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Danny76 wrote:

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

MajorWesJanson wrote:All they need to do is throw in some dice, and a rule pack, and it is just a replacement for DI

It literally is. I don't understand why people were expecting anything other than that. All this complaining of monopose, even though big packs like these have been monopose for decades, is baffling.

Ordana wrote:Scroll down.

The Daemonkin and Vanguard "codexes" aren't full codexes. They're more like the starter ones that we also got in Dark Imperium - they won't be standalone forces, but rather the minimum amount necessary to add these guys into your existing armies. There may be an update to the codexes soon, but these won't be full armies in their own right (aka, there won't be a difference between Codex: Space Marines and Codex: Vanguard. Van will just be an update to Space Marines)

However, for decades they have, all last year the boxes that they said this is like (Forgebane etc), were not like it.
So can quite see why it was unknow in this case.


I’m not sure they’d update the books soon as you’d get these codexes that would Bolt to your current one really.

If it wasn’t for the fact that SM seems to be in need of one and has had potential rumours of getting one soon, then I’d say they just leave it and you buy this box to get the models and rules, with it saying change <....> to your faction or something.
Only thing throwing that off is if they release multi part later, would each data sheet just say usable with x,y,z codexes without breaking the single faction rule thing people bang on about.. (I don’t do tournaments etc so I forget what it’s called.. battle forged?)

All those units have the keyword phobos and they say that there are new warlord traits in the mini codexes. This makes me think that vanguard units are not just new units but might also be played separatly as allies to normal space marine ? I don't know

 Kanluwen wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

 Galas wrote:
This can't (Or shouldn't) cost as much as Dark Imperium because that one had the big rulebook.

All the battle boxes have cost the same as DI. I wouldn’t expect any different here.

I would. Battle boxes are full kits sold at a discount, this isn't.

Exactly. Easy to Build kits are cheaper than the proper boxes.

The Infiltrators are great! Love the helmets, love the bolters, love the antennas all over the place. The lieutenant is also great. Suppressors are.. a little silly, but still cool.

It's a shame that three man squads like the Suppressors and Eliminators only get two poses. Would be nice if all the members of a three man squad would be unique. Oh well, might be separate kits in the future with more posability.

Those new flying primaris are just..... yikes. I didn’t think it was possible, but they’re even uglier than the previous flying primaris.

At least the normal ground guys look okayish. The legs of their armor look like the designers watched all three Iron Man movies back to back and decided that’s what scout armor should look like though.

The Librarian would be great if his right arm were doing anything other than tipping a hat that isn’t there. Sucks they had to be stupid and prevent a simple kitbash by giving him leather gloves instead normal primaris armor gauntlets. It’s not like wearing them will let him channel his powers better or be more dexterous/skilled with his blade, so what’s the point?


At least the chaos side is a near total win model wise. The Obliterators are a tad goofy looking, but everything else is choice. Bad rules be damned, I’m running that crawler for fun.

 Galas wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

 Galas wrote:
This can't (Or shouldn't) cost as much as Dark Imperium because that one had the big rulebook.

All the battle boxes have cost the same as DI. I wouldn’t expect any different here.

I would. Battle boxes are full kits sold at a discount, this isn't.

Exactly. Easy to Build kits are cheaper than the proper boxes.

There is a good chance that some mini in this box are exclusive - mostly the characters - which might justify the price.

WhiteDog wrote:
All those units have the keyword phobos

Suppressors don't.

Justify the price isn’t the right word there...

Be the reason for the price they chose, maybe I suppose yeah.
Either way I’m expecting it will be £95..

Here is what confuses me.

Dark Imperium and its subsequent mini-lings were easy to build because they were starter boxes, etc. The additional mini-boxes were also easy-to-build, etc. Also understandable. We can assume for a while that the DI box will continue to be the main rulebook/starter box. As mentioned all of the other combo-boxes have been collections of newish full kits sold at a discount and for a short limited time.

This doesn't fit into the mold. Most of these kits will "likely" get a proper full multi-part kits, which means GW is making duplicate models for a lot of random units. So if this box doesn't hang around for a while, it seems a bizarre investment. I don't see the point in GW releasing a nearly duplicate range of easy-to-build kits alongside normal kits. That's an expensive redundancy even if they think it'll attract a few buyers for being $5-10 cheaper, etc. This box would have made sense had it replaced DI, come with a softbound rulebook (preferably in two parts, rules and fluff), dice, rulers, etc.

