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Skinflint Games wrote: Just to throw my two pennorth into the ring, I kind of dig TFA and TLJ (not seen Solo yet) and very impressed by Rogue 1.. it's just the "Look at us! We're so hip! We cast a WOMAN! And a BLACK GUY! Just like they're REAL PEOPLE!" virtue signalling PC stuff that sticks in my craw.
For what it's worth, I think Finn, Rey and Poe are good characters and actors. They deserved their roles on merit, not so Disney could go tick some boxes on a diversity quota form. That said, it's not like Star Wars is a documentary. If you're taking life lessons from those fllms... you need to rethink things
If you think they are good characters and actors...why do you also think they are just there for a diversity quota?
Mozzyfuzzy wrote: In a movie where everything was already going wrong for the resistance, the audience needed another moment of everything going wrong in order to bring them back to Earth, followed by a moment of heroic sacrifice is good, followed by everything is going wrong, heroic sacrifice is bad, heroic sacrifice is good as long as you're projecting yourself across the galaxy, by the way we actually have hope now there's only a dozen of us?
Rose stopping Finn from sacrificing himself makes much more sense when you realize that the sacrifice would have been pointless - Finn's speeder would have just been squished like a bug for no effect. Alas the movie didn't make that very clear, and much of the audience probably remembered very similar Independence Day scene where it worked (for some inexplicable reason).
Mozzyfuzzy wrote: In a movie where everything was already going wrong for the resistance, the audience needed another moment of everything going wrong in order to bring them back to Earth, followed by a moment of heroic sacrifice is good, followed by everything is going wrong, heroic sacrifice is bad, heroic sacrifice is good as long as you're projecting yourself across the galaxy, by the way we actually have hope now there's only a dozen of us?
Rose stopping Finn from sacrificing himself makes much more sense when you realize that the sacrifice would have been pointless - Finn's speeder would have just been squished like a bug for no effect. Alas the movie didn't make that very clear, and much of the audience probably remembered very similar Independence Day scene where it worked (for some inexplicable reason).
The issue with Rose stopping Finn is that she seemed a-okay, if a little torn up, with her sister bravely sacrificing herself at the start of the movie. Then she decides to stop Finn, not because it wouldn't work, but because in her mind sacrificing yourself isn't how you win, a sudden shift in opinion that has no explanation in her mostly uncharacterized characterization. We're given no context for why Rose would suddenly feel differently about this topic, so when she makes that choice it feels forced and empty.
Really they could have spent less time on Rose and Finn's excellent adventure given how little it mattered, not just in the plot but to the Characters. Finn basically repeats his arc from TFA, for some reason, and Rose doesn't seem to be along for any reason other than to give Finn a new love interest and because someone has to educate him about how evil rich people are (and I will blame her for making me criticize anyone for pointing out that the rich are douches! )
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/08/02 01:10:58
If you think they are good characters and actors...why do you also think they are just there for a diversity quota?
It's more like they're just honking their horn so much how they cast a WOMAN in the lead, unlike ALL OTHER previous movies which were made by CHAUVINIST PIGS (exaggaration deliberate). I guess there is a sub-demographic which needs to be appealed with this kind of rhetoric, and indeed I have seen hipster rag reviews who approvingly nod to these supposed 'modern' gestures. I guess those reviewers never watched the original Star Wars movies where Rebel Alliance is led by woman, and very first movie opens with Princess Leia action scene.
It's a phenomenon not restricted to PC, rather it's a need for marketing to come up with an angle which would appeal to the crowd who otherwise would be cynical about that type of movie. For example, when Saving Private Ryan came out, there was much hype how it broke new ground by being gritty war movie which did not glorify war, unlike every other war movie made before it. I mean seriously, there were tons of people saying that with a straight face.
The issue with Rose stopping Finn is that she seemed a-okay, if a little torn up, with her sister bravely sacrificing herself at the start of the movie. Then she decides to stop Finn, not because it wouldn't work, but because in her mind sacrificing yourself isn't how you win, a sudden shift in opinion that has no explanation in her mostly uncharacterized characterization. We're given no context for why Rose would suddenly feel differently about this topic, so when she makes that choice it feels forced and empty.
Really they could have spent less time on Rose and Finn's excellent adventure given how little it mattered, not just in the plot but to the Characters. Finn basically repeats his arc from TFA, for some reason, and Rose doesn't seem to be along for any reason other than to give Finn a new love interest and because someone has to educate him about how evil rich people are (and I will blame her for making me criticize anyone for pointing out that the rich are douches! )
Umm, I read it that Rose, having already lost her sister, did not want to see another close one to get killed, especially in such a pointless manner. After all, Poe had already called off the attack.
