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Abby looks good!

I like that they gave him 3 head variants, just wish that one was a full helmet, as I have always hated his stupid 3ft tall topknot...

I will of course cut it off, if I get him, but It would be nice if he had a really crazy chaos helmet as an alternative.

The noble/calmer head is great though, I always thought he was a bit 'Teenagey Ragey' in the original sculpt. But then again, I was a teenager when he came out (barely...).

Without a helmet wouldn't his head kinda vanish amongst all that without the topknot?

If we are getting a new Termy kit I wonder if one of the heads there would fit?

I can only hope that the new Chaos Termi kit will have all the crazy rhino and elephant horned helmets.

I always loved those. My favourite terminator helmets of all time.

My question is when a bullet whip became his primary weapon.
Seems impractical.

Put those puppies in a pair of magazines.

 Galas wrote:
I can only hope that the new Chaos Termi kit will have all the crazy rhino and elephant horned helmets.

I always loved those. My favourite terminator helmets of all time.

I have no issue with them, but I always liked Araghast the Pillager (of Dawn of War II: Chaos Rising) helmet style for terminator armor. I used that helmet as much as I could for my Chaos terminators.

 Galas wrote:
I can only hope that the new Chaos Termi kit will have all the crazy rhino and elephant horned helmets.

I always loved those. My favourite terminator helmets of all time.

Amen

I still don't think that we are getting new termies, but if we do, I hope the helmets have the same style


Automatically Appended Next Post:
must say that a genestealr skull on Abby trophy rack is a bit........ underwhelming. He's the warmaster, not some second string lieutenant who would be proud of slaying such a creature


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Galas wrote:

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
I like that someone could just walk up behind him and turn off his Talon of Horus. And he wouldn't be able to turn it back on.

Spoiler:

Pure greatness. You win the Internet for the day

 streetsamurai wrote:

must say that a genestealr skull on his trophy wrack is a bit........ underwhelming. He's the warmaster, not some second string lieutenant who would be proud of slaying such a creature

The original metal Abaddon had one though...

Mr Insomniac wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:

must say that a genestealr skull on his trophy wrack is a bit........ underwhelming. He's the warmaster, not some second string lieutenant who would be proud of slaying such a creature

The original metal Abaddon had one though...

The original Abaddon faced much scarier genestealers...

 insaniak wrote:

Mr Insomniac wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:

must say that a genestealr skull on his trophy wrack is a bit........ underwhelming. He's the warmaster, not some second string lieutenant who would be proud of slaying such a creature

The original metal Abaddon had one though...

The original Abaddon faced much scarier genestealers...

Maybe that is the skull of the last scary genestealer.

 Haighus wrote:

 Kirasu wrote:

 Haighus wrote:

What you have said is more likely... but I think it would be neat if they made the rotor cannon S3 (like the Heresy-era version) or even S2, but a bucket load of shots. This would make it statistically better at killing weak units than Space Marines, and really cement it into a chaff-killing role. Probably not going to happen though.

I request using math first. At S2 this weapon need to be HEAVY 30 to even do 3 wounds to guardsmen in cover, or Heavy 20 at S3. To kill chaff it should probably be S5 Heavy 6 (and yes this means Heavy bolsters are awful, but they always have been).

I'd rather S3 heavy 20 than S5 heavy 6- at least then the battlefield role is clear, and it isn't another variant of heavy bolter-type weapon. Also, rolling the dice for a unit of Havoks with 4 would be great fun

Anyway, why is 3 wounds-per-turn the benchmark? Even a plasmagun, one of the best man-portable weapons of this edition, could only kill two guardsmen at best, and a heavy bolter could only kill three at best. If the weapon is cheap (say, 4-5pts), and a unit is chucking out a lot of shots, it will do the job. If you really want to, add some suppression mechanic so it doesn't have to outright kill units.

If your anti-chaff weapon can’t kill 12 points of chaff then it sucks. CSM and SM are already at an almost insurmountable disadvantage in 8th edition 40k. They need useful firepower. Anything less than that is expanding the gap further.

I hope it has a lot of shots. I just want something like the leman russ punisher for marines. Is that hard to ask?!

 streetsamurai wrote:
I still don't think that we are getting new termies, but if we do, I hope the helmets have the same style

I didn't think that either, but GW's art reflects the miniatures (look at the Dark Apostle on the new cover - his backpack and burning book match the Rumour Engine pics exactly, and remember that this entire thread got started because of the "Chaos Tick" in that one piece of artwork), and there's a Terminator with a sword in that pic.

Neither the Chaos Termy nor Termy Lord kit has a sword.

The Nurgle and 1KSons kits do, but it looks like a Black Legion termy to me. For that reason I think we're getting new Termies, or at least a new character with a sword or giant mace option.

Surely with these its all but confirmed we're getting new terminators?

 Galas wrote:
I hope it has a lot of shots. I just want something like the leman russ punisher for marines. Is that hard to ask?!

Assault Cannon Razorback?

Any news on the Malefic Discipline?

