Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I really like the Telemon with two Illiastus Culverins. For 242 pts it is a “mini” Leviathan Dreadnought with a FNP. I’ve also been toying around with the Galatus, the 4++ has been really good. I think for 155 pts, it’s a pretty good character/elite killer.

I would expect the Galatus to have it's CC strength increased based on previous discussion. S:User on a Dreadnought CCW must surely be a typo.

Telemon has been readjusted but not significantly nerfed I'd say. Compared to the old Accelerator cannons (which I think were too cheap before), a Storm cannon Telemon now has about the same chaff clearing ability, and improved damage vs T8 vehicles, at greater range, all for 40 points less. It lost some performance vs multi wound infantry and certain niche targets such as Daemon primarchs. Still has the same A+++ durability with only a wound (or 2?) less.

As I posted a while ago it can now reasonably be expected to knock out a LRBT or equivalent target every turn, whereas before it would do about 8 or 9 wounds. In a Custodes list where it's likely that the Telemon is your only solid source of ranged AT, that's an important breakpoint. I'm considering ordering a second at this stage.

I think double Arachnus Storm Cannons is the way to go for the Telemon. Great anti-vehicle and anti-infantry in one makes it a very versatile weapon and with the nerf to the Accelerator Culverins the Arachnus Storm Cannons out performs it against both vehicles and infantry now but not against multi wound elite infantry, which we have plenty of other units that can address those. With the overall points decrease, it's at least as good as it was before all things considered. Definitely still one of Custodes' best units.

Not exactly tactica but I figure I'll ask here anyway. So I have a few custom bases left over from the rest of my army I'd like to use for my Venatari but the flight stems don't sit flat on the bases at all, the whole surface is at an angle. Would it be in bad taste/modeling for advantage if I modeled them on foot without the flight stems? They would only be losing about 1/4" in height, which may make a difference in obscuring their model behind barricades (possibly affecting whether or not they get a cover save).

Spartacus wrote:

I'm considering ordering a second at this stage.

It certainly is a nice model to put together. With 2 I think you'd be committing to mono-custodes but I dont feel that is viable. Are people still committed to making it work?

Erik Trock and Shane Watts are both playing Mono Custodes at LVO. We will see how the event goes for them. I’m super interested in Trock. He keeps playing lists with these 9 Warden blobs.

Speaking of, it seems like Wardens are fitting a role like Bullgryns. I’m gonna try out his list soon, obviously I won’t replicate his play, but I’m still trying to understand how footslogging Custodians can win in the current meta. With the amounts of Orks I’ve seen, not having Hurricane Bolters feels bad.

 Smirrors wrote:

Spartacus wrote:

I'm considering ordering a second at this stage.

It certainly is a nice model to put together. With 2 I think you'd be committing to mono-custodes but I don't feel that is viable. Are people still committed to making it work?

Yeah sure is, I love how it's pre-prepped for magnets. Could still go outrider of bikes, plus 2 Teleboys, banner guy and battalion of Guard if you wanna min-max it. But I don't go to tournaments, pure Custodes is funner, and strong enough for my games.

KampfKrote wrote:
Erik Trock and Shane Watts are both playing Mono Custodes at LVO. We will see how the event goes for them. I’m super interested in Trock. He keeps playing lists with these 9 Warden blobs.

Speaking of, it seems like Wardens are fitting a role like Bullgryns. I’m gonna try out his list soon, obviously I won’t replicate his play, but I’m still trying to understand how footslogging Custodians can win in the current meta. With the amounts of Orks I’ve seen, not having Hurricane Bolters feels bad.

I am definitely interested in these lists if you don't mind sharing them.

Are they using any of the FW units as well?

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

KampfKrote wrote:
Erik Trock and Shane Watts are both playing Mono Custodes at LVO. We will see how the event goes for them. I’m super interested in Trock. He keeps playing lists with these 9 Warden blobs.

Speaking of, it seems like Wardens are fitting a role like Bullgryns. I’m gonna try out his list soon, obviously I won’t replicate his play, but I’m still trying to understand how footslogging Custodians can win in the current meta. With the amounts of Orks I’ve seen, not having Hurricane Bolters feels bad.

I am definitely interested in these lists if you don't mind sharing them.

Are they using any of the FW units as well?

I did a quick google and found this:

https://nightsatthegametable.com/blog/2019/01/21/nick-nanavati-vs-erik-trock-orks-vs-custodes-live-stream-1-22-19/


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also Shane Watts has a thread going on Bolter & Chainsword discussing his LVO list. It's basically just bikes, banner, and a min battalion, nothing radical but no allies.

