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Even as a contemporary review it doesn't make sense. I repeat, 68% for revenge of the sith is just wrong.
I guess 52% for Empire Strikes Back makes sense for that time. It was a huge tonal shift and did end on a cliff hanger. I personally liked it for that and thought it provided a good contrast with the previous film, but I can see how it would have been shocking for people at that time.
I guess they really hated Ewoks back then. Can't say I blame them
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/12/14 11:12:12
What I have
~4100
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Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
Just seen the last jedi and I was pretty unimpressed, I was not expecting much after TFA but the comedic relief (most of which was not funny) every ten seconds was pretty grating as was the lack of in universe consistency. Space battles were good and loved the red dudes which were badass for mooks. Hamill really killed it as well.
Well he did say they were contemporary reviews (as in people who've gone back today/recently and reviewed the films.
Now stop and think for a moment about why someone would go back and review movies that are older than I am
Sorry, no; Reviews contemporary to the films; so, reviews from 1977 from Star Wars, from 1980 for ESB, etc. It also only looks at equivalent sources of reviews. For example, in 1977, the reviews that RT have records of were from newspapers and TV reviewers, so for the modern films, they only took reviews from the same sources. When they took all reviews, the prequels scored higher (83% for RotS, 68 for TPM, 63 for AotC)
Just seen the last jedi and I was pretty unimpressed, I was not expecting much after TFA but the comedic relief (most of which was not funny) every ten seconds was pretty grating as was the lack of in universe consistency. Space battles were good and loved the red dudes which were badass for mooks. Hamill really killed it as well.
Well he did say they were contemporary reviews (as in people who've gone back today/recently and reviewed the films.
Now stop and think for a moment about why someone would go back and review movies that are older than I am
Sorry, no; Reviews contemporary to the films; so, reviews from 1977 from Star Wars, from 1980 for ESB, etc. It also only looks at equivalent sources of reviews. For example, in 1977, the reviews that RT have records of were from newspapers and TV reviewers, so for the modern films, they only took reviews from the same sources. When they took all reviews, the prequels scored higher (83% for RotS, 68 for TPM, 63 for AotC)
*contemplates total brain failure*
I do remember Revenge of the Sith getting goodish reviews when it came out but I think that's just because it was so much better than the two films that came before it while still being pretty bad. It just looked really good, and still does really, in comparison.
I think that on the whole Revenge was a more concise film. It was still bad, but Attack of the Clones every time I rewatch it just reminds me that the Jedi really were just too dumb to live. That entire plot was migraine inducing, convoluted, and just plain forced. I mean what sane human being reacts like Padme to finding out her "friend" just committed a mass murder? And she's supposed to be a pacifist! There's a lot in the prequels that plays out like horrible fan fiction and I think Attack of the Clones has some of the worst of it while also having great moments like Chris Lee, Yoda kicking butt, and seeing a horde of Jedi on screen in a fight.
Mediocrity is a very, very generous term. I will admit though that I have quite enjoyed watching the Fall of the Jedi fan edits of the prequels, they still are not great but they are definitely a hell of a lot more watchable.
Its a cracking film on the whole. The two main plot lines are very satisfying, and feel well paced. The side story in Kanto Bight doesn’t quite work for me, but then we’re not there for very long.
Some bits of the humour verge toward Jar Jar Buffoonery, but are few and far between. Certainly it’s rare enough that anyone who claims the Porg On The Windshield bit ruins the movie is just seeking attention.
The battle scenes are just superb, and the opening ups the stakes very nicely.
Favourite bit for me was Yoda’s Star turn, and Snoke himself.
