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Milkshaker wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Seeing the upgrades marines are getting in their Codex, I'm not sure why not

It's always worth considering that GW has a history of treating loyalists better than traitors.

But looking at the past, there is actually ample reason to believe disgustingly resilient is all Death Guard will get. Until the Traitor Legions book, Chaos was plagued by stuffing everything into a single army list, making legion rules something that only appeared in their unit entry when, say, Blood Angels had an army wide special rule section with their chapter tactic even though they had the book for themselves and vanilla Marines had an army wide special rules section for different chapters because the book covered more than just one faction. Marines were written to have their traits regardless of format. Chaos was not.

This could be the case again. I'm not saying it will be, but it's best to be cautious when it comes to GW writing rules for Chaos Marines. They'd still be true to their word if they had an army wide special rule page in the codex detailing what disgustingly resilient (the Death Guard trait) does and then have relevant data sheets just list disgustingly resilient and point to the special rules page for details.

The real issue here would be that disgustingly resilient is worked into Death Guard point cost whereas the Iron Hand one, to use a similar trait, may end up being a free bonus.

Milkshaker wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Seeing the upgrades marines are getting in their Codex, I'm not sure why not

... what having a +1 version of the Iron Hands chapter tactic isn't good eneugh?

BrianDavion wrote:

Milkshaker wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Seeing the upgrades marines are getting in their Codex, I'm not sure why not

... what having a +1 version of the Iron Hands chapter tactic isn't good eneugh?

Not if the iron hands' version is a free upgrade But yes, Disgustingly resillient is quite good. Unfortunately, it's also worked into the points cost of every unit that has it at the moment.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Geifer wrote:

Milkshaker wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Seeing the upgrades marines are getting in their Codex, I'm not sure why not

It's always worth considering that GW has a history of treating loyalists better than traitors.

But looking at the past, there is actually ample reason to believe disgustingly resilient is all Death Guard will get. Until the Traitor Legions book, Chaos was plagued by stuffing everything into a single army list, making legion rules something that only appeared in their unit entry when, say, Blood Angels had an army wide special rule section with their chapter tactic even though they had the book for themselves and vanilla Marines had an army wide special rules section for different chapters because the book covered more than just one faction. Marines were written to have their traits regardless of format. Chaos was not.

This could be the case again. I'm not saying it will be, but it's best to be cautious when it comes to GW writing rules for Chaos Marines. They'd still be true to their word if they had an army wide special rule page in the codex detailing what disgustingly resilient (the Death Guard trait) does and then have relevant data sheets just list disgustingly resilient and point to the special rules page for details.

The real issue here would be that disgustingly resilient is worked into Death Guard point cost whereas the Iron Hand one, to use a similar trait, may end up being a free bonus.

True

Milkshaker wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:

Milkshaker wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Seeing the upgrades marines are getting in their Codex, I'm not sure why not

... what having a +1 version of the Iron Hands chapter tactic isn't good eneugh?

Not if the iron hands' version is a free upgrade But yes, Disgustingly resillient is quite good. Unfortunately, it's also worked into the points cost of every unit that has it at the moment.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Geifer wrote:

Milkshaker wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Seeing the upgrades marines are getting in their Codex, I'm not sure why not

It's always worth considering that GW has a history of treating loyalists better than traitors.

But looking at the past, there is actually ample reason to believe disgustingly resilient is all Death Guard will get. Until the Traitor Legions book, Chaos was plagued by stuffing everything into a single army list, making legion rules something that only appeared in their unit entry when, say, Blood Angels had an army wide special rule section with their chapter tactic even though they had the book for themselves and vanilla Marines had an army wide special rules section for different chapters because the book covered more than just one faction. Marines were written to have their traits regardless of format. Chaos was not.

This could be the case again. I'm not saying it will be, but it's best to be cautious when it comes to GW writing rules for Chaos Marines. They'd still be true to their word if they had an army wide special rule page in the codex detailing what disgustingly resilient (the Death Guard trait) does and then have relevant data sheets just list disgustingly resilient and point to the special rules page for details.

