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the_scotsman wrote:
Unlike what we had in the good old days when kits were customizable and possibilities were endless!

Should I assemble this guardsman holding his rifle sideways facing forwards? Or should I turn him 90 degrees on his torso so you can clearly see the flat join on the model on the sides of his hip and his head doesn't seat properly in the groove? or should I turn him around 180 like hes grand emperor scroob in spaceballs after a transporter accident?

the possibilities were literally endless!

Have you looked at the Skitarii or GSC Neophyte kits at all? They use the 'old style' of assembly, and even if it doesn't produce enormous variation between the models, it allows for some diversity. And they look real good.

The mono-build plastic kits hearken back to the days of pewter models and only having a handful of poses for a model, and with very busy/recognizable sculpts like the Death Guard, it makes the repetition very obvious.

 TheFleshIsWeak wrote:
Looks like I'm going to be in the minority here but to me those Thousand Sons kits look vastly better than the Death Guard ones.

Aesthetically, I agree 100%. My disagreement comes from the claim that the Death Guard kit is less customizable than the Thousand Sons kit.

Which it is not. An individual death guard model created from the Death Guard kit is going to be much more distinct from another Death Guard model created from the same kit than a Thousand Son will be distinct from another Thousand Son created from the same kit.

The most different you can get is:

-Beak on boltgun vs No Beak
-Dragon head backpack vs Regular CSM Backpack
-What sculpt on the shoulder pads
-What sculpting on the headdress
-Is model holding his gun flat across his chest or aiming.

Besides the sorceror, who gets the choice of Pistol vs Open Hand and two staff-toppers, that's the extent of the customization present in the thousand sons kit.

the_scotsman wrote:
I know you went to a lot of effort to put this post together...

If only you'd put half the effort into reading it.

the_scotsman wrote:
Sure, the Exalted Sorcerors kit is more customizable than the Deathshroud Terminator kit. Love the exalted sorceror kit.

Translation: Sure, this one thing completely proves what you're saying but...

the_scotsman wrote:
But the Plague Terminator kit looks *exactly* as customizable as the Scarab terminator kit (Much more so, honestly, because the bits in the kit actually look different from one another) and the Death Guard kit looks to be similar. Like I said before - the only difference appears to be monopose legs (with swappable chest plates unless I'm understanding wrong) vs ball and socket joint legs.

But it's clearly not as customisable. Clearly. I mean, how can you not see that?

The 1KSons Terminators are like pretty much all the previous regular Terminator kits (with the exception of the BA Assault Terminator box). Any torso can go with any legs can go with any arm can go with any shoulder pad. The Plague Terminator kits have no such options. There are 5 bodies, and those bodies will always be the same (one with the Nurgling, one that's mutated into a fly with the tiny arms, and so on). You cannot mix and match as they're all set poses. The arms are built in their entirety, and whilst my kits are in the other room under too many other unbuilt things to find, I'd be willing to bet all the money in my wallet against all the money in your wallet that only certain torsos can take certain arms.

I started my post with "No matter how much some people want to deny it...", and, well, here we are.

the_scotsman wrote:
I've built the new rubric kit. It is very much not a particularly poseable kit. Your choice for each miniature is "Aiming" or "Standing" and all the rubrics look the same (that is kind of the point). You maybe should have gone for Deathwatch Vets to make this point?

No, the point still stands. You can mix all the torsos, legs, heads, arms, shoulder pads and guns (with their requisite arms) around. The same cannot be said for the Plague Marines.

the_scotsman wrote:
Should I assemble this guardsman holding his rifle sideways facing forwards? Or should I turn him 90 degrees on his torso so you can clearly see the flat join on the model on the sides of his hip and his head doesn't seat properly in the groove? or should I turn him around 180 like hes grand emperor scroob in spaceballs after a transporter accident?

the possibilities were literally endless!

You can be glib about it all you like, doesn't change the fact that it was true, and that any of those Cadians could have the Flamer or the Grenade Launcher, rather than the specific Flamer guy or Grenade guy.

 catbarf wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:
Unlike what we had in the good old days when kits were customizable and possibilities were endless!