He said that the Loyal 32 he used to bring would often die easily in the backfield, turning some of his wins into losses (I assume due to the ITC objectives format, not that familiar with it).

Spartacus wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

KampfKrote wrote:
Erik Trock and Shane Watts are both playing Mono Custodes at LVO. We will see how the event goes for them. I’m super interested in Trock. He keeps playing lists with these 9 Warden blobs.

Speaking of, it seems like Wardens are fitting a role like Bullgryns. I’m gonna try out his list soon, obviously I won’t replicate his play, but I’m still trying to understand how footslogging Custodians can win in the current meta. With the amounts of Orks I’ve seen, not having Hurricane Bolters feels bad.

I am definitely interested in these lists if you don't mind sharing them.

Are they using any of the FW units as well?

I did a quick google and found this:

https://nightsatthegametable.com/blog/2019/01/21/nick-nanavati-vs-erik-trock-orks-vs-custodes-live-stream-1-22-19/


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also Shane Watts has a thread going on Bolter & Chainsword discussing his LVO list. It's basically just bikes, banner, and a min battalion, nothing radical but no allies.

He said that the Loyal 32 he used to bring would often die easily in the backfield, turning some of his wins into losses (I assume due to the ITC objectives format, not that familiar with it).

Hmm, interesting. I personally would've dropped the Terminators for 1 additional member each for the troops and then an Eversor for dirty and cheap horde destroying.

More importantly, he's not running any bikers outside a Captain. That's interesting to me.

Also what you're talking about might be Reaper, where you score an additional VP for killing a squad of 10+ models. If you wanna avoid that, typically you take a heavy weapon. Was he not doing that?

Trocks LVO list is a tiny bit different from the one he played on NatGT.

Here it is:



Additionally, Shane was running DKOK as his 32, so no heavy weapons in the infantry squads.

Interesting list.

FW beta custodies are not legal for LVO so that's why you wont see any.

I made a unit of 5 melta spear custodies as I feel they may be useful. Deepstrike em down to tank hunt.

Hopefully youll see lits with the new FW stuff added to see whats good/bad for turney

str00dles1 wrote:
Interesting list.

FW beta custodies are not legal for LVO so that's why you wont see any.

I made a unit of 5 melta spear custodies as I feel they may be useful. Deepstrike em down to tank hunt.

Hopefully youll see lits with the new FW stuff added to see whats good/bad for turney

Due to the rules cutoff the lvo implmented and not a standing ban of beta or forge world rules as a note

str00dles1 wrote:
Interesting list.

FW beta custodies are not legal for LVO so that's why you wont see any.

I made a unit of 5 melta spear custodies as I feel they may be useful. Deepstrike em down to tank hunt.

Hopefully youll see lits with the new FW stuff added to see whats good/bad for turney

So how much more effective for the points is that compared to the FW Bikes or our current bikes with the Launcher?

3 Melta Spear is 180
3 Las Pulsar bike is 360
3 salvo bike is 285

Spears will cost a CP as you don't want to run them up the field being only 12 inch range, and bikes are obviously faster. Bikes though hit on 3s most of the time as a big part of them being useful is on the charge.

I think they are pretty point efficient, and looks even better as 5 guys since they are only 15 points more then the 3 salvo bikes, hit on 2s and get 5 shots to the 3 of bikes.

I feel the Las Pulsar bikes are pretty terrible all over. They don't really have a role. You can get lots of other anti tank or anti chaf for cheaper

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:


Also what you're talking about might be Reaper, where you score an additional VP for killing a squad of 10+ models. If you wanna avoid that, typically you take a heavy weapon. Was he not doing that?

Reaper no longer works like that. Its kill every 20 models to get 1 point. In a custodes list even with loyal 32, no one will pick this secondary as at best it will give you 2 out of 4.

Loyal 32 can however easily give away Kill One primary.

I'm writing a custodes list, and I've got 1210 points to play with. Trying to figure out the best possible loadout.
I only have seven Jetbikes in total, and will be getting ten command points from my other detachments of Sisters of Battle. I don't have any Terminator models, but I do have Traajan.

What's the best configuration for what I can take? If I have points leftover I can spend them on the Sisters of Battle.

I can't work out any way to take a Battalion and all of my bikes without going over on points. I could take a Battalion with two Jetbike captains and only four bikes in a squad, but that seems suboptimal.

I can always just take a Patrol detachment with a Jetbike captain, six Jetbikes, and then one great big unit of Custodians - This did pretty well for me at a previous tournament, albeit a tournament with a smaller points value. I'd be able to take Nine custodians, which is a pretty imposing unit to be able to Deep Strike.

