Codex Adeptus Custodes: By His will alone

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**Eihnlazer**

Wardens don't have native deep strike and lack some of the stratagems that the allarus have.

The termies also have D3 shot grenade launchers with ap-3 instead of 2 damage bolters.

The bolters are better againgst everything except for MEQ and 2+ save vehicles honestly though.

**ImPhaeronWeasel**

Can they shoot their grenade launchers AND spears?

**Eihnlazer**

I'd imagine so if they are equipped with the same "Castellan Axe" that the other custodies get.

They get two very nice strats as well, but its nothing really game changing.

The grenade launchers can slow units (with a strat), but considering their range limitations they aren't nearly as good as the thunderfire cannon.

The allarus termies can also all split up into single man units. This can really mess up an opponents targeting priority but doesn't really do much else.

Honestly if I had a squad of termies, I'd want the Imperialus banner behind them with Trajan buffing them and the squad staying together to use another of their strats.

The one that gives the whole unit +1 attack for each guy that dies is very strong on a 9 man termy squad.

**ImPhaeronWeasel**

So right now Im even thinking if the termies are THAT worth it in comparison to a battalion. I just want to play Custodes as allies so a 10man terminator squad is kinda overkill for me.

A battalion is a bit more expensive but I get 5CP instead of 1 and the normal Custodes have a 3++ for 10points.

Plus for mandatory HQs id go with a shieldcap on Bike

**stratigo**

ImPhaeronWeasel wrote:
So right now Im even thinking if the termies are THAT worth it in comparison to a battalion. I just want to play Custodes as allies so a 10man terminator squad is kinda overkill for me.

A battalion is a bit more expensive but I get 5CP instead of 1 and the normal Custodes have a 3++ for 10points.

Plus for mandatory HQs id go with a shieldcap on Bike

Depends on what you need in your army. Footstodes are slow. Abysmally slow. So a battalion starting on foot will have minimal impact on the game unless the enemy comes to you. It’s part of the reason bikes are so good. But if you have enough mobile elements in your death watch, maybe slow survivable is fine. You can also rock the guard bomb which is 10 guard that you deep strike in to nullify their slowness while the other two squads stay at 3 man and just hold objectives. But you’re quickly investing 1000 points into custodes.

**Pomguo**

Eihnlazer wrote:
The allarus termies can also all split up into single man units. This can really mess up an opponents targeting priority but doesn't really do much else.

Another thing it does is help their deepstrike charge - you’re making it much much more likely that some will make that 9” charge, even if not all of them will. Important when needing to tie stuff up or just wanting to guarantee that any damage will happen during their fight phase.

**Astmeister**

Pomguo wrote:
Eihnlazer wrote:
The allarus termies can also all split up into single man units. This can really mess up an opponents targeting priority but doesn't really do much else.
Another thing it does is help their deepstrike charge - you’re making it much much more likely that some will make that 9” charge, even if not all of them will. Important when needing to tie stuff up or just wanting to guarantee that any damage will happen during their fight phase.

AFAIK it does not work, since you have to use "Unleash the Lions" at the beginning of the movement phase. So you cannot do it after deep strike.

**Pomguo**

Ah, you’re absolutely right. Well, then yeah it’s far less useful than I’d thought. Thanks for correcting that before I erroneously tried it in-game haha

**KampfKrote**

I made a recent Reddit post looking for some help deciding between lists for an upcoming event. I suppose I should have just come here first. I’m looking for some pointers on what each list will do better than the other. Variations of both lists have done well in past events so I’m not worried about that. But any other info on them would help. Looking for deployment tactics that may not jump out to you by looking at the lists, etc. Thanks!

List 1:

Spoiler:

List 2:

Spoiler:

**Asherian Command**

Seems like a solid list.

**greyknight12**

I think the bike list is better, but that’s mainly cause I like the bikes

. I would reduce the size of one of the praetor squads to get a second bike captain; having another single unit that can threaten most things by himself spreads out your damage potential a bit more.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Since a lot of us in this thread play the same elitist armies (Custodes, Imperial Knights, Grey Knights) I thought I’d share a AC/IK list I’ve been having some local success with:

2000pts (7 CP)
Outrider:
2x shield captains
Vexilla w/magnifica
3x3 bikes

Superheavy:
Knight Errant w/ironstorm missile pod
2x Armigers Helverins

I use Taranis, and have subbed a warden for the errant but like the thermal cannon more. I always open the vaults so both captains have a 3++, and pay a CP for my big knight to have a warlord trait (4++). Depending on what my opponent has, I may throw a relic on the knight as well but usually I save CP to resurrect my errant. The list synergizies pretty well, everything moves fast and with rotate ion shields on the knight and -1 to hit on the bikes it weathers shooting pretty well. I have about a million bolter shots, good melee, and high strength melee and shooting from the knights.