Should I assemble this guardsman holding his rifle sideways facing forwards? Or should I turn him 90 degrees on his torso so you can clearly see the flat join on the model on the sides of his hip and his head doesn't seat properly in the groove? or should I turn him around 180 like hes grand emperor scroob in spaceballs after a transporter accident?

the possibilities were literally endless!

Have you looked at the Skitarii or GSC Neophyte kits at all? They use the 'old style' of assembly, and even if it doesn't produce enormous variation between the models, it allows for some diversity. And they look real good.

The mono-build plastic kits hearken back to the days of pewter models and only having a handful of poses for a model, and with very busy/recognizable sculpts like the Death Guard, it makes the repetition very obvious.

Skitarii kits and GSC troops are both "Category 3" new kits - customizable arms, customizable heads, fixed paired torsos+Legs.

I might be remembering wrong and there might be leg rotation on the Neophytes, but I don't think there was. IIRC there are paired legs+Torsos. There are definitely paired legs+Torsos in the Skitarii kit, you cannot mix and match legs with torsos. Additionally, arms on all two-handed weapons are have designated pairs.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but that would appear to be exactly the same level of customization as the plague marine MPPK. Arms on all two-handed weapons are paired, torsos and legs are fixed (Plague marines may have swappable chests/bellies, I cant tell) and arms with one-handed weapons are fully swappable.

EDIT: Yep, torsos and legs are fixed in the neophyte kit. I remember now that the little sticks of dynamites and grenades on the torsos fit in with one particular pair of legs. Also, half your models are hunch-backed 3rd gen hybrids and half are upright 4th gen hybrids, and that is determined in the leg+Torso step.

Skitarii Rangers/Vanguard have fixed arms, torsos, and legs.

There's different arm sets for the torsos, but they're all keyed to specifics. If you look on the inside of the arms, there's indentations that match up to the torso pipings.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:
But the Plague Terminator kit looks *exactly* as customizable as the Scarab terminator kit (Much more so, honestly, because the bits in the kit actually look different from one another) and the Death Guard kit looks to be similar. Like I said before - the only difference appears to be monopose legs (with swappable chest plates unless I'm understanding wrong) vs ball and socket joint legs.

But it's clearly not as customisable. Clearly. I mean, how can you not see that?

The 1KSons Terminators are like pretty much all the previous regular Terminator kits (with the exception of the BA Assault Terminator box). Any torso can go with any legs can go with any arm can go with any shoulder pad. The Plague Terminator kits have no such options. There are 5 bodies, and those bodies will always be the same (one with the Nurgling, one that's mutated into a fly with the tiny arms, and so on). You cannot mix and match as they're all set poses. The arms are built in their entirety, and whilst my kits are in the other room under too many other unbuilt things to find, I'd be willing to bet all the money in my wallet against all the money in your wallet that only certain torsos can take certain arms.

the possibilities were literally endless!

You can be glib about it all you like, doesn't change the fact that it was true, and that any of those Cadians could have the Flamer or the Grenade Launcher, rather than the specific Flamer guy or Grenade guy.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Thing is, as much as some people want to pretend that it isn't real and that nothing has changed with GW minis, we can pinpoint exactly where it changed en mass for 40K.

It was between the 1kSons and Death Guard releases:

We went from this kit, with sprues like this, to this kit, with sprues like this.
We went from this kit, with sprues like this, to this kit, with sprues like this.
We went from this kit, with sprues like this, to this kit, with sprues like this.

And whilst you can forgive most of the EZ2B kits, it started impacting the rules thanks to the "no model = no rule" kick GW's been on since the CHS debacle, so because this kit can only be built one way, it's rules only allow for that exact config. And kits are no longer able to work with one another in quite the same way (with some exceptions, like Skitarii/GSC, which were designed to fit) to discourage kitbashing, again, because no model = no rule, and if there's no rule for your fancy model, you don't need to kitbash.

It's awful.

All those stunning new models, terrible... *rolls eyes*

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
All those stunning new models, terrible... *rolls eyes*

And that's what we call a non sequitur.

They're starting the short stories for Psychic Awakening: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/09/30/psychic-awakening-the-pathgw-homepage-post-3/

That first one is not very good. Hopefully they get better.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
All those stunning new models, terrible... *rolls eyes*

And that's what we call a non sequitur.