Or, as a variant of that, I could take a smaller unit of Custodians with a buff character - I'm leaning towards Trajan, for the rerolls and the Command Point refund, or else a Vexilus with the standard Magnifica, to give my bikes more durability in the earlygame and save a possibility for super-close Deep Strikes. (Autocharging Custodes from Deep Strike, if I can get in close and lucky.)

NOTE: It occurs to me that I could make it a battalion if I wanted to, by dropping one of my Sisters of Battle battalions. This wouldn't gain me any command points, but if I wanted to take more custodians it would be possible.
I don't think that's worth it, but it's something to consider.

Waaaghpower wrote:
I'm writing a custodes list, and I've got 1210 points to play with. Trying to figure out the best possible loadout.
I only have seven Jetbikes in total, and will be getting ten command points from my other detachments of Sisters of Battle. I don't have any Terminator models, but I do have Traajan.

What's the best configuration for what I can take? If I have points leftover I can spend them on the Sisters of Battle.

I can't work out any way to take a Battalion and all of my bikes without going over on points. I could take a Battalion with two Jetbike captains and only four bikes in a squad, but that seems suboptimal.

I can always just take a Patrol detachment with a Jetbike captain, six Jetbikes, and then one great big unit of Custodians - This did pretty well for me at a previous tournament, albeit a tournament with a smaller points value. I'd be able to take Nine custodians, which is a pretty imposing unit to be able to Deep Strike.

Or, as a variant of that, I could take a smaller unit of Custodians with a buff character - I'm leaning towards Trajan, for the rerolls and the Command Point refund, or else a Vexilus with the standard Magnifica, to give my bikes more durability in the earlygame and save a possibility for super-close Deep Strikes. (Autocharging Custodes from Deep Strike, if I can get in close and lucky.)

NOTE: It occurs to me that I could make it a battalion if I wanted to, by dropping one of my Sisters of Battle battalions. This wouldn't gain me any command points, but if I wanted to take more custodians it would be possible.
I don't think that's worth it, but it's something to consider.

You could take a Supreme Command det of 3x Shield Captains as well as a unit of 3-4 Vertus. Not sure if Sisters would be a good combo, as from what I've read they're still only mid-tier and their main gimmick (AoF) will ever hardly perform miracles (ironically).

I think you'll have to decide between wanting all your bikes or trimming some points off elsewhere from your Sisters. Personally I'd go for the latter.

 Valkyrie wrote:

You could take a Supreme Command det of 3x Shield Captains as well as a unit of 3-4 Vertus. Not sure if Sisters would be a good combo, as from what I've read they're still only mid-tier and their main gimmick (AoF) will ever hardly perform miracles (ironically).

I think you'll have to decide between wanting all your bikes or trimming some points off elsewhere from your Sisters. Personally I'd go for the latter.

I played a similar version of this list at a 1750pt tournament and was quite happy with the Sisters' performance. They function a lot like the Loyal 32, acting as extremely efficient Command Point batteries, then to boost up my anti-tank since I'm quite low on it, I added in four meltaguns and two combi-meltas, and threw some of the squads into Repressors. I run them as Bloody Rose, which means they also have a decent, (if not great,) amount of counter-charge capacity. Against light infantry or hordes they can actually hold their own and kick some serious butt. (One Canoness will actually be able to deal serious damage to enemy beatsticks and monsters, too - She'll have 5 or 6 WS2+, S6, AP-3, D3 attacks that reroll hits and wounds.

More importantly, if I need Deny the Witch I take the Brazier of Eternal Flame and I suddenly have four or five DtW rolls that can easily shut down enemy psykers, on top of a 1cp Strategem to shut down powers on a 4+.

All in all, I've got ten Command Points, four or five Deny the Witch, six mobile Meltaguns with a pair of 12w boxes to keep them safe, four mobile Heavy Flamers, and a massive amount of board control for 790pts. You're right, though - The Acts of Faith to jack all and might as well not exist.

Supreme Command Detachments only allow for HQ and Elites, so how would I bring in the Vertus Praetors? I'm limited to three detachments and already have two full Battalions of sisters of battle.

Incidentally, I did work out a variant where I drop two of the Heavy Flamers from the repressor and I have just enough points to bring two Shield Captain bikes, 3x three-man squads of Custodians, and five regular jetbikes. That's all my bikes, but I'm worried the three-man Custodians won't have enough weight behind them to be worth deep striking, and they're incredibly slow on foot.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Okay, I have two "Good" options:

Jetbike Captain
8x Custodians with Spears
Vexillus Magnifica (-1 To Hit)
2x 3 Jetbikes

OR

2x Jetbike Captain
3x Three Custodians with Spears
5 Jetbikes

The points cost is identical.

