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Chopstick wrote:
Nice, finger crossed for Destroyer variant of the marauder.

Probably as a resin upgrade kit that will sell out in moments and never reappear on the US version of the FW site.

Didn't expect it this early. Still, may grab a starter to add to my backlog of models and games. If they are broken up on ebay, may grab a few spares, I may get a few to wreck and use at AT scenery.

Pleasantly surprised that its so cheap. Look forward to picking it up in a couple of months, just hope they have an aggressive release schedule for it.

I can already tell this is going to frustrate me - I'll want to know the size of the models before I buy anything(and not "err, they're kinda sorta 20/100ths of the 40K model maybe?", actual measurements), and you just know they'll have radically under-produced everything so that by the time anyone actually posts that information it and any accessories will be sold out :/

This is coming sooner than I expected.

I have faith (though it's someone's misplaced) that the game will be at least as fun as the old version.

This is another tempting set, but it may be better for me to wait until Eldar see a release. The price is pretty surprising though!

The price suggests that GW wants this very niche game to sell well as a core set - hence putting it on a really low value. A really low buy-in is going to generate a lot more interest and get more people at least collecting the models and casually playing. It also suggests to me that GW know some are going to buy into it to get the models in anticipation of a potential Epic re-release in the future. Again generating that casual buying interest.

I reckon that the low buy in price is to directly compete with FFG's X-wing. How much is a starter X-wing set these days, £30-£40?

 Strombones wrote:
Great looking models. Happy to see the specialist games chugging along. Man Id kill for a proper epic release.

Yeah. Loved the AT and while airplanes have never interested me that much in 2d games and so I'll be passing this I'm still hoping for rerelease of epic. THAT would get expensive.

Yes and no - X-Wing is a prepainted Starwars. Competing with that is tough because many will buy into it for both those reasons alone and neither is an area GW can compete on really.

The low price might also be more because its competing with GW's own somewhat bloated specialist game market. GW has grown it really fast and I suspect they are pitching a lower price buy-in so that it appears attractive against games like Warcry, AT, Bloodbowl etc...

At that price?

I’m in, hands down.

 Yodhrin wrote:
I can already tell this is going to frustrate me - I'll want to know the size of the models before I buy anything(and not "err, they're kinda sorta 20/100ths of the 40K model maybe?", actual measurements), and you just know they'll have radically under-produced everything so that by the time anyone actually posts that information it and any accessories will be sold out :/

Well knowing FW you can get that pretty much to spot on if you know what size they are in technical info in FW fluff books. From that what size they would be in 6mm scale gives you the answer.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:

Chopstick wrote:
Nice, finger crossed for Destroyer variant of the marauder.

Probably as a resin upgrade kit that will sell out in moments and never reappear on the US version of the FW site.

Didn't expect it this early. Still, may grab a starter to add to my backlog of models and games. If they are broken up on ebay, may grab a few spares, I may get a few to wreck and use at AT scenery.

Is alright. I’m happy to play international arms dealer

Spotted on B&C - note comment about being the same scale as AT - Epic, here we come!

tneva82 wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
I can already tell this is going to frustrate me - I'll want to know the size of the models before I buy anything(and not "err, they're kinda sorta 20/100ths of the 40K model maybe?", actual measurements), and you just know they'll have radically under-produced everything so that by the time anyone actually posts that information it and any accessories will be sold out :/

Well knowing FW you can get that pretty much to spot on if you know what size they are in technical info in FW fluff books. From that what size they would be in 6mm scale gives you the answer.

It would indeed, if they were keeping to a consistent scale. Instead, they're taking whatever size the 40K version of the model is and quartering it. Since the 40K vehicles are all over the joint, so will the AT/AI/potential nuEpic models be.

I'm scaling everything based on the Titans at ~1:260, and I know what size the vehicles all *should* be in that scale, but whether the AI planes will match that I won't know until someone measures the models.

 Yodhrin wrote:
I can already tell this is going to frustrate me - I'll want to know the size of the models before I buy anything(and not "err, they're kinda sorta 20/100ths of the 40K model maybe?", actual measurements), and you just know they'll have radically under-produced everything so that by the time anyone actually posts that information it and any accessories will be sold out :/

In case it's useful, the resin Marauder Forge World released for Epic/the old Aeronautica Imperialis measured 85mm from rear gun tip to front gun tip, and (despite the parallax error from my photo!) 85mm from wingtip to wingtip. From the previews, the bases – and thus 'planes – look identical in size.

Images spoilered, just to avoid anyone inadvertently jumping to conclusions – to be clear, this is the old resin version, not the upcoming (presumably) plastic version, posted only for reference. Apologies for the WIP paintjob, too!

