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Totally unsurprised by this.

Bit annoying as I love the models, but I don't care about their game at all. I collect the models for use for things like Oathmark and, if I ever finish the huge backlog of painting, the old war of the ring rules.

I managed to collect almost everything I'd ever want for my collection barring a handful of models- sadly a few of them are always out of stock and some of them are on the list of things to go. But thankfully most of the the middle earth stuff is easy to pick up second hand and usually when GW have these big clear outs (especially for things not long having been re-released) we do see an excess of hobby clearance sales from folks dropping the game.

I do feel bad for those that do play the game exclusively or has one of these forces that are getting dumped. The Mahud stuff only came back out a couple of years ago, and was out of stock for a good chunk of that time. A lot of folk have probably only just got their hands on it, finally got paint on them and just as they see the tabletop been told they are being squatted. Good times.

Ah, we're entering a brave new paradigm:

"No movie, no rules"

It's a licensed game, one that was made as a tie in to the LotR films. It's a shock anything not from the films even got made in the first place.

I think that's probably reflective of changes in the licensing landscape. New Line Cinema basically maintains a separate instance of the license from Middle Earth Entertainment, and GWs license is via New Line. Ergo film content is fair game, anything else is probably not.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Eh, the only thing i'm really sorry about there is the titled wraiths. Never seen anyone touch Far Harad and the metal Khand chariots can go to hell and stay there. Give me proper resin or plastic for the redo's.

Well I guess I'm glad I backed the KS for STLs of Easterlings and Khand now. Real surprise on the Easterling and Dunland since they recently got those updates and resin minis.

Sad to see the Dweller In The Dark leave the range, as I was hoping they'd update it. But its fair enough as it wasn't in the movies, and I sat on the opportunity to buy one for years.

 legionaires wrote:

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Eh, the only thing i'm really sorry about there is the titled wraiths. Never seen anyone touch Far Harad and the metal Khand chariots can go to hell and stay there. Give me proper resin or plastic for the redo's.

Well I guess I'm glad I backed the KS for STLs of Easterlings and Khand now. Real surprise on the Easterling and Dunland since they recently got those updates and resin minis.

What do you mean? There's nothing Easterling on the list. Dunland's hardly surprising as they're about to be hit with new stuff.

Gert wrote:It's a licensed game, one that was made as a tie in to the LotR films. It's a shock anything not from the films even got made in the first place.

chaos0xomega wrote:I think that's probably reflective of changes in the licensing landscape. New Line Cinema basically maintains a separate instance of the license from Middle Earth Entertainment, and GWs license is via New Line. Ergo film content is fair game, anything else is probably not.

They still sell a lot of models that weren't in the films and some not even in the books, so I doubt the licence is the reason.

They had the license for content from the books (via Saul Zaentz) which is how there was non-movie content. However they didn't have the license for stuff still owned by the Tolkien family (so no Silmarilion, etc). Now maybe they've decided not to renew the wider license and just go with something that just covers the films, but previously they could do things that were in the 3+1 books that weren't in the movie, hence Scouring of the Shire, Khand, etc).

I think the more obvious answer is that they've got a fresh start and have used that to kick decades old models and now have the opportunity to redo them in more expensive resin.

Very sad to see Erkenbrand getting squatted. I'm glad I finally got my miniature painted after 10+ years but not having his profile and likely also losing the Redshields is going to set my force back a lot.

I really wish GW wouldn't play around with this Legacies stuff in their games. They know that people just don't play legacies because they want all their stuff useable anywhere they go. Could I just play with friends and ignore all of GW's stuff? Sure, but I'd have to find that group that wants to or is willing to play that way.

I feel for all the collections losing stuff, especially full factions being tossed. Big shame all around.

 Dryaktylus wrote:

They still sell a lot of models that weren't in the films and some not even in the books, so I doubt the licence is the reason.

Depends on how creatively the license is being used.
Cast your thoughts back to that massive period where nothing was happening for MESBG and then a diorama got released.
I'd be willing to be that was about license negotiations seeing as we're about to hit a decade on from Five Armies being released and 20 on from RotK.

If my memory serves, the original rulings for GW inventions was that they had to be approved by the Tolkien estate as something that would be appropriate and fit within the universe, which is why they could take so long.

Looks like its even more narrow, "no model available with described equipment, no rules"

So conversions are out the window

It's the inconsistency more than anything. Mauher is in the books and the film. Gildor is in the book. But Ghulavar isn't and it stays.

It brings into question the decision making and doesn't bode well for everything else ro come.

Gulavhar might be a best seller. If that is the case then they'll not get rid of him, or any other such kit.

 .Mikes. wrote:
It's the inconsistency more than anything. Mauher is in the books and the film. Gildor is in the book. But Ghulavar isn't and it stays.

It brings into question the decision making and doesn't bode well for everything else ro come.

