Heavy D3 to Heavy D6, I just hate they don't take the initiative to do the same for our poor Exorcist missile launcher!! I want to love the Exorcist and they beg me to bring them off the shelf and include them in my games, I just can't see myself bringing 160 points of fail in my list for one of them. I have a feeling once we get our Codex they'll bring the gun in line with reality.

The Leman Russ is being reduced in cost by 10 points and getting 2d6 shots, so I'd expect at lest some change to the Exorcist.

The fact that the Leman Russ will still probably be bad notwithstanding, it would at least be an attempt.

Leman Russes just became great. They dropped a couple points and the different regiments give them all kinds of flavor. The only problem now is which regiment. Do you want to shoot twice, overwatch on 4+, or need to be dropped to 3 hull points before hitting mid tier?

**davidgr33n**

What codexes are left? Tau, Eldar, DE, Orks, Nids, Necrons, Inquisition/Assassins, Custodes/ Silent Sisters, yea we might be waiting awhile, and with every new Dex our competitiveness gets worse.
I had a Marine player the other day complain about my Repressors, and they had all the Relics, new units, command options, etc, I kinda let it get to me and pointed out that they were complaining about one of the 3 options we have when they get 50 times the options and benefits we get.

**Niiru**

davidgr33n wrote:
What codexes are left? Tau, Eldar, DE, Orks, Nids, Necrons, Inquisition/Assassins, Custodes/ Silent Sisters, yea we might be waiting awhile, and with every new Dex our competitiveness gets worse.
I had a Marine player the other day complain about my Repressors, and they had all the Relics, new units, command options, etc, I kinda let it get to me and pointed out that they were complaining about one of the 3 options we have when they get 50 times the options and benefits we get.

I've known marine players complain about Eldar too, and even Orks can you believe.
"Omg you have that one unit that's steamrollering me right now, should be nerfed we can't do that".
Forgetting that they have more unit options than all the Xenos combined.

Though tbh that includes Sisters, as you do have a lot of *options* you can take. It's just that if you stay pure sisters you struggle.

As far as Codex releases go, I suspect Sisters will be folded into a single codex with Custodes, Silent Sisters and Inquisition. Maybe Assassins in there too. None of those need a whole codex to themselves, and it'd be easier to do a "Ministorium" or "Imperial Agents" codex and be done with it.

**Inquisitor Lord Katherine**

deviantduck wrote:
Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
davidgr33n wrote:
@niiru
The reason most people take fewer than 10 Seraphim, and as you mentioned it's typically 8, is twofold: 1. points, since 8 will do what 10 can do and provide enough ablative wounds for the heavy pistols to do their work, and 2. If they lose enough models and fail a morale test you will lose extra models regardless, so it's better to keep the squad smaller as far as morale tests go.
Inferno pistols are the go- to weapon for Seraphim due to the need for more melta. Seraphim usually accompany Celestine and use an AoF for rapid movement to get into melta range.

@jbeil
Crusaders are not the most competitive unit but if you need an assault force they are not a bad option.

Did everyone notice in the new FAQ the Knights' Thermal Cannons got a nice bump from Heavy D3 to Heavy D6, I just hate they don't take the initiative to do the same for our poor Exorcist missile launcher!! I want to love the Exorcist and they beg me to bring them off the shelf and include them in my games, I just can't see myself bringing 160 points of fail in my list for one of them. I have a feeling once we get our Codex they'll bring the gun in line with reality.

The Leman Russ is being reduced in cost by 10 points and getting 2d6 shots, so I'd expect at lest some change to the Exorcist.

The fact that the Leman Russ will still probably be bad notwithstanding, it would at least be an attempt.

Leman Russes just became great. They dropped a couple points and the different regiments give them all kinds of flavor. The only problem now is which regiment. Do you want to shoot twice, overwatch on 4+, or need to be dropped to 3 hull points before hitting mid tier?

I'd argue with that.

A Leman Russ Battle Tank outputs 2d6 direct fire shots at S8, AP-2 for ~150 points.
A Mancitore outputs 2d6 indirect fire shots at A10, AP-2 for 133 points.

Leman Russes have +1T and +1W. The Regimental Doctrines apply to the Manticore too, and has the whole indirect fire thing going for it.

And yes, Space Marines seem to be like that.

**davidgr33n**

Going back to the long range missile discussion, what are the thoughts on the Hunter-Killer missiles (HKMs), does anyone equip those on their vehicles? I am seriously considering removing my lone Geminae from my go-to list to get 8 HKMs to go on each of my vehicles. That salvo could potentially take out one or two light vehicles early game or put a dent in a Knight, and would help me better mitigate armor threats. For the points I think they are a good bargain.
Thoughts?

**Inquisitor Lord Katherine**

davidgr33n wrote:
Going back to the long range missile discussion, what are the thoughts on the Hunter-Killer missiles (HKMs), does anyone equip those on their vehicles? I am seriously considering removing my lone Geminae from my go-to list to get 8 HKMs to go on each of my vehicles. That salvo could potentially take out one or two light vehicles early game or put a dent in a Knight, and would help me better mitigate armor threats. For the points I think they are a good bargain.
Thoughts?

