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 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Mods - can you explain exactly what you consider off topic for this thread please?

Surely a poster exclaiming; 'I'm really happy with what my faction got' is no more on topic than; 'I'm not happy my faction got less than x faction'?

Is this some weird positive perception thing?

I made this thread and the intention was to speculate and share news for all things PA. If people are speculating that the next PA will have more rules for one faction than another, I'm really struggling to see how that can be considered off topic?

Hi AAE,

First can I ask that anyone who makes a note in a thread asking for moderator input please also yellow triangle their message, that way we are guaranteed to actually see it whereas if you do not do so then it just chance if one of us does.

As to your question, as you know from following this thread yourself there is a constant issue with it devolving into a back and forth argument about SM getting too many releases, why they get so many releases and GWs whole business model. As a one off in any thread that would not be an issue, however it has happened frequently here and every single time it gets more impolite and hostile. I think currently this thread generates more user alerts and moderator action than any other and the vast majority of it is from this back and forth argument. Whilst it is relevant that SM (or sub species of) gets a release and some people are happy about it and others are not, a N&R thread is not the place for a circular argument about its value. People come to these threads to read News and Rumours, not to read person A call person X a donkey cave because he thought that the Marines get special attention, or that person C whishes that person F would die in a hole because their faction got a newer release by a decade. This keeps on happening, it hasn't been once or twice and it is tiresome, not only for myself and the other moderators but also for everyone who wants to read News and Rumours.

Are we trying to enforce a relentless wave of positivity? No. That would be as tiresome, or more so, than relentless negativity. Are we trying to enforce this thread not rehashing the same tired argument again every 10 pages? Yes. If one really must have their say about how burdensome it is to have another Sm release, or yet another Primaris Lt. stood in a slightly different pose, then there is a thread for that kind of thing in discussions. The same goes for people complaining about the people complaining, it isnt N&R, it isnt needed, its off topic and frankly really boring by now. As always if you see a post that breaks the rules then hit the yellow triangle of friendship and let us know but do not engage in the off topic.

 ingtaer wrote:

Hi AAE,

First can I ask that anyone who makes a note in a thread asking for moderator input please also yellow triangle their message, that way we are guaranteed to actually see it whereas if you do not do so then it just chance if one of us does.

As to your question, as you know from following this thread yourself there is a constant issue with it devolving into a back and forth argument about SM getting too many releases, why they get so many releases and GWs whole business model. As a one off in any thread that would not be an issue, however it has happened frequently here and every single time it gets more impolite and hostile. I think currently this thread generates more user alerts and moderator action than any other and the vast majority of it is from this back and forth argument. Whilst it is relevant that SM (or sub species of) gets a release and some people are happy about it and others are not, a N&R thread is not the place for a circular argument about its value. People come to these threads to read News and Rumours, not to read person A call person X a donkey cave because he thought that the Marines get special attention, or that person C whishes that person F would die in a hole because their faction got a newer release by a decade. This keeps on happening, it hasn't been once or twice and it is tiresome, not only for myself and the other moderators but also for everyone who wants to read News and Rumours.

Are we trying to enforce a relentless wave of positivity? No. That would be as tiresome, or more so, than relentless negativity. Are we trying to enforce this thread not rehashing the same tired argument again every 10 pages? Yes. If one really must have their say about how burdensome it is to have another Sm release, or yet another Primaris Lt. stood in a slightly different pose, then there is a thread for that kind of thing in discussions. The same goes for people complaining about the people complaining, it isnt N&R, it isnt needed, its off topic and frankly really boring by now. As always if you see a post that breaks the rules then hit the yellow triangle of friendship and let us know but do not engage in the off topic.

Perfect, thank you for the response.

We have out answer and can cite this if the topic continues to go off topic.

Apologies for not reporting my own post, I didn't realise that would get your attention quicker - I'll use this in future for any queries.

Thanks again.

E - on topic - what do people think we're going to see for DG and Tau then?

Do DG have similar Cults to TS? Are there different Vectors or something from the Heresy?

What will Tau see - an expansion of their Mont'ka and Kau'yon abilities? Perhaps the ability to create an army with this theme?

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

E - on topic - what do people think we're going to see for DG and Tau then?

Do DG have similar Cults to TS? Are there different Vectors or something from the Heresy?

Detachment-level rules for 7 Vectors of DG is probably a good bet.
EDIT: the codex names 7 plague companies and 14 'vectoriums', so maybe it'll be the former.