The real issue here would be that disgustingly resilient is worked into Death Guard point cost whereas the Iron Hand one, to use a similar trait, may end up being a free bonus.

True

except are chapter tactics "Free" or are they baked into the cost and we simply didn't get them yet. plague marines are 8 points perman more then tac marines, this buys them several things, 1: 1 point of toughness, 2: Blight Grenades (which are a straight up upgrade over frags 3: re-rolls of 1 on wound rolls in close combat, 4: the ability to take 2 special weapons, in a squad even if less then 10 troopers. 5: Digustingly reiliant which is a good deal better then the Iron Hands chapter tactic.

yeaaah.

remember Chapter Tactics apply to all Infantry, Bikes and Dreadnoughts

So yes, DR is better than the iron hands tactic on base marines, Iron hands also get it on Centurions, Devastators, Dreadnoughts, Terminators (!), Primaris marines (with an extra wound!) - We get more things, but they get more units to use their thing on

Charax wrote:
remember Chapter Tactics apply to all Infantry, Bikes and Dreadnoughts

So yes, DR is better than the iron hands tactic on base marines, Iron hands also get it on Centurions, Devastators, Dreadnoughts, Terminators (!), Primaris marines (with an extra wound!) - We get more things, but they get more units to use their thing on

given that feotid blight drones have disgustingly resliant I think we can assume death guard will have it on their Hellbrutes (and proably all of their deamon engines)

it's not a good idea to assume anything at this point

We're up to 7 pages of this thread.

#PapaIsWatching

Maybe while papa is watching and the 7th month is coming to an end we could get at least the confirmation of our Nurgle primarch

While I'm elated to see GW finally focus on my DG homies, I'm a bit jaded by the fact that now every special snowflake newb is going to have my army (as opposed to the psychotic fascists that'll go Marines). Not that I'm against new players joining the game, I'm just against new players playing my army.

Still, I'm excited for what's coming and I'm already thinking of selling off my GW finecast/FW Plague Marines to replace them with these new models.

Ubl1k wrote:Maybe while papa is watching and the 7th month is coming to an end we could get at least the confirmation of our Nurgle primarch

You mean model spoilers? they already confirmed they are having him as a model with his teaser video and art work. Along with the current story he is the main focus for chaos.

zverofaust wrote:While I'm elated to see GW finally focus on my DG homies, I'm a bit jaded by the fact that now every special snowflake newb is going to have my army (as opposed to the psychotic fascists that'll go Marines). Not that I'm against new players joining the game, I'm just against new players playing my army.

Still, I'm excited for what's coming and I'm already thinking of selling off my GW finecast/FW Plague Marines to replace them with these new models.

And im willing to be many others had deathguard even before you, so wouldn't you be copying them and it wouldn't be, as you say it "your army"? 50$ or so for 1000 point army is a steal, so yea. Everyone has nurgle, everyone has loyalists.

I just want to see a new Great Unclean One.

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Whilst I'm not expecting it, I also wouldn't be surprised to see Vectorum Traits as a thing in the DG book. The DI booklet descriptions on the Vectorums read as very similar to the minor differences in doctrine that the Codex chapters practice.

After all, as we can see, having an overall Faction rule(ATSKNF) doesn't preclude sub-Faction rules.

Neronoxx wrote:

Okay, so just to be clear, Normal marines have a garbage load of options that none of the other codex marines have, so this is argument may actually do the opposite of what you want.
My blood angels do not get;
Land Speeder Storms, Honor Guard, Generic Chapter Masters(at least in the past), Bikes as troops regardless of chapter, A myriad of formations, 2 flyers, 3 tanks, centurions, 2 dreadnoughts, cataphracti terminators and captains, legion of the damned....
Seriously.

Formations? In 8th? Bikes as Troops? In 8th?

There's a reason I said 80% - in place of the missing units you get Death Company, Furioso Dreads, DC Dreads, Librarian Dreads, Sanguinary Guard, A myriad of characters, Terminator Ancients and Baal Predators. The few things you are missing does not compare to what Death Guard had culled from them wholesale - every single Daemon Engine outside the Defiler for one.