Whole scene was somewhat poorly set up. Both the unbreakable blast door and unbeatable Death Star mini-cannon were daft plot devices which were not needed in any way. Resistance could have counted on simply hiding in the abandoned base, and when found, mounted a desperate attack against superior firepower which then would have been beaten back. Same effect, point made, less confusing technobabble.
Finn repeated his TFA story arc because his character was written pretty much a loser from the start whose only asset was some inside knowledge of First Order workings. It gave few giggles in the first movie, but was counterproductive for his long term characterization prospects.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/08/02 01:27:59
I don't recall that type of hype from the official campaign. Yes, the Internet is full of culture war angles to everything, but I don't recall Disney doing anything particularly "woke" with the advertising.
And I thought they sold Saving Private Ryan on Ted Danson in a uniform...
BobtheInquisitor wrote: I don't recall that type of hype from the official campaign. Yes, the Internet is full of culture war angles to everything, but I don't recall Disney doing anything particularly "woke" with the advertising.
And I thought they sold Saving Private Ryan on Ted Danson in a uniform...
I don't remember seeing Ted Danson in that movie. You sure you don't mean Tom Hanks?
Mozzyfuzzy wrote: In a movie where everything was already going wrong for the resistance, the audience needed another moment of everything going wrong in order to bring them back to Earth, followed by a moment of heroic sacrifice is good, followed by everything is going wrong, heroic sacrifice is bad, heroic sacrifice is good as long as you're projecting yourself across the galaxy, by the way we actually have hope now there's only a dozen of us?
Rose stopping Finn from sacrificing himself makes much more sense when you realize that the sacrifice would have been pointless - Finn's speeder would have just been squished like a bug for no effect. Alas the movie didn't make that very clear, and much of the audience probably remembered very similar Independence Day scene where it worked (for some inexplicable reason).
How do we know it wouldn't have worked? Finn is our source of information on FO technology. He knows about their new tech. He knows they're deploying the battering ram cannon. He knows the specs, certainly better than Rose.
He seems to think it is going to work when they're getting suited up. He seems to think it will work when Poe calls off the attack (did their original plan involve more then a suicide ramming run or did they literally just decide to drive up to the enemy without guns or any means of.... engaging in violence against their enemy?)
Rose never says it wouldn't have worked, just that it wasn't the right thing to do.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: I don't recall that type of hype from the official campaign. Yes, the Internet is full of culture war angles to everything, but I don't recall Disney doing anything particularly "woke" with the advertising.
And I thought they sold Saving Private Ryan on Ted Danson in a uniform...
I don't remember seeing Ted Danson in that movie. You sure you don't mean Tom Hanks?
My interest in Star Wars is mostly as a cultural touchstone.
I am not a super-fan, but the kids liked the movies and assorted toys and what not. I enjoyed all of the movies to some degree.
I didn’t like that the latest trilogy rehashed episode 4. I mean, that for me was incredibly disappointing. To that end, I liked episode 8 more than 7. There is some dumb gak in there, it’s almost like watching episode 5 (Hoth?) in some kind of weird tesseract version where it’s inside out and backwards, but you can still see a lot of direct correlations.
I look at them as popcorn movies in space. I further view it as science fantasy... heavy on the fantasy. Once magic is involved, you really just have to go with it. I genuinely dislike that it feels like the exact same movies ground up and stuffed in a sausage casing being sold as new movies.
But aside from that, it’s still Star Wars. It’s still the chosen one gone off to battle the Dark King. Dad rescues offspring from the (Next) Dark King, sacrificing himself so that blah-blah-blah.
I sound more down on it than I am. I wanted to see Vader’s story in the Prequels. I got that. Regardless of subjective quality, I got something I wanted. The latest trilogy did not deliver a new story in that universe. It inexplicably reset the story to episode 4. I had no particular interest in that. I’ve seen it already.
I’m excited by episode 9. I’m looking forward to it. I’m hoping it tells a new story. Hell, the rise of Kylo to become the next Not-Sith Master. I’m down for that. Skywalker Jr decides to join him. Together they build that which she sought to oppose. They get nasty and breed a long line of super-powerful not-sith-not-Jedi and become philosopher kings. Inbred, fugly philosopher kings.
Didn’t see that one coming! That’s what I’m looking for. Not the incest, but something new and unexpected. That’s what I’m hoping for.
