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But that has no bearing on PA books which were not affected by the Pandemic production disruption in any way? Which is the issue at hand, the PA books being just...overall bad narrative, with low stakes and not actually "a big deal" like they were promoted. I've no clue why corona, which was still "a thing in Wuhan" back when the first books of the cycle were coming out, is being brought into the discussion on that series of campaign books.

All I can say is I'm hoping that the end point of those books will be Slaaneshi mortals- and entire army of the glaves and archers would be incredible (I can pass on the slaangors personally, as I was hoping for serpent/reptile people.)

I believe that is more of a slaangor champion with mutations than a generic rank-and-file one.

Fingers crossed we find out soon!

Carlovonsexron wrote:
All I can say is I'm hoping that the end point of those books will be Slaaneshi mortals- and entire army of the glaves and archers would be incredible (I can pass on the slaangors personally, as I was hoping for serpent/reptile people.)

Yeah, an entire army of Slaaneshi mortals would be great. I'd like a little more than just bows and pointy sticks, though. That just doesn't make for much variety at the army size you normally play AoS.

GW being GW we'll probably find out before summer next year if that hope comes true.

wouldn't it be great if the next starter set will be Slaanesh vs. daughters of khain (I know won't happen because stormcast)

I actually think that's less likely because we're about to get a battle box so themed in a short while. With AoS 2nd ed turning three years old next summer and likely being replaced by 3rd ed then, it's just too close together for that matchup

Honestly I can still believe that Sigmarines don't have to be in an AoS starter box in the same way Marines are sure to be in a 40k one. Yes, both starter boxes so far did have Sigmarines, but it seems GW has eased up on shoving them down people's throat and is open to doing a greater variety of forces like they used to in Fantasy. This may turn out to be incorrect and Sigmarines may be in the next starter after all, and I'll have to revise my opinion, but I'm not there yet.

Additionally, if I had to put money on an army that's matched up against Slaanesh's forces, it'd be Tyrion's elves in an expansion of what we just got, or Malerion's elves to finally introduce him and his followers. Both of them are relevant to the Slaanesh narrative after all, whereas Sigmarines are not. And since Morathi gets a background book and a battle box in a bit, I think Daughters of Khaine are covered for the time being.

My dream scenario would actually be Seraphon vs. Slaanesh, unless normal order humans in a greco-roman aesthetic become a thing.

Sigmarine stuff isn't nearly as prevalent as it is in 40k, but I still think the timing on 3.0 aligns with a new Stormcast Battletome landing with a new chamber in the new starter box - it's the oldest tome and they're still the posterboys of the IP, even if GW don't hold them over a barrel and milk them until blood comes out the way they do Astartes. Gordrakk is still doing his thing, but that plot point hasn't been explored much yet and as the only GA not to feature in a starter box yet, it would make sense for a Sigmarine vs Black Or- uhh, Ironjawz themed starter set and accompanying fluff.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Cronch wrote:
It was advertised as "big thing", and it ended up being less consequential than Storm of Chaos was for WHFB, I think it's fair to say people were led to expect more.

It just ended a few months ago and we're still in the middle of a frigging worldwide pandemic that is messing with production, shipping, and all factors of basically everything for everyone.

Why in the world do you people keep making these kinds of statements like everything is still normal in the world? You can't know what consequences are happening or where things are going--because we've only gotten a few codices at this point. And one of them involved the return of a near-mythical figure and the awakening of another.

That isn't "a big thing" to you?

You realize story and whole book series was written before corona made even first appearance　in　china right?

White knights these day. Blaming　corona for everything. Sheesh what kind of superbug it is since　it is(according to you) capable of rewriting already written books in past? Yikes.

 Geifer wrote:
Honestly I can still believe that Sigmarines don't have to be in an AoS starter box in the same way Marines are sure to be in a 40k one. Yes, both starter boxes so far did have Sigmarines, but it seems GW has eased up on shoving them down people's throat and is open to doing a greater variety of forces like they used to in Fantasy. This may turn out to be incorrect and Sigmarines may be in the next starter after all, and I'll have to revise my opinion, but I'm not there yet.

I can certainly see it going either way: either they ease on the Sigmarine focus to give some love to another faction that could actually do with some new sculpts, or they revert to Sigmarines precisely because they haven't received enough as of late. Beyond aesthetics, I hope there will never be a Marine-equivalent in AoS. (And okay, I also wish there wasn't an equivalent in terms of aesthetics, but that ship has sailed and is now a distant speck on the horizon.)

tneva82 wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Cronch wrote:
It was advertised as "big thing", and it ended up being less consequential than Storm of Chaos was for WHFB, I think it's fair to say people were led to expect more.