**Waaaghpower**

I'm writing a Custodes/Sisters list and I'm super light on anti tank. I only have one squad of Jetbikes, plus a Jetbike captain - Am I better off taking the missiles, or are the Hurricane Bolters just so much better that I shouldn't bother?

**greyknight12**

Waaaghpower wrote:
I'm writing a Custodes/Sisters list and I'm super light on anti tank. I only have one squad of Jetbikes, plus a Jetbike captain - Am I better off taking the missiles, or are the Hurricane Bolters just so much better that I shouldn't bother?

If sisters still have melta in spades, then use them for your anti-tank.

**Waaaghpower**

greyknight12 wrote:
Waaaghpower wrote:
I'm writing a Custodes/Sisters list and I'm super light on anti tank. I only have one squad of Jetbikes, plus a Jetbike captain - Am I better off taking the missiles, or are the Hurricane Bolters just so much better that I shouldn't bother?

If sisters still have melta in spades, then use them for your anti-tank.

Sisters have melta, what we lack is cost effective delivery systems. Our cheap option is an 83pt Seraphim squad which basically packs four 6" Meltaguns but is made of tissue paper and has such short range that even 12" movement isn't much help. Our better option is Dominions in a Repressor which brings five normal Melta shots and two Heavy Flamers, but that loadout costs a whopping 242 points.
I'm writing a 1750pt list. Most of it is Custides, the sisters are less than 500pts and exist to hold objectives and generate Command Points. Sisters can bring anti infantry for cheap, but our anti tank is expensive and won't fit into my army.

**Pomguo**

Could always deepstrike a Custodes Dread!

**Ordana**

Waaaghpower wrote:
I'm writing a Custodes/Sisters list and I'm super light on anti tank. I only have one squad of Jetbikes, plus a Jetbike captain - Am I better off taking the missiles, or are the Hurricane Bolters just so much better that I shouldn't bother?

The missiles just don't do enough. The reduced cost is nice but your still paying 100+ points for a Lascannon. You need so many to actually put a dent into tanks that its simply not worth it.

**Eihnlazer**

It's called a salvo launcher. Salvo usually means multiple shots fired at once. If it was Heavy 3 str 7 melta rule it would be worth the points.

**Waaaghpower**

Here's the list I'm toying with:

Spoiler:

It's 1750 points total, so with what I've got left I can either take two squads of Seraphim with Fusion Pistols to get some extra anti tank, or I can take a Vexillus Magnifica and one extra Custodian.
Thoughts?

**Ming**

Hi there,

So i'm about to have some competitive games at 1500 points.

I've got some good results with a Vanguard Detachment (Allarus + Dread in DP) + 1 Supreme Command Detachment (with 3 bikes).

I am about to get the Telemon Dread and the question here is: Is it worth in a list of 1500 points? He would stay still in the back shooting the big guns while the allarus and the bikes spread fear and the emperors justice

**stratigo**

Ming wrote:
Hi there,

So i'm about to have some competitive games at 1500 points.

I've got some good results with a Vanguard Detachment (Allarus + Dread in DP) + 1 Supreme Command Detachment (with 3 bikes).

I am about to get the Telemon Dread and the question here is: Is it worth in a list of 1500 points? He would stay still in the back shooting the big guns while the allarus and the bikes spread fear and the emperors justice

Honestly? No. The telemon is just too much the obvious choice to pound anti tank weapons in to. Super cool model though

**Audustum**

stratigo wrote:
Ming wrote:
Hi there,

So i'm about to have some competitive games at 1500 points.

I've got some good results with a Vanguard Detachment (Allarus + Dread in DP) + 1 Supreme Command Detachment (with 3 bikes).

I am about to get the Telemon Dread and the question here is: Is it worth in a list of 1500 points? He would stay still in the back shooting the big guns while the allarus and the bikes spread fear and the emperors justice

Honestly? No. The telemon is just too much the obvious choice to pound anti tank weapons in to. Super cool model though

Gotta disagree. His meta doesn't appear to be super-competitive if he's having success with Allarus and a normal Dread. A Teleconference should do great in that kind of environment.

Now, if he wanted to be super-competitive and stray from mono, an IK is the way to go, but for this it should do fine. The Telemon is actually plenty durable, it's just unwieldly and a little overcosted.

**stratigo**

Audustum wrote:
stratigo wrote:
Ming wrote:
Hi there,

So i'm about to have some competitive games at 1500 points.

I've got some good results with a Vanguard Detachment (Allarus + Dread in DP) + 1 Supreme Command Detachment (with 3 bikes).

