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stratigo wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except one is AP3 and one is AP 0. Also one is assault, and one is heavy, not that it matters being a fire weapon, but they don't get max hits being a fire weapon, the launcher does. I will take 9 extra shots of S4 AP3 D1 character targeting over the firepikes random number of shots that can't target characters or be fired after advancing.

Firepikes are ap 1 and strength 6.

Also, what is simultaneously a Character (to be targeted) AND a horde?

Character targeting....

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except one is AP3 and one is AP 0. Also one is assault, and one is heavy, not that it matters being a fire weapon, but they don't get max hits being a fire weapon, the launcher does. I will take 9 extra shots of S4 AP3 D1 character targeting over the firepikes random number of shots that can't target characters or be fired after advancing.

Flamers could easily get the max shots. We don't know what weapons are blast. We do know it will be by the weapon. Not generic "all random shot weapons"

Just curious, how many CPs did you guys normally run in a 2000pt game (with or without souping)

Having 12 automatically regardless of army compensation feels like a big burden has been taken off my shoulders, although I’ve seen lots of complaints for IG players for example who ran over quadruple this number.

12CP + the ones generated over the course of the game so possibly more like 18CP. Seems great for pure custodes.

nemesis464 wrote:
Just curious, how many CPs did you guys normally run in a 2000pt game (with or without souping)

Having 12 automatically regardless of army compensation feels like a big burden has been taken off my shoulders, although I’ve seen lots of complaints for IG players for example who ran over quadruple this number.

4 to 9, usually 8 from a single battalion

I ran 5 plus Trajann in my tournament list. In my casual lists i go with 8 plus maybe Trajann.

I am looking forward to having 15+ CP. Really pump for the new edition and War of the Spider. I a bit consered that troopswill be played a lot less. The new Action thing they previewed could be a reason to take cheap troops but.

12+5+D3 = 18-20 CPs if taking Trajann who is likely back to his original 250 price tag.

That lets us use stooping dive or Vexilla homer without blowing our load. We can tanglefoot twice a turn with complete freedom and who knows what the new strats are... Exciting stuff.

I’d likely go with a battalion of 2 min shields and 1 spear bomb. Then either Allarus or bikes. Trajann & bike SC and a vexilla.

A patrol is another attractive options so we can just take 1 HQ and 2 troops but still get the 2 elites.

So far 9th is shaping up nicely imo. Could be we just use a few min squads of sisters to perform actions while our golden boys go smash heads.

Yeah I was running outrider+spearhead a lot, so starting with anything more than 5 is a win. If we get sisters as troops a single battalion will probably be a go-to, and even if not the action system makes regular guard more interesting.
I’m also scared/hopeful for the points changes, if we get a relative points rebalance compared to other factions then that could be a buff or nerf.

I suspect patrols will be the way to go in the next edition

I think if you only want 2 elite or 2 fast attack then the patrol is great (proving you get it for net free). I think I’ll still be going for the battalion as I’ll want 2 units of guards and then maybe a unit or two of cheap sisters to complete objectives. No point bringing expensive models if they can’t fight or shoot.

I’m seriously eyeing up my Telemon. If it can shoot in melee (big if) then two flamer fists and FGLTC sounds great. I’d never do that in 8th because it was ineffective against chaff and it was too many CPs if I wanted to bring Wardens, Allarus, or spear blob... but now it sounds pretty fun.

Hey Custodes folks!

So I'm REALLY thinking about starting up a Custodes force when the new PA drops, and I was curious about what you veteran janitorial players thought was likely to be included for them in that new book.

I was also curious what you would really LIKE to see from the new PA...

leerm02 wrote:
Hey Custodes folks!

So I'm REALLY thinking about starting up a Custodes force when the new PA drops, and I was curious about what you veteran janitorial players thought was likely to be included for them in that new book.

I was also curious what you would really LIKE to see from the new PA...

I am fairly sure sisters of silence will be folded in to and included with custodes.

Other than that, it is pretty much a mystery. There's no way to tell. There's no one theme in PA, some armies got a lot of buffs and benefits, some just got shafted, and there's no way to tell until they start dropping previews.

Hopefully June is the preview/release month for “War of the Spider” since Engine War is out and Pariah and 9th Edition are supposedly end of July (no one really knows but that’s my local gossip)

Edit: Looks like we’ll start getting some previews this week!
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/06/07/sunday-preview-zoats-and-spiders/

War of the spider previews start this week.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/06/07/sunday-preview-zoats-and-spiders/

leerm02 wrote:
Hey Custodes folks!