2019/08/02 09:17:32
Subject: Re:Does anyone still care about Star Wars?
Haha I think that's a little more Dune that Star Wars but damn if that wouldn't be cool.
I think Kylo Ren is my favourite part of the new Star Wars. Compared to the stoic Darth Vader and the self assured Dooku, he feels a lot more human. I love how he is angry, conflicted, self-doubting and feels weighed down by the expectations of others but manages to fight on and succeed despite the odds. Maybe that's a bit millennial of me... but he's got more personality than any of the heroes at this point!
BobtheInquisitor wrote: I don't recall that type of hype from the official campaign. Yes, the Internet is full of culture war angles to everything, but I don't recall Disney doing anything particularly "woke" with the advertising.
As I said I was deliberately exaggarating, but they did comment it to that effect, see here for example.
How do we know it wouldn't have worked? Finn is our source of information on FO technology. He knows about their new tech. He knows they're deploying the battering ram cannon. He knows the specs, certainly better than Rose.
He seems to think it is going to work when they're getting suited up. He seems to think it will work when Poe calls off the attack (did their original plan involve more then a suicide ramming run or did they literally just decide to drive up to the enemy without guns or any means of.... engaging in violence against their enemy?)
Rose never says it wouldn't have worked, just that it wasn't the right thing to do.
One of the writers (Johnson himself? Don't remember) said later that Finns suicide drive would not have worked. I agree the movie itself hardly makes it clear.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/02 09:51:36
Mr Vetock, give back my Multi-tracker!
2019/08/02 10:00:20
Subject: Re:Does anyone still care about Star Wars?
Kroem wrote: Haha I think that's a little more Dune that Star Wars but damn if that wouldn't be cool.
I think Kylo Ren is my favourite part of the new Star Wars. Compared to the stoic Darth Vader and the self assured Dooku, he feels a lot more human. I love how he is angry, conflicted, self-doubting and feels weighed down by the expectations of others but manages to fight on and succeed despite the odds. Maybe that's a bit millennial of me... but he's got more personality than any of the heroes at this point!
I think it's because he's coming from a very different place.
Dooku fell because he was disillusioned with the Jedi Order. He saw the corruption in the Senate, and the Jedi just sitting by. It's not hard to turn good intentions to dark in those circumstances.
Anakin was much the same, but with near life-long manipulation by The Man With The Plan, who ensured the flaws in the Jedi Order were writ especially large on a galactic scale (peace keepers turned generals)
Kylo Ben Ren Solo? Just an angry kid, with a legacy he desperately wants to live up to. If anything, they've done a far better job showing his conflicted nature than they ever managed with Anakin, and they've not showed a lot - just showed the right stuff. That we the audience (well, part of it at least) still wonder if he can be redeemed, or even wants to be redeemed speaks to that.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Yea I'm not sure whether they will redeem him or not. It's Disney so maybe?
I never thought but Dooku and Anakin are actually quite similar, now I wish they had put a scene in Phantom Menace where Qui Gon Jin goes to see his old master on Corusant for advice after the council refuses to train Anakin. He can rail against the corruption of the council and Qui Gon would be unsettled at his master's loss of his patient wisdom.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/02 11:21:35
2019/08/02 11:23:23
Subject: Re:Does anyone still care about Star Wars?
It's more like they're just honking their horn so much how they cast a WOMAN in the lead, ...
Are they? Where?
Ah, you see this one person connected with the production said something on Twitter.....
Kroem wrote: Haha I think that's a little more Dune that Star Wars but damn if that wouldn't be cool.
I think Kylo Ren is my favourite part of the new Star Wars. Compared to the stoic Darth Vader and the self assured Dooku, he feels a lot more human. I love how he is angry, conflicted, self-doubting and feels weighed down by the expectations of others but manages to fight on and succeed despite the odds. Maybe that's a bit millennial of me... but he's got more personality than any of the heroes at this point!
Ren's villain arc is one of the saving graces for me. He starts off being a pale imitation of Darth Vader, but that's entirely intentional. And then he arguably proves a better Sith than Vader, by supplanting his master. And the Emperor talked a lot about the power of anger and hate, but he's the only Sith character who really conveys that.
My big worry for Ep9 is that they'll cave in to the fangirls and redeem him with the power of love.
"The 75mm gun is firing. The 37mm gun is firing, but is traversed round the wrong way. The Browning is jammed. I am saying "Driver, advance." and the driver, who can't hear me, is reversing. And as I look over the top of the turret and see twelve enemy tanks fifty yards away, someone hands me a cheese sandwich."
greatbigtree wrote: My interest in Star Wars is mostly as a cultural touchstone.