Yes. So far, an opening salvo of H-K missiles has managed to cripple leman russes and wreck dreadnoughts, and, more importantly, crack transports.

I wouldn't trade Gemini 1 for it, but I would trade Gemini 2 for them.

**dracpanzer**

davidgr33n wrote:
Going back to the long range missile discussion, what are the thoughts on the Hunter-Killer missiles (HKMs), does anyone equip those on their vehicles? I am seriously considering removing my lone Geminae from my go-to list to get 8 HKMs to go on each of my vehicles. That salvo could potentially take out one or two light vehicles early game or put a dent in a Knight, and would help me better mitigate armor threats. For the points I think they are a good bargain.
Thoughts?

I have swapped Geminae 2 out for the HK's twice now, but have forgotten to use them both times. Need to get some modeled up so I remember I took them.

**deviantduck**

Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
deviantduck wrote:
Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:
davidgr33n wrote:
@niiru
The reason most people take fewer than 10 Seraphim, and as you mentioned it's typically 8, is twofold: 1. points, since 8 will do what 10 can do and provide enough ablative wounds for the heavy pistols to do their work, and 2. If they lose enough models and fail a morale test you will lose extra models regardless, so it's better to keep the squad smaller as far as morale tests go.
Inferno pistols are the go- to weapon for Seraphim due to the need for more melta. Seraphim usually accompany Celestine and use an AoF for rapid movement to get into melta range.

@jbeil
Crusaders are not the most competitive unit but if you need an assault force they are not a bad option.

Did everyone notice in the new FAQ the Knights' Thermal Cannons got a nice bump from Heavy D3 to Heavy D6, I just hate they don't take the initiative to do the same for our poor Exorcist missile launcher!! I want to love the Exorcist and they beg me to bring them off the shelf and include them in my games, I just can't see myself bringing 160 points of fail in my list for one of them. I have a feeling once we get our Codex they'll bring the gun in line with reality.

The Leman Russ is being reduced in cost by 10 points and getting 2d6 shots, so I'd expect at lest some change to the Exorcist.

The fact that the Leman Russ will still probably be bad notwithstanding, it would at least be an attempt.

Leman Russes just became great. They dropped a couple points and the different regiments give them all kinds of flavor. The only problem now is which regiment. Do you want to shoot twice, overwatch on 4+, or need to be dropped to 3 hull points before hitting mid tier?

I'd argue with that.

A Leman Russ Battle Tank outputs 2d6 direct fire shots at S8, AP-2 for ~150 points.
A Mancitore outputs 2d6 indirect fire shots at A10, AP-2 for 133 points.

Leman Russes have +1T and +1W. The Regimental Doctrines apply to the Manticore too, and has the whole indirect fire thing going for it.

And yes, Space Marines seem to be like that.

T8 is few and far between and goes a long way. I'm still surprised Exorcists got it. Plus, depending on regiment, the manticore could potential be out of missiles turn 2 and then useless.

**davidgr33n**

So is Geminae #1 so necessary that she's better than 8 HKMs?
Also, when you have used HKMs (which I'm assuming you do 1st turn), do your vehicles stay stationary in order to get the 3+ hit, or do you move your vehicles regardless and go with 4+ to hit?
My meta is a mix of both extremes (hordes on one end and tanks at the other), so against tank heavy forces I think I'd sit still and get the 3+ to hit, possibly with my Canoness in buff range for re-rolls of 1.

**pretre**

Gem #1 is a significant force multiplier for Celestine, so I would say in a lot of cases, yes, she is worth the HKMs.

**Amishprn86**

Yeah, i dont have the math but the 1st Gem is a huge boost to survivability and the 2nd one added very little to it.

Its my understanding that the 2nd Gem is better spend elsewhere.

**Taikishi**

davidgr33n wrote:
Without the Exorcist there is no long range anti-tank in a pure Sisters force (except flying melta Seraphim). Heavy screens will protect vulnerable armor and there is little that can be done. Playing to the mission and pulverizing everything else was my MO.

I'd argue we don't have that long range anti-tank even with the Exorcist. The Exorcist is better equipped to handle heavy infantry now, tanks and MCs not so much.

**IandI**

Agreed, the Exorcist is a much better Hunter of men than vehicles. D3 damage doesn't take down armor efficiently but blasting devastator squads in cover is a nice utilization of the Exorcist. I hate to admit it, but if I had more squad leader models my 2 Exorcists would be traded in for more Immolators filled with BSS or Dominions.

The most effective anti tank we have is a toss up between Inferno pistol Seraphim and Dominions. My vote is the Seraphim.