I am about to get the Telemon Dread and the question here is: Is it worth in a list of 1500 points? He would stay still in the back shooting the big guns while the allarus and the bikes spread fear and the emperors justice

Honestly? No. The telemon is just too much the obvious choice to pound anti tank weapons in to. Super cool model though

Gotta disagree. His meta doesn't appear to be super-competitive if he's having success with Allarus and a normal Dread. A Teleconference should do great in that kind of environment.

Now, if he wanted to be super-competitive and stray from mono, an IK is the way to go, but for this it should do fine. The Telemon is actually plenty durable, it's just unwieldly and a little overcosted.

A teleconference? No, under no circumstances should you pay nick nanavati 100 dollars to get good at warhammer!

Anyways I took the question as meta agnostic on the merits of the telemon within the custodes codex

**Ming**

Thanks for the answers.

The meta in my group isn't ultracompetitive this is why i'd play a mono-custodes list rather than an highly competitive list (i don't want to be "that guy").

**stratigo**

It’s a beautiful model, and often that’s enough of a reason to play with it. It is why I would take it out for a spin. The problem is that unless you rock three, one will collect every las cannon, Melta, bright lance, or other anti tank gun on the table, and even non competitive play can collect a lot of that

**Spartacus**

With T8 and a 6+++, a Teletubby is pretty well equipped to take a hammering. Every big gun directed at him is one not being shot at your bikes. With his best loadout he costs only a little more than a squad of 3 bikes anway.

**Ming**

So... then plan is as follows:

1500 pt. mono Custodes:

Vanguard Detachment
HQ
Valoris

Elite
3x Allarus
1x Contempor with Kheres Pattern Assault Cannon
1x Vexillus Praetor with Vexillia Magnifica

Heavy
Telemon

Supreme Command Detachment
3x Jet Bike Shield Captains one of them is the Warlord with the Auric Aquilis

Gun line with the 2 Dreads and the Vexillia putting a -1 to hit on them

Allarus and Trajann in DP

The 3 bikes frontal attack and/or objective grabbing

I am aware that the army is not ultra competitive and that I lack troops for tactical objectives. My local meta is about rolling dice

and having fun.

**Waaaghpower**

Ming wrote:
So... then plan is as follows:

1500 pt. mono Custodes:

Vanguard Detachment
HQ
Valoris

Elite
3x Allarus
1x Contempor with Kheres Pattern Assault Cannon
1x Vexillus Praetor with Vexillia Magnifica

Heavy
Telemon

Supreme Command Detachment
3x Jet Bike Shield Captains one of them is the Warlord with the Auric Aquilis

Gun line with the 2 Dreads and the Vexillia putting a -1 to hit on them

Allarus and Trajann in DP

The 3 bikes frontal attack and/or objective grabbing

I am aware that the army is not ultra competitive and that I lack troops for tactical objectives. My local meta is about rolling dice and having fun.

"Not competetive" is relative, but this list is going to seriously struggle against a lot of things.
First and most notably, you only have 5 Command Points and 10 models in your entire army. You're going to seriously struggle with map control and will run out of strategems before turn one is over. You probably already knew that.

Also, I'm not really seeing the benefit of running three captains over one captain and four regular bikers. The nice thing about Custodes is that our rank and file hit just as hard as our commanders - All a Captain gets over a regular biker is 3 wounds, 1 attack, relic access, and an aura. Since everyone can use his aura and only one captain is taking a relic, you just don't get much from the extra captains. (The shooting is going to be identical to boot.)

Custodes ven dreads are also not good for gunlines because of our very short range and we're forced to take a melee weapon so we only get 50% dakka.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, and there's just no weight of fire to kill hordes, and very little anti tank to deal with knight-sized enemies.

**str00dles1**

stratigo wrote:
It’s a beautiful model, and often that’s enough of a reason to play with it. It is why I would take it out for a spin. The problem is that unless you rock three, one will collect every las cannon, Melta, bright lance, or other anti tank gun on the table, and even non competitive play can collect a lot of that

You can only take 1 per army though still yea?

**stratigo**

str00dles1 wrote:
stratigo wrote:
It’s a beautiful model, and often that’s enough of a reason to play with it. It is why I would take it out for a spin. The problem is that unless you rock three, one will collect every las cannon, Melta, bright lance, or other anti tank gun on the table, and even non competitive play can collect a lot of that

You can only take 1 per army though still yea?

You can take three. The custodes don’t have the same relic limitations that space marines have.

**str00dles1**

So I just checked the download from warhammer community.

A Telemon Heavy Dreadnought is a single model. It is equipped with two Telemon Caestus, two twin plasma ejectors and a Spiculus bolt launcher. Only one Telemon Heavy Dreadnought may be taken in an army.WEAPON

That's what it says in description. So only 1 an army