I am not a super-fan, but the kids liked the movies and assorted toys and what not. I enjoyed all of the movies to some degree.
I didn’t like that the latest trilogy rehashed episode 4. I mean, that for me was incredibly disappointing. To that end, I liked episode 8 more than 7. There is some dumb gak in there, it’s almost like watching episode 5 (Hoth?) in some kind of weird tesseract version where it’s inside out and backwards, but you can still see a lot of direct correlations.
I look at them as popcorn movies in space. I further view it as science fantasy... heavy on the fantasy. Once magic is involved, you really just have to go with it. I genuinely dislike that it feels like the exact same movies ground up and stuffed in a sausage casing being sold as new movies.
But aside from that, it’s still Star Wars. It’s still the chosen one gone off to battle the Dark King. Dad rescues offspring from the (Next) Dark King, sacrificing himself so that blah-blah-blah.
I sound more down on it than I am. I wanted to see Vader’s story in the Prequels. I got that. Regardless of subjective quality, I got something I wanted. The latest trilogy did not deliver a new story in that universe. It inexplicably reset the story to episode 4. I had no particular interest in that. I’ve seen it already.
I’m excited by episode 9. I’m looking forward to it. I’m hoping it tells a new story. Hell, the rise of Kylo to become the next Not-Sith Master. I’m down for that. Skywalker Jr decides to join him. Together they build that which she sought to oppose. They get nasty and breed a long line of super-powerful not-sith-not-Jedi and become philosopher kings. Inbred, fugly philosopher kings.
Didn’t see that one coming! That’s what I’m looking for. Not the incest, but something new and unexpected. That’s what I’m hoping for.
Man this hit home for me so hard. I don't think I've ever seen someone else so succinctly describe how I feel about the sequel trilogy. I too hated the farce awakens more than last Jedi, the latter at the very least has some stuff in there that isn't ripped straight from the OT. I don't think it's good by any means, but it was more palatable to me than TFA: ANH redux. As someone who dabbled in the EU it's especially disappointing because it clearly is totally possible to tell new and good stories in that setting but instead we must watch the original films over again. Le sigh
I think that is one thing the latest trilogy does fail at. I mean, if we look at places where conflict happens in the OT, and even PT:
Yavin IV - Rebel's are hiding there to minimize civilian casualties and keep out of sight of the empire
Hoth - rebels hiding to minimize civilian casualties and stay out of sight
Endor - strategically important due to shielding protecting DS Mk.2, Empire hid it here to minimize prying eyes from civilian populace/prevent rebels from blowing up until it was ready.
Naboo- battle took place, battles in the street, presumably lots of civilian casualties (off screen, of course)
Bug Planet - strategic importance due to manufacturing capabilities, basically entire populace participates, so minimal civilian casualties.
Jakku - A battle took place here because. . . reasons? Most of what is shown has already happened has little to no plausible explanation done.
OT had wordbuilding through civilians- Luke was initially a civilian dragged into the conflict through chance/the will of the force.
IV: We are told the Evil galactic empire controls the galaxy. They control the senate. They dissolve the senate to rule through pure force. Luke, a citizen says he hates the empire. Leia is part of a political and a military resistance movement. Stormtroopers are seen interacting with citizens and informants in Mos Eisely. Rest of the film is hidden bases and spacestations.
V: Rebs are hiding but a civilian installation is dragged into the conflict. we see first hand how the Empire strong arms a private business to get what it wants. Cloud City populace eventually evacuates rather than risk imperial retribution for Lando's defiance.
VI: Cuddly sentient teddy bears are dragged into a space conflict.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/02 12:26:46
BobtheInquisitor wrote: I don't recall that type of hype from the official campaign. Yes, the Internet is full of culture war angles to everything, but I don't recall Disney doing anything particularly "woke" with the advertising.
As I said I was deliberately exaggarating, but they did comment it to that effect, see here for example. .
There is absolutely nothing in that article that even hints at the sort of attitude you were suggesting. It quite simply says that people were asking for more strong, female characters, and Disney said, 'Yup, we'll have plenty of strong, female characters.'
He ended up going back and doing the entire prequel trilogy with each film getting further and further from the originals. However, I thought it was a cool format. So in the style of that format. Here is how I would fix TLJ. (I liked TFA and honestly, don't know what I would change even if I wanted to make it "more original and less ANH")
The first off, I don't think I would change any of the Luke/Rey stuff or the Rey/Kylo stuff. I think it all worked very well for it's intended purpose.