 Apologist wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
I can already tell this is going to frustrate me - I'll want to know the size of the models before I buy anything(and not "err, they're kinda sorta 20/100ths of the 40K model maybe?", actual measurements), and you just know they'll have radically under-produced everything so that by the time anyone actually posts that information it and any accessories will be sold out :/

In case it's useful, the resin Marauder Forge World released for Epic/the old Aeronautica Imperialis measured 85mm from rear gun tip to front gun tip, and (despite the parallax error from my photo!) 85mm from wingtip to wingtip. From the previews, the bases – and thus 'planes – look identical in size.

Images spoilered, just to avoid anyone inadvertently jumping to conclusions – to be clear, this is the old resin version, not the upcoming (presumably) plastic version, posted only for reference. Apologies for the WIP paintjob, too!

Spoiler:

Well if they're remaining consistent, the new ones should be larger, since IIRC the "rule" for the FW Epic models was 1/5 40K scale, while the "rule" for AT models is 1/4 40K scale. I'll just have to hope one of the people who gets sent a demo copy takes some measurements.

Oof, that's a little much at full retail considering you're getting just a handful of jets. Judging by previous comments, I'm just not seeing the value others are.

Cronch wrote:
Oof, that's a little much at full retail considering you're getting just a handful of jets. Judging by previous comments, I'm just not seeing the value others are.

You also get the rule book and depend on how they handle the kit, could be 2019 GW price or a reasonable one.

Cronch wrote:
Oof, that's a little much at full retail considering you're getting just a handful of jets. Judging by previous comments, I'm just not seeing the value others are.

I mean, we can't really speak to the new system yet, but in the first iteration of AI that box would contain two almost complete armies. You might want to add one, maybe two extra planes and that'd be you sorted.

 Overread wrote:
The price suggests that GW wants this very niche game to sell well as a core set - hence putting it on a really low value. A really low buy-in is going to generate a lot more interest and get more people at least collecting the models and casually playing. It also suggests to me that GW know some are going to buy into it to get the models in anticipation of a potential Epic re-release in the future. Again generating that casual buying interest.

I think competing with their additional games is definitely part of it. I think part of it is what's in the box. If they tried to charge 170 USD for 9 small miniatures, some dice, a board, and a rulebook compared to say Warcry which includes a boatload of terrain, 29 large(r) miniatures, dice, rulebook, 4 card decks, etc. it would just look really bad.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Cronch wrote:
Oof, that's a little much at full retail considering you're getting just a handful of jets. Judging by previous comments, I'm just not seeing the value others are.

I think that's a valid opinion, it isn't a lot of minis for what is probably 90 USD. But it also includes a rulebook and if it's a complete rulebook (unlike the Necromunda starter), that's a pretty good value for a complete mini game in a box (from GW). Especially if most fighter Squadrons are 4-6 fighters, which seems to be the case in the older version of the game.

 Yodhrin wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
I can already tell this is going to frustrate me - I'll want to know the size of the models before I buy anything(and not "err, they're kinda sorta 20/100ths of the 40K model maybe?", actual measurements), and you just know they'll have radically under-produced everything so that by the time anyone actually posts that information it and any accessories will be sold out :/

Well knowing FW you can get that pretty much to spot on if you know what size they are in technical info in FW fluff books. From that what size they would be in 6mm scale gives you the answer.

It would indeed, if they were keeping to a consistent scale. Instead, they're taking whatever size the 40K version of the model is and quartering it. Since the 40K vehicles are all over the joint, so will the AT/AI/potential nuEpic models be.

I'm scaling everything based on the Titans at ~1:260, and I know what size the vehicles all *should* be in that scale, but whether the AI planes will match that I won't know until someone measures the models.

Doesn't look like quartering since that would result in 8mm being titan scale but it's 6mm.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Yodhrin wrote:

Well if they're remaining consistent, the new ones should be larger, since IIRC the "rule" for the FW Epic models was 1/5 40K scale, while the "rule" for AT models is 1/4 40K scale. I'll just have to hope one of the people who gets sent a demo copy takes some measurements.

FW models in epic were true 6mm. Any reason to think their planes weren't when pretty much everything else was.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 Apologist wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
I can already tell this is going to frustrate me - I'll want to know the size of the models before I buy anything(and not "err, they're kinda sorta 20/100ths of the 40K model maybe?", actual measurements), and you just know they'll have radically under-produced everything so that by the time anyone actually posts that information it and any accessories will be sold out :/

In case it's useful, the resin Marauder Forge World released for Epic/the old Aeronautica Imperialis measured 85mm from rear gun tip to front gun tip, and (despite the parallax error from my photo!) 85mm from wingtip to wingtip. From the previews, the bases – and thus 'planes – look identical in size.

Images spoilered, just to avoid anyone inadvertently jumping to conclusions – to be clear, this is the old resin version, not the upcoming (presumably) plastic version, posted only for reference. Apologies for the WIP paintjob, too!

Spoiler:

Well if they're remaining consistent, the new ones should be larger, since IIRC the "rule" for the FW Epic models was 1/5 40K scale, while the "rule" for AT models is 1/4 40K scale. I'll just have to hope one of the people who gets sent a demo copy takes some measurements.

