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Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

 Sqorgar wrote:


GW is using loot box psychology to trick its customers into paying more than they want or should feel comfortable with. Their entire business plan is built on FOMO, hype, and limited releases to obfuscate the true value of their product. If they ever stopped pumping out new crap for a second, people would look at their pile of boxes of unbuilt models and realize that they are literally spending money on something which has zero real world value to them.


Wait what? The boxes GW makes are all discount boxes, limited production and they are certainly using limited to help drive sales up of those boxes there's no denying that. However you get a box of models at the end of the day - a box with a pretty good discount from GW direct and even more discount if you get it from a 3rd party store. And yeah if you are one of those people with a million boxes of unbuilt stuff then yes its adding to the pille; but honestly the majority of people I see with a mountain of models that big have been building the mounting for decades in general.


Heck one thing driving boxes out of sale is likely more ebay stores buying and spiltting boxes - so they are certainly getting a real world value (and profit) out of them

A Blog in Miniature

3D Printing, hobbying and model fun! 
   
Made in es
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain




Vigo. Spain.

It seems the box is again availible in GW webstore. But in many 3rd party stores it seems as a direct-only box. Hmm. Strange.

 Crimson Devil wrote:

Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.

ERJAK wrote:
Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

 
   
Made in ca
Nihilistic Necron Lord




The best State-Texas

Reviews are now up on both the Ossiarch and Ogor Mawtribes.

GMG:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Whg32GhCqVE

Mini
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVfr0wqLXSE

4000+
6000+ Order. Unity. Obedience.
Thousand Sons 4000+
:Necron: Necron Discord: https://discord.com/invite/AGtpeD4  
   
Made in gb
RogueSangre



West Sussex, UK

 Galas wrote:
It seems the box is again availible in GW webstore. But in many 3rd party stores it seems as a direct-only box. Hmm. Strange.


It’s now out of stock on the uk webstore (appears to be in stock until you actually click on it).
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Overread wrote:

Wait what? The boxes GW makes are all discount boxes, limited production and they are certainly using limited to help drive sales up of those boxes there's no denying that. However you get a box of models at the end of the day - a box with a pretty good discount from GW direct and even more discount if you get it from a 3rd party store. And yeah if you are one of those people with a million boxes of unbuilt stuff then yes its adding to the pille; but honestly the majority of people I see with a mountain of models that big have been building the mounting for decades in general.
The problem is that just about everything GW puts out is a limited time release or released under conditions which temporarily increase the price. But that temporarily never gets tested because very little of it stays on shelves for very long. The stuff that doesn't sell well, GW takes back and puts on their online store (where it can sit for years) so that they can release another $3,000 worth of product each month. They know that if they kept their product on the shelves, it would eventually be sold on sale or clearance just to get rid of the damn thing - because that's the ACTUAL value of GW products, and GW would rather buy all their stock back than ever see a single GW product on clearance.

The end result is that it is virtually impossible to determine the actual market value of GW products because they are all sold under manipulative practices designed to drive up prices. None of these market manipulations would survive actual market conditions, which is why GW does everything in its power to make sure that their product is NEVER found under real world market conditions.

Heck one thing driving boxes out of sale is likely more ebay stores buying and spiltting boxes - so they are certainly getting a real world value (and profit) out of them
This right here is an indication to me that GW's primary audience is whales and scalpers, and not of a healthy market full of loyal consumers. After all, why release a two army bundle which doesn't really work as a starter set for two players? How many GW customers are buying these two armies for themselves and not splitting the box? Why not just release the two armies separately, as start collecting boxes? For the same reason you can't just buy any Fortnite skin you want whenever you want it. For the same reason you have to get a loot box for a chance to get the thing you want rather than getting it directly.

It's because GW is trying to sell two things for the price of one and two-thirds things, hoping that the perceived value of the discount (not the product) is enticing to consumers. The idea that you are saving $30 is supposed to offset the idea that you are buying something your don't really want in order to get something you do want. Being able to sell the stuff you don't want to make part of your investment back is enticing as well, but these boxes generally have unequal propositions in them. A lot more people want the Ossiarchs than the Ogors, and the Ogor half is worth less than half of the price, whichs means that if your goal is to sell the Ogor half of the box, you will probably end up taking a loss. Either you end up paying more for "half" of the box, or you end up dumping the Ogors on eBay for less than market value because there's been a recent flood of them (also why GW doesn't want these boxes to stick around).

