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2018/04/18 14:16:49
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Skullhammer wrote: I keep seeing deepstriking destroyers but cant find an ability in thd dex to allow this, how are people doing this?
Nephrek Destroyers can be placed in deep strike using a 1 point stratagem prior to the first battle round.
I think its called translocation crypt.
For now, it seems to be 100% the best way to use destroyers. Drop them in, pop eradication protocols, and delete something off the board. Their 24 inch range means they should not be able to be auspex scanned or the like, so double win there.
Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts
MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum.
2018/04/18 14:39:47
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
As an experiment I thought I'd try to see what our absolute maximum CP amount would be in a 2000 point list using the new list building restrictions in the FAQ:
• maximum 3 detachments
• only 1 of any detachment type
• maximum 3 of any particular unit (excluding Troops).
Spoiler:
++ Brigade Detachment +12CP [66 PL, 1281pts] ++
+ HQ +
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
Looks like the maximum CP we can get is 21 (including 3 for battleforged).
(and no, there was no way to fit Imotekh in for an extra 1 CP this time with these restrictions)
Note: this is not meant to be a "good list".
I was just trying to see what our absolute limits were.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/18 14:45:45
2018/04/18 14:42:01
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
skoffs wrote: As an experiment I thought I'd try to see what our absolute maximum CP amount would be in a 2000 point list using the new list building restrictions in the FAQ:
• maximum 3 detachments
• only 1 of any detachment type
• maximum 3 of any particular unit (excluding Troops).
Spoiler:
++ Brigade Detachment +12CP [66 PL, 1281pts] ++
+ HQ +
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
punisher357 wrote: Do you happen to know the command point difference if we elected to use Imotek?
If we're going for maximum CP there's no way to fit him in this scenario using 2000 points (I tried using a Supreme Command Detachment and juggling the HQs around, but because everything was already the cheapest it could get there just weren't enough points left over).
I guess you could instead remove the Outrider detachment completely and substitute Imotekh as one of the Battalion's HQ, but you would still end up with the same amount of points (though I guess you'd probably have more points left to buff things with... you know, if this was a real list someone intended to play with... which they shouldn't because it's bad).
2018/04/18 15:09:46
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
out, add immotek for the 1cp, and acctually have some points to play around with (though not many)
Yes, as I told punisher357 it'd be the same amount of CP, just a bit more points to pad things out.
But again, this is not a real attempt at a list, just an exercise to see how many CP our absolute maximum was.
Ideally we can probably expect between 9 (battalion + 1 CP minor Detachment) and 16 (Brigade + 1 CP minor Detachment). It might be possible to do a Brigade + Battalion for 20, but it probably wouldn't be as optimized a list as the lesser alternatives.
Either way, I think it may be safe to say we probably won't be playing any more lists consisting of only minor Detachments (ie. no Batt or Brig). The sacrifice in CP is just not worth it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/18 15:24:05
2018/04/18 15:33:46
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
skoffs wrote: So,
With the increase in available CP, what are people's thoughts on Nephrekh reserving half of its forces to come onto the table turn 2?
Pros: keep your guys safe from long range fire.
Cons: if they DO manage to kill the stuff you have on the table turn one, that's a quick game over.
Just to point out that Sudden Death (pg. 215 of the main rulebook) is only checked for at the end of any turn after the first battle round. If you go first and get wiped out in the first battle round, you still have your turn in the second battle round to bring more units on to the table.
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
2018/04/18 15:36:06
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Wraiths could advance 18", not bad, and still charge for an extra CP. Scarabs would also like the extra 6". Most C'Tans too, since they can still fire their powers at end of move phase.
Immortals could move 11" and still shoot twice, albeit with -1 to hit.
Same with tesla tomb blades. Characters could get places to provide buffs.
You get the solar staff, which is not too shabby.
The vault could get in position for his CTan powers and still shoot decently.
Its not extra 6". Dont think about this bonus that way. With normal advance you get medium 3,5". So you get extra 2,5" and fly.
Most units prefere sautekh dynasty with better shoot after 3,5" advance.
Sautekh suffer the same -1 after advance as other dynasties, right? It's just that more weapons now get to shoot in the first place
2018/04/18 15:44:33
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Wraiths could advance 18", not bad, and still charge for an extra CP. Scarabs would also like the extra 6". Most C'Tans too, since they can still fire their powers at end of move phase.
Immortals could move 11" and still shoot twice, albeit with -1 to hit.
Same with tesla tomb blades. Characters could get places to provide buffs.
You get the solar staff, which is not too shabby.
The vault could get in position for his CTan powers and still shoot decently.
Its not extra 6". Dont think about this bonus that way. With normal advance you get medium 3,5". So you get extra 2,5" and fly.