Option A has the advantage of a denser unit, better durability for my jetbikes on turn one (Because -1 To Hit,) and much more efficient use of Strategems on the big squad. I can Deep Strike them all together, (Directly adjacent to the Vexillus, if I want, allowing for a short range charge,) Piercing Strike is fabulous on a giant unit, and Avenge the Fallen allows for a huge amount of attacks if I get charged by a threatening unit. (What's that? You killed two or three of my Custodians? I now have more attacks than I had before.)

Option B gives me a bit more flexibility in deployment and five more Command Points, but I lose out on durability for my jetbikes the first time I get blasted, and three small squads are a lot less Command Point efficient.

So I have been waffling on guardian squad load outs. When considering a battalion formation I am wondering how necessary is a storm shield in a 3 man squad? And how viable is a storm shield and blade shield captain?

 BrotherGecko wrote:
So I have been waffling on guardian squad load outs. When considering a battalion formation I am wondering how necessary is a storm shield in a 3 man squad? And how viable is a storm shield and blade shield captain?

I always like to run a shield in my 3 man squads. When I run a mostly foot list, anything without a 3++ tends to be the target of heavy weapons, so the best remedy is to give every unit a 3++. Different story if you're going to teleport a bigger squad, or put them in a transport - you can probably afford to go all spears.

Storm shield on a Captain is fine, but if you can its better to give him the Eagles eye relic and have the best of both worlds. Better yet, put him on a bike.

I have been running the grav tanks with The captain-general. They do work.

Just did a game with 2 Bike captains 2 units of Vertus 1 Grav-attack, Trajann, and 3 Grav tanks (w/ 3 Assassins) vs an Admech force with a Gallant. Ran roughshod over him. Only model I lost was the grav-attack. Several got banged up but were still kicking in the end.

Gonna be testing out the new termies today.

1 cheapo squad /w bolters and claws
1 squad with firepikes and claws
1 squad with pikes and fists


By the time i got to the FW line at the LVO they were sold out of all the callidus grav tanks and I got the last pack of fist guys.

So, Wardens.

They're like, what, 7 points more than a Guardian, get two extra attacks (including the misercordia) and a 6+ ignore wounds roll? Why are these guys not the staple of every Custodes list???

...no, really, why? In other words, how to use Wardens effectively, from a tactical standpoint. Should they basically supplant/replace my regular Guardians? What do I dooo.

Note, I'm not asking whether to take Wardens, or if they're better than Allarus - that argument is done to death. I just want to know tactically the best way to use them.

Deep Strike them and enjoy the fact the opponent has to really commit to killing them.

Sole purpose of Guardians is to make sure those objectives are kept and generating CP. Assuming you run Guard alongside though, this would not be an argument in their favor.

In my opinion if your going to use them best as a Deepstrike unit or in an Orion. They are tough customers bit not durable enough to take a pounding in the open. Getting them to their target seems to be a bit of a trick.

The game fell a bit short but let me tell you, the firepikes are probably the best assassin weapon in the game atm.

3d6 str6 hits with -1 ap hitting a character is pretty effective at killing them.

Took 5 wounds off a C'tan, and one shot an overlord with the two squads I took.

the 12" range from deep strike really gives you some flexability in their deep strike to hit characters that aren't completely surrounded by troops.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
The game fell a bit short but let me tell you, the firepikes are probably the best assassin weapon in the game atm.

3d6 str6 hits with -1 ap hitting a character is pretty effective at killing them.

Took 5 wounds off a C'tan, and one shot an overlord with the two squads I took.

the 12" range from deep strike really gives you some flexability in their deep strike to hit characters that aren't completely surrounded by troops.

How are you sniping characters with Aqilons?

The Allarus stratagems won't work with them right?

Even though they are on fairly large bases, they still come in a unit of 3, which is fairly easy to squeeze in with their deep strike. With the 12" range, they can pop in like 11" away from a character on turn 2/3 and snipe them off as long as your opponent isn't a perfectionist with his placement.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
The game fell a bit short but let me tell you, the firepikes are probably the best assassin weapon in the game atm.

3d6 str6 hits with -1 ap hitting a character is pretty effective at killing them.

Took 5 wounds off a C'tan, and one shot an overlord with the two squads I took.

the 12" range from deep strike really gives you some flexability in their deep strike to hit characters that aren't completely surrounded by troops.

Huh, maybe I will give them a second chance. Last time I used them, I deep struck them into a GSC backfield. On the GSC player's turn, they ate 20D6 S3 auto-hits from his infantry squad, which he brought in from deep strike in response. Hurt them pretty bad.