So who wins here? Not the consumer. They've had to buy something they didn't want and even if they eBay it, they'll still end up subsidizing someone else's purchase. Because it is a discount, it seems like a good deal, but remember that this discount is in comparison to prices which have been artificially inflated in the first place. I'd wager that even with the discounts, the actual market value of the models contained in this box are far less than people would pay for it under normal market conditions. If they produced enough, this is the kind of thing you'd see on clearance in six months.
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

Lady Atia has her review up on War of Sigmar:

Spoiler:

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/10/26 20:37:41


'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor






Gathering the Informations.

His "companion abilities" is what I had hoped we would get with Cities of Sigmar.
   
Made in ca
Nihilistic Necron Lord




The best State-Texas

I've spent some time reviewing everything, and I think the army is going to be strong, but not back breaking.

The Army has tons of good stuff. The only thing I really dislike, is the fact that one subfaction is just clearly so much better than the others it's not even close. That's really too bad, but the Petrifex Elite is just heads and shoulders above everything.

There is tons of depth the army. With so many command abilities, it's rare you are going to be doing the same things every time. I like that a lot.

Most of the units appear to be really strong. I don't really see any duds, besides maybe the soul reaper. I think Nagash is going to be too expensive to really see play. Orpheus is really cool, but 500 points and his legion is a bit of a dud.

The main thing that is keeping this army in check is the points values. I've been brewing a few lists, but it is impossible to fit everything you want into it. You have to balance how much healing, Discipline Points and other abilities you want in the army.

4000+
6000+ Order. Unity. Obedience.
Thousand Sons 4000+
:Necron: Necron Discord: https://discord.com/invite/AGtpeD4  
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Petrifax elite is obviously OP, the army as whole is going to struggle against any sort of MW spam. If you run an army without much rend or MWs, however, you're going to have a tough time at best. Strong overall, not a beginner's army IMO. It would be really easy to make a list/play the army in a manner where it does poorly. On the other hand, it also has the tools to do well at tournaments bar MW spam.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Did they just reuse the corpses from the corpsecart on the base of the Carrion Bird endless spell? I swear, they look identical. Same hair, same screamy mouths, clothes, etc.
   
Made in au
Hissing Hybrid Metamorph






It’s mainly just the basic troops for me, they seem bonkers for their points. The 3+ re-rolling saves with either the subfaction every human and their mom will go, or if Katakros is around with his subfaction, and then all the ways to get models back and being fearless, they just won’t die unless you unloading a billion mortal wounds into them which isn’t fun.
Otherwise the army seems fine and quite fun to play/fight against.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/10/27 00:36:19


 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




 Sqorgar wrote:
 Overread wrote:

Wait what? The boxes GW makes are all discount boxes, limited production and they are certainly using limited to help drive sales up of those boxes there's no denying that. However you get a box of models at the end of the day - a box with a pretty good discount from GW direct and even more discount if you get it from a 3rd party store. And yeah if you are one of those people with a million boxes of unbuilt stuff then yes its adding to the pille; but honestly the majority of people I see with a mountain of models that big have been building the mounting for decades in general.
The problem is that just about everything GW puts out is a limited time release or released under conditions which temporarily increase the price. But that temporarily never gets tested because very little of it stays on shelves for very long. The stuff that doesn't sell well, GW takes back and puts on their online store (where it can sit for years) so that they can release another $3,000 worth of product each month. They know that if they kept their product on the shelves, it would eventually be sold on sale or clearance just to get rid of the damn thing - because that's the ACTUAL value of GW products, and GW would rather buy all their stock back than ever see a single GW product on clearance.

The end result is that it is virtually impossible to determine the actual market value of GW products because they are all sold under manipulative practices designed to drive up prices. None of these market manipulations would survive actual market conditions, which is why GW does everything in its power to make sure that their product is NEVER found under real world market conditions.

Heck one thing driving boxes out of sale is likely more ebay stores buying and spiltting boxes - so they are certainly getting a real world value (and profit) out of them
This right here is an indication to me that GW's primary audience is whales and scalpers, and not of a healthy market full of loyal consumers. After all, why release a two army bundle which doesn't really work as a starter set for two players? How many GW customers are buying these two armies for themselves and not splitting the box? Why not just release the two armies separately, as start collecting boxes? For the same reason you can't just buy any Fortnite skin you want whenever you want it. For the same reason you have to get a loot box for a chance to get the thing you want rather than getting it directly.