Overall, I don’t see many people being disappointed with this. Not unless it’s a conscious decision to be so because Edge Lord.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
First you are rude and condescending, I am a massive Star Wars fan, my Avatar is from a pretty obscure part of the lore/EU and I didn't like the film. Not because I am an "Edgelord", but because it lacked internal consistency, the characters were for the most part crude caricatures with very little development. Snoke, the new badass lord of the Sith had a stupid accident that doesn't serve the franchise in any way. Reys whole built up back story is non existent, Jedi suddenly develop new super powers for no apparent reason, if they could do that before then how the hell did 66 happen. The comedy was so poor it even devolved to your mum jokes, the silly/cute bits I can stand, but that type of gak has no place in SW. New super weapons! hurray! that made no more sense than the last... were used in place of any sort of realistic approach (like launching the 300 odd fighters you have on your capital ships when blockading a planet, 12 will do...). Yoda... Ackbar... Hyperspace tracking, that's new. Apparently it possible due to some macguffin that they couldn't even be assed to explain in any way, shape or form beyond its from that glowey gak behind the door (even though we know a tiny transponder is needed). Oh and being explosively decompressed has a few hours of hospital care needed to cure (not even in a bacta tank). Casino planet? why? worked for the whole hope vibe at the end but otherwise not. Laser weapons now travel in arcs as well... Ad infimum.
But, as I said Mark Hamill was excellent really well played, consistent and well developed. Graphics as always are spectacular, loved the way they tied the unnecessary trench run with the DS from RTJ. The FO army was pretty damn spectacular and the Praetorian guard rocked. The Mon Cal cruiser bit at the end was also pretty damn good, TIE/vn as well. I liked how Poe developed but not how.
I just find it really annoying how they feel that working within the rules of the universe don't matter and after how gritty RO was that they felt in necessary to produce that.
On parle toujours mal quand on n'a rien à dire.
2017/12/14 15:55:41
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
BobtheInquisitor wrote: So, to recap, the only positive review in this thread is from the guy who rails against the haters? Were there any other positive reviews yet?
I can only hope having adjusted expectations will help the rest of us enjoy the film more.
Well it's not mega horrible movie if you can accept it's not really a new movie but remix of original trilogy with new tech, has very little internal consistency and space battle logic leaves often lots to be hoped for like.
Spoiler:
You are trying to mount an escape, big fleet appears and you...send in ONE fighter to knock out guns? What the other fighters were doing? And since when empire lost so much technology their ships are even WORSE vs fighters(having been ridiculoulsly weak against them before as well) that one fighter has no issues and taking just few out makes one of the big ships of empire fleets so vulnerable suddenly? And what were star destroyers doing there? Not helping out for sure...
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/12/14 18:20:38
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
BobtheInquisitor wrote: Damn. Internal consistency and space battle competence were my things. Expectation adjusted accordingly. Thanks!
So, it has rehashed elements, but takes them to new places or has characters react differently?
Well technically new places but really that's more of in name. One white place is pretty much same as another and does it REALLY have huge impact if there's some other colour as well. Black background, red background. Sure not same room but not really that it matters for story.
Seriously some big scenes are like replace Kyle with Darth Vader and Rey with Luke and it would be just scene from originals with new actors.
But on more positive note Luke scenes were good and for me were worth the trip alone. Liked how they did his major scene toward the end. Also liked how certain event was described in not as black&white as it might have been but it had two sides and was more of grey. Yey.
But without Luke in this it would have been very bad movie for me. Well some of Rey's scenes even without Luke were also good enough. Not spectacular but good enough. Leia scenes were alright except for the space scene.
But on the flip side I'm hopeful that next movie won't be quite as bad rehash on the simple fact there's not much significant rehashing to do from original trilogy so if it's rehashing it's going to have to rehash TFA and TLJ!
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2017/12/14 19:22:12
Subject: Re:The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
The Last Jedi? It should have been named The Last Star Wars film. This is how a franchise dies.
If TFA was a burning sack of horsegak, then this is a burning sack of horsegak, tied to other burning sacks, thrown in a dumpster fire full of gak, had another burning dumpster dropped on top of it, and then had a flight of B-52s fly over and carpet bomb it!
An awful, awful, awful, bloated mess of a film...
Come back George Lucas - I forgive you. You are a giant compared to this Disney comittee that make films by group think.
They should have drawn a line under ROTS and left the story arc untouched forever more, with ROTJ being the last apperance of Luke Skywalker.
New Star Wars films? Fine. Do a new story arc, with new characters, in this infinite galaxy. Do something else, anything. If need be, paint Star Wars on a box and film that for 3 hours...Hell, that would have been better than this mess.
