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2018/03/21 21:41:27
Subject: Re:Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
Hey,
alert! not the most tactical discussion, but anyways BA player ramblings..
First..
for a 500 point gaming, I've been running a Slamguinius, lieutenant, 2x scouts, tac squad with HB and a 6man DC with jump packs.. It has performed reasonable well.. but amount of vehicles people are bringing in such a small party I was thinking what if..
Second, having a game tomorrow. My friend is coming over for a 1k match up. BA vs. DG. Both are my armies, but he likes to play all painted, so by all means..
Spoiler:
I've tried to pull two evenly competitive lists for us and if this works out well, I'll bring the same list in a gaming day with several opponents.. what do you think, big tweaks needed? 1k games are yet strange for me, but 2k games tend to take so much time, so we are trying to settle in a new point limit (I'm hoping 1500 or 1250, but..) and organizer talked about trying 1k next.
- 10x Tacticals w/ flamer, heavy-flamer, sergeant w/ combi-flamer and power sword in a rhino
Wow, so many wasted points. Flamers are pathetic. Those models are 243 points. You get 8 boltgun shots at 24", 16 shots at 12", 7 auto flamer hits (same damage as boltgun) at 8", and 3,5 heavy flamer hits at 8" with S5 and AP-1. Plus 11 melee attacks.
A razorback with twin AC and stormbolter and a 5 model company veteran squad with stormbolters and chainswords is 208 pts. For that you get 14 boltgun shots at 24", 28 shots at 12", and 12 twin AC shots at 24" with S6 and AP-1. Plus 16 melee attacks.
Alternatively you could use a rhino with twin stormbolters and two 5 model company veterans with stormbolters and chainswords, thats 254 pts. For that you get 24 boltgun shots at 24". 48 boltgun shots at 12". Plus 32 melee attacks.
Yeah I’m trying to make use of a 7th ed army that wasn’t even great in 7th haha along with Primaris because the models are sweet
2018/03/22 14:57:53
Subject: Re:Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
So I've reworked my list after playing a couple of games today. Reivers are unfortunately really lacking, which is a damn shame. Also 8 Sanguinary Guard ended up feeling a little bit like overkill and ended up drawing too much fire after mega wrecking a unit. Captain didn't really do much either unfortunately. So here is my new list, is it any better?
What are you all running for Devastators? I’ve purchased 2 kits and have been using 2x lascannon and 1x plasma cannon from each box. I’ve been having notable success with those squads, but I’m at a loss as to what to build out of the 4th marine. Ideally it would be more lascannon, but only 2 of each gun per box. Plasma cannon benefits from the sergeant’s signum, so one is perfect but I’m hesitant to add a second plasma cannon. Thoughts?
2018/03/22 15:03:11
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
If you don't want to buy a third box. a missile launcher can function as a poor man's lascannon that can also split fire in to infantry squads for more damage than a lascannon would probably deliver.
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2018/03/22 15:22:35
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
Bremon wrote: What are you all running for Devastators? I’ve purchased 2 kits and have been using 2x lascannon and 1x plasma cannon from each box. I’ve been having notable success with those squads, but I’m at a loss as to what to build out of the 4th marine. Ideally it would be more lascannon, but only 2 of each gun per box. Plasma cannon benefits from the sergeant’s signum, so one is perfect but I’m hesitant to add a second plasma cannon. Thoughts?
Everything except melta and grav is good. RL and HB can be used with a stratagem to inflict mortal wounds. Plasma is good when you have a captain around, to reroll 1s when overcharging. Always use more marines than heavy weapons for ablative wounds. And use a cherub, its only 5 pts. and you can allocate wounds to it. Another cheap ablative wound.
2018/03/22 16:07:36
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
Bremon wrote: What are you all running for Devastators?
Everything except melta and grav is good.
Don't underestimate Grav. A Grav cannon is actually better than a Lascannon against vehicles due to RoF and better than a heavy bolter at mulching hordes. It is better than a plasma cannon vs MEQs and doesn't overheat. The only downsides are high cost and short range.
Range can be overcome by putting them in a Pod and dropping them midfield where they will have plenty of targets. Put a cheap buffing character like a Lt in for rerolls and they will shred any unit type in the game.
If you want a traditional stand-back-and-shoot Dev squad then my preference is 3 Lascannons and 1 plasma cannon. The plasma cannon can be buffed by the Signum meaning it is safe to overcharge, even if there is no Captain around.
I stand between the darkness and the light. Between the candle and the star.
2018/03/22 17:00:06
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
I think a third box is in order but I did forget about the stratagems. I do have several heavy bolter marines already due to multiple Start Collecting! boxes but a missile launcher could do in a pinch, we currently play 1250 points, soon 1500, so a missile launcher’s versatility might be nice.
2018/03/22 17:53:50
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
Yeah, the ML isn't the greatest thing but if you need to fill a spot, it'll at least do something.