No,that's what YOU call a non sequitur..... not having to kitbash your models because all the lovely new models come with all the weapon options for your unit is great, common sense, and doesnt stop people from kitbashing/converting. Try harder next time....

the_scotsman wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Skitarii Rangers/Vanguard have fixed arms, torsos, and legs.

There's different arm sets for the torsos, but they're all keyed to specifics. If you look on the inside of the arms, there's indentations that match up to the torso pipings.

Looking at the assembly kits for these guys, this isn't quite true - multiple torsos can accept the same bit (Several guys are shown to be assembled with bit #92, the plasma caliver).
it does look like you can't take any paired set of arms and assemble them with any torso, but it's not 100% fixed - each torso can accept at least 1 rifle, at least 1 carbine, and some can accept special weapons.

Yes, the Plasma Caliver is interestingly unique though as it doesn't have a 'sleeved' arm set--and it has two sets of 'steadying' arms to make it so that it's aimed or the operator is moving.

Also I'd be willing to bet anyone can be the sarge, since those arms aren't paired. One handed melee weapons are almost always more poseable than two-handed guns/melee weapons.

Not easily. You have to trim stuff to make it work.

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
No,that's what YOU call a non sequitur..... not having to kitbash your models because all the lovely new models come with all the weapon options for your unit is great, common sense, and doesnt stop people from kitbashing. Try harder next time....

But that wasn't the point I was making at all. You're arguing something unrelated, therefore, non sequitur.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
No,that's what YOU call a non sequitur..... not having to kitbash your models because all the lovely new models come with all the weapon options for your unit is great, common sense, and doesnt stop people from kitbashing. Try harder next time....

But that wasn't the point I was making at all. You're arguing something unrelated, therefore, non sequitur.

Its a slight shame its a little trickier than the older 'every limb is separate' way, but they generally look better. And yes, its related, but you can keep arguing all day if you want

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
They're starting the short stories for Psychic Awakening: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/09/30/psychic-awakening-the-pathgw-homepage-post-3/

That first one is not very good. Hopefully they get better.

Huh, I didn't know they were going to follow the AoS model with short story tie-ins.

Time to over-optimistically read into this story how the first book won't just be Eldar but have surprise Slaanesh content.

This was posted on YouTube, next little fluff video thing

Yay! Everyone's favorite hysterical Inquisitor is back!

Rhana Dandra can't come soon enough. The wait is killing me.

So, is it even a big deal if a phoenix falls?
Fluffwise, Phoenixs just regenerate. And it's not like Phoenix Lords dying off is unheard of, since someone else can just don the armor and take over for them

Unless of course they use this as a chance to perma kill a phoenix lord, so they don't have to give one a new model

The issue when a Phoenix Lord falls is that their armor is left there and could be lost waiting for an Eldar to find it. I suppose it's possible for them to be destroyed as well, but that's never happened in the background to my knowledge.

It'd be unfortunate if they did. It'd be Baharroth (there's a preexisting prophecy that says he'll be the first to die in the Eldar apocalypse.)

Model wise he's pretty fun and game play wise he's got fly, high movement and deep strike which are several requirements to not be useless in 8th.

I'd rather they kill Karandras or Asurmen myself, as aesthetically I don't like them and they're both pretty bad walking melee named characters who don't have Abbadon/Gilliam level auras.

If Slannesh gets hold of that Phoenix armour they're going to be in trouble as he/she/it should be able to eat that tasty mix of souls

Now that's a hat.

Looking pretty damn swish.

I like the model. Looks a lot more inspiring than the artwork.

Hmm model looks a bit too busy at this angle

That is a damn sweet model. I can't wait to get him and some Incubi for my Dark Eldar Army.

Is it me, or is he in a very, very similar pose to Lelith, just wearing more clothes?

"Nobody can know its Drazhar coming next week" oh look its Drazhar.

Nvs wrote:
The issue when a Phoenix Lord falls is that their armor is left there and could be lost waiting for an Eldar to find it. I suppose it's possible for them to be destroyed as well, but that's never happened in the background to my knowledge.

It's actually the whole plotline for FW's Doom of Myrmea book.

The Shadow Spectres' Phoenix Lord had fallen ages ago, the shrine was exposed and the Eldar went after it.

Personally I think that model is boring as gak. If it was a standard Klaivex? Fine. For Drazhar? Very uninspired.