Spoiler:
Luke I-don't-want-to-be-found-Skywalker, but here's a map showing you where I am anyway.
Rebel troops evacuating a base, with Imperial, sorry, first order troops turning up? I've seen that before somehwere.
Captain Chrome. Fething useless and overated. As expected.
Snoke? Yout build this guy up for months, a billion geek specualtion videos and blogs, and the end result is that he's fething useless.
Yoda? Feth me...
One ship takes out a star battleship/dreadnought, aircraft carrier whatever they call it? Glory fething be!
And the steaming pile of gak on the cake, the crowning glory of this disaster: Princess Leia floating around in space like a bad music video from the 80s..
Holy fething horsegak!
I'd rather be beaten to death with a Jar Jar binks toy than have to watch this mess again. Bad characters, plot holes as wide as the grand canyon, and convinient plot devices that I could see coming before I even sat down to watch this film.
Phantom Menace? Last jedi makes it look like Citizen Kane.
Damn you Disney!
If this film didn't have the previous films and the hype machine behind it, then it would bomb like the US airforce in Vietnam!
rant over!
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Overall, I don’t see many people being disappointed with this. Not unless it’s a conscious decision to be so because Edge Lord.[/spoiler]
Seriously..
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/12/14 20:15:12
Fatum Iustum Stultorum
Fiat justitia ruat caelum
2017/12/14 20:29:34
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
I'll be seeing it this weekend or as soon as I get over this flu. Setting my expectations very low...I didn't like the last two movies that much and from the sounds of it this is more of the same.
2017/12/14 20:51:28
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Thargrim wrote: I'll be seeing it this weekend or as soon as I get over this flu. Setting my expectations very low...I didn't like the last two movies that much and from the sounds of it this is more of the same.
Set them really low.
This scene should tell you about the quality of this movie:
Spoiler:
There is literally a book burning in this film, where the old jedi knowledge is burned by a force ghost who calls lightening from the sky, because the knowledge can be found in Rey and the books aren't. Luke is distraught at this but the force ghost simply whacks him on the head then laughs and says "page turners they where not".
Yes, Yoda commits a book burning on ancient Jedi knowledge and texts.
There are many more scenes which are making the rounds at the moment, like the scene where snoke dies, leia doing the superman in space or B grade fight scene where Kylo and Rey team up in a Power Ranger style action sequence. people are also hating Lukes character assassination. A fair few slow motion shots in this too...
Honestly I caution you to expect far, far less in this movie than the others... and the others are pretty bad.
On the bright side there are going to be a lot more comedic reviews next year. Best thing about these new movies are the reviews ripping into them.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Overall, I don’t see many people being disappointed with this. Not unless it’s a conscious decision to be so because Edge Lord.[/spoiler]
Seriously..
Yeah I've just read the plot synopsis on Wikipedia and, well...I'm already disappointed. Won't be in any rush to go see it with my friends.
Which is a complete 180 from my previous statement...
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: Even if its as crap as The Phantom Menace, its still worth at least one viewing...because its Star Wars.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/14 21:31:46
2017/12/14 22:19:42
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
The more time that passes after the viewing- the further I get from the spectacle on the screen- the more I'm disliking this film. I'm really, really disappointed with the way they've handled technology.
Spoiler:
I think it can be perfectly summed up with the 'Cloaked Beacon'- a device that simultaneously broadcasts a galaxy wide signal (from a wrist watch sized device no less) yet can't be detected. Throw in the whole 'They're tracking us through hyperspace!' 'But that's impossible!' bit and suddenly the whole plan about a codebreaker (couldn't say slicer? really?) and some secret new tech and busting into the freaking command ship becomes massively questionable (before you even consider it was an utterly pointless subplot!). Worse they know immediately how to circumvent it and which room it's on- in a ship that is sixty kilometers long.
"General Leia, they're tracking us through hyperspace!"
"But that's not possible!"
"It must be some new kind of never before seen technology! "
"Or, you know, I am wearing a galaxy wide beacon. Could be they picked that up. Or a tracker. Or a spy. Wait, no- definitely some never before seen technology. Quick, concoct a horrifyingly convoluted plan that will fail but eat up screen time!"