As it stands - I don't get it. The characters etc. make sense, they'll be clam-packed. While I don't collect much modern 40K I hope it's not a heavier swing in the direction of removing actual multi-option kits. I just don't understand the thinking and placement of this box in the 40K market right now. It'll obviously sell a bajillion copies, but then what? Will you actually see the mono-pose Chaos marine squad in a box for $35 while a new Chaos marine multi-part kit comes out for $55? I dunno. Seems very odd. Unless GW simply thinks they'll make enough off this box in six months to ditch it and some of its sculpts (feasible).

There's a market for these models and multipart. By releasing this first they'll get some people to double dip. £££££££ is why.

Danny76 wrote:
Justify the price isn’t the right word there...

Be the reason for the price they chose, maybe I suppose yeah.
Either way I’m expecting it will be £95..

Yes justify "in their eyes".

I think this will be around a while, as this campaigns ticks over..

But I wouldn’t be surprised if these are characters all on the sprues mixed with the units etc, like DI.

And likewise, these kits may (will) not come out as an ETB or anything, just like the DI, or DV before, didn’t come out as sets..

Therefore making the full kits more feasible when they come..

I see this kind of boxes as a way to add more and interesting poses for my miniatures, because monopose models have poses that can't be easely replicated with the multipart boxes.

Also for the characters that are normally exclusive.

And also because with the new style of boxes, for example, with the 7 plague marines of DI and the 3 Easy to Build ones those are 10 extra sculpts for a unit that if you only buy the proper multipart box become repetitive very fast.

WhiteDog wrote:

Danny76 wrote:
Justify the price isn’t the right word there...

Be the reason for the price they chose, maybe I suppose yeah.
Either way I’m expecting it will be £95..

Yes justify "in their eyes".

Heh, indeed.

Danny76 wrote:
I think this will be around a while, as this campaigns ticks over..

But I wouldn’t be surprised if these are characters all on the sprues mixed with the units etc, like DI.

And likewise, these kits may (will) not come out as an ETB or anything, just like the DI, or DV before, didn’t come out as sets..

Therefore making the full kits more feasible when they come..

Surely that makes these kits a waste of design time and the cost of the molds? Just put multi part in and have done, then resell them later as separate kits.

I look at the Supressors and I see both the SAMUS and the MS-06RD-4 Zaku II High Mobility Test Type

I don't know how I feel about this box. There's some models I love and some I don't. I really want that librarian and the Infiltrator with the smoke grenade is awesome.

But I was not a huge fan of the inceptors from that box. I found their poses a little awkward. And it seems to be a similar situation with the suppressors.

I want bits of the box but not the whole thing. We still can't get a gravis captain or an ancient unless we get DI box

 ProtoClone wrote:

 warboss wrote:
Wow...flying primaris with oversized galoshes wielding autocannons. That's the 40k miniatures equivalent of bad fan fiction. I hope someone ends up modelling a shark fin or head under each of them.

Spoiler:

Looks like Samus armor from Rifts.
https://goo.gl/images/nPqBVJ

Only superficially IMO so much so that I didn't make the connection despite being intoduced to roleplaying games with Rifts and playing it exclusively for almost a decade.

 totalfailure wrote:
Yeah, mini dexes like the ones in Kill Team Rogue Trader - covering only the models given, built exactly as shown, with no options or other unit sizes possible beyond precisely what they give you in the box.

Welcome to the Games Workshop HHHobby.

Those suppressors are awful

Why can't they just be on the ground?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 totalfailure wrote:
Yeah, mini dexes like the ones in Kill Team Rogue Trader - covering only the models given, built exactly as shown, with no options or other unit sizes possible beyond precisely what they give you in the box.

Welcome to the Games Workshop HHHobby.

It is what has kept me from really jumping in with Primaris Marines.

I like them, but the lack of customization and just about any options makes them less appealing then they should be?

I was hoping that GW would open this all up - and give them a viable Rhino equivalent - soon, but that doesn't appear to be the case?

And maybe I'm missing something (probably, as I'm not much of an actual 4oK gamer anymore), but Primaris don't appear to be too competitive either.

Granted, for as much love as Marines get, and have gotten for some time now, they've never been that competitive, outside of the specialist chapters like the Wolves or the Blood Angels.

I like the models, generally speaking. I should be careful what I wish for on new oblits... They are fluffed as having fleshmetal where there is no difference between the organic and mechanical whereas these miniatures have very clear distinction between those areas, for the most part. Fortunately a little bit of green stuff and a different paint setup will go a long way.

I almost wonder if the box will at least have head options. The two non-sergeant Eliminators have different heads, but the same body. So there is probably two different heads for them to choose from, since they are likely on duplicate sprues. So that might make the Eliminators okay for me.

