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Yes you can. Allies are fine, mixed detachments are not.

I believe you can't run your Nurgle daemons using Nurgle deamons inside the same detachment as your CSM. But two detachments from different codexes is fine.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So can I not run a Nurgle Daemons detachment and a Nurgle CSM detachment in the same army if using the no-soup beta rule?

Are Chaos Marks a Faction Keyword? If they are you can mix <Nurgle> units in the same detachment.

If they aren't, you can have detachments for them in the same army but not mix them in the same detachment.

Just wondering if this was common knowledge? Digital editions of codexes will all be updated to incorporate the faqs.
I have gone all digital so this is good for me. Would this encourage more people to go digital in the future?

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So can I not run a Nurgle Daemons detachment and a Nurgle CSM detachment in the same army if using the no-soup beta rule?

The FAQ only prohibits soup detachments, not soup armies.

It's why I haven't bought a physical book this edition.

 Galas wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So can I not run a Nurgle Daemons detachment and a Nurgle CSM detachment in the same army if using the no-soup beta rule?

Are Chaos Marks a Faction Keyword? If they are you can mix <Nurgle> units in the same detachment.

If they aren't, you can have detachments for them in the same army but not mix them in the same detachment.

This is correct. So you could do like, a supreme command detachment of Ahriman and two heralds of tzeentch (I am never going to be able to remember the new names for them...). Not that you would ever want to do that, but you can!

If you have a CSM detatchment with Daemons in it you'll lose your Legion trait however.

 Ghaz wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So can I not run a Nurgle Daemons detachment and a Nurgle CSM detachment in the same army if using the no-soup beta rule?

The FAQ only prohibits soup detachments, not soup armies.

Ahh, shows what I know since I totally thought you couldn't mix factions in a single detachment anyway...

Thanks for the responses guys.

On page 172 of my digital edition it says every GK psykers gains Brotherhood of Psykers so every single one of them, including characters, smites on a 5.

I know I’m going to get attacked for this, but just in case someone with an open mind is reading.......

I think the reason people have trouble winning with GK is because they are deep striking turn 1. Why would you deep strike when the enemy screens are still up?

GK can’t screen the enemy so no DS T1 and no movement out of DS helps GK much more than it hurts them. Your backfield will be safe T1 as long as you have LOS blocking terrain.

Horde lists took a hit with the lose of poxwalkers and Tide of Traitors only allowed to be used once. Less horde helps GK.

Shining Spears will not be able to deploy out of DS, soul burst and assault. That helps GK.

Dark Reapers are more expensive and won’t be able to Fire and Fade into a Wave Serpent. That helps GK.

Fire Raptors are 90pts more. That helps GK.

Tyrant Spam is gone. That helps GK.

GK can still charge T2 with a reroll from the Warlord trait after the enemy army has spread out. They didn’t spread out? Then who cares if you can’t DS T1.

As long as you can hide a Rhino(s) size T1 you should survive T1 and use smoke to move up, then drop on T2 freely. Remember Scions aren’t coming down T1. Obliterators aren’t coming down T1. You don’t need to come down to kill Poxwalkers before they get their abilities up.

I’m not saying you will roll up to the table with GK and sleepwalk through 5 wins, but the competitive separation has definitely been shrunk because of what other armies can’t do anymore.

Solid points. Despite all the turmoil it causes I both appreciate their efforts and it will be interesting to see how it plays out.

My gut reaction is static shooting and transport spamming got stronger.

Why not just ban DS'ing on Turn 1 if that was the problem?

 chimeara wrote:
If you have a CSM detatchment with Daemons in it you'll lose your Legion trait however.

"We bring the power of the Warp to the enemies of Chaos! But in doing so, we forgot which Legion we were part of..."


Dumb rule is dumb.

They've 'fixed' the soup issue with a sledgehammer it seems.

Bad example. More chaos brings more chaos even to the allied chaos.