It's because GW is trying to sell two things for the price of one and two-thirds things, hoping that the perceived value of the discount (not the product) is enticing to consumers. The idea that you are saving $30 is supposed to offset the idea that you are buying something your don't really want in order to get something you do want. Being able to sell the stuff you don't want to make part of your investment back is enticing as well, but these boxes generally have unequal propositions in them. A lot more people want the Ossiarchs than the Ogors, and the Ogor half is worth less than half of the price, whichs means that if your goal is to sell the Ogor half of the box, you will probably end up taking a loss. Either you end up paying more for "half" of the box, or you end up dumping the Ogors on eBay for less than market value because there's been a recent flood of them (also why GW doesn't want these boxes to stick around).

So who wins here? Not the consumer. They've had to buy something they didn't want and even if they eBay it, they'll still end up subsidizing someone else's purchase. Because it is a discount, it seems like a good deal, but remember that this discount is in comparison to prices which have been artificially inflated in the first place. I'd wager that even with the discounts, the actual market value of the models contained in this box are far less than people would pay for it under normal market conditions. If they produced enough, this is the kind of thing you'd see on clearance in six months.


I agree GW didn't get my money on blood of the phoenix or Feast of Bones. They keep upping their prices by making fake demand. Everyone in a panic because they sell out in an hour, well no duh, when you only make 1000 units to distribute worldwide of course you will sell out. It does three things, increases the inpulse buyers because they feel if they don't order it they won't get it, increases direct sales to guarantee a copy (more money directly into GW wallet per unit), and people who are buying these sets are always buying all the add ons to go with the one or sometimes both armies in the set, so GW banks yet again.

Blood of Phoenix stopped my impulse buying, Feast of Bones made me think and finally come to my sense. The new upcoming Necromunda release was appealing until I heard it might be $290 USD... At that price GW might have priced this consumer clear out as I keep loosing interest more and more and can't justify the prices. It won't be until we stop buying that GW will adjust prices, people please, keep preordering the stuff and keep the process growing... at what price will you stop is what you should be asking yourself. Luckily I woke up and my credit card bill this month won't be including the 230 for Blood of Phoenix and the 190 for Feast of bones... $420... Just thinking about that makes me wonder why i never woke up before.
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






I am fine putting a bunch of money down on preorder (way more than I normally would for miniatures) because if I change my mind I know that not only can I get my money back by reselling but I can actually make money. If I had the time and the spare funds I would see no reason not to order 5, 10, however many they'd let me, just to part out and resell. Taking a while to resell them all isn't even a bad thing since the price on the exclusive models will continue to go up and the box is a heavy discount off the retail price the miniatures will eventually go for.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/10/27 03:01:30


Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





angel of death 007 wrote:

Blood of Phoenix stopped my impulse buying, Feast of Bones made me think and finally come to my sense. The new upcoming Necromunda release was appealing until I heard it might be $290 USD... At that price GW might have priced this consumer clear out as I keep loosing interest more and more and can't justify the prices. It won't be until we stop buying that GW will adjust prices, people please, keep preordering the stuff and keep the process growing... at what price will you stop is what you should be asking yourself. Luckily I woke up and my credit card bill this month won't be including the 230 for Blood of Phoenix and the 190 for Feast of bones... $420... Just thinking about that makes me wonder why i never woke up before.


Thing is if you want to start the bone guys the feast of bone is no brainer money saver. Similarly blood of phoenix can save you money compared to buying separately.

So what you are saying: don't start bonereapers.

Or even more accurately: quit all gw right now

2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




tneva82 wrote:
angel of death 007 wrote:

Blood of Phoenix stopped my impulse buying, Feast of Bones made me think and finally come to my sense. The new upcoming Necromunda release was appealing until I heard it might be $290 USD... At that price GW might have priced this consumer clear out as I keep loosing interest more and more and can't justify the prices. It won't be until we stop buying that GW will adjust prices, people please, keep preordering the stuff and keep the process growing... at what price will you stop is what you should be asking yourself. Luckily I woke up and my credit card bill this month won't be including the 230 for Blood of Phoenix and the 190 for Feast of bones... $420... Just thinking about that makes me wonder why i never woke up before.