So I'm REALLY thinking about starting up a Custodes force when the new PA drops, and I was curious about what you veteran janitorial players thought was likely to be included for them in that new book.

I was also curious what you would really LIKE to see from the new PA...

I wrote out a more lengthy reply to your post on a phone and then accidently swipe refreshed and it was gone.

So in shorter form, what we know from GW, and what I expect based on previous PA books:

Basically confirmed by GW:
- Custodes and Sisters of Silence receiving some mechanism to combine their forces into a legal, battleforged detachment, possibly via a TALONS OF THE EMPEROR keyword.
- Rules for Valerian and Aleya models, hopefully not just a reprint of the original rules which were sent out with them which are bad and non-functional.

Highly likely (in my opinion) based on previous PA books:
-New stratagems
-New relics and WL traits

Less likely (in my opinion) based on previous PA books:
-Faction applicable buffs for being a pure army à la SM combat doctrines
-Roll-your-own sub faction rules
-Unit specific options added (like Eldar Exarch powers)

A lot of people are expecting to see a doctrine like bonus to help with how apparently Custodes are struggling on the tabletop (not my experience but hey...). While it would be nice, I don't see it happening really. The only factions who got it were SM factions who didn't get their equivalent doctrines in the updated SM codex version 2. Namely Grey Knights, Dark Angels, Blood Angels and Black Templars. Everyone else has just had some other form of faction type rule like the roll-your-own systems of Eldar, Dark Eldar, Imperial Guard etc which were cool but not blatant buffs. The Talons of the Emperor will be 'the faction thing' Custodes get. There is a slight chance GW could do something with the sects within the Adeptus Custodes, but unlikely I think.

As far as what I'd like to see, some cool new stratagems to make use of all the upcoming 9th edition CP would be good. Im hoping for at least one defensive stratagem for infantry units, something like Transhuman Physiology which would really help my Warden-star. Also more strats that play off the subterfuge aspect of the Eyes of the emperor(would an 'Agents of Vect' equivalent be too much to ask??).

CSM didn't get any doctrines or similar. The heck you talking about?

 JNAProductions wrote:
CSM didn't get any doctrines or similar. The heck you talking about?

Really? My Tsons player friend has mislead me then. I haven't played 'regular' CSM since the PA books. Ill remove that.

Exactly my point though, if you're not Marines, don't expect doctrines.

Spartacus wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
CSM didn't get any doctrines or similar. The heck you talking about?

Really? My Tsons player friend has mislead me then. I haven't played 'regular' CSM since the PA books. Ill remove that.

Exactly my point though, if you're not Marines, don't expect doctrines.

TSons got cults, but they're not like Doctrines. I don't play TSons myself, so I can't validate exactly what they are, but if that's what he's talking about, then he's been on the up and up.

 JNAProductions wrote:

Spartacus wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
CSM didn't get any doctrines or similar. The heck you talking about?

Really? My Tsons player friend has mislead me then. I haven't played 'regular' CSM since the PA books. Ill remove that.

Exactly my point though, if you're not Marines, don't expect doctrines.

TSons got cults, but they're not like Doctrines. I don't play TSons myself, so I can't validate exactly what they are, but if that's what he's talking about, then he's been on the up and up.

Yeah the Tsons cults are just Psychic powers, WL traits and Relics. He seemed to think that the vanilla legions got some new rules equivalent to doctrines though, evidently not the case as you said.

So with the new shooting into combat and Heavy weapons rules, it looks like the Telemon is back on the menu? Can shoot into combat now with a penalty and can move and shoot freely now is huge. Could also make a hybrid option with one storm cannon and caestus viable now? I can also see Agamatus bikes benefiting from these changes as well.

Mr. Funktastic wrote:
So with the new shooting into combat and Heavy weapons rules, it looks like the Telemon is back on the menu? Can shoot into combat now with a penalty and can move and shoot freely now is huge. Could also make a hybrid option with one storm cannon and caestus viable now? I can also see Agamatus bikes benefiting from these changes as well.

I didn’t even know this was a thing to be honest, where are you finding these new rules?

Great news though- I’ve got 2 hybrid Telemon and they felt so torn between 2 roles before.

nemesis464 wrote:

I didn’t even know this was a thing to be honest, where are you finding these new rules?