*Jazz hands*

Kkkkkkahhhhosssssssss

"We are the Death Guard.

We are the chosen of Nurgle.

We spread his plagues and decimate his enemies across the galaxy.

In a tide of filth we bring ruin to all who would oppose the great Plague Father.

Showing us his favour, he brings his own Daemonic minions to fight alongside us.

We are the... uhh... we are the... damn... once those Nurglings showed up I completely forgot where I was going with this.

We are the Thousand... no, that's not right. The Alpha... no. The Blood Angels! Yes. That's it.

We are the Blood Angels! Chosen of... Khaine? It'll come to me!"
- Intercepted Transmission of Plaguefather Grullious Pussball, [Legion Unknown]

DarthDiggler wrote:
On page 172 of my digital edition it says every GK psykers gains Brotherhood of Psykers so every single one of them, including characters, smites on a 5.

I know I’m going to get attacked for this, but just in case someone with an open mind is reading.......

I think the reason people have trouble winning with GK is because they are deep striking turn 1. Why would you deep strike when the enemy screens are still up?

GK can’t screen the enemy so no DS T1 and no movement out of DS helps GK much more than it hurts them. Your backfield will be safe T1 as long as you have LOS blocking terrain.

Horde lists took a hit with the lose of poxwalkers and Tide of Traitors only allowed to be used once. Less horde helps GK.

Shining Spears will not be able to deploy out of DS, soul burst and assault. That helps GK.

Dark Reapers are more expensive and won’t be able to Fire and Fade into a Wave Serpent. That helps GK.

Fire Raptors are 90pts more. That helps GK.

Tyrant Spam is gone. That helps GK.

GK can still charge T2 with a reroll from the Warlord trait after the enemy army has spread out. They didn’t spread out? Then who cares if you can’t DS T1.

As long as you can hide a Rhino(s) size T1 you should survive T1 and use smoke to move up, then drop on T2 freely. Remember Scions aren’t coming down T1. Obliterators aren’t coming down T1. You don’t need to come down to kill Poxwalkers before they get their abilities up.

I’m not saying you will roll up to the table with GK and sleepwalk through 5 wins, but the competitive separation has definitely been shrunk because of what other armies can’t do anymore.

Woah, woah, woah. Evaluating changes in a broader context, rather than just yelling about how the sky is falling and setting your models on fire in a fit of kneejerk hysteria? You're in the wrong place, buddy - we don't take kindly to that sort of thing around here. >:|

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So can I not run a Nurgle Daemons detachment and a Nurgle CSM detachment in the same army if using the no-soup beta rule?

The FAQ only prohibits soup detachments, not soup armies.

Ahh, shows what I know since I totally thought you couldn't mix factions in a single detachment anyway...

Thanks for the responses guys.

Well, We cannot take Faction: <CHAOS> as the common keyword, but <ALLEGIANCE> and <MARK OF X> are listed as Faction also, so a Herald of Khorne and Berzerkers should be allowed in the same Detachment through <KHORNE>.

You miss out on Traits and Locus to do so....

Pretty good changes neat that the Commisars got cheaper, a friend of mine will be happy about that...

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
[i]"We are the Death Guard.

We are the chosen of Nurgle.

We spread his plagues and decimate his enemies across the galaxy.

In a tide of filth we bring ruin to all who would oppose the great Plague Father.

Showing us his favour, he brings his own Daemonic minions to fight alongside us.

We are the... uhh... we are the... damn... once those Nurglings showed up I completely forgot where I was going with this.

Thematically, they are now a Nurgle force and not a Death Guard force...thanks Nurglings.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
[i]
We are the Thousand... no, that's not right. The Alpha... no. The Blood Angels! Yes. That's it.

Wouldn't be a T̶h̶o̶u̶s̶a̶n̶d̶ .. A̶l̶p̶h̶a̶ ...Blood Angels force if it had a bunch of random stuff in it. It would be a [insert keyword here] force.