No, no news yet.

CORRECTED.


I'm pretty jazzed about most of these.
Incursion: Summoning daemons without having to give up movement (and potential mortal wounds) makes building a sideboard a lot more palatable.
Sacrifice: Fluffy and very useful. I run a lot of daemon engines, but my stupid warpsmiths can never keep up. Now I can cut them and fix my machines.
Invigoration: Siturational, but helps iron out the major flaws in those random units. Some possessed, a greater possessed, and a MoP in a termite drill would make a pretty gnarly hammer.
Possession: Gotta be at least one dud I guess. No ones going to pay the points for a spawn or greater possessed on the off chance a MoP makes it into combat and wins against a character.
Cursed Earth/Infernal Power: makes the MoP a pretty dope gunline commander. Oblits or forgefiends (or venomcrawlers maybe?) start looking meaty.

 Saturmorn Carvilli wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

Mr Insomniac wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:

must say that a genestealr skull on his trophy wrack is a bit........ underwhelming. He's the warmaster, not some second string lieutenant who would be proud of slaying such a creature

The original metal Abaddon had one though...

The original Abaddon faced much scarier genestealers...

Maybe that is the skull of the last scary genestealer.

Now I’m just waiting to see people’s converted trophy racks.
I want to see skulls from that kit full of skulls, all the big ones, a carnifex head (isn’t there one with half it’s face to the bone?), wraith Lord helmed, maybe I titans head. Hmm Let’s see, what else...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The Possession one is nice, cast that if you know you might kill character,particularly a marine, and get a Greater Possessed.

Possession + warlord traits and relics could lead to some humorous situations of a MoP running around blowing up vehicles all over the place, but it's not great.

The big winners will be possessed with Cursed Earth, and Oblits being buffed by Infernal Power to finally re-roll wounds, and perhaps Invigoration. 3++ tzeentch possessed or 4++/5+++ slaanesh ones if you bring a regular sorc will be really inefficient to shoot at.

Lord of Skulls with Cursed Earth and regular Sacrifices will be funny.

Also, i notice that the 1ksons and DG summoning strat are redundant with Incursion since those both give a 4th die and protection from MW. But can you use the Word Bearers strat with it? 4d6, no MW, and re-roll any die would be killer.

 Irbis wrote:

 ceorron wrote:

Spoiler:

 Albertorius wrote:

 aracersss wrote:
did anyone notice the new apostle?
PD: new scale comparison

Wow. Abaddon looks so, so much better than Guilliman, it's not even funny.

Also funny that it's more subdued, too. Didn't see that coming.

10 times better TBH

I don't know where you see that ""better"", Abby still suffers from the same issue as all oldmarines (namely, the torso the lenght of his forearm). G has actual, human proportions, in both torso and limbs, with correctly sized head to height ratio (1:7) while Abbaddoo has comical, child sized 1:5. At least his terminator armor FINALLY doesn't have arms coming out of ears but to not break the iconic terminator silhouette they needed to put pauldrons above his arms which looks even more silly. Methinks someone stared at old, garbage 'heroic' anatomy so long actual humans look weird now

As for details, model is nice, but something bugged me about Talon. After looking at FW version, I realized what - sculptor converted it from side-loaded to top-loader... Without thinking for a second the most natural pose of human arm is fingers down, not up. If Armless tries to rotate arm to slash downwards the ammo belts are going to hopelessly tangle with his arm cables and fingers. Compared to Talon, G's Hand actually has feed naturally supporting his arm in proper shooting pose, instead of only looking good with comical posturing, and the ammo supply not only allows him to shoot for longer than 2 seconds but is actually armored to not have any random mook detonate his bullets with frakking laspistol, unlike Talon

Realistic human proportions are not something I want in my miniatures. Excessive realism and anatomical correctness completely ruin the absurdist fantasy of the 40k setting. Not only that but realistically proportioned sculpts are not nearly as effective in expressing the character of a sculpt when scaled down to 28mm. There is a very good fundamental design reason for the hyper exaggerated features of the older sculpts. Go too realistic with scale and things like facial features become even more impossible to actually appreciate on the tabletop.

The proportions and the push toward tacticool are definitely my two biggest gripes with the Primaris line and the direction loyalist marines are headed. It's a good thing I'm more of a Chaos player. These issues are no where near as prevalent in the new CSM range, based on everything they've revealed so far.

I'm happy Abaddon retained his characteristic bulk and didn't end up getting all weirdly lanky and stretched out-looking like Guilliman

If i'm not mistaken if you use Invigoration on a big unit of Oblits, who you just happen to put VOTLW and then the Slannesh fire twice strat. And each time you fire you'd get a re-roll for the fleshmetal gun stats.

I started Chaos in 2nd edition and even though I went to eventually all Khorne marines by 3rd edition I had Abbadon as my commander at one point.

Then models got physically larger to the point where old Abby looks like a Chaos Dwarf even next to a pleb marine.

I'm glad he looks to be to the correct proportion again. I've been eagerly awaiting a new, updated WE codex but in the meantime I will for sure be building a Black Legion army once again.