GW is doing a daily stream with rules snippets from 9th. The Tank/Monster and Heavy weapons changes were today's topic.

Is the heavy weapons that all random dice equal max hits? Because that is a massive let down. We don't have much in the way of random shot heavy weapons. The Plasma Flamers are nice for anti hordem but that telemon will get nuked on the first turn, Also, given GW's threat to re-do all FW model rules, I doubt you will see this thing survive it's current state in 8th into 9th. 24 S7 AP3 autohitting shots? Yeah, call me crazy but I don't see that making the cut.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I doubt you will see this thing survive it's current state in 8th into 9th. 24 S7 AP3 autohitting shots? Yeah, call me crazy but I don't see that making the cut.

Am I missing something? Isn’t it just 12 S6 AP2 shots (+the bolt launcher)?

The 2x plasma projector only spit out 6 each (2xD3) because they’re not actually twin linked.

We also have no idea on what weapons will get the Blast keyword. That hasn’t been released yet. Today’s info was just in regards to tanks shooting in combat, and helping everyone see the light on my precious Agamatus bikes by revealing that the -1 to hit penalty for moving and shooting with heavy weapons only applies to infantry.

nemesis464 wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I doubt you will see this thing survive it's current state in 8th into 9th. 24 S7 AP3 autohitting shots? Yeah, call me crazy but I don't see that making the cut.

Am I missing something? Isn’t it just 12 S6 AP2 shots (+the bolt launcher)?

The 2x plasma projector only spit out 6 each (2xD3) because they’re not actually twin linked.

Thats my feth up, I was looking at the pre nerf stats of 2d6 shots of S7 AP 3. Still, 12 auto-hitting S6 AP2 it either overkill for trash hordes, or underwhelming for it's real purpose, Big target hunting. Besides, the guy above is right. It's pointless to say something is or isn't going to be awesome. Telemons are getting a rules review per GW, as are all FW. Other than Telemons, we don't have any random shot heavy weapons so this is a fairly pointless tactic for us.

My question is what is the definition of "horde". I would hope it's more than 10, but even that does nothing for us. Thank god I never assembled that Lehman Russ. Punisher tanks with flamers backing up lines of bikes or Telemons. Welcome back to Dakkahammer 40k.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:

nemesis464 wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I doubt you will see this thing survive it's current state in 8th into 9th. 24 S7 AP3 autohitting shots? Yeah, call me crazy but I don't see that making the cut.

Am I missing something? Isn’t it just 12 S6 AP2 shots (+the bolt launcher)?

The 2x plasma projector only spit out 6 each (2xD3) because they’re not actually twin linked.

Thats my feth up, I was looking at the pre nerf stats of 2d6 shots of S7 AP 3. Still, 12 auto-hitting S6 AP2 it either overkill for trash hordes, or underwhelming for it's real purpose, Big target hunting. Besides, the guy above is right. It's pointless to say something is or isn't going to be awesome. Telemons are getting a rules review per GW, as are all FW. Other than Telemons, we don't have any random shot heavy weapons so this is a fairly pointless tactic for us.

My question is what is the definition of "horde". I would hope it's more than 10, but even that does nothing for us. Thank god I never assembled that Lehman Russ. Punisher tanks with flamers backing up lines of bikes or Telemons. Welcome back to Dakkahammer 40k.

In terms of the upcoming "blast" weapon rule, it may or may not be useful for the Telemon, we just don't know enough about it yet. The thing to get excited about now is the fact that Dreadnoughts and vehicles like the Telemon can now move and shoot its heavy weapons without penalty and even if it gets tied up in combat it can pretty easily get itself out of it especially if it goes with a hybrid loadout.

Thanks for the feedback folks! I think I'm gonna "pull the trigger" on collecting Custodes then :-)

...now if only there was a "start collecting" box. Oh well!

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Is the heavy weapons that all random dice equal max hits? Because that is a massive let down. We don't have much in the way of random shot heavy weapons. The Plasma Flamers are nice for anti hordem but that telemon will get nuked on the first turn, Also, given GW's threat to re-do all FW model rules, I doubt you will see this thing survive it's current state in 8th into 9th. 24 S7 AP3 autohitting shots? Yeah, call me crazy but I don't see that making the cut.

We can safely tell it's not blanket random shots is blast. For starter rulebook will have appendix telling by weapon which has blast. Not needed if it's blanket. Also blast can't be used in melee and heavy flamers were called out as nasty for vehicles in melee