From memory AI was either 1/300 or 1/285, can’t remember and don’t have my AI stuff in front of me to check. But they gave real world sizes of aircraft in the books and you could measure the models and they’d be that scale. Not sure why you think they “should” be larger? They were self consistent, ideally I’d want them to stay the same so then they’ll match the AI models I already have.

What’s AT’s scale? Like, as a real scale and not relative to 40k’s wonky scale?

tneva82 wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
I can already tell this is going to frustrate me - I'll want to know the size of the models before I buy anything(and not "err, they're kinda sorta 20/100ths of the 40K model maybe?", actual measurements), and you just know they'll have radically under-produced everything so that by the time anyone actually posts that information it and any accessories will be sold out :/

Well knowing FW you can get that pretty much to spot on if you know what size they are in technical info in FW fluff books. From that what size they would be in 6mm scale gives you the answer.

It would indeed, if they were keeping to a consistent scale. Instead, they're taking whatever size the 40K version of the model is and quartering it. Since the 40K vehicles are all over the joint, so will the AT/AI/potential nuEpic models be.

I'm scaling everything based on the Titans at ~1:260, and I know what size the vehicles all *should* be in that scale, but whether the AI planes will match that I won't know until someone measures the models.

Doesn't look like quartering since that would result in 8mm being titan scale but it's 6mm.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Yodhrin wrote:

Well if they're remaining consistent, the new ones should be larger, since IIRC the "rule" for the FW Epic models was 1/5 40K scale, while the "rule" for AT models is 1/4 40K scale. I'll just have to hope one of the people who gets sent a demo copy takes some measurements.

FW models in epic were true 6mm. Any reason to think their planes weren't when pretty much everything else was.

I mean, I'm literally just quoting Will Hayes from a discussion had on FB a while ago(pic related). They made various sizes of Marine, they liked how the ~8mm one looked, they re-scaled the Titans accordingly, and they'll re-scale everything else by the same amount, ie about 1/4 40K size, just as their Epic models were 1/5 40K size. There won't be any attempt to rationalise the models into an absolute scale.

Which is why I want to know the exact size of these planes before buying, so as to know if 1/4 40K size is accurate for a 1:260 scale plane of those types.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
-snip-

What’s AT’s scale? Like, as a real scale and not relative to 40k’s wonky scale?

See above, it doesn't have one officially.

The actual Titans are ~1:260 though, but if a 40K model is scaled wonkily, the AT/AI/nuEpic model will be wonky be exactly the same amount, just smaller.

I think I'm most interested in the campaign book. It probably won't be much more than a roster and a few small upgrades, but even that is enough to make me take a second look at the game. Did the original Aeronautica Imperialis have a campaign system? If so, what was it like?

It's interesting that it is getting a campaign book right out the gate. I think GW (and the industry as a whole) is definitely swinging more to narrative/campaign style gaming these days than competitive play. The pendulum of player interests has started to swing back...

70 EUROS for us.

Yeah, this doesn't seem like a good value at all, even compared with other GW stuff. Nightvault is $60. Warlord Games has a historical fighter combat game, and that starter set is $50 with 12 planes (though admittedly those are much less detailed miniatures). I'm not seeing a good value here, except maybe in comparison to Adeptus Titanicus.

£55 sounds about right and decent against X-Wing. Surprised it isn't £70, knowing GW...

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Yeah, this doesn't seem like a good value at all, even compared with other GW stuff. Nightvault is $60. Warlord Games has a historical fighter combat game, and that starter set is $50 with 12 planes (though admittedly those are much less detailed miniatures). I'm not seeing a good value here, except maybe in comparison to Adeptus Titanicus.

Just looked in on that. It doesn’t come with a board or terrain. So you’d need to factor that in,

 stonehorse wrote:
I reckon that the low buy in price is to directly compete with FFG's X-wing. How much is a starter X-wing set these days, £30-£40?

The RRP of the X-Wing starter is £36 for three models plus the accessories required to play. This is somewhat less than twice that, for three times as many models.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Yeah, this doesn't seem like a good value at all, even compared with other GW stuff. Nightvault is $60. Warlord Games has a historical fighter combat game, and that starter set is $50 with 12 planes (though admittedly those are much less detailed miniatures). I'm not seeing a good value here, except maybe in comparison to Adeptus Titanicus.

Just looked in on that. It doesn’t come with a board or terrain. So you’d need to factor that in,

Amazon will do you a blue tablecloth for less than a tenner.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Yeah, this doesn't seem like a good value at all, even compared with other GW stuff. Nightvault is $60. Warlord Games has a historical fighter combat game, and that starter set is $50 with 12 planes (though admittedly those are much less detailed miniatures). I'm not seeing a good value here, except maybe in comparison to Adeptus Titanicus.

Just looked in on that. It doesn’t come with a board or terrain. So you’d need to factor that in,

Might come out even worse for GW if the starter only has a demo board and you're supposed to buy a bigger one as day 1 DLC.