I'm still wondering if that Shadowsun picture is a red herring and GSC won't appear in PA5, but rather AdMech will be the 3rd faction. That would neatly tie up three things; their upcoming model release, explain who helped repel the DG fleet, and means one less Imperial faction to cover later.

Then we can have a GSC vs Deathwatch rematch in a later book.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
E - on topic - what do people think we're going to see for DG and Tau then?

Do DG have similar Cults to TS? Are there different Vectors or something from the Heresy?

DG are organized into seven Plague Fleets, with each having signature diseases they spread and being weighted more towards certain aspects of DG like sorcerers, daemon engines or poxwalkers. It's not a huge theme in the army though, so I hope they get something more creative than that.
DG currently are mostly lacking in the stratagem department, they have the least stratagems of any codex right after assassins. New warlord traits would also be nice, as all but Arch Contaminator are irrelevant.

 xttz wrote:
EDIT: the codex names 7 plague companies and 14 'vectoriums', so maybe it'll be the former.

I'm still wondering if that Shadowsun picture is a red herring and GSC won't appear in PA5, but rather AdMech will be the 3rd faction. That would neatly tie up three things; their upcoming model release, explain who helped repel the DG fleet, and means one less Imperial faction to cover later.

Then we can have a GSC vs Deathwatch rematch in a later book.

Yea agreed on all points - I think 14 would be a bit much so the Plague Companies are probably more likely.

I wouldn't be surprised if GSC were not in PA5, though it'd be a nice link in terms of themes if they were included IMO.

 Jidmah wrote:
DG are organized into seven Plague Fleets, with each having signature diseases they spread and being weighted more towards certain aspects of DG like sorcerers, daemon engines or poxwalkers. It's not a huge theme in the army though, so I hope they get something more creative than that.
DG currently are mostly lacking in the stratagem department, they have the least stratagems of any codex right after assassins. New warlord traits would also be nice, as all but Arch Contaminator are irrelevant.

I think it's a given DG get new strats. How many though I'm not sure. Their guns were specifically referenced as sounding "wet" in the short story - perhaps they'll get some "Sloppy Issue Ammunition"?

 xttz wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

E - on topic - what do people think we're going to see for DG and Tau then?

Do DG have similar Cults to TS? Are there different Vectors or something from the Heresy?

Detachment-level rules for 7 Vectors of DG is probably a good bet.
EDIT: the codex names 7 plague companies and 14 'vectoriums', so maybe it'll be the former.

I'm still wondering if that Shadowsun picture is a red herring and GSC won't appear in PA5, but rather AdMech will be the 3rd faction. That would neatly tie up three things; their upcoming model release, explain who helped repel the DG fleet, and means one less Imperial faction to cover later.

Then we can have a GSC vs Deathwatch rematch in a later book.

Even if there are no GSC in this book (and right now it seems very likely they are), the third faction will not be admech. They are needed for toaster wars against necrons.

 BoomWolf wrote:


Even if there are no GSC in this book (and right now it seems very likely they are), the third faction will not be admech. They are needed for toaster wars against necrons.

Yeah they could continue the story from Forgebane. Hell, there are rumour engine pics implying both Necron and AdMech character models, so we could see another boxed set like it too.

It's just very odd for GW to preview that AdMech vehicle at the end of November if it's not due until say PA7 in April, or later.

Given the number of admech kits not currently in the codex, I'm expecting them to get a full 2.0 book in the next month or two, instead of just a PA supplement. Sisters just did after all.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Given the number of admech kits not currently in the codex, I'm expecting them to get a full 2.0 book in the next month or two, instead of just a PA supplement. Sisters just did after all.

The same could be said of daemons who have all the slaanesh releases and revised khorne profiles missing from the codex. Alongside being seriously short in stratagems, plus their natural adversary already being covered.

the_scotsman wrote:
For the remainder of the edition itll be the same somg and dance as 7th:

"This is good and fun but cant compete with scatterbikes and free razorback spam"

"Nothing should compete with that, those things should be nerfed."

*neither gets nerfed until a new edition blows up all the rules in the game*

Well complete blow up will be like 13th edition or something. Unti' then just enough tweaks to make people buy new rulebooks, codexes and more models

 xttz wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:


Even if there are no GSC in this book (and right now it seems very likely they are), the third faction will not be admech. They are needed for toaster wars against necrons.