I would, however, mess around with all the Holdo, Poe, Finn, Rose stuff. Right off the bat, I think I would ditch Holdo as a leader of the resistance after Leia dies. Give it to Admiral Ackbar. Have Ackbar do all the Holdo stuff. Then have Holdo as a subordinate that helps to cover for Poe/Finn/Rose and the secret mission. Send Poe with Finn and Rose on the mission. He is established as a spec ops guy in the comics. He knows how to handle a mission like this.
On the casino planet. Give us a tease that Lando was the man they were looking for, or even better. Make DJ actually be the guy we were looking for. Rather than horses, make it pod racers. Make the slaves the pilots of the pod racers. Now we have actually rescued the slaves during the chase sequence and we have that little bit of extra nod to the prequels.
When everyone converges back on the big "not a superstar destroyer" we can have everyone get captured and what you know? Rey is in the prison cell as well maybe her confrontation with Snoke and Kylo Ren got her thrown in jail. Then when Admiral Ackbar suicides the capital ship. We get an escape sequence with the main cast stealing a shuttle and retreating to the base with the rest of the resistance. (Which Holdo would have informed Poe and the rest about before they left on their mission as being Ackbar's big plan.)
Once we get down to the planet itself. The main cast finds that the FO has already got the Resistance under siege in their mountain base. Rey senses Luke nearby and we see the Millennium Falcon landed by the secret exit. The main cast finds Chewie and Luke waiting by the secret exit and together he and Rey clear the cave in to make it accessible. Inside we find a still comatose Leia whom Luke brings out of the coma using his force powers (because why not?). Then he announces that he is going outside. After debate, they end up forming a plan, and we get the sand skimmer scene only this time posing solely as a distraction to get the stolen shuttle and Millenium falcon boarded up and off-world. Poe and rose are on the shuttle because only they can fly it, Chewie and Rey in the falcon for the same reason. This leaves us with Finn, Luke, and some other random volunteers on a suicide mission to distract the first order. They all die in the ensuing action sequence. I'm torn on if I think luke should fight outside of his skimmer. As an old man, I think it makes sense he wouldn't try to duel his apprentice 1 on 1.
Anyway, I personally think that would have made for a better film. I'm curious to hear what you armchair directors would have done.
I agree that Kylo is the most interesting character. Most conflicted, most character development.
Star Wars seems to be able to create great, (somewhat) relatable villains. I don’t think it’s a “millennial” thing to root for him. I was initially put off by his whiny indecision. That is a character trait I can’t stand in general. I love that...
Spoiler:
just in case.
He decides to reject both previous paths of Sith and Jedi. He decides to create a new path, and is part of my greatest hope for “something new” in episode 9.
And in doing so is forging his own destiny. Rey still pretty much feels like she’s along for the ride. To be fair, Luke didn’t really come into his own until the 3rd movie either... so there’s a new hope yet that her character will continue to develop.
I really enjoyed the whole relationship between Rey and Kylo in TLJ and exploring the nature of light side v dark side. It’s still not clear whether they’ll redeem Kylo (or could even have Rey fall) and I think Kylo’s “burn the past, because it’s caused me nothing but pain” is one of the best villain motivations they’ve had in the whole series.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I was also disappointed that they backed out of the “you don’t need the Jedi teachings, just be a good person” angle that they seemed to be going for.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/02 13:39:48
Zed wrote: *All statements reflect my opinion at this moment. if some sort of pretty new model gets released (or if I change my mind at random) I reserve the right to jump on any bandwagon at will.
I'm preparing myself for a big disappointment in Rise of Skywalker. Not from any story point, but because the previews don't show Rey with a LightSTAFF. It's clear she rebuilt Excalib...I mean the Skywalker saber, but it was a missed opportunity to not have her build it into her staff and incorporate that into her existing fighting style.
It's one of the cool things I like about the lightsaber duels in SW, each movie adds something new, usually in the form of a unique saber design. New Hope introduced light sabers, ESB showed us what a true duel could look like (not just 2 old guys poking each other). RotJ gave us the Green saber (my favorite saber color), TPM gave us the double bladed saber and arguably the best duel on screen, AotC gave us Dooku's curved handle saber, RotS gave us Grievous's 4-armed robo-dueling and TFA gave us Kylo's hilt blades and that Storm Trooper with the anti-lightsaber baton. And even though TLJ didn't give us a new saber, Snoke's guards had those cool weapons and the duel was my second favorite behind TPM.