Most units prefere sautekh dynasty with better shoot after 3,5" advance.
Sautekh suffer the same -1 after advance as other dynasties, right? It's just that more weapons now get to shoot in the first place
Yep, still have the -1 to hit... a real hoser for Tesla weapons, even with the strategem or MWBD.
2018/04/18 15:52:25
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Skullhammer wrote: I keep seeing deepstriking destroyers but cant find an ability in thd dex to allow this, how are people doing this?
Nephrek Destroyers can be placed in deep strike using a 1 point stratagem prior to the first battle round.
I think its called translocation crypt.
For now, it seems to be 100% the best way to use destroyers. Drop them in, pop eradication protocols, and delete something off the board. Their 24 inch range means they should not be able to be auspex scanned or the like, so double win there.
You can do the destroyer trick using C'Tan deceiver. Don't have to take an outrider detachment. Can Alpha turn 1.
2018/04/18 15:57:48
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Wraiths could advance 18", not bad, and still charge for an extra CP. Scarabs would also like the extra 6". Most C'Tans too, since they can still fire their powers at end of move phase.
Immortals could move 11" and still shoot twice, albeit with -1 to hit.
Same with tesla tomb blades. Characters could get places to provide buffs.
You get the solar staff, which is not too shabby.
The vault could get in position for his CTan powers and still shoot decently.
Its not extra 6". Dont think about this bonus that way. With normal advance you get medium 3,5". So you get extra 2,5" and fly.
Most units prefere sautekh dynasty with better shoot after 3,5" advance.
Sautekh suffer the same -1 after advance as other dynasties, right? It's just that more weapons now get to shoot in the first place
Yep, still have the -1 to hit... a real hoser for Tesla weapons, even with the strategem or MWBD.
Coupling with MWBD negates that, though, and it's really nice for Gauss weaponry since you can close the distance and still get some of that sweet AP-2 Immortal shooting.
Skullhammer wrote: I keep seeing deepstriking destroyers but cant find an ability in thd dex to allow this, how are people doing this?
Nephrek Destroyers can be placed in deep strike using a 1 point stratagem prior to the first battle round.
I think its called translocation crypt.
For now, it seems to be 100% the best way to use destroyers. Drop them in, pop eradication protocols, and delete something off the board. Their 24 inch range means they should not be able to be auspex scanned or the like, so double win there.
You can do the destroyer trick using C'Tan deceiver. Don't have to take an outrider detachment. Can Alpha turn 1.
Main downside being if you go second, they have to just sit out there and get shot. Deep Strike also keeps them safe from long range shooting things like Artillery and Flyers/other units that get up the board fast, so you can put them down when and where they'll be safe to shoot.
2018/04/18 16:45:46
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Nephrekh dynasty on a Warlord Anarkyr sandwich in between Flayed Ones and/or Lychguard could be nasty. Advance everything up turn 1 for maximum movement, use cover if possible.
Dispersion Field Stragem turn 1 for lychaguard for survivability and then use use Disruption field for increase Strength next turn when they get in.
Maybe use scarabs or wraiths to advance in front of these guys to pose a more immediate threat so that your opponent has to decide which to shoot. Thoughts?
10000+
10000+
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3500+ IK Plus 1x Warhound, Reaver, Warlord Titans
Dynas wrote: Nephrekh dynasty on a Warlord Anarkyr sandwich in between Flayed Ones and/or Lychguard could be nasty. Advance everything up turn 1 for maximum movement, use cover if possible.
Dispersion Field Stragem turn 1 for lychaguard for survivability and then use use Disruption field for increase Strength next turn when they get in.
Maybe use scarabs or wraiths to advance in front of these guys to pose a more immediate threat so that your opponent has to decide which to shoot. Thoughts?
Probably would work for a casual, friendly game. I'd use a unit of wraiths to provide target priority issues.
Or, sell out, and run 18 Nephrek Wraiths, 10 Lychguard with Anrakyr in a Night Scythe, and then watch them scramble to try and beat all those units. Pretty lulzy stuff. I call the list "Space Jam" because it goes hard in the paint.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/18 17:01:26
Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts
MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum.
2018/04/18 17:01:42
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Dynas wrote: Nephrekh dynasty on a Warlord Anarkyr sandwich in between Flayed Ones and/or Lychguard could be nasty. Advance everything up turn 1 for maximum movement, use cover if possible.
Dispersion Field Stragem turn 1 for lychaguard for survivability and then use use Disruption field for increase Strength next turn when they get in.
Maybe use scarabs or wraiths to advance in front of these guys to pose a more immediate threat so that your opponent has to decide which to shoot. Thoughts?