Yeah they could continue the story from Forgebane.

They've been continuing the story from Forgebane. The AdMech codex actually laid the groundwork for it, Kill Team's starter box with Skitarii v GSC, and Vigilus Defiant continued it.

Hell, there are rumour engine pics implying both Necron and AdMech character models, so we could see another boxed set like it too.

The Necron "rumor engine" seemed to be more of an AdMech special character. There's been a good chunk of focus on the Xenarites and Stygies VIII lately and having a piece of Necron tech is right up their alley.

It's just very odd for GW to preview that AdMech vehicle at the end of November if it's not due until say PA7 in April, or later.

There was a decent gap between the reveal of the Skorpius and the actual release too.

Tomorrow, GW will likely post a Genestealer Cults short story. That's why I think they are the 3rd faction in Book 5. I do not recall mention of Tau or DG in this one, or any other faction really.

It might not mean anything, as others have already mentioned, seeing as guardsmen were mentioned in previews PA short stories but haven't been featured in the books as of yet.

What's the point of posting that? At this juncture, it's obvious that whatever information there is not an actual source for the info on the book--it's speculation coming off of datamining on the Community page's media permissions.

You don't consider Psychic Awakening short story .pdfs a source of info on Psychic Awakening books when they have posted each one on the Warhammer Community site?

You're right, I'll stick to posting on B&C.

So, a full review of the stuff thousand sons got, ranked from least interesting to most interesting.

How cults work: Each thousand sons detachment gains a cult keyword on all non-unique, non-cultist or tzaangor units. Funnily enough that includes spawn and mutaliths, we dont judge I guess.

That grants all the psykers the cult's unique psychic power in addition to what they ordinarily get, so thats fun. Still only one cast per turn but anyone can cast it. This is better kn some cults than others.

Allies dont affect this rule, you can soup and still get cults.

All thousand sons also get 7 new stratagems.

Magister 1CP. One use only, give a non warlord a warlord trait.

Useful for actually getting the cult rules on the table.

Risen Rubricae 1CP: deploy one unit of rubric marines anywhere outside 9" from enemy models rather than deploying normally.

Good for using the next stratagem turn 1.

Fullisades 1CP: a unit of rubrics or scarabs that did not move this turn may fire rapid fire weapons twice.

Obviously a big boost to the power of rubrics if you pull it off. Its really nice that all these new stratagems are pretty cheap, since after buying a second wl trait and relic almost every game youll probably need the stratagems to be inexpensive.

Sorcerous Something 1CP: use in the psychic phase when a friendly unit is affected by a power and a natural 9 or better was rolled for the psychic test. One model in the unit is healed D3 wounds or if no models are wounded, one model is returned from the unit with full wounds remaining.

Again, I like that the stratagems are cheap but situational. That lets them be impactful while still being only 1CP, and we can stretch out our limited pool.

Warp Invuln Saves Thingy 1CP: use when a unit of rubrics or scarabs is targeted by an attack.add 1 to the units invuln save to a max of 3++ until the end of the phase.

Remember that All is Dust could theoretically let us get a 2++ with this anyway. Another very good rubric focused stratagem.

No, It's Much Too Perilous 1CP: ignore a perils roll.

Thousand sons have needed this one for ages. Very good addition.

Yoked Automata 2CP: use when a character is charged, a unit of rubrics or scarabs can heroically intervene 2D6".

Uh...what? The only bad one of the bunch. Random distance? Catapult your shooting units into melee? 2CP? Eh, whatever, most of them were good.

Now to talk about the cults.

Thanks for the summary!

Cult of Manipulation

Power: Attempted Possession. Target character within 18" takes 1MW and suffers -2 to all psychic tests they take in their next turn.

Trait: beguiling influence. -1 to A and S of all units within 1" of warlord

Relic: Sothors Reflector. When this model is chosen to fight they may copy the melee weapon of an enemy character within 1", but may not reroll any dice when attacking.

Overall thoughts: the weakest of the bunch imo. An anti-psyker anti character sort of setup but other cults have much better tools for that.

 Brometheus wrote:
You don't consider Psychic Awakening short story .pdfs a source of info on Psychic Awakening books when they have posted each one on the Warhammer Community site?

You're right, I'll stick to posting on B&C.

Lets not be overly dramatic, don't stop posting here because of some troll.

I value most of what you guys say, even if i don't agree with it .