No, all the books. There weren’t that many, and why would you leave some? Which is probably why Yoda burned it, to stop Luke entering and finding them gone, as well as appearing to make a point.
As for Jedi Astral Projection? That’s not a sudden superpower. At all. First instance I’m sure Of occurs in Rebels Season 1, when Yoda has a chat with Ezra.
Seriously, some of the comments above sound more like people just read a bunch of spoilers, rather than actual watched the film.
Sure, there’s a scene or two I find didn’t quite land. But nowhere near enough to derail the film as a whole. Leia In Space was a bit much, and I felt Canto Bight could’ve been handled better. But those are really quite minor parts of the whole.
As for the humour? Remember, first and foremost this is a family film, intended for as wide an audience as possible. It’s not for the 40 year old neckbeard market. Like, at all.
Totally off to see it again come payday.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
I didn't like it. I wouldn't say it was an objectively bad film but yeah...
I didn't like it.
For what this means for me, as a bit of context.
Rogue One is my favourite Star Wars film and one of my favourite films.
The original trilogy, I really, really like them and, to be honest, I can't really choose between them. Luke, Vader and Palpatine on the Death Star is one of my favourite film situations.
I am somewhat positive towards 'The Force Awakens' but it doesn't top any real lifetime lists or the like.
I actively like the second half of 'Revenge of the Sith'. I am, overall, ambivalent towards 'Attack of the Clones' and the first half of RotS.
I actively, strongly dislike The Phantom Menace. I dislike the Last Jedi less than The Phantom Menace.
2017/12/14 22:45:59
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
No, all the books. There weren’t that many, and why would you leave some? Which is probably why Yoda burned it, to stop Luke entering and finding them gone, as well as appearing to make a point.
As for Jedi Astral Projection? That’s not a sudden superpower. At all. First instance I’m sure Of occurs in Rebels Season 1, when Yoda has a chat with Ezra.
Seriously, some of the comments above sound more like people just read a bunch of spoilers, rather than actual watched the film.
Sure, there’s a scene or two I find didn’t quite land. But nowhere near enough to derail the film as a whole. Leia In Space was a bit much, and I felt Canto Bight could’ve been handled better. But those are really quite minor parts of the whole.
As for the humour? Remember, first and foremost this is a family film, intended for as wide an audience as possible. It’s not for the 40 year old neckbeard market. Like, at all.
Totally off to see it again come payday.
It is amazing how you cant discuss the film without Ad hominem. Yes you like it, others don't. How about you grow up?
On parle toujours mal quand on n'a rien à dire.
2017/12/15 00:24:37
Subject: The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
tneva82 wrote: Seriously some big scenes are like replace Kyle with Darth Vader and Rey with Luke and it would be just scene from originals with new actors.
It's Abrams' modus operandi. You should be expecting this by now.
2017/12/15 03:58:14
Subject: Re:The Last Jedi - Movie Discussion - WARNING - Possible Spoilers Within!
Kojiro wrote: The more time that passes after the viewing- the further I get from the spectacle on the screen- the more I'm disliking this film. I'm really, really disappointed with the way they've handled technology.
Spoiler:
I think it can be perfectly summed up with the 'Cloaked Beacon'- a device that simultaneously broadcasts a galaxy wide signal (from a wrist watch sized device no less) yet can't be detected. Throw in the whole 'They're tracking us through hyperspace!' 'But that's impossible!' bit and suddenly the whole plan about a codebreaker (couldn't say slicer? really?) and some secret new tech and busting into the freaking command ship becomes massively questionable (before you even consider it was an utterly pointless subplot!). Worse they know immediately how to circumvent it and which room it's on- in a ship that is sixty kilometers long.
"General Leia, they're tracking us through hyperspace!"
"But that's not possible!"
"It must be some new kind of never before seen technology! "
"Or, you know, I am wearing a galaxy wide beacon. Could be they picked that up. Or a tracker. Or a spy. Wait, no- definitely some never before seen technology. Quick, concoct a horrifyingly convoluted plan that will fail but eat up screen time!"
Spoiler:
And wasn't millenium falcon tracked as well in new hop? Yeah real never seen before thing...
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