I'd rather just use Warlord Kutlakh at that point.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
2018/04/18 18:10:37
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Requizen wrote: Does Kutlakh get to pick a Warlord Trait? How does Maynarkh even work with Dynasty Codes/Artifacts/Stratagems?
It's a custom dynasty as far as codex rules are concerned, pick the features of any dynasty
Well, RAW, he doesn't get a Warlord Trait because he's a Named Character, and Named Characters have to use the Trait of their Dynasty, there is none for <Maynarkh>, though one could argue his "advance + charge" rule is essentially a Warlord Trait.
However, if your units are <Maynarkh>, then they can't use the Stratagem or Artifact of any named Dynasty, since those specifically reference <Sautekh> or <Novokh> or whatever. So you could have a <Maynarkh> unit that uses <Novokh> Code to reroll hits in the first round of Combat, but they could never use Blood Rites since that specifies a "<Novokh> Unit".
2018/04/18 18:49:06
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Requizen wrote: Does Kutlakh get to pick a Warlord Trait? How does Maynarkh even work with Dynasty Codes/Artifacts/Stratagems?
Until FW picks one for him, yeah you're picking the Code and Warlord Trait. You won't get the relic though that's special, and unsure how the specific Stratatgems would work. I know with Marines you're allowed to use the parent Chapter Strategem (proven with Bolter Drill being usable with Kantor and crew).
2018/04/18 19:01:56
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Requizen wrote: Does Kutlakh get to pick a Warlord Trait? How does Maynarkh even work with Dynasty Codes/Artifacts/Stratagems?
Until FW picks one for him, yeah you're picking the Code and Warlord Trait. You won't get the relic though that's special, and unsure how the specific Stratatgems would work. I know with Marines you're allowed to use the parent Chapter Strategem (proven with Bolter Drill being usable with Kantor and crew).
Huh, yeah it's only the code that you get with the current wording. As a named character he shouldn't have an extra trait I agree.
2018/04/18 19:29:39
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Came Across this from a high level tourney player. Interesting quote regarding the FAQ:
"Durable units that can take shooting for a bit while they wait for reinforcements will see more play, and faster units that can effectively redeploy will be more valuable to make up for the momentum loss."
Da W wrote: I almost see no point of taking a 1CP force when you can just add 3X5 immortals and a cryptek for 5CP. That's +340pts for +4CP and its not like those points will do nothing on the table! You at least need a bataillon, i think you waste enormous potential if you do not.
Uh, yeah, that's why I said,
skoffs wrote: see if I can fit a Deceiver Super-Heavy Bomb™ in with a minimum Nephrekh Battalion, dropping the three troop units on to objectives instead of having them march there.
However, after doing the math, it looks like the cheapest Battalion load out (2x Sword Lords, 3x 5 Immortals) that includes the Deceiver + Vaults is 2120 points, so the Super-Heavy Bomb build isn't going to work (you could technically still fit a Super-Heavy Detachment and a bare minimum requirements Battalion together in one 2000 point list... but to do so you would need to take 2 Obelisks with the Vault, so that's definitely not worth it.)
If you're going for a Battalion to try for maximum CP, looks like you're restricted to taking the Vault as an Auxiliary only. (which is fine).
If you want 3x Vaults + The Deceiver you're going to have to opt for an Outrider.
You can also take triple cloaktek supreme command as a medic squad with some upgraded staff of light.
2018/04/18 20:29:41
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
I'm very excited with all these changes. This really is a new game....it shifts every army and play strategy in one way or another.
I do think it's kind of ironic that we seemed to be at a disadvantage with the necron army in a lot of aspects and the "solution" wasn't to improve our army, but instead to alter the entire meta.
I really like where this is all headed and I'm very optimistic about the results. I think there will still be a little tweaking, but overall it's going to be good.
I'm hopeful that the Monolith might be worthwhile now....I think it's still a little too pricey, but in casual games that teleportation is going to be a lot of fun.
2018/04/18 21:30:57
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
iGuy91 wrote: Probably would work for a casual, friendly game. I'd use a unit of wraiths to provide target priority issues. Or, sell out, and run 18 Nephrek Wraiths, 10 Lychguard with Anrakyr in a Night Scythe, and then watch them scramble to try and beat all those units. Pretty lulzy stuff. I call the list "Space Jam" because it goes hard in the paint.
How does Anrakyr utilize a Night Scythe? He doesn't have a dynasty keyword. Has this been addressed?
2018/04/18 21:41:15
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Dynas wrote: Came Across this from a high level tourney player. Interesting quote regarding the FAQ:
"Durable units that can take shooting for a bit while they wait for reinforcements will see more play, and faster units that can effectively redeploy will be more valuable to make up for the momentum loss."