I was really hoping the Rey would eventually get a LightStaff to continue the tradtion, but it doesn't look like that's gonna happen
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/08/02 13:53:10
Rey has the texts - but not the 'Wisdom' of the Jedi order.
Consider how some people follow a given religion, and how far their actions and take on that given religion can be from their given holy text's words and theme.
When was the last time a Jedi actually read those books? When was the last time a Jedi actually checked his Master was indeed wise and knowledgeable?
With the dogma stripped away (no love life, stop caring about people. No, not those people. Those people), Rey has more freedom to learn for herself.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
insaniak wrote: I certainly wouldn't have removed the scene with Luke defeating his former apprentice from a different star system. That's the best part of TLJ.
I had a hard time deciding if I wanted to keep the force projection part or have him there in the flesh. I just think having Luke there in flesh is somehow the "stronger" choice.
He decides to reject both previous paths of Sith and Jedi. He decides to create a new path, and is part of my greatest hope for “something new” in episode 9.
I really liked this part of TLJ but for different reasons: Rey and Kylo are both successors to previous generations that believed they had all the answers but ultimately failed. Kylo argues passionately that to avoid failing similarly they must reject everything about that previous generation and strike out on their own, while Rey in turn commits to learning about the previous generation's successes (and failures thanks to a reality check from Luke) and chart her course that way. Both philosophies are informed by their contrasting backstories: Kylo's being born into a storied legacy and becoming disillusioned with it, Rey having no connection to her family and the way that makes her feel insecure about her identity; as well as their ability to follow through with their actions: Rey clearly leans more about the Force in the intervening time leading into Rise, while Kylo's inability to see past his hated Jedi mentor and see all the clues he was being tricked ultimately results in there being a next movie at all.
I'm still holding my breath that Rey isn't actually a nobody and that she is indeed connected more that just being another lame "chosen one". I mean, we only "know" she's a nobody because Kylo saw a vision....that was most likely given to him by Snoke.
That "revelation" gives Kylo power over Rey and Rey only believes it because it's a fear she has, so well within the perimeters of a deceptive manipulation on Snoke's part. I know many people want there to be less family connection in SW, but it is officially the SKYWALKER saga. There needs to be some Skywalker drama, and Kylo can't be the only one now that Luke is gone. In the OT, that drama revolved around a father and lost son, then later his sister. Uncle/Nephew drama just isn't as impactful. But cousin drama, in which both are descended from the "chosen one" and both on opposite sides of the Force is interesting. It can be used to bring Anakin's legacy into balance. Kylo being the darkside son of Anakin's daughter and Rey being the lightside daughter of Anakin's son.
I'm also really hoping for Force Ghost Anakin played by Hayden in Rise of Skywalker. George Lucas replacing the older actor in RotJ always bothered me, but if Hayden reprises the role to smack Kylo upside the head (metaphorically, of course) would be a good payoff for that change
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/08/02 14:33:06
I hear that, but I don't really agree. Star Wars fans are weirdly obsessed with the characters' bloodlines and its something I blame the old EU's insistence that every force sensitive they ever introduced had to be the secret grandkid of some Jedi hero in order to lend them some sense of legitimacy, but it's something that George rejected softly with the 'Jedi forbid love' thing and Disney appeared to reject stiffly with the little orphan Jedi and Rey's apparent (so far) lack of pedigree.
Even if midichlorians muddle the waters a bit.
Rey comes into the story carrying the same baggage as those fans: She believes she needs to be from someone of significance in order to be someone of significance or else she doesn't matter. We see this in both movies: in the way she hollowly insists her parents will come back despite being otherwise grounded and aware, in the way she tries to make sense of her connection to the force by trying to figure out how her parents factor in, and in both films where being confronted with the fact that they were never going to come back for her brings her to tears.
So I for one, hope she remains a 'nobody' because an assertion that anybody can be a Jedi is a powerful one.
But hey, maybe she'll turn out to be a clone from Palpatine's Killer Bee project or something.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/02 15:46:15
I think Solo is a better film than either of the new Episodes...
Rogue One was worth reviving the IP on its own.
I'm not a huge Star Wars fan, so I'm more forgiving of flaws, particularly if they're lore-based. My expectations of each film are middling and I'll see them in the cinema towards the end of their run when the screen is empty and the ticket price has gone down provided reviews don't suggest an absolute turkey. So far the Episodes have met those expectations.
)