Cult of Change

Power: Twist Reality, wc6. Select enemy unit within 12", -1 to Ld and A.

Trait: Fickle Nature. Warlord rerolls charges and may shoot and charge after falling back.

Capricious Crest: within 18" of the bearer, you may change enemy psykers' 6s to 1s and Cult of Change psykers' 1s to 6s

This one is only worth considering for arguably the best relic in all the cults.

Double your opponents chance to peril, remove their chance to supersmite, make their average roll a 5 and yours a 9... But probably the least useful trait and power.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Cult of Knowledge

Power; psychic delve WC6. Select an enemy unit within 18", whwn resolving an attack against that unit friendly cult of knowledge units reroll 1 to wound.

Trait: Scholar. Reroll dice rolls of 1 for psychic tests

Relic: gladdions cry. This was glossed over I/ the video bit I believe it was a warpflame pistol with +1S and damage

A fairly unexceptional cult, one of the only ones saddled with a weapon relic and a boring trait. Power is OK. Mini doom.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Cult of Mutation

Power: Warp Reality WC6. Select a terrain feature within 18" and an enemy unit within 3" of the feature. That units movement is halved and subtract 1 from all advance and charge rolls in its next turn.

Trait: touch of vissitude. Warlord inflicts 1MW for each unmodified hit roll of 6 in the fight phase.

Relic: Exalted mutation. SORCEROR only, +1S, A, and T.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Cult of Scheming

Power: Seeded Strategy WC6. A friendly cult of scheming unit within 6" can shoot and charge even if it fell back.

Trait: grand schemer. While within 3" of the warlord all cult of scheming units gain disciples of tzeentch (obsec)

Relic: if the model is on the battlefield once per battle you may declare a stratagem to cost 0CP.

This is one of the mid tier ones with a very strong use case, that being max size rubric blobs. Use the power to prevent them being tied up and the relic to give them a free use of Votlw on a turn you have them buffed to hell and double tapping.

Id pass up the trait personally for the 5+ cp regen or something. If im running cult of scheming I have troops with a good board footprint. Maybe to get obsec scarabs.


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Cult of Prophecy

Divine Future WC6. If manifested roll a die and set it aside. After rolling a hit roll, wound roll, damage roll, psychic test, charge roll, damage roll or advance roll made by a cult of prophecy unit you may substitute the number on that die for the result.

Trait: guided by whispers. After the warlord fires overwatch he may move 6".

Relic: psychic brazier. When a friendly unit within 6" of the bearer attacks it may reroll 1 hit roll wound roll or damage roll.

A middling cult. A slightly more limited miracle die (only for offensive actions) but slightly more potent as you can substitute after rolling is a good power, but the trait is very bad.


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Cult of Duplicity

Power: sorcerous Facade wc7. Select one friendly unit within 6", pick up the unit and set them down anywhere over 9" from enemy models. The unit counts as having moved.

Trait: duplicitous tactician. Redeploy D3 Cult of Duplicity units before the start of the first turn.

Relic: perfidious tome. Roll a die at the start of each battle round. On a 1 your opponent gains 1CP, on a 4+ you gain 1CP.

Barring the...let's say very chaos-y relic, this offers some great possibilities. If the larger detachment of your army is this cult, basically every unit has the ability to Da Jump themselves. Get out of melee, grab an objective, target an exposed character, love it.

Good trait too. Especially if youre trying the risen rubricae+fullisade combo and you dont want to worry about getting seized.


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Cult of Magic

Power: Astral Bigly Smite WC6. If manifested the closest enemy unit within 18" takes D3 MWs and all units within 3" take 1MW.

Trait: devastating sorcery. When this warlord deals any MW from a psychic power to an enemy unit, that unit suffers 1 additional MW.

Relic: Add +1 to psychic tests taken by the bearer.

Heres the one for your supreme command. A DPtz with the trait and infernal gateway is a hideous threat to clustered enemy units. Just in general though every model in this cult has the option to pull out a double smite AND they get to select all their regular powers, making them very versatile.




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Cult of Time

Power: Time Flux WC5. One friendlt cult of time infantry unit within 12" returns 1 destroyed model to the battlefield or D3 if the power was cast on a 9+.

Trait: if your warlord casts a power on a 9+ he may cast 1 additional power this turn.

Relic: hourglass of monach. The first time the bearer is destroyed, it is returned with D3 wounds remaining at the end of the phase. Place the model as close to its previous position as possible.