I think the pure Nephrekh Battalion has potential merit for competitive play. I do like manuever and space occupying armies especially with the card game. I read Nick's blog on the FAQ as well.
Here's my look at a 1750 that would utilise the exclusive Nephrekh goodies.
- A big block of Lychguard to occupy space on the table. As Nephrekh they can move minimum 11" and through/over terrain to reposition up the board quickly onto objectives. These guys are the anvil which is an element any manuever army really needs to occupy the centre so not to have your army walked off the board.
- An Overlord + 10 Tesla Immortals likely within arms reach of the Lychguard. Filling the Battalion and making use of MWBD first turn. Immortals can fetch objectives as needed.
- Two big blocks of 20 Warriors. These will likely deepstrike in most games where I need them via the stratagem.
- Canoptek Cryptek with the Solar Staff and 2x9 Scarabs. These are the disruptors who can hit the enemy at the same time my Warriors blocks drop, to prevent them being tied up in combat the turn after. (Can't leave combat with scarabs and charge warriors). The Nephrekh Solar staff relic is in it's element with it's special effect here that can turn off overwatch on my assaulting scarabs as well as a -1 to hit on return attacks the turn I charge them.
- A full unit of Destroyers in the pocket as firefighters, what they do best.
Warlord trait I'm not sure of - Immortal Hubris is probably the safest, though it's tempting to just pick the Nephrekh exclusive one for 4/4 uses of the Dynasty over 3/4.
I think this army has some real potential in the card objective based games/Beta striking - while it's not a point and click gunline it's so good at putting things where they need to be, and it doesn't give a whole lot away as juicy targets early - 10 Shield Lychguard, 10 Immortals or some Scarabs? Come at me...
Heavy Destroyers [9 PL, 171pts] . 3x Heavy Destroyer: 3x Heavy Gauss Cannon
Heavy Destroyers [9 PL, 171pts] . 3x Heavy Destroyer: 3x Heavy Gauss Cannon
[b]++ Total: [87 PL, 1747pts]
Which is a list built purely on shooting the opponent off the board. Totally different in strategy to win, but is it more effective or just differently effective?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/18 22:04:00
2018/04/18 22:02:59
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
skoffs wrote: As an experiment I thought I'd try to see what our absolute maximum CP amount would be in a 2000 point list using the new list building restrictions in the FAQ:
• maximum 3 detachments
• only 1 of any detachment type • maximum 3 of any particular unit (excluding Troops).
Spoiler:
++ Brigade Detachment +12CP [66 PL, 1281pts] ++
+ HQ +
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
Lord [5 PL, 76pts]: Hyperphase Sword
Looks like the maximum CP we can get is 21 (including 3 for battleforged).
(and no, there was no way to fit Imotekh in for an extra 1 CP this time with these restrictions)
Note: this is not meant to be a "good list".
I was just trying to see what our absolute limits were.
I'm not seeing only one of any detachment type in the FAQ, where is this?
Armies I field - Tau, Dark Angels, Necrons, Blood Angels
2018/04/18 22:15:55
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
- Canoptek Cryptek with the Solar Staff and 2x9 Scarabs. These are the disruptors who can hit the enemy at the same time my Warriors blocks drop, to prevent them being tied up in combat the turn after. (Can't leave combat with scarabs and charge warriors). The Nephrekh Solar staff relic is in it's element with it's special effect here that can turn off overwatch on my assaulting scarabs as well as a -1 to hit on return attacks the turn I charge them.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the solar staff get a potential -1 to hit for each successful hit it gets?
2018/04/18 22:19:11
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
The general idea is to Grand Illusion some combination of troops/HQ to cover or outside RF range depending on turn order. There's only a 11.1% chance of getting 1 unit when command reroll is used, so it seems pretty reliable to get at least 2 units along with the Deceiver.
Wraiths will be deployed near edge of deployment to move, advance, and 1CP charge one of them. Idea is to force opponent to make a choice between targeting troops or getting multiple units locked up next turn.
DDAs will be deployed on any objective found in my deployment. If objective is put in a bad spot for them (in cover or out of LOS), scarabs will take their place. 5 scarabs should be durable enough to survive 1-2 rounds of IDF.
I haven't picked a Dynasty yet, but I'm leaning towards Nephrekh for Wraiths 6" advance or Sautekh for Warriors/DDA movement/advance. Mephrit is an option, but that more so relies on me getting first turn and placing units in RF range.
Another detachment is an option, but for 1CP, I don't see much value any more compared to a battalion. 2 battalions could work, but running MSU troops is the exact opposite of what Necrons want with RP, not to mention easy primary points in ITC. If not running MSU troops, then you'll be infantry heavy and running yourself too thin in other categories (TEQ, AV). Both of which aren't considering the high tax we pay for our HQs either...
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