And people still play Blood Angels. People still play Codex Marines. You're statement there doesn't actually refute my original statement in any way, just verifies it. Cheers.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Platuan4th wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Whilst I'm not expecting it, I also wouldn't be surprised to see Vectorum Traits as a thing in the DG book. The DI booklet descriptions on the Vectorums read as very similar to the minor differences in doctrine that the Codex chapters practice.

After all, as we can see, having an overall Faction rule(ATSKNF) doesn't preclude sub-Faction rules.

Well, they did mention Deathwatch getting specific trait/bonuses....

So Sub-Factions are probably getting individual Warband/Cult/Fortress bonuses as well.

 Ubl1k wrote:
Maybe while papa is watching and the 7th month is coming to an end we could get at least the confirmation of our Nurgle primarch

All our reveals are slated for September, the true seventh month!

It's funny cause it's true

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
Well, they did mention Deathwatch getting specific trait/bonuses....

So Sub-Factions are probably getting individual Warband/Cult/Fortress bonuses as well.

Huh, so we might have specific DG factions getting different bonuses? That'd be interesting, forgeworld already has a couple units like that if I recall.

If Deathguard are released in September that would be oddly appropriate.
Probably will be too; SM are in end of July, GK will probably be in August, So Deathguard might either be end of August or beginning of September, with CSM coming quickly after.

 Platuan4th wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Whilst I'm not expecting it, I also wouldn't be surprised to see Vectorum Traits as a thing in the DG book. The DI booklet descriptions on the Vectorums read as very similar to the minor differences in doctrine that the Codex chapters practice.

After all, as we can see, having an overall Faction rule(ATSKNF) doesn't preclude sub-Faction rules.

we could but if so I doubt it'll be anything like a -1 to hit at longer ranges, for death guard that'd be a bit much, now I could see stuff like no -1 when using a heavy weapon on the move.

BrianDavion wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I think it's more likely then not the DG aren't actually getting "chapter tactics" per say, but instead it's gonna defact be disgustingly resliant on everything. (which means stuff like hellbrutes with it etc)
The people thinking they could ALSO get something like the RG tactics are living in a dream world, GW's not gonna give DG a -1 to hit them in addition to what is basicly a 5+ FNP

Whilst I'm not expecting it, I also wouldn't be surprised to see Vectorum Traits as a thing in the DG book. The DI booklet descriptions on the Vectorums read as very similar to the minor differences in doctrine that the Codex chapters practice.

After all, as we can see, having an overall Faction rule(ATSKNF) doesn't preclude sub-Faction rules.

we could but if so I doubt it'll be anything like a -1 to hit at longer ranges, for death guard that'd be a bit much, now I could see stuff like no -1 when using a heavy weapon on the move.

I think if we see that it might be on a specific unit rather than army-wide. I wouldn't write off an "Aura of Flies" styled ability as well, but it might be tied to the Daemons rather than the Death Guard themselves.

I will say though that I feel people are really discounting Disgusting Resilience and the "Nurgle's Gift" that Typhus and the Lord of Contagion grants to Death Guard units within 7".
Yes, it's 1 Mortal Wound to a unit within range of a Death Guard unit...but if you get enough units into that footprint, those Mortal Wounds add up quick.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
If Deathguard are released in September that would be oddly appropriate.
Probably will be too; SM are in end of July, GK will probably be in August, So Deathguard might either be end of August or beginning of September, with CSM coming quickly after.

According to their website, GK is next, followed by Chaos, then Death Guard.

Games Workshop wrote:
Codex: Space Marines will be swiftly followed by the Grey Knights and Chaos Space Marines with Death Guard not far behind. (Yeah, you read that right – the sons of Mortarion are getting their own codex.)

I used to fish for the DG WL trait from traitor legions that did a similar aura for a biker lord. Worked a lot better than you'd have thought, since you wanted him in combat all the time anyway.

 puma713 wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
If Deathguard are released in September that would be oddly appropriate.
Probably will be too; SM are in end of July, GK will probably be in August, So Deathguard might either be end of August or beginning of September, with CSM coming quickly after.

According to their website, GK is next, followed by Chaos, then Death Guard.