Thing is if you want to start the bone guys the feast of bone is no brainer money saver. Similarly blood of phoenix can save you money compared to buying separately.

So what you are saying: don't start bonereapers.

Or even more accurately: quit all gw right now


No you can keep feeding them your money all you want. But at what price will you stop? Or the steady price increases don't seem to bother you then so be it. Some people have infinite funds. Bonereapers will be out... and eventually they will even get a start collecting box... and all the craziness right now will just keep encouraging GW to raise their prices. So keep buying and rock on. Saving over $400 by not just grabbing a gimmick or two is worth it to me and at this rate I think I will just keep ignoring it as there are far better games then GW makes out there at a fraction of the price... And even more on the way.
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




angel of death 007 wrote:


No you can keep feeding them your money all you want. But at what price will you stop? Or the steady price increases don't seem to bother you then so be it. Some people have infinite funds. Bonereapers will be out... and eventually they will even get a start collecting box... and all the craziness right now will just keep encouraging GW to raise their prices. So keep buying and rock on. Saving over $400 by not just grabbing a gimmick or two is worth it to me and at this rate I think I will just keep ignoring it as there are far better games then GW makes out there at a fraction of the price... And even more on the way.


Well you can have lots of value out of Feast of Bone box by forcing the Orgor player to take the short end of the straw with 50% value splitting. Playing with GW nowaday you can't just be a customer, you have to also be a used car salesman.

I didn't tell you to buy any of those boxes btw, just some interesting take from my POV.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/10/27 08:45:58


 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Chopstick wrote:
angel of death 007 wrote:


No you can keep feeding them your money all you want. But at what price will you stop? Or the steady price increases don't seem to bother you then so be it. Some people have infinite funds. Bonereapers will be out... and eventually they will even get a start collecting box... and all the craziness right now will just keep encouraging GW to raise their prices. So keep buying and rock on. Saving over $400 by not just grabbing a gimmick or two is worth it to me and at this rate I think I will just keep ignoring it as there are far better games then GW makes out there at a fraction of the price... And even more on the way.


Well you can have lots of value out of Feast of Bone box by forcing the Orgor player to take the short end of the straw with 50% value splitting. Playing with GW nowaday you can't just be a customer, you have to also be a used car salesman.

I didn't tell you to buy any of those boxes btw, just some interesting take from my POV.


Why should you go thru all that effort? Try to get a few to resale and bump up the cost and rip off all your fellow gamers who already couldn't afford to buy the set to get what they wanted or needed. Great motto. Rather then stand up against the company only producing 1000 copies so they can cause the chaos in the first place. Well maybe GW isn't the place for me anymore, luckily all you believers have drove the cost up so high i can sell my stuff for very little loss and give someone a deal.
   
Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User



UK

I haven't been interest in warhammer fantasy since 6e and have to say I am loving the Ossiarch just wish I A) had the money to grab FoB & B) GW didnt do such ridiculously low runs that they can justify their price hikes (yet after lurking for ages I am aware this conversation ,has occurred multiple times across multiple threads).
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




Bubbles420 wrote:
I haven't been interest in warhammer fantasy since 6e and have to say I am loving the Ossiarch just wish I A) had the money to grab FoB & B) GW didnt do such ridiculously low runs that they can justify their price hikes (yet after lurking for ages I am aware this conversation ,has occurred multiple times across multiple threads).


Well it's sold out online everywhere so your problem is gone now. They will be on store separately in November if leak is correct so you can still get whatever Bonecast you like.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/10/27 17:26:52


 
   
Made in us
Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor






Gathering the Informations.

Bubbles420 wrote:
I haven't been interest in warhammer fantasy since 6e and have to say I am loving the Ossiarch just wish I A) had the money to grab FoB & B) GW didnt do such ridiculously low runs that they can justify their price hikes (yet after lurking for ages I am aware this conversation ,has occurred multiple times across multiple threads).

These "sellouts" are just the webstore/preorder allocations. Around Monday or Tuesday we might see some go back up on the webstore when orders that had payment problems or the like get cancelled out, but by and large you're down to "if you want it, show up early on Saturday".
Most GW stores will have at least 2-3 to put out on the shelves on Saturday, but that crap will go fast.