Can't ever have too much plastic crack!!!

If Thousand Sons and Death Guard can take the MoP things will get crazy! Getting Cursed Earth on Magnus or Mortarion will be nasty.

I kinda hope they don't. They both already have their set of special characters, let the plane-jane CSM have something unique for once.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Without a helmet wouldn't his head kinda vanish amongst all that without the topknot?

If we are getting a new Termy kit I wonder if one of the heads there would fit?

This is what I'm thinking of doing. waiting for the terminator kit to release and then seeing if some of the suitable ornate looking helmets (if any) in it would work with abbadon.

Abaddon is spectacular. Over the moon. Can't wait to see the new kits that will follow in his wake.

 slave.entity wrote:

 Irbis wrote:

 ceorron wrote:

Spoiler:

 Albertorius wrote:

 aracersss wrote:
did anyone notice the new apostle?
PD: new scale comparison

Wow. Abaddon looks so, so much better than Guilliman, it's not even funny.

Also funny that it's more subdued, too. Didn't see that coming.

10 times better TBH

I don't know where you see that ""better"", Abby still suffers from the same issue as all oldmarines (namely, the torso the lenght of his forearm). G has actual, human proportions, in both torso and limbs, with correctly sized head to height ratio (1:7) while Abbaddoo has comical, child sized 1:5. At least his terminator armor FINALLY doesn't have arms coming out of ears but to not break the iconic terminator silhouette they needed to put pauldrons above his arms which looks even more silly. Methinks someone stared at old, garbage 'heroic' anatomy so long actual humans look weird now

As for details, model is nice, but something bugged me about Talon. After looking at FW version, I realized what - sculptor converted it from side-loaded to top-loader... Without thinking for a second the most natural pose of human arm is fingers down, not up. If Armless tries to rotate arm to slash downwards the ammo belts are going to hopelessly tangle with his arm cables and fingers. Compared to Talon, G's Hand actually has feed naturally supporting his arm in proper shooting pose, instead of only looking good with comical posturing, and the ammo supply not only allows him to shoot for longer than 2 seconds but is actually armored to not have any random mook detonate his bullets with frakking laspistol, unlike Talon

Realistic human proportions are not something I want in my miniatures. Excessive realism and anatomical correctness completely ruin the absurdist fantasy of the 40k setting. Not only that but realistically proportioned sculpts are not nearly as effective in expressing the character of a sculpt when scaled down to 28mm. There is a very good fundamental design reason for the hyper exaggerated features of the older sculpts. Go too realistic with scale and things like facial features become even more impossible to actually appreciate on the tabletop.

The proportions and the push toward tacticool are definitely my two biggest gripes with the Primaris line and the direction loyalist marines are headed. It's a good thing I'm more of a Chaos player. These issues are no where near as prevalent in the new CSM range, based on everything they've revealed so far.

I'm happy Abaddon retained his characteristic bulk and didn't end up getting all weirdly lanky and stretched out-looking like Guilliman

You articulated my biggest gripe I had with the primaris range!

Thank you (yoinks).

To expand on this...

The Exaggeration as you say is missing from these miniatures which is a key part of 40k. Because thats what we have now with the Suppressors and Aggressors they just look silly, not really fitting in the grim dark universe. I give gak to the dreadknight, or dreadnought, or the centurion but at least they make sense, they are still based on something, and use a similar design. These new primaris units don't and they are missing the exaggeration on the whole image. Go all out if you want to exaggerate, if the suppressors had a giant jumppack and huge arms to heave the gun go ahead. But right now it looks silly and as id4chan puts it eloquently grimderpy.

Abaddon's model is fascintating because it is designed and exaggerated, the model has interesting body parts but who cares the model is stellar, its like people who say they love picasso's early work compared to his later work. Even though artistically and with originality people love Picasso's later works because they are exaggerations of the human form.

Getting the human form right is the hardest thing to do. So don't. Unless you want to measure everything in the golden ratio then the model will just look awkward without it.

 Marshal Loss wrote:
Abaddon is spectacular. Over the moon. Can't wait to see the new kits that will follow in his wake.

If "an army's worth of new models to show" is genuine and not just a puff piece in that article, it definitely looks like a full reboot of the line.

I've had a Black Legion project on my mind for quite a few years now but never got around to it because the models were just too old. Seems like I can finally start it

 NurglesR0T wrote:

 Marshal Loss wrote:
Abaddon is spectacular. Over the moon. Can't wait to see the new kits that will follow in his wake.

If "an army's worth of new models to show" is genuine and not just a puff piece in that article, it definitely looks like a full reboot of the line.

I've had a Black Legion project on my mind for quite a few years now but never got around to it because the models were just too old. Seems like I can finally start it

As have I and these new primaris models are any indicator I am just going to run my bog standard regular marines as primaris and just say all of them are void born. But I have been thinking about starting a Black Legion army for a long long time.

Word Bearer Masters of Possession are gonna be fun I guess.