Games Workshop wrote:
Codex: Space Marines will be swiftly followed by the Grey Knights and Chaos Space Marines with Death Guard not far behind. (Yeah, you read that right – the sons of Mortarion are getting their own codex.)

Oh its CSM then DG? Odd, I thought it was the other way around.

 puma713 wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
If Deathguard are released in September that would be oddly appropriate.
Probably will be too; SM are in end of July, GK will probably be in August, So Deathguard might either be end of August or beginning of September, with CSM coming quickly after.

According to their website, GK is next, followed by Chaos, then Death Guard.

Games Workshop wrote:
Codex: Space Marines will be swiftly followed by the Grey Knights and Chaos Space Marines with Death Guard not far behind. (Yeah, you read that right – the sons of Mortarion are getting their own codex.)

To be fair, that reads as the release schedule will be this:
Codex: Space Marines
goes to
Grey Knights and Chaos Space Marines at the same time
goes to
Death Guard

They did say there will be Codex releases with no models accompanying them, and I expect CSM and GK to be such examples.

GK don't need any new models though.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
GK don't need any new models though.

I think, at the very least, that GK will see a solo release of the new character that released with Guilliman.

I imagine the GK and CSM will be smaller releases between the larger SM and DG ones.

If they dont release new models for CSM basic troops, I am going to be very sad..

 Kanluwen wrote:
I will say though that I feel people are really discounting Disgusting Resilience and the "Nurgle's Gift" that Typhus and the Lord of Contagion grants to Death Guard units within 7".
Yes, it's 1 Mortal Wound to a unit within range of a Death Guard unit...but if you get enough units into that footprint, those Mortal Wounds add up quick.

it's currently not amazing because we don't have much in the way of close combat troops. Plague marines were always ranged special weapon guy who could kinda melee, and even that's been hit hard now. The zombies are well... zombies so it's kinda hard to get them positioned properly for it as well.

Messiah wrote:
If they dont release new models for CSM basic troops, I am going to be very sad..

It's possible but I haven't even heard hints of this so far.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
GK don't need any new models though.

Grey Knight players proably feel differantly, as someone with a small GK force I can think of a few unit types I'd not mind seeing. not saying they'll GET ANYTHING (I'd be suprised if they did, or if they got anything I'd be something like "we're putting out a new plastic tech marine! GKs can use those!") but the GK army list is a little thin. I'd not mind seeing paladins seperated into their own unit, given the option to take storm sheilds and made a little more visually distinct, for example.

as for Chaos Marines, I'm gonna make a prediction here.

Chaos Marines will see Phase 1 of the Death guard release. this'll be standard plague marines, and maybe a nurgle chaos lord. this will be for the most part it. I figure this seems possiable as the death guard release from some rumors may be as big as the Primaris Marines, (consider, bare we're looking at 5 new kits, not including characters characters could see that expanding by another 5) GW could thus put out PLague marines with the CSM kit, as they're usable as elites in the standard CSM list, and then follow this up with the death guard specific stuff. this means the release schedule would proably be codex CSM at the start of the month, with Death Guard at the end, with a buncha death guard goodies sandwhiched in between.

BrianDavion wrote:

Chaos Marines will see Phase 1 of the Death guard release. this'll be standard plague marines, and maybe a nurgle chaos lord. this will be for the most part it. I figure this seems possiable as the death guard release from some rumors may be as big as the Primaris Marines, (consider, bare we're looking at 5 new kits, not including characters characters could see that expanding by another 5) GW could thus put out PLague marines with the CSM kit, as they're usable as elites in the standard CSM list, and then follow this up with the death guard specific stuff. this means the release schedule would proably be codex CSM at the start of the month, with Death Guard at the end, with a buncha death guard goodies sandwhiched in between.

Why must you get me excited for such things!

To be fair, it does actually sound reasonable. Perhaps even the release of our glorious Primarch as well to be in time for the fate of Konor?

It would also fit with the rumours that DG are getting info on their release in August

 dan2026 wrote:
I just want to see a new Great Unclean One.

Surely this will be a priority as all the other Greater Daemons have been done recently, my only doubt about this is the other GD got resculpted as part of AOS releases if I remember rightly.