Aye, based on this I wouldn't want to trust on any particular profiles/minis surviving future updates to the game/range. Some staples of the range, of factions, even whole (sub)factions, named characters appearing in books and/or movies, all have a chance of not surviving the cull. Some not so surprising, some I had certainly not seen coming.

Appreciate the information for what it's worth, but in some ways it's not worth much - "These models are now on Last Chance to Buy, and will be available while stocks last. Head over to Warhammer.com to grab them while you can." is just a joke when so many have been unavailable for ages, either not for sale, or just permanently "temporarily" out of stock...

A very complicated rights deal has caused this. I'm sure the creatives behind the game hate it as much as us, but probably the only way they can keep selling it.

Ive sat on buying khand, dunlendings and mahud for a while, I'll have to pick them up before they disappear forever. Lovely sculpts.

Hopefully the massively reduced range means they redo all of the old plastic infantry.

James12345 wrote:
A very complicated rights deal has caused this. I'm sure the creatives behind the game hate it as much as us, but probably the only way they can keep selling it.

Ive sat on buying khand, dunlendings and mahud for a while, I'll have to pick them up before they disappear forever. Lovely sculpts.

Hopefully the massively reduced range means they redo all of the old plastic infantry.

I guess we can't be 100% certain, but it seems pretty unlikely to be the rights issue given there is a whole bunch of stuff not from the movies which GW (for now at least) are going to be continuing to produce. Some of it is a little random - for instance in Serpent Horde the Haradrim King is going but the Serpent Guard are staying despite the fact they are definitely also not in the movie (or even book I would guess?). Balin is going but Durin is staying - and he's paired with Mardin, who not only isn't in the movies I'm pretty sure he's a GW invention...?

Sadly the other big change seems to be MESBG joining the disappointing NMNR as their mainstream games...

I think the deal is to do with book stuff, seems like if it's mentioned in book, but not in movie it's gone. Does seem very random wouldn't be surprised if the Tolkien estate just told them which to drop

if it's in the book, but not int he movie, get rid of it. But if it's in the movie and the book, but it's an orc, then it's not. Unless it's an elf whose name begins with a G and and I, then it's gone, but G and an L is fine. If it's completely made up it can stay. Unless you want it to go.

I'm a little salty about losing Khand; there's nothing else in the game quite like the chariots. And I've always loved their whole Mongol look. Hopefully I can grab some of the cavalry before it goes away forever, as at least with legacy rules I can use it in friendly games (I've already got a couple of regular chariots, a King on chariot, and some infantry, plus 2 cav). Edit: RIP to that plan, the cavalry is already gone, at least in the US. Single tear.

Some of the other stuff that's going away boggles my mind. Razgush and Muzgur are only a couple of years old (they came with Defence of the North), and also doing away with all of the existing Dunland stuff seems like a bad decision (granted, those are going to be replaced with the new War of the Rohirrim models). Also, getting rid of ALL of the named Ringwraiths that aren't the Witch King? Granted, some of the ancillary characters should probably go away to reduce bloat, but this feels a bit too far.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
Also, getting rid of ALL of the named Ringwraiths that aren't the Witch King? Granted, some of the ancillary characters should probably go away to reduce bloat, but this feels a bit too far.

There are a couple of sets left that are not on the last chance to buy- one from the each of the film trilogies by the looks it.

I suspect we could see them bring out a new set if the new film flops but the new Gollum film brings more life back into the live action films again, and they decide to quietly refocus the game back to the live action side of things. Or they could bring them back on a MTO (at double the cost they are now!)

All of these models being removed is a death knell for the game. Squatting so many profiles and armies is a joke. smh

Hardly. The game survived quite literal years with bare releases and and no support under Kirby. This is not a "a sky is falling" situation. Not even close.

And then the Legends churn came for LotR...

It's pretty bad though. Some factions are losing key models and options with no replacement, from a gameplay POV that's really sad.

I'm not personally bothered too much because none of these are models I wanted to buy for myself (some are lovely but GW prices mean I'll look for alternatives) and maybe that attitude of mine, if more widespread, is part of why this happened.

It does re-affirm to me that playing GW games means picking the era of the game you like the best and playing THAT, with whatever models you like. Big Blue Book era with historicals for various human factions and Oathmark for the non-humans for me. Not interested in keeping up with the modern game and happier for it.

Hope people that wanted those models are able to get them without getting gouged.

Annoyingly I missed out getting some more Mahud Raiders (don't get paid till Thursday) - didn't expect everything on LCTB to sell out within the day lol. I don't suppose knows of anywhere (UK ideally) with any of them in stock...?

 Lord Damocles wrote:
And then the Legends churn came for LotR...

at least they have not (yet) decided to change the base size for no apparent reason

Oh, yuck. I'm like a refugee from GW arbitrarily changing base sizes, and SBG was my safe haven.