Another generically good cult for a large detachment. Ideally with good sized units for you to resurrect models to.

Great summary, thanks!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/01/20/psychic-awakening-oppressors-endgw-homepage-post-4/


Genestealer cult in this book.

I do like it when a book contains 3 factions that I don't collect, saves buying it. So far I've done OK with the book options (no BA/Nids), and now no DG/Tau/GSC. The downside is I still have Harlequins and Deathwatch remaining and rumours are they are not in the same book, so my luck may be ending.

Well, here's to GSC becoming a decent army, ideally without having to jump through 2 vigilus detachments and multi-faction detachments from every section of the book just to get some basic functionality going.

GSC having all their "unit-specific" strats that give that extra bit of flavour/utility to a units also be their "sub-faction" specific strats was really a poor design choice of the original Codex IMO.

Sunny Side Up wrote:
Well, here's to GSC becoming a decent army, ideally without having to jump through 2 vigilus detachments and multi-faction detachments from every section of the book just to get some basic functionality going.

GSC having all their "unit-specific" strats that give that extra bit of flavour/utility to a units also be their "sub-faction" specific strats was really a poor design choice of the original Codex IMO.

Considering the trend of non imperium not getting this status of affairs that seems preetty low a chance to happen.

 Brometheus wrote:
Tomorrow, GW will likely post a Genestealer Cults short story.

 Kanluwen wrote:
What's the point of posting that?

'Cause he was right. They just posted a GSC story.

Well done Brometheus.

A GSC and Tau short story specifically.

Guess I am only getting one book then

Not Online!!! wrote:

Sunny Side Up wrote:
Well, here's to GSC becoming a decent army, ideally without having to jump through 2 vigilus detachments and multi-faction detachments from every section of the book just to get some basic functionality going.

GSC having all their "unit-specific" strats that give that extra bit of flavour/utility to a units also be their "sub-faction" specific strats was really a poor design choice of the original Codex IMO.

Considering the trend of non imperium not getting this status of affairs that seems preetty low a chance to happen.

Well, either we'll get a second pheonix rising where the book is just 30% shorter, or maybe with no factions that will not be named we'll actually see decent attention getting paid.

The problem Cults have currently is just...they don't need goodies like what PA has been mostly about. They need core functionality. They've just got so much clunk and jank in their rules - BS4+ vehicles toting heavy weapons leading to our "Mobile" options functionally being stationary gun turrets, only 5 of their actual units benefitting from cult traits, cartoonishly nerfed Aberrants and Kelermorph, Metamorphs still lacking a reason for their existence with Acolytes toting far nastier weaponry, Neophytes being absolutely identical to Brood Brothers/Guardsmen but for no reason costing 20% more.

Genestealer cults get treated like pretty much any "assassin" type character that relies on ambush and high damage output in a competitive video game: every single player who picks the "Sniper" type characters who emphasize the lowest-risk, highest-reward style of play screeches at the fact that they stand no chance once the assassin is already on top of them and they're in a 1 on 1 fight, demands nerfs and ways to combat them without changing their preferred playstyle at all, and the assassin is an actual viable choice for about 3 seconds before they get nerfed to the ground.

Oh no, oh god, a unit exists that can deep strike in and kill a knight if it isn't screened? And it's not a Space Marine captain kitted out in a few very specific ways that we don't care about for some reason? That thing better see a 30% points nerf toot sweet! A 12" range assassin might challenge the supremacy of Characterhammer? No, say I, it shall not be! He MUST be more expensive than nearly every character he can conceivably kill in one round or he is irredeemably broken!!

Genestealer Cults have one specific tool that works really well and absolutely 0 tools for almost anything else. What do you do if you see a list with several flyers? Well, you lose. What do you do against anti-deep strike bubbles and stratagems? Lose. Space Marine super-deep strike? lose.

You could, I guess, give them a few stratagems to handle specific situations they don't really have the means to deal with currently, but they need more of a core rework to function. For starters, the "everybody jumps out of a hole and stabs the dudes to death" playstyle is supposed to be only one of three things GSC do, but the "ragged band of vehicle-riding mad max dudes" just....doesn't work, and the "traitor guard regiment" identity is just "hey want to play a guard army but you don't get traits?"

the_scotsman wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

Sunny Side Up wrote:
Well, here's to GSC becoming a decent army, ideally without having to jump through 2 vigilus detachments and multi-faction detachments from every section of the book just to get some basic functionality going.