Raven Guard by themselves can fight war on their terms as ninja space marines of stealthiness. Raven Guard baby sat by conscripts from Cadia are just space marines fighting a war for the Emperor.

A Chaos force lead by a Thousand Sons sorcerer with 2 squads of Plague Marines supported by Iron Warriors Havoc's and reconed with Steeds of Slannesh are a Chaos force. Fluff wise, nobody cares why they came together. They are no longer fighting their respective God's and legion's fighting styles and therefore they shouldn't on the table.

Cherry picked faction armies should fight as if they were one cohesive faction army, not as cherry picked members of their sub factions. You forfeit the individual strengths in a soup army for the combined strengths of various sub factions. Fair trade to me and I don't see any fluff problems with it.

 BigbyWolf wrote:
Pretty good changes neat that the Commisars got cheaper, a friend of mine will be happy about that...

Even more important re: the Commissar - they are no longer actively detrimental. The Guard FAQ allows you to choose whether you want to reroll the failed morale check rather than make it mandatory, meaning they actually kind of help. I'm not sure whether it makes them hard core competitive, but they are no longer actively working against you. Personally, I intend to use them in friendlier games now... so yeah, happy about that change.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Why are people claiming GK got hit so hard? Aren't they one of only 2 factions exempt from the smite nerf? Or is it because they can't DS turn one anymore? Like every. Other. Faction.

Just because rule is same for all doesn't mean it affects all armies same. Deep strike rule hurts most flamer deep strikers. Then h2h deep strikers with 2d6" charge. Then h2h with 3d6". Then melta deep strikers. The ones it hurts least are plasma deep strikers and long range deep strikers like obliterators.

Now apart from flamer deep strikers nobody uses next biggest ones hurt are h2h deep strikers...Which grey knights are! Also stuff like da jump and kommandos from orks that just died(why take kommandos when you can take more boyz instead and get more reliable turn 2 charge?).

Funnily enough people complain about stuff like plasma storm troopers deep striking but those are actually the ones that were hurt LEAST. So what happened is that alpha shooting while nerfed was nerfed less than alpha h2h. Which wasn't the real problem anyway.

Blanket rule like this actually hurt balance as it hindered units that weren't problem much more than the ones it was actually supposed to bring to balance.

Bring in 2 armies. One is filled with deep striking plasma, one with deep striking h2h units. Plasma wins the day. Even more than before...

edit: Whoops misremembered oblit range so they are hurt about same as plasma scions.

 BrotherGecko wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
[i]"We are the Death Guard.

We are the chosen of Nurgle.

We spread his plagues and decimate his enemies across the galaxy.

In a tide of filth we bring ruin to all who would oppose the great Plague Father.

Showing us his favour, he brings his own Daemonic minions to fight alongside us.

We are the... uhh... we are the... damn... once those Nurglings showed up I completely forgot where I was going with this.

Thematically, they are now a Nurgle force and not a Death Guard force...thanks Nurglings.

Oh, please. Like there weren't a thousand silly quirks in 40k before this happened. The rules are meant to represent, not replicate, and to that end every single 'simulation' game in all of human history has stuff that doesn't make sense. If you really want to criticize 40k for not making sense start at the ground up with basic stats, like wounds representing a scale between healthy and dead. You'd have a encyclopedia before you ever get to this FAQ.

DarthDiggler wrote:

GK can still charge T2 with a reroll from the Warlord trait after the enemy army has spread out. They didn’t spread out? Then who cares if you can’t DS T1.

They will spread out their chaff even MORE making your distance toward the real meat that much harder...It was hard enough to charge anything worthwhile T1 especially without 3d6" charge. With T2 it becomes that much harder.

Anyone remember when you couldn’t control which turn your modes came on, they scattered, and possibly completely died before ever hitting the board?