So I am probably going to pick up the SM half on eBay, but leave the heads off the guys without helmets until the regular kits come out. That way I can put real heads on them, since the kits tend to come with extras anyway.

 Elbows wrote:
Here is what confuses me.

Dark Imperium and its subsequent mini-lings were easy to build because they were starter boxes, etc. The additional mini-boxes were also easy-to-build, etc. Also understandable. We can assume for a while that the DI box will continue to be the main rulebook/starter box. As mentioned all of the other combo-boxes have been collections of newish full kits sold at a discount and for a short limited time.

This doesn't fit into the mold. Most of these kits will "likely" get a proper full multi-part kits, which means GW is making duplicate models for a lot of random units. So if this box doesn't hang around for a while, it seems a bizarre investment. I don't see the point in GW releasing a nearly duplicate range of easy-to-build kits alongside normal kits. That's an expensive redundancy even if they think it'll attract a few buyers for being $5-10 cheaper, etc. This box would have made sense had it replaced DI, come with a softbound rulebook (preferably in two parts, rules and fluff), dice, rulers, etc.

As it stands - I don't get it. The characters etc. make sense, they'll be clam-packed. While I don't collect much modern 40K I hope it's not a heavier swing in the direction of removing actual multi-option kits. I just don't understand the thinking and placement of this box in the 40K market right now. It'll obviously sell a bajillion copies, but then what? Will you actually see the mono-pose Chaos marine squad in a box for $35 while a new Chaos marine multi-part kit comes out for $55? I dunno. Seems very odd. Unless GW simply thinks they'll make enough off this box in six months to ditch it and some of its sculpts (feasible).

The thing that I keep coming to is that this might be related to their Start Collecting set price adjustments and a mention(offhandedly) that was made about trying to make things more accessible.

Something like this would allow for a Start Collecting set down the line. If you look at AoS, the previous starter set has since been turned into two Start Collecting sets that were immune to the price bumps(Goreblade Warband and Thunderstrike Brotherhood sets in case you're interested). We'll have to wait and see the sprue breakdowns on Shadowspear but I would be surprised if they have the units mixed on it.

If this truly is a new subfaction within a Codex as a whole and not a new book entirely? These setups would allow for existing players to expand in a pretty quick manner without it potentially being too stressful for their production+distribution side of things as people wouldn't have to go for the full kits if they just wanted 'the basics'.

I like the Suppressors. They look goofy but IMO that's what makes them awesome, marines with zogging full length autocannons dropping out of the sky to make stuff go boom. Definitely going to get a spot in my Space Wolves army because it seems like such a deliciously wolfy thing to do. And with Keen Senses they can stay mobile too unless somehow a 10 foot autocannon is classified as assault now and everyone can do that.

 warboss wrote:
Wow...flying primaris with oversized galoshes wielding autocannons. That's the 40k miniatures equivalent of bad fan fiction. I hope someone ends up modelling a shark fin or head under each of them.

Spoiler:

this has to be some of the worst minis that GW has put out in quite a while. So ridiculous

 streetsamurai wrote:

 warboss wrote:
Wow...flying primaris with oversized galoshes wielding autocannons. That's the 40k miniatures equivalent of bad fan fiction. I hope someone ends up modelling a shark fin or head under each of them.

Spoiler:

this has to be some of the worst minis that GW has put out in quite a while. So ridiculous

It is a pity they wern't armed with multilasers though...

Why none have ranted about these guys yet:




These guys are the real winners here and with knowing that there is going to be proper set coming to boot!

Flash forward a few months til the Suppressors get FAQd into brilliance and everyone complaining now suddenly owns 9...

Pandabeer wrote:
I like the Suppressors. They look goofy but IMO that's what makes them awesome, marines with zogging full length autocannons dropping out of the sky to make stuff go boom. Definitely going to get a spot in my Space Wolves army because it seems like such a deliciously wolfy thing to do. And with Keen Senses they can stay mobile too unless somehow a 10 foot autocannon is classified as assault now and everyone can do that.

I thought the whole thing with the Wolves is they like to have their feet on thr ground - well unless they are riding stupid sleds or giant wolfy wolf wolves,

I really wish the new stealths marines had been done in Rave Guard colours and/or even shock horror cameoline coated armour.

Most of the new marines look really good, well except for Mr Shouty Stealth Captain.

As others have said the floating autocannon snipers are very SAMAS looking - not a bad thing - they are a million times better than Centurions or Grey Knight Baby Carriers.

Hate the russian Doll Oblits but rest of the Chaos Stuff looks good.

Part of me hates them. Part of me loves them. In the grim darkness of my hobby brain, there is only war. Lose the moon shoes and it's almost enough to save them for me. Almost.