GSC having all their "unit-specific" strats that give that extra bit of flavour/utility to a units also be their "sub-faction" specific strats was really a poor design choice of the original Codex IMO.

Considering the trend of non imperium not getting this status of affairs that seems preetty low a chance to happen.

Well, either we'll get a second pheonix rising where the book is just 30% shorter, or maybe with no factions that will not be named we'll actually see decent attention getting paid.

The problem Cults have currently is just...they don't need goodies like what PA has been mostly about. They need core functionality. They've just got so much clunk and jank in their rules - BS4+ vehicles toting heavy weapons leading to our "Mobile" options functionally being stationary gun turrets, only 5 of their actual units benefitting from cult traits, cartoonishly nerfed Aberrants and Kelermorph, Metamorphs still lacking a reason for their existence with Acolytes toting far nastier weaponry, Neophytes being absolutely identical to Brood Brothers/Guardsmen but for no reason costing 20% more.

I know that problem, i play/ed (well it's hard not to stop playing ) R&H, and mostly played what was in essence an infantry only regiment, that i sold of and replaced with my 31. after the realisation that basic militia got from3 to 4 pts in 8th, and understandably, when your core unit gets that treatment it is no wonder an army tanks in performance, especially if you factor in CP so my condolences.

Genestealer cults get treated like pretty much any "assassin" type character that relies on ambush and high damage output in a competitive video game: every single player who picks the "Sniper" type characters who emphasize the lowest-risk, highest-reward style of play screeches at the fact that they stand no chance once the assassin is already on top of them and they're in a 1 on 1 fight, demands nerfs and ways to combat them without changing their preferred playstyle at all, and the assassin is an actual viable choice for about 3 seconds before they get nerfed to the ground.

Frankly, that is maybee just my opinion, but GSC should've not been so heavily melee centric as they were and still are. Tehy should've been the ambush army, not just relying upon an otk charge but advantagous positions for snipers, shooting units aswell, but alas, maybee i just am too unkowing in design.

Oh no, oh god, a unit exists that can deep strike in and kill a knight if it isn't screened? And it's not a Space Marine captain kitted out in a few very specific ways that we don't care about for some reason? That thing better see a 30% points nerf toot sweet! A 12" range assassin might challenge the supremacy of Characterhammer? No, say I, it shall not be! He MUST be more expensive than nearly every character he can conceivably kill in one round or he is irredeemably broken!!

As a parttime csm player, i understand the frustration on both parts, random spanker popping out somwhere and ripping your lord / sorcerer to shreds for a fraction of the cost? annoying. Not beeing able to use the Asassin the way he should be useable? annoying.

Genestealer Cults have one specific tool that works really well and absolutely 0 tools for almost anything else. What do you do if you see a list with several flyers? Well, you lose. What do you do against anti-deep strike bubbles and stratagems? Lose. Space Marine super-deep strike? lose.

honestly cult ambush has been handled wrong, but also, more importantly, i feel like the sizecreep, with lower unit prices (csm was 15 pts when i started playing, now he is 11) and the general hike in pts for pick up games and competitive on not size increased boards leads to a ridicoulus ammount of gotcha pain, with no possibility to even propper use a defense in depth due to size constraints.

You could, I guess, give them a few stratagems to handle specific situations they don't really have the means to deal with currently, but they need more of a core rework to function. For starters, the "everybody jumps out of a hole and stabs the dudes to death" playstyle is supposed to be only one of three things GSC do, but the "ragged band of vehicle-riding mad max dudes" just....doesn't work, and the "traitor guard regiment" identity is just "hey want to play a guard army but you don't get traits?"

Hey atleast you'd get SOME stratagems which is better, objectively then nothing. Also, out of the thre styles, frankly GSC should've been instead the guerrilla army, Regular core and line bait troops, irregular strategy and abilites, infantry centric , special terrain interactions etc. Focus on special weapons brittle but high damage output.
but that is how i'd design the list...

Speaking of PA, have any of the books changed points of any faction?

zamerion wrote:
Speaking of PA, have any of the books changed points of any faction?

The first had the new, lower points for the Ynnari characters, that later appeared in Chapter Approved. But I think that was more a CA preview.

Like CA, the books currently coming out were probably all still written before the Marines Codex was published.