The DS thing is a bit of a reset to limit the devastation of T1 Alpha Strike without rolling the clock right back to unpredictable 7th Reserves. I will be interested to see how it plays out. Army builds will have to change all round, as leaving a full 50% of your stuff off the board and going second could see you tabled at the end of your opponent’s turn 2. Interested to see what the new builds that come out of this will be, and how it affects the feel of the game.

As a grey knights player..... A hahaha hahaha ha.... Oh well, see you in 9th

Did I get the Death guard daemon prince change right? You can take a plague spewer but if you do, then you're stuck with the standard sword?

"This model may either take a plague spewer, or it may
replace its hellforged sword with a daemonic axe or a
second set of malefic talons."

Myytti666 wrote:
Did I get the Death guard daemon prince change right? You can take a plague spewer but if you do, then you're stuck with the standard sword?

"This model may either take a plague spewer, or it may
replace its hellforged sword with a daemonic axe or a
second set of malefic talons."

That's how it reads to me. Wording is a little clunky but an interesting addition that I'm going to give a try.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Why not just ban DS'ing on Turn 1 if that was the problem?

 chimeara wrote:
If you have a CSM detatchment with Daemons in it you'll lose your Legion trait however.

"We bring the power of the Warp to the enemies of Chaos! But in doing so, we forgot which Legion we were part of..."


Dumb rule is dumb.

They've 'fixed' the soup issue with a sledgehammer it seems.

That...is not a change either.

It was like this all along, you only get your faction abilities in a pure faction detachment.
If you got a detachment of CSM and a detachment of daemons you are fine, if you got them mixed up you lose the faction powers.

Now, you just can't take them in the same detachment to begin with by the new FAQ, with the sole exception that a mono-god mixed chaos detachment is possiible as it goes around the forbidden keywords by using that god's keyword, but that detachment wont get faction abilities-exactly as before.

If anything, chaos took the least hit from it. everyone else lost the ability to soup a detachment at all, chaos can still soup mono-god detachments, under the same old penalty of losing faciton powers.
Point being, many times the value of a soup is higher than the faction power (especially if all/most units in that detachment gains little to nothing from the faction powers to begin with)

 JohnnyHell wrote:
Anyone remember when you couldn’t control which turn your modes came on, they scattered, and possibly completely died before ever hitting the board?

The DS thing is a bit of a reset to limit the devastation of T1 Alpha Strike without rolling the clock right back to unpredictable 7th Reserves. I will be interested to see how it plays out. Army builds will have to change all round, as leaving a full 50% of your stuff off the board and going second could see you tabled at the end of your opponent’s turn 2. Interested to see what the new builds that come out of this will be, and how it affects the feel of the game.

And on top of this, there's another FAQ due in 6 months time.

Feed it all back. Make notes, offer your insight into how it's affected your games and your options. Tell GW - not just the interwebs at large.

Especially the Beta rules that people are worrying about. Those are a work in progress. They need your feedback, so no use sitting on your hands and lamenting. Get playing with them, give them anecdotes and data from games, not hypothetical number crunching.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
"We are the Death Guard.

We are the chosen of Nurgle.

We spread his plagues and decimate his enemies across the galaxy.

In a tide of filth we bring ruin to all who would oppose the great Plague Father.

Showing us his favour, he brings his own Daemonic minions to fight alongside us.

We are the... uhh... we are the... damn... once those Nurglings showed up I completely forgot where I was going with this.

We are the Thousand... no, that's not right. The Alpha... no. The Blood Angels! Yes. That's it.

We are the Blood Angels! Chosen of... Khaine? It'll come to me!"
- Intercepted Transmission of Plaguefather Grullious Pussball, [Legion Unknown]

Thanks for fixing my grumpy mood

Well while amusing not different from past either. Same thing happened before.

you could also say it's pretty silly ultramarines lose their memory of how to be ultramarine because there's 10 imperial guard troopers on the same battlefield.