It just ended a few months ago and we're still in the middle of a frigging worldwide pandemic that is messing with production, shipping, and all factors of basically everything for everyone.

Why in the world do you people keep making these kinds of statements like everything is still normal in the world? You can't know what consequences are happening or where things are going--because we've only gotten a few codices at this point. And one of them involved the return of a near-mythical figure and the awakening of another.

That isn't "a big thing" to you?

You realize story and whole book series was written before corona made even first appearance　in　china right?

White knights these day. Blaming　corona for everything. Sheesh what kind of superbug it is since　it is(according to you) capable of rewriting already written books in past? Yikes.

Literally nothing I said has to deal with the writing. It has everything to do with the actual distribution and production of the follow-on items.

About the only relevance the writing has to do with what I said is that the writing is the item that people need to read to see the impact of PA and that stuff has been delayed in actual releases thanks to covid screwing with shipping and distribution infrastructure.

Which has nothing to do with contents of the books which was the initial comment. People have seen the writing and pretty much since the first PA book were critical of the poor narrative it had.

The writing in AoS campaign books has been good; there is more of it and it is of higher quality than what was in PA. Important stuff has happened in every AoS campaign book so far. The most recent, Wrath of the Everchosen, was a pretty big deal plot-wise.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
The writing in AoS campaign books has been good; there is more of it and it is of higher quality than what was in PA. Important stuff has happened in every AoS campaign book so far. The most recent, Wrath of the Everchosen, was a pretty big deal plot-wise.

That whole passage of Archaon talking Slaanesh to its face made the whole book worth it just for that

 Coenus Scaldingus wrote:

 Geifer wrote:
Honestly I can still believe that Sigmarines don't have to be in an AoS starter box in the same way Marines are sure to be in a 40k one. Yes, both starter boxes so far did have Sigmarines, but it seems GW has eased up on shoving them down people's throat and is open to doing a greater variety of forces like they used to in Fantasy. This may turn out to be incorrect and Sigmarines may be in the next starter after all, and I'll have to revise my opinion, but I'm not there yet.

I can certainly see it going either way: either they ease on the Sigmarine focus to give some love to another faction that could actually do with some new sculpts, or they revert to Sigmarines precisely because they haven't received enough as of late. Beyond aesthetics, I hope there will never be a Marine-equivalent in AoS. (And okay, I also wish there wasn't an equivalent in terms of aesthetics, but that ship has sailed and is now a distant speck on the horizon.)

Me, I don't have a problem with Sigmarines. Sigmar's dominion isn't the Empire of old that sends out halberdiers with one shoe to fight monstrous incursions. Pretty much every other god has an army of capable warriors, and being a warrior god I don't see why Sigmar shouldn't have one either.

Aesthetically I think Sigmarines are only let down by GW's stubborn refusal to make Order humans that put Sigmarine appearance in perspective. Not all visual design choices agree with me, especially of the wizardy guys, but if you accept that AoS aesthetic is founded on super buff dudes, I think Sigmarines fit right into the paladin niche that an Order god might claim for himself.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
The writing in AoS campaign books has been good; there is more of it and it is of higher quality than what was in PA. Important stuff has happened in every AoS campaign book so far. The most recent, Wrath of the Everchosen, was a pretty big deal plot-wise.

I have to say I was not impressed with the Realmgate Wars books, but that was during the dreaded beginning of AoS and may not be indicative of recent quality.

Realmgate Wars books were hobbled heavily.

First up they were heavily focused on Sigmarines (yes I'll use that term because that's what they very much were at launch); and because of how the Stormcast were designed they come off as exceptionally "Mary Sue" in those books. Armies marching for days on end through chaos blighted lands with no food or water; climbing mountains of silver whilst fighting off winged attackers then fighting a battle at the top against a small army; then sieging a fortress over a sea of silver. It's all really epic, but at the same time its a whilst stop for the stormcast doing extreme things

They are almost totally battle focused stories by design which weakens their lore building and they were made to go into campaign books alongside battleplans.


I'd also wager GW's attitude at the time had a huge impact on how much lore was set in stone for the writers to work with and how much communication they had since GW was keeping it all super secret hush hush.