Additionally, we know from the Model Focus article for the Bonereapers that:
While the Mortek Guard and Necropolis Stalkers will be available separately the week after the release of Feast of Bones, Vokmortian will initially only be available in this set. If you want to add him to your collection, make sure to pre-order yours this weekend!


Vokmortian's a named character, making this the third time(Blight War being the first, Blood of the Phoenix being the second, and now Feast of Bones) we've had named characters in one of these boxes.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/10/27 17:36:45


 
   
Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User



UK

Yeah I think I'll have to grab some of the Ossiarch if sell some of my stuff and move soon.
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

The only bonus of named characters in boxes like this is if you can get them off ebay as anyone who doubles up technically won't need a second. However in practice many do hang onto the model to paint/convert; whilst the stock that goes up on ebay will sell out fast leaving only the expensive ones (someone in Italy is already being really creative with around £800 for each model option in the box).

Of course with the box selling out this fast I don't think there will be a huge amount of reapers on ebay to get - too many people want them and bought in on the box.



When I got Carrion empire it took moments to find several willing to trade half and half for flesheaters even though skaven were more popular in general. This boxed set feels like GW has really understocked compared to the previous ones, even Carrion Empire. Plus I think ogors being an elite style army means that many ogor players just weren't "as" tempted by the box since they already owned many of the core options present. I think if GW had put a little more content in for ogors they might have tempted them over. Then take out the morghasts that GW spent a month coaxing us to buy direct and replace them with cavalry for reapers

A Blog in Miniature

3D Printing, hobbying and model fun! 
   
Made in us
Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor






Gathering the Informations.

There's always a perception of "GW has really understocked!"...but how many various eBay "stores" and the like have been taking preorders since the box got announced?

Where exactly do you think they get their product if they don't actually have a trade account?
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

 Kanluwen wrote:
There's always a perception of "GW has really understocked!"...but how many various eBay "stores" and the like have been taking preorders since the box got announced?

Where exactly do you think they get their product if they don't actually have a trade account?


I've not actually seen many in the UK. Granted it might be that they aren't putting up for pre-orders and will only sell once they get stock; and that what few which have appeared have been bought fast

A Blog in Miniature

3D Printing, hobbying and model fun! 
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend




Australia

Pretty much everything up for preorder next weekend. Really like that GW aren't dragging it out.

The Circle of Iniquity
The Fourth Seal
 
   
Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User



UK

It all looks incredible and very shocked dropping the whole lot across just two weeks. I suppose with SOB, Necromunda etc they do have lots coming out already.
   
Made in gb
Moustache-twirling Princeps




United Kingdom

 Overread wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
There's always a perception of "GW has really understocked!"...but how many various eBay "stores" and the like have been taking preorders since the box got announced?

Where exactly do you think they get their product if they don't actually have a trade account?


I've not actually seen many in the UK. Granted it might be that they aren't putting up for pre-orders and will only sell once they get stock; and that what few which have appeared have been bought fast


One of my FLGSs made a FB post Saturday saying that while GW had sold out, they still had some of their allocation available - but now GW was out there was no guarantee they'd actually get their allocation...
   
Made in ie
Fixture of Dakka






Pity the Stormthrone is part of a $100 kit hopefully it will get released later in a smaller kit or I'll have to chase down the parts on ebay/bits sellers. I'm up to my eyes in Stormvaults I don't need any more of them.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/10/27 18:17:37


 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

So do I get the new Ossiarchs next week or the 'Start Collecting: Painting Handles'?

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

Bubbles420 wrote:
It all looks incredible and very shocked dropping the whole lot across just two weeks. I suppose with SOB, Necromunda etc they do have lots coming out already.


I'm more surprised at how little they dropped in week 1 to be honest. We got a limited print run boxed set; battletome, spells and terrain etc.... The second week is pretty much the ENTIRE army.

It also makes me wonder why they've got this odd policy of having short term duel army sets with characters in them which appear to have production lead times of months to a year before they come around again. It' seems odd and a little bit like GW is testing the waters on how 3rd parties are actually reacting and how it actually affects GW's bottom line. It might be GW is relenting on their fear of the 3rd party market.

A Blog in Miniature

3D Printing, hobbying and model fun! 
   
 
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