**davidgr33n**

I've only played one game using a Geminae, she didn't seem to do much for Celestine. In the game she took a ton of hits before finally going down, but once Celestine starts taking hits, even if the Geminae comes back next turn Celestine will keep taking them until she goes down. Offensively the Gem threw a grenade and swung her sword a few times with no results.
So why take the Gem? I want to be convinced she's worth taking.

**pretre**

davidgr33n wrote:
I've only played one game using a Geminae, she didn't seem to do much for Celestine. In the game she took a ton of hits before finally going down, but once Celestine starts taking hits, even if the Geminae comes back next turn Celestine will keep taking them until she goes down. Offensively the Gem threw a grenade and swung her sword a few times with no results.
So why take the Gem? I want to be convinced she's worth taking.

In your scenario:
- Geminae dies
- Celestine takes 1 wound
- Geminae res'd
- Celestine dies because she has to take wounds
- Miraculous Intervention
- Geminae Dies
- Celestine takes 1 wound
- Geminae Res'd
- Celestine dies because she has to take wounds.
- Use Spirit of the Martyr to res Celestine
- Rinse
- Repeat

Edit: Fixed Healing Tears to Spirit of the Martyr

**davidgr33n**

RAW, Celestine uses Healing Tears to rez the Gem, not vice-versa, or am I missing something?

**Niiru**

pretre wrote:
davidgr33n wrote:
I've only played one game using a Geminae, she didn't seem to do much for Celestine. In the game she took a ton of hits before finally going down, but once Celestine starts taking hits, even if the Geminae comes back next turn Celestine will keep taking them until she goes down. Offensively the Gem threw a grenade and swung her sword a few times with no results.
So why take the Gem? I want to be convinced she's worth taking.

In your scenario:
- Geminae dies
- Celestine takes 1 wound
- Geminae res'd
- Celestine dies because she has to take wounds
- Miraculous Intervention
- Geminae Dies
- Celestine takes 1 wound
- Geminae Res'd
- Celestine dies because she has to take wounds.
- Use Healing Tears to res Celestine
- Rinse
- Repeat

This... isn't how the rules work? Unless there has been an FAQ I haven't read.

Main issue being, you can't res celestine with Healing Tears, it's for Geminae only. And it can't work if Celestine is dead, because you have to res the Geminae within 2" of Celestine.

So the actual events would be:

- Geminae dies
- Celestine takes 1 wound
- Geminae res'd (With healing tears)
- Celestine dies because she has to take wounds
- Miraculous Intervention
- Geminae Dies
- Celestine takes 1 wound
- Geminae Res'd
- Celestine dies because she has to take wounds.
- ~~Use Healing Tears to res Celestine~~
- Geminae dies
- End

**MrFlutterPie**

Sometimes if Celestine takes a wound or two I use Spirit of the Martyr on her to heal her to full wounds. Then her favorite meat shields can keep taking bullets for her again

**pretre**

Oh sorry, SPirit of the Martyr, not healing tears. Let me edit my posts.

**deviantduck**

The geminae has the potential to soak up a lascanon shot. That's worth it in my book.

**Inquisitor Lord Katherine**

davidgr33n wrote:So is Geminae #1 so necessary that she's better than 8 HKMs?
Also, when you have used HKMs (which I'm assuming you do 1st turn), do your vehicles stay stationary in order to get the 3+ hit, or do you move your vehicles regardless and go with 4+ to hit?
My meta is a mix of both extremes (hordes on one end and tanks at the other), so against tank heavy forces I think I'd sit still and get the 3+ to hit, possibly with my Canoness in buff range for re-rolls of 1.

It depends. The tanks don't have to move, since they're already in range of their primary weapons, but if I have to move them for more optimal shots or to set up something later, like a charge, then I'll go ahead and move them.

As for Gemini 1, yes. For 50 points, she adds a lot to Saint Celestine, since Celestine can heal herself back up with Spirit of the Martyr.

deviantduck wrote:

T8 is few and far between and goes a long way. I'm still surprised Exorcists got it. Plus, depending on regiment, the manticore could potential be out of missiles turn 2 and then useless.

That's not a bad thing. That means it did 4d6 S10, Ap2, Dd3 shots during the first two turns. I really like frontloaded damage.

The amount of damage you need to be able to deal decreases over the course of the game. A Manticore has a fixed potential, and the faster it's capable to doing it, the better.

**Zefig**

Well this popped up on Reddit:

**dan2026**

I'll believe it when I see it.
It wasn't too long ago they were teasing plastic Sisters and all that materialised was Celestine.

**deviantduck**

Speaking of boob plate.. I finished my Roberta Gillian last night.

Spoiler:

**MrFlutterPie**

Pics don't work

**deviantduck**

I uploaded them to Dakka then updated the links. Flickr is dumb.

**pretre**

Yeah, not a fan. Watermelons strapped to a chest do not a female make.

**Amishprn86**

deviantduck wrote:
Speaking of boob plate.. I finished my Roberta Gillian last night.

Spoiler:

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Spoiler:

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This is hilarious. i love it.