Finally it likely suffered a bit because unlike Old World and 40K; AoS wasn't starting with 2 or 3 factions it was starting with a whole world of factions and armies and forces and alliances and such. Almost too much for writers to wrap their heads around when the lore was also designed to be supremely open ended (early on the Realms were each near infinite). Even now we've only a sketchy idea of some maps and regions and still no accurate time or dating system for events (right now its almost "pre-post Necroquake and pre-post Age of Sigmar starting" as the dating points.



So yep those early books were hobbled. There are still some gems- Pestilens is a great early story. Yet at the same time I'd say the early Fyreslayers stories are quite dull in comparison.

Don't use realmgate as the measure; they are neat to read for establishing the setting as the starting point, but they aren't the best by far

@Overread- Are you talking about the Pestilens book by Josh Reynolds? With the crawling city?

That was probably one of my favorite AOS books that Black Library put out. I enjoyed the Stormcast's allies in that one...

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
@Overread- Are you talking about the Pestilens book by Josh Reynolds? With the crawling city?

That was probably one of my favorite AOS books that Black Library put out. I enjoyed the Stormcast's allies in that one...

Yes and I agree its a fantastic and often overlooked story!

WarCry in Age of Sigmar

I really, really, really, really want them to stop with this mixed unit garbage.

My only surprise is a lack of spells on that warscroll. Otherwise an interesting unit of skirmishers.

Shadowleap is just what I'd expect its also very interesting because you can do it over and over and over again! Rather than just a one turn how it appears on the battlefield trick.

Annoying part is you can't even say "this is what happens when rules are limited to what's in the set!". There's zero reason that these could not be parceled out into Hero choice, other than the fact they shot themselves in the foot with there only being the 'Leader' role for characters effectively.

 Kanluwen wrote:
I really, really, really, really want them to stop with this mixed unit garbage.

Same.

I don't think these qualify as mixed units! They are pretty clean, same weapons on everyone, a few buff characters here or there but nothing that would require seperate dice rolling apart from the Shroud Queen. Totally in line with a normal AoS unit with command group. Nothing like the atrocity that is Zarbag's Gitz, or the Godsworn Hunt.

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
@Overread- Are you talking about the Pestilens book by Josh Reynolds? With the crawling city?

That was probably one of my favorite AOS books that Black Library put out. I enjoyed the Stormcast's allies in that one...

Its a great book - same as Spear of Shadows - so much possibility for tabletop units in both.

The Shadowstalkers scroll is ok - the Shroud Queen could/should have been a character though...

Khainities look useful (depending on points), Flameboys are as bad as all the other chaos warcry units in AoS proper.What is it with them that GW continues to make them so bad?

Shadowstalkers are good. Like really good. Just by existing they force the opponent to camp their objectives to prevent the stalkers from teleporting to them. And they have a nice little shooting attack to use while their hiding behind the front line.

Scions are all in the points cost. If they are cheap they could be a decent ranged support unit. But they need to be very cheap.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Cronch wrote:
Khainities look useful (depending on points), Flameboys are as bad as all the other chaos warcry units in AoS proper.What is it with them that GW continues to make them so bad?

I get what you are saying with their basic stats generally being pretty lackluster, but they aren't all bad. Splintered fang have decent damage because of MWs on 6s and a bit of extra survivability from snek regeneration. Cypher lords have a useful hit penalty ability. Iron golems are actually insanely good for their durability.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't think these qualify as mixed units! They are pretty clean, same weapons on everyone, a few buff characters here or there but nothing that would require seperate dice rolling apart from the Shroud Queen. Totally in line with a normal AoS unit with command group. Nothing like the atrocity that is Zarbag's Gitz, or the Godsworn Hunt.

Except not really.

There's no handbows options(which we know are a thing), no magic+knife, etc.
It's all dumbed down to accommodate keeping it as one unit. Same as the Underworlds warbands always are. In 40k, these things would likely be a HQ+Elite+Troops choice that are all 'unique'.

They would, and you'd have a meager CC hero and most likely completely weak troops. See Briar Queen or Thundrik in AoS, where you buy a hero and a useless infantry unit on top of him driving the price up..

As for previous Warcry bands, they're too expensive for their gimmicks or just outright outclassed by the basic marauders. All they had to do was to make them count as marauders instead of making them the worst units in the whol StD book.

Marauders are probably the strongest unit in the book for how absurdly powerful they are. It does tend to eliminate cultists as an option before they even get considered. Also, cultists need the undivided keyword.