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2018/03/22 18:16:24
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
That’s very true Martel, I see bloat drones, blight haulers, hive tyrants, etc. regularly, and the lascannon is overkill against those targets while the frag missile can help kill a few scrubs when LOS on the tasty stuff isn’t going to happen (we play with plenty of LOS breaking pieces).
2018/03/22 20:01:36
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
I'm actually thinking of running a Brigade in my next few games. Something along the lines of:
Captain Hammer
Lemartes
Jump pack Lieutenant
6 Death Company w/ 4 Thunder Hammers
8 Death Company w/ Chainswords
Company Ancient
5 man Tactical squad w/ Heavy Bolter
5 man Tactical squad w/ Heavy Bolter
5 man Tactical squad w/ Heavy Bolter
5 man Tactical squad w/ Missile Launcher
5 man Tactical squad w/ Missile Launcher
5 man Intercessor squad w grenade launcher
3 Inceptors w/ assault bolters
3 Inceptors w/ assault bolters
Land Speeder w/ heavy bolter
5 man Devastator squad w/ 2 lascannons, 2 missile launchers and a cherub
Whirlwind w/ the anti-hoard missiles
Whirlwind w/ the anti-tank missiles
Basically, that list allows me to spend a turn shooting a long range if I'd like (to thin out screens) before dropping in with my Death company, which seems decent as more horde armies break into the meta. Also, it has a decent amount of board prescence.
I've been running the Troops as shown in my lists for awhile now and they almost always stick around (not high on the priority list)
Out of time...laters
2018/03/22 20:37:34
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
Range can be overcome by putting them in a Pod and dropping them midfield where they will have plenty of targets. Put a cheap buffing character like a Lt in for rerolls and they will shred any unit type in the game.
You must be joking Dropping devs with grav guns and a buffing character in a pod midfield ? Thats ~350 pts. You get to shoot once in your turn, hitting on 4s. You wont be able to kill a razorback with that. 16 shots, 8 hits, 3 wounds, 6 damage. Hilarious. On your opponents turn your devs will be tied up in melee by chaff
I can get two units of devs with 8 lascannons for about the same amount of points, they will take out a razorback for sure, and they will damage a second one.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/03/22 20:42:24
2018/03/23 06:50:31
Subject: Re:Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
6 Death Company w/ 4 Thunder Hammers
8 Death Company w/ Chainswords
Is there a reason that isn't either:
5 Death Company w/ Chainswords
9 Death Company w/ 4 TH's
Or
7 Death Company 2 TH's
7 Death Company 2 TH's
?
Yep.
The 6 man DC with 4 Thunderhammers is basically my main...um...hammer unit, and is deployed to dispatch the enemy's biggest threat. The 2 extra non-Thunderhammer guys are for absorbing potential overwatch deaths on the way in. The 4 Thunderhammers are for doing the work.
The 8 man DC with chainswords is for screen clearing, if needed, and the more the merrier for such a task.
2018/03/23 18:07:12
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
I had Captain Smash kill a Plaguecaster and 3 Blightlords yesterday. That felt good.
This was the second game in a row where a Daemon Prince survived with 1 wound and was the difference between me winning and losing. Also...I dislike Death to the False Emperor lol. On another note; it’s been great having devastators instill the fear of god into a plagueburst crawler.
2018/03/23 19:37:31
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
Last night I pulled DoA charge with capt Slam on a Nurgle DP with suppurating plste. I died and made only a single wound. Next turn Mephy with quickening and unleash rage charged the DP getting 4 wounds through.. Mephy survived the first blows at 2 wounds left, but died on the DG turn.. Game was a uphill struggle from there. DC was my mvp..killed a squad of 16 poxwalkers on the charge 10dc 2 hammers..
Licking my wounds and trying to figure out should I alter my list.. Any suggestions welcome.. My list in the first post on this page above..
2018/03/23 21:02:08
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
Predator at 1k does nothing but give your opponents anti-tank an obvious target. I use DC as dedicated chaff clearing at 1250 points; 6 w bolter and chainsword I’ve used to kill 10 cultists and 19 poxwalkers in one turn; double tap cultists, then DOA and Vengeance for Sanguinius.
DC Artisan Hammer JP Captain will obliterate that DP, my regular opponent uses the 4+ DR trait. If his DP is open then he’s public enemy number one; DOA, red rampage, only in death; 5 CP (use VV to try and regen; yesterday’s game I regenerated 4 CP), but you average 14 attacks hitting on 3s, rerolling 1s, wounding on 2s, forcing his 5++ to protect him from attacks that do 4 damage; you should average around 24 rolls for DR if I’m not mistaken.
Devastators give you ablative wounds and a sergeant to buff a heavy weapon; they’ll be more resilient in the early game (anti tank weaponry won’t worry them as much, forcing that crawler to be fairly careful).
2018/03/23 23:00:41
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
Bremon wrote: What are you all running for Devastators? I’ve purchased 2 kits and have been using 2x lascannon and 1x plasma cannon from each box. I’ve been having notable success with those squads, but I’m at a loss as to what to build out of the 4th marine. Ideally it would be more lascannon, but only 2 of each gun per box. Plasma cannon benefits from the sergeant’s signum, so one is perfect but I’m hesitant to add a second plasma cannon. Thoughts?
Everything except melta and grav is good. RL and HB can be used with a stratagem to inflict mortal wounds. Plasma is good when you have a captain around, to reroll 1s when overcharging. Always use more marines than heavy weapons for ablative wounds. And use a cherub, its only 5 pts. and you can allocate wounds to it. Another cheap ablative wound.
I have been running 3 Missile Launchers and a Cherub in my three 5 man squads. I know that most people prefer Lascannons, but I like the way Missile Launchers look. Plus, I tend to encounter quite a few armies that are a mix of cheap hordes and some armor. I am rarely dissapointed by the Missile Launchers.
Last game my Frag Missiles were able to wipe out my opponents Electropriests on my turn 1. To me that was more important than hitting his Dune Crawlers since I managed to find a spot my Angel's Wing Librarian could pop in and shut off his shooting. That freed up the Death Company to hit his lines like a freight train and consolidate into the rest of his armor. Sometimes the versatility to the Missile Launchers works in my favor since shooting armor over infantry isn't always the right decision if you can blunt his counter punch and force the vehicles to fall back.
2018/03/23 23:39:02
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
No fourth weapon? Interesting. I'm guessing to save points and have an ablative wound?
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2018/03/24 01:37:15
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
I’ve been running 5 man squads with 3 weapons as well; otherwise I need to ditch a squad member in my DC and SG, at 1250 it’s been working quite well but when we bump up to 1500 my Devs, SG, and DC will all get more squad members.
2018/03/24 01:51:43
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
That makes sense. I'm just so used to people trying to minmax every ounce of firepower they can out of their squads.
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2018/03/24 02:26:59
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
I can’t reliably get first turn and if I don’t my regular opponents will kill a few Devs; they’re the only single wound models I have that start on the table, and they pack the most heat lol. 1 scrub and the cherub are usually enough to weather the storm, and if I get first turn I can burn the cherub for a second lascannon shot at 2+. Exocrine and a plagueburst crawler are usually priority number one for me; getting 7 wounds on the crawler really takes the sting off, 5+ BS and the DP flying off to do his own thing pretty much cripple it.
2018/03/24 06:11:24
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
With BA i've run my devs with a ablative as well. 2x las, plasma cannon and cherub. Although I think I'll do a PC, ML, LC, cherub devs to my next game.
I wanna beat that DG list. If you could help me list tailor a bit. Better dice rolling and artisan of war for the capt Slam should take the DP. That foetid bloat-drone and the PBC burned my infiltrated scouts from objectives. Those S6-7 4d6ap-1 d1 autohit, reroll all wounds flamers are nasty in 1k game. Atleast that predator and rapid firing plasma needed three turns to drop the drone.. Predator finished the DP on turn 3, the last remaining 4 wounds.
So with what I should stop the drone, PBC, DP advance team? One dev squad ain't enough and drone can't be locked in combat.
2018/03/24 08:43:15
Subject: Re:Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
I wouldnt run TH or PF with DC without lemartes. You only hit on 4s and only 3 attacks when you charge. Next turn its only 2 attacks hitting on 4s. DG is hard to beat at 1k. The PBC and the drone are way to low on points. Here is what i would try :
Company Ancient [4 PL, 63pts]: Bolt pistol, Standard of Sacrifice
Death Company [18 PL, 254pts]: Jump Pack
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword
. Death Company Marine: Chainsword, Inferno pistol
. Death Company Marine: Chainsword, Inferno pistol
. Death Company Marine: Chainsword, Inferno pistol
. Death Company Marine: Chainsword, Inferno pistol
. Death Company Marine: Chainsword, Inferno pistol
. Death Company Marine: Chainsword, Inferno pistol
p5freak wrote: I wouldnt run TH or PF with DC without lemartes. You only hit on 4s and only 3 attacks when you charge. Next turn its only 2 attacks hitting on 4s. DG is hard to beat at 1k.
[snip]
You tried cheap DC with chainswords? No negative on the to-hit, 4 S5 attacks on the charge (S6 with the priest).
Just throwing it out there, not sure it'd really be worht the price.
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2018/03/24 14:07:06
Subject: Blood Angels 8th Tactica - For Sanguinius
p5freak wrote: I wouldnt run TH or PF with DC without lemartes. You only hit on 4s and only 3 attacks when you charge. Next turn its only 2 attacks hitting on 4s. DG is hard to beat at 1k.
[snip]
You tried cheap DC with chainswords? No negative on the to-hit, 4 S5 attacks on the charge (S6 with the priest).
Just throwing it out there, not sure it'd really be worht the price.
I usually run most of my DC with boltguns and chainswords, when they are alone. What's the alternative ? Assault squad's are bad, and vanguard or company vets are only 1 pt. cheaper. I think 1 pt. for black